An average kid in a family of gifted?

[joannqn]

Is it normal to have both average kids and gifted kids, academically, in the same family? Would you be concerned if one of your kids was significantly behind where the others were at their age but still fine compared to other kids their age?

[dalynnrmc]

Myself, my oldest sister, and our younger brother were all considered "gifted" in school. Our middle sister was pretty average, and had to work hard to get decent grades.

 

I totally think it's possible and that it probably happens all the time. Just like you may end up with just one child out of 3 or 4 who IS gifted, it's very realistic for it to happen the other way around also. I'd bet s/he excels in some area(s) where the others don't! :)

[8filltheheart]

Is it normal to have both average kids and gifted kids, academically, in the same family? Would you be concerned if one of your kids was significantly behind where the others were at their age but still fine compared to other kids their age?

 

No, I wouldn't be concerned. Most of my kids are above avg or significantly above avg. However, I have 2 kids that aren't. One started out above avg when she was younger and definitely plateaued and graduated high school completely avg---a hard worker, but still avg. I think my 6 yo is below avg. She is definitely different than all of her siblings and is maturing mentally much slower.

[bcnlvr]

I have one gifted and one average. They are very different, but what I try to do is meet each child where they are. I don't worry too much about it.

[boscopup]

I think I'd want to look closer and see if there are any hidden LDs, just in case. Though is this the 4 year old? If so, I'd wait until school age and see how he progresses.

 

My middle son is significantly behind his big brother in many areas, and what I see of my youngest so far (only 2.5), I suspect youngest will be much like oldest. So basically, that puts middle son behind both. I see glimpses of some really out of the box thinking in DS2, and he had a speech delay (he's in speech therapy and doing well). I'm currently working on getting him evaluated to see what is going on. He is clearly wired differently than the others. Academically, he's doing fine - probably average to slightly above average, but definitely not blazingly above average. His overall maturity though seems like that of a younger child. His language is that of a younger child as well (I swear I'm talking to a 3 year old sometimes, and he just turned 5). So something is going on his little brain that isn't quite "normal". I'm not concerned about him academically being behind his brothers. He tends to not know anything, then suddenly knows everything about a subject. He also seems to fit the profile of a VSL, and they can often be late bloomers. My main concern with him is how to treat his behavior and how to get through to him in language he can understand. I also don't always know if he truly doesn't understand or if he's manipulating. :glare: He's just a different critter. Very sweet and funny critter, but different. :D

[2smartones]

I'd also look for LD's or even hidden gifts. My personal belief is that blood siblings with parents who have similar intelligence will be pretty close in intelligence as well. If there's a big difference in the parents, there could be a big difference in the children as well. (like having one blond child and one brunette)

[Mandy in TN]

I have had my big boys tested, but not my youngest.

My oldest ds tested 2E- mildly dyslexic and mildly gifted. He is also disorganized and has attention issues. I never received a clear answer on whether this was part of the dyslexia or another issue. As a child, he also received speech therapy due to hearing issues and OT therapy for low muscle tone in his hands.

My middle ds tested very normal/ average in all areas except that he had tendencies toward perfectionism and a complete disintegration of skills in timed situations.

(Funny story: My oldest didn’t want his dyslexia label following him to college, so we didn’t ask for accommodations on the ACT. Middle ds overcame his fear of timed situations. Their final ACT scores ended up within one point of each other.)

My youngest has not been tested. He has a different father and is very different from my older two.

I went through school in G/T programs. My dh was accelerated. My xh was not in this category and dyslexia runs in his family.

My oldest is the only one who concerned me. I was primarily concerned, because his skills were just all over the place. He seemed frustrated and I needed help to learn how to help him.

Anyway, I have 3 sons. At an early elementary age (4-8yo), they had very different needs and skill sets. It is what it is. They are all very unique and very loved.

HTH-

Mandy

[gracyomalley]

It is often said that within a genetic sibling group, IQs vary very little...I suspect that if parents are vastly different in their IQs (and I don't in any way imply that IQ is the end all to intelligence) then there will likely be more differences in a family. That being said, how a child does academically is not the same as intelligence, and many kids have learning differences.

 

Within our family, all three clearly show signs of "brightness" at least, but not in the same areas. If I judged only on preschool skillset, particularly early reading/writing, then dd would be miles ahead of her brothers...while if I judged on math, ds #2 would stand out, and if I judged on reasoning skills and conceptual knowledge/memory, ds #1.....Once ds#1s LD was discovered and tutoring and time accomodations instituted, his test scores (except spelling) are now within a few percentage points of sisters...and both meet talent search qualification for "gifted" (again, for what that's worth). If I had gone with his 3rd grade testing, I'd have said he was "average"....

 

My point is, that as a homeschooling family, you can find each kids learning style, and baring different genetics, medical issues, etc...most likely those "average" kids in gifted families, are brighter than they are performing...just haven't found their "area" or are slower to develop...I'd bet that by adulthood, they would have the same chance fo excelling in something as the more classically gifted kiddo...

 

Erin

[enviromommy]

I'd also look for LD's or even hidden gifts. My personal belief is that blood siblings with parents who have similar intelligence will be pretty close in intelligence as well. If there's a big difference in the parents, there could be a big difference in the children as well. (like having one blond child and one brunette)

 

This is my experience as well. It's like any other trait with a strong genetic component. The children end up some combination of the parents, so if both parents are gifted, the children tend to be as well. On the other hand, the genes will recombine in various ways. Just as two children in the same family may look very much alike overall, but have completely different noses, for example, two children in the same family may both be quite intelligent but possess different individual gifts. My DD(11) and DS(9) are both quite bright in what I think of as "general intelligence." And yet they are also very different from each other. DD loves to read long novels and history, and writes beautiful stories. She is not at all gifted in math, however. My DS HATES to put pen to paper, and is not interested in being creative AT ALL. On the other hand, he is quite gifted in math. If I had stopped at these two kids, I would have thought, "Ok, so the girl is like me and the boy is like DH." But then I went on to have three more boys and realized that there are lots more ways to combine those genes. They are each good at different things. (Ok, so I don't really know what the baby is good at yet) :)

 

And yes, I'd agree that if one child seems to be an outlier, I'd check into whether there might be an LD or some other issue going on. Not that there necessarily is, but it might be worth looking into. My DD had some issues earlier on in elementary school, and testing showed some processing problems, possibly related to the fact that she started life as a 2 lb. 11 oz. growth restricted preemie.

 

Edited to add: If it's just a question of being behind where the others were at that age, it can also just be a developmental timing difference rather than a difference in giftedness. When my now 4 year-old was 15 months, the pediatrician had me take him to be evaluated by early intervention because he wasn't saying any words and I wasn't even sure if he was understanding me. His big language explosion came somewhere between 18 months and 2 years. Now, at 4, he's reading on about a 2nd grade level.

Edited November 3, 2011 by enviromommy

[wapiti]

Anything is possible, so I wouldn't necessarily get worked up over an average performance in a family of gifted siblings, but I'd keep an eye out. What you'd be looking for is a 2E situation, and certainly academic performance and standardized test performance might be average in such individuals. For a homeschooling parent, I'd probably go more on gut, because you know your child best - I'd keep an eye out for some of the typical problems that 2E kids might have, particularly if you can separate input and output in your mind (there can be problems with either one - e.g., handwriting, reading, writing, auditory issues, attention, etc.).

 

For example, a kiddo with very bright siblings who struggles to learn to read might be a late bloomer, or might have some learning issues, or both ;). My kids tend toward 2E-ish, and two of the older ones didn't really get into reading much until mid-way through K, and then improved rapidly (those two were reading Magic Treehouse in the second half of K). They did not have any impediments to learning to read (except maybe for speech for one of them). But my dd didn't really click with reading at all during K, and it turned out she had a significant eye tracking problem. Once that was fixed during first grade, she zoomed ahead as well; however, we would never have known about that if I hadn't had her tested in the second half of K completely on a gut feeling - she was in a regular public school, doing "fine" or "average" and the K teacher was unconcerned, but I felt that her performance did not reflect her intelligence as I perceived it. With a history of other issues (low tone, speech delay, etc.) it made sense that there might be other issues lurking. Anyway, the psych was the one who pointed us toward getting the vision issue checked out. I do shudder to think of what she'd be like right now if I hadn't done that, but like I said, it was an intuition thing. My current K-er isn't really reading yet (though he can sound words out) and I don't think he's got any problems; at this point I'm just waiting for "the click." If we get to the end of the school year without significant improvement, I might think about testing, but only because all his older siblings have been tested and he'll probably get tested eventually. I'd want to wait until he's at least 6, so that the WISC would be an option, though at this point I do not foresee having to do this anytime soon (lol, he's my most normal-developing child yet, which is not to say that I feel his intelligence is average - likely not; as for his academic performance, we'll see what happens with his teacher conference tomorrow).

 

If you feel there's a chance there might be a problem based on what you know about your kiddo, there's nothing to lose by getting it checked out except for the significant cost. Unless there are specific signs/symptoms/concerns, I wouldn't bother until school-age. Even (or especially) in gifted kids, development may happen in unevenly, in spurts.

 

Having had three of my kids tested (two of them more than once, due to LD issues) it amazed me how similar their score profiles were even though their personalities, and achievement at school, seem to be so different. They are odd and complicated, according to the psych, and yet for the most part they share the same oddities. For one of them, that was very surprising to me.

 

The other day, I went to a teacher conference for my 3 y.o. preschooler, and the teacher began with the fact that he doesn't talk at school and likes to observe - LOL, I ended up telling her that his four older siblings were all like that in preschool. There's a lot to the genetics. (DH and I are pretty similar in that regard; he outscored me by one point on the LSAT and likes to lord it over me lol, so it stands to reason that there might be a certain amount of consistency amongst our six kids.)

[Maus]

I have heard Human Development types say that full-blood siblings are almost always within 10 IQ points of each other.

 

However, they also used to say, "to predict your child's IQ, take the mother's IQ and add the father's IQ. Divide by 2, then add 10 points." They've now revised the end to say, "add or subtract 10 points." So, now there is a 20 point spread on that prediction.

[Ester Maria]

Not only is it possible to have a child of high intelligence and an average child in the same family by the same biological parents, it is ALSO possible to have a child of high intelligence and a mentally challenged child in the same family by the same biological parents. I know at least of two such cases IRL, and there is at least one member on these boards (maybe she pops into this thread) who stated that in her family there is such a situation.

 

Anything is possible. Stastically, yes, one is more likely to get children who do not vary as much one from another, but theoretically speaking, literally anything is possible.

Edited November 3, 2011 by Ester Maria

[MinivanMom]

I'd also look for LD's or even hidden gifts. My personal belief is that blood siblings with parents who have similar intelligence will be pretty close in intelligence as well. If there's a big difference in the parents, there could be a big difference in the children as well. (like having one blond child and one brunette)

:iagree:

 

My parents were both very intelligent (though nonfunctional when it came to life skills). All 4 of the kids in our family were identified as moderately to highly gifted. Dh's dad is a very intelligent scientist, but his mom is average and not at all academically inclined. Of the 4 kids in his family, 2 were gifted and 2 were average.

[LisaKinVA]

However, they also used to say, "to predict your child's IQ, take the mother's IQ and add the father's IQ. Divide by 2, then add 10 points." They've now revised the end to say, "add or subtract 10 points." So, now there is a 20 point spread on that prediction.

 

Basically, that means my children will land anywhere from moderately gifted to the low-end of profoundly gifted... well, at least using one test.

[8filltheheart]

Not only is it possible to have a child of high intelligence and an average child in the same family by the same biological parents, it is ALSO possible to have a child of high intelligence and a mentally challenged child in the same family by the same biological parents. I know at least of two such cases IRL, and there is at least one member on these boards (maybe she pops into this thread) who stated that in her family there is such a situation.

 

Anything is possible. Stastically, yes, one is more likely to get children who do not vary as much one from another, but theoretically speaking, literally anything is possible.

 

:iagree: There are multiple variables......too many to think that all children should end up w/narrow variation. It is sort of like making the assumption that b/c we have a child on the autistic spectrum that either dh or I must have traits (which is definitely false for both of us) or that some of our other children will (and that is also definitely false......the closest is one dd who is only mildly ADD).

 

There have also been claims that birth order affects intelligence and that in larger families, the higher the number in birth-order, the lower the intelligence. I actually find that humorous. Birth order has not equated in any way to intelligence w/my children. Oldest is very bright, #2 is bright but in a very limited manner (he is my aspie and in things that really matter in the functioning world, he is definitely way below avg), #3 is completely avg, #4 is extremely intelligent as is #5. #6 is very bright. #7 is low-avg at this pt.....whether she is just a really late bloomer only time will tell. #8 is incredibly intelligent and way beyond my other kids at this stage (functioning at almost 12+months beyond my other kids did at the same age. Whereas #7 functions about 8-12 months below).

 

Our #7 has no signs of any disabilites. None. She is simply just not as "quick" on the uptake as our other kids and really has to be taught things that I have never had to teach anyone before (like colors......I never understood the concept of teaching kids their colors b/c my kids have always just known them. But I had to really constantly point out colors to her for her to learn the correct names.)

[boscopup]

She is simply just not as "quick" on the uptake as our other kids and really has to be taught things that I have never had to teach anyone before (like colors......I never understood the concept of teaching kids their colors b/c my kids have always just known them. But I had to really constantly point out colors to her for her to learn the correct names.)

 

I had to teach my middle son colors too. I tried and tried to teach them by pointing out the "red car" or the "blue train" or "You're wearing a yellow shirt!" My current 2.5 year old has picked up some colors this way. My oldest picked them up around 2.5 as well. Middle child? At 3.5 he STILL didn't know any colors at all. I got the R&S ABC series workbooks, and after going through Adventures With Books, he knew his colors solid. Why pointing them out in real life didn't work, I don't know? :confused: He needed a workbook. Strange kid. :tongue_smilie:

 

Counting was similar. I needed a workbook with lots of repetition on how to count. He picked that up just after the colors, since we started Counting With Numbers after the other book. :D

 

He's starting to pick things up more "in real life" now that he's a bit older, thankfully. He is learning a lot via asking questions. I'm trying to just grin and bear it. I know he's just exploring his world. He's also purposely trying to make my brain hurt, asking if various things are real ("Is the flower in this book real?" "Well, that's a drawing of a real flower..."). Then sometimes he makes amusing statements, like, "If ghosts and monsters were real, Star Wars would be real!" Ok, not quite logical, but it's funny nonetheless. :lol:

[FairProspects]

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Edited November 21, 2012 by FairProspects

[jar7709]

Is it normal to have both average kids and gifted kids, academically, in the same family? Would you be concerned if one of your kids was significantly behind where the others were at their age but still fine compared to other kids their age?

 

 

What a good question, I've been pondering this as well. I don't see why that couldn't be normal, but it is outside my experience. Growing up, my sister and I were both in the same gifted programs, and even though I tended to the sciences and she to music, I think our IQs are probably close (I think we were both tested as children but our parents never told us the results.) Now, my DS is quite obviously highly gifted in language and reading, but DD at only 18 months younger is still learning all her letters and mispronounces many words. She isn't 'behind' her age level, but her learning style is so different, that sometimes I do wonder if she is 'average'. She does seem to have the edge on her big brother in fine motor skills and is better at puzzles, so for now I'm just thinking their gifts are different in the way me and my sister are, and matching each of them where they are at. It will be interesting to watch where each of them go.

[higginszoo]

I have a brother like this. Decidedly normal among gifted siblings. He grew up as the youngest, which I think helped as far as comparisons went, but I know there were times it wasn't easy for him, as my other brother and I didn't have to work so hard, and our parents, who were also gifted, didn't have to work as hard, either. In the end, the strong work ethic he had to develop so much earlier has served him well.

 

Dh's siblings are all gifted, his parents are, too. His dad's one non-gifted sibling is also the youngest, I imagine some of his experiences may be comparable to my brother's. M-i-l also had one non-gifted sibling, the oldest. Things were very tough for him, and he has little contact with any of his 4 younger siblings now.

[StephanieZ]

No, I wouldn't be concerned. Just like one tall kid in a short family, or other genetic variations. It happens.

 

I would worry over how to handle the comparisons among kids, but I guess that happens in all families in various ways. I guess I'd work hard to make sure the less gifted child had other special talents that were focused on other than school . . . particularly things the OTHER kids were NOT doing. I.e., I'd invest in music lessons, or make time for soccer every season + summer/winter camps, etc, or make sure to foster a serious interest in scouting (especially if it was a boy who could get Eagle). Something that this child could excel at while not being overshadowed. It is nice for each person in a family to shine at something substantial.

[joannqn]

She is simply just not as "quick" on the uptake as our other kids and really has to be taught things that I have never had to teach anyone before (like colors......I never understood the concept of teaching kids their colors b/c my kids have always just known them. But I had to really constantly point out colors to her for her to learn the correct names.)

 

 

This is what I'm finding with my 4 1/2 year old. He doesn't know all of his letters and isn't particularly interested in learning them or their sounds. He doesn't care to be read to most of the time, either. His fine motor skills are lacking, making writing/drawing very difficult, though he is getting better. He does better with math: can count to 100 with a few helps, comparisons, one-to-one correspondence, identifying 0-10, etc. He doesn't know more than one or two shapes, but does know his colors.

 

DD11, on the other hand, was reading by this age, loved being read to, could write legibly, was doing well with math, knew all of her shapes and colors, etc. She was basically done with kindy at age 4 and into 1st and 2nd grade by the time she turned 5.

 

DS9 is hard to compare. He had undiagnosed lactose intolerance and was diagnosed with severe learning delays. However, once I discovered the problem, he quickly caught up and was ready for first grade by the time he was starting kindy.

 

DS4 seems so far behind. Unless something changes, I expect DD2 to pass him up because she does like being read to and is often more interested in activities I try to do with them. I'm figuring him out a bit. He'll do things if they are active enough, fun enough, or for a short enough period of time (5-10 minutes for more interesting activities). I discovered that he likes workboxes so I'm working on coming up with activities for those. It's hard to come up with that many different activities for him every day, though.

 

 

Signs of LDs? If anything, I'd suggest ADHD as a possibility. There was also an unknown amount of lead exposure too. They all grew up in the same house, but it was in better condition with the oldest two, then DS4 came five years later, then we discovered it before DD2 was at the age where lead levels peak and left. There's a good chance he got the most exposure of all of them. But how do you know the difference from a very active and loud 4 year old and one that is experiencing a problem?

[zaichiki]

If it's just a question of being behind where the others were at that age, it can also just be a developmental timing difference rather than a difference in giftedness.

:iagree:

We have this experience with our crew. One *does* have dyslexia, but has also had IQ tests that tell us she is gifted. Honestly, if we had never had the testing, we would have thought she was the "average child in the gifted family". We wouldn't have realized she was a gifted child with dyslexia. She has strengths in areas her older brother (bloomed earlier in academic areas) doesn't. So... now, years later, we can see it.

 

Number 3 came along and has totally different strengths. Turns out that he's more evenly gifted, without the sharp hills and steep valleys of his older siblings, but he was also a later bloomer. There was a point in time that I suspected *he* was the "average one." (A certain friend would laughingly tell you that I even thought he might have had autism. Yes: when he was a baby he actually avoided eye contact with me for quite a few MONTHS. I was beside myself and "knew" something was wrong! Heh. Turns out it was just me, apparently. My friends were quite entertained to tell me that he made sheep's eyes at *them* all the time.)

 

My littlest is a puzzle, but I'm not worried yet. Some say that this is b/c she's number 4 and I just don't have TIME to be worried. Others say it's just b/c she's so cute and sweet. Her real obvious strength is her strong bond with her siblings/parents and her concern for others. She shows empathy beyond her years in a serious way. (Kinda weird when she's hardly talking.) She's really good at connecting with people in general. Yep: she's a puzzle.

[zaichiki]

There was also an unknown amount of lead exposure too. They all grew up in the same house, but it was in better condition with the oldest two, then DS4 came five years later, then we discovered it before DD2 was at the age where lead levels peak and left. There's a good chance he got the most exposure of all of them. But how do you know the difference from a very active and loud 4 year old and one that is experiencing a problem?

 

If you have any question about lead poisoning, talk to your doctor about it. I don't know if lead testing would tell you anything at this point, but if he does have elevated lead levels that can be treated.

[joannqn]

If you have any question about lead poisoning, talk to your doctor about it. I don't know if lead testing would tell you anything at this point, but if he does have elevated lead levels that can be treated.

 

We all had our lead levels tested and his was 1.7, which isn't a concern. The problem is that blood tests only show recent exposure. There's no feasible way to determine what his exposure was when he was in the 18-24 month range, which is when blood lead levels peak.

[EKS]

This is what I'm finding with my 4 1/2 year old. He doesn't know all of his letters and isn't particularly interested in learning them or their sounds. He doesn't care to be read to most of the time, either. His fine motor skills are lacking, making writing/drawing very difficult, though he is getting better. He does better with math: can count to 100 with a few helps, comparisons, one-to-one correspondence, identifying 0-10, etc. He doesn't know more than one or two shapes, but does know his colors.

 

DD11, on the other hand, was reading by this age, loved being read to, could write legibly, was doing well with math, knew all of her shapes and colors, etc. She was basically done with kindy at age 4 and into 1st and 2nd grade by the time she turned 5.

 

DS9 is hard to compare. He had undiagnosed lactose intolerance and was diagnosed with severe learning delays. However, once I discovered the problem, he quickly caught up and was ready for first grade by the time he was starting kindy.

 

DS4 seems so far behind. Unless something changes, I expect DD2 to pass him up because she does like being read to and is often more interested in activities I try to do with them. I'm figuring him out a bit. He'll do things if they are active enough, fun enough, or for a short enough period of time (5-10 minutes for more interesting activities). I discovered that he likes workboxes so I'm working on coming up with activities for those. It's hard to come up with that many different activities for him every day, though.

 

 

Signs of LDs? If anything, I'd suggest ADHD as a possibility. There was also an unknown amount of lead exposure too. They all grew up in the same house, but it was in better condition with the oldest two, then DS4 came five years later, then we discovered it before DD2 was at the age where lead levels peak and left. There's a good chance he got the most exposure of all of them. But how do you know the difference from a very active and loud 4 year old and one that is experiencing a problem?

 

This is similar to how my gifted/dyslexic son was at your son's age. If my younger one had been born first, I would have been running to get the older one assessed for LDs (if that makes any sense at all!).

[jenbrdsly]

To throw a curve ball out there, I only have one sibling, and she is adopted! She came into our family at two weeks, so it was a classic nature vs. nurture situation. My sister is very people smart and highly verbal, but never tested as gifted, even though my mom did everything with my sister that she did with me.

What this means to me is that you can't "hothouse" a kid to pass a gifted assessment, although really that's just based on a data pool of one.

 

Good luck Joannqn! I agree with the others who said keep an eye out for a LD just in case.

[zaichiki]

To throw a curve ball out there, I only have one sibling, and she is adopted! She came into our family at two weeks, so it was a classic nature vs. nurture situation. My sister is very people smart and highly verbal, but never tested as gifted, even though my mom did everything with my sister that she did with me.

 

What this means to me is that you can't "hothouse" a kid to pass a gifted assessment, although really that's just based on a data pool of one.

 

Good luck Joannqn! I agree with the others who said keep an eye out for a LD just in case.

 

I know a few families with one child adopted from China. These families have highly nurturing/supportive (some might say borderline "hothousing") environments. The parents are all academics (professionally). The adopted children are all brilliant! (Grade skipped, gifted classes, etc.) This has made me wonder how much you CAN influence with "nurture." If it's not that, then it seems from my perspective that a lot of genetically gifted people in China are giving their children up for adoption.

 

Granted, this is also a small sample -- and annecdotal (I have no test scores.).

[Parker Martin]

Keep in mind that you're also comparing boys with girls. Girls are more likely to be of the disposition to sit and do that kind of work.