Day 2 of school and already ready to quit

[lisamarie]

All I can say is that it is a good thing we are planning to send my middle child to school next month for K. It's only been 2 days and she is already in rare form of torturing mom with "I'm too tired," "I don't know how," "I already know HOW to do math and don't need to learn any more," and on and on. :banghead::banghead::banghead:

 

My DS just sits there and gets his work done without any complaining or arguing while my DD will. not. shut. up.

[NanceXToo]

She just turned 5? She's very young. I wouldn't force a 5 year old to sit down with math worksheets or any such thing if she didn't want to do it, I'd rather do hands on, creative, fun things at that age. That, and read lots of books to her :)

 

I'm not even sure why you're bothering to force the issue anyway if you plan to send her to school next month, and in the meanwhile the two of you just seem frustrated by trying to do school at home. Can't you just enjoy her and play with her for this last month before school starts?

[Kalypso]

:grouphug:

 

All I can say is: Hang in there and be grateful for the one who is quietly doing his work.:)

 

(I am avoiding starting this morning, and it is our 3rd day.)

[....]

All I can say is that it is a good thing we are planning to send my middle child to school next month for K. It's only been 2 days and she is already in rare form of torturing mom with "I'm too tired," "I don't know how," "I already know HOW to do math and don't need to learn any more," and on and on. :banghead::banghead::banghead:

 

My DS just sits there and gets his work done without any complaining or arguing while my DD will. not. shut. up.

 

 

I wanna say this without sounding negative...but, don't try to create public school at home. If there's negativity with schoolwork, there's going to be a big backlash against learning. If she's complaining or tired, just stop (in fact, if she's just going to ps, I wouldn't even work with her on academics). I accidentally drove my 7 yro to tears this week in math and I completely stopped - mid-math-problem. If they burn out, do NOT push them.

 

Also, don't forget...at that age group (and even with older elementary-aged kids)...do lapbooks, read-alouds, coloring pages, science experiments, art projects, listen to Ray Charles on Youtube (:D we did that last week during a Georgia state study), switch activities every 15 minutes or so...if you create a variety, they won't lose interest and they will be excited to see what's next. My son is huge on SnapCircuits right now. Because it's totally hands-on!! :) One of our activities for K today was to "walk like an animal". It sounds stupid, but 5 yro was laughing hysterically and hugging me afterwards. But, hey, she's also reading now, so, Woohoo!

 

I think I'm just trying to say, Be Positive! especially when you're first starting off...don't try to push academics too hard until they are really used to learning at home...

 

You can do it! Good luck!

[Dawn in OH]

All I can say is that it is a good thing we are planning to send my middle child to school next month for K. It's only been 2 days and she is already in rare form of torturing mom with "I'm too tired," "I don't know how," "I already know HOW to do math and don't need to learn any more," and on and on. :banghead::banghead::banghead:

 

 

Both my school age children were like that when we started. It gets easier over time. They have learned to understand that they will do school work at home for me for part of the day or they will be shipped off to public school (not really) and sit there for 7 hours a day. No toys. No costumes. No smoothie breaks. No biscuit making.

[....]

They have learned to understand that they will do school work at home for me for part of the day or they will be shipped off to public school (not really) and sit there for 7 hours a day. No toys. No costumes. No smoothie breaks. No biscuit making.

 

Hey! I thought I was the only one who used that threat! :D And, don't forget... no lightsaber fighting, no "Aliens versus Sea Creatures", no eating every 10 minutes :tongue_smilie:, no jumpin jacks during Prima Latina and absolutely, positively NO playing with Shih Tzus during Math.

[Dawn in OH]

Hey! I thought I was the only one who used that threat! :D And, don't forget... no lightsaber fighting, no "Aliens versus Sea Creatures", no eating every 10 minutes :tongue_smilie:, no jumpin jacks during Prima Latina and absolutely, positively NO playing with Shih Tzus during Math.

 

Oh yeah, all of that! No slippers. No pajamas. No wizard hat. No cloaks. No armor. No laying on the floor. No 20 minute potty visits. No little brother on your lap. No baby holding breaks.

 

I think my kids were most traumatized by the idea that they don't get to eat when they are hungry, but when the school says it's "lunchtime".

[Wildiris]

1. I'd be worried about the one who sits quietly.

 

Kids just want to have fun. To make the adjustment from summer fun to sit down and be quiet school is hard even for me.

 

Your job,whether you home schooling or sending the kids to public school, is to make learning fun. At five you just want the kid to be turned onto learning. The last thing you want to encourage is a sit-down shut up style of learning. It kills curiosity.

[lisamarie]

I only had her draw a picture in her nature journal, write 1 sentence about the butterfly she drew, and read 3 lines out of a book. That's it. Yesterday she copied 3 math problems (as in traced them in her R&S math book), and wrote 2 lines of the letter P. We're talking maybe 15 minutes total of work per day. I wanted to slowly ease into the work so the last 2 days the kids did just a few short things.

 

I did MFW-K last year with her so this isn't her first experience with HSing. She actually did really well with it for the most part--I was planning to do it half speed since she was still young, but she breezed through it. She just likes to fight me over everything. School, what she's going to eat for breakfast, when she is going to go to bed, what we are going to do for the day, etc. She knows it all, has done it all before, doesn't need to learn anything more. And it usually involves lots of eye rolling.

 

The plan right now is to send her to K if this month of HSing doesn't go well. I told DH that I needed to enroll her so I had a backup plan if I find HSing her to be not worth the strain on our relationship. School doesn't start until Sept 7 here so I still have time to decide either way. Which is why I can't just ditch school altogether and just play. The deal I made with DH was that I'd give it my best effort this month before making the decision--but at this point I am heavily leaning toward school.

[mom31257]

If she fights you over everything, what are the consequences for non-school stuff? I would treat school the same way.

 

She will be expected to do what is required in her classroom, which will be a lot more than you did of her today. If you send her to school and she gets in trouble there, will you discipline any differently than you did today? Does she know you are considering school? Could she be acting out to get to go or afraid to go?

 

I don't think requiring 15 minutes of school work out of a K age child is too much. I think the earlier they learn that school is required, just like chores, going to bed when told, etc., the easier it is on you.

[lisamarie]

1. I'd be worried about the one who sits quietly.

 

By quietly, I mean sits there and gits 'er done, but it does generally involve lots of talking and sometimes singing, just not the whining and complaining. If you knew my DS, you would not think this at all. He is a big bundle of energy. Before we started school the kids ran around in the yard for an hour. After 30 minutes of school (I only had him do one lesson in his math book to see how much he remembered from the spring and if I was going to have to do any review with him--I told him to only do the first page of his lesson and he did both pages because he loves math), we went for a walk to my mom's because she has a deck that we could throw DS's airplane off of. The kids then ran around for another hour before going home for lunch. After lunch they had rest time and then played outside with the neighbor kids until dinner, then back out with the neighbors and then bed.

 

My DS generally likes to do school work and loves to learn. When he is older, he would be a perfect candidate for self-education. When we offered to let him goto PS this year, he said no. He likes HSing better because then he can get his work done and have more time to play. He likes to turn his school lessons into races to get it done before the timer goes off.

[EKS]

 

The plan right now is to send her to K if this month of HSing doesn't go well.

 

I think this might be part of the problem because you have a choice. I'd approach it as though you are planning to homeschool and have started as of now and discipline accordingly.

[Dawn in OH]

 

 

The plan right now is to send her to K if this month of HSing doesn't go well.

 

In all honesty, a month isn't enough time to determine if it's going to work. A month just isn't enough time to get used to the routine, the expectations, her needs, your needs, etc. And she's 5. That's so young. I have to vote in favor of the "learn through play" theory for age 5.

 

My suggestion is just keep her home all year, the first year is the hardest. If it isn't working out, put her in school for First grade.

 

You may also want to try a reward system. When my kids were that age I had a system where they got a pirate gold coin for every lesson they completed without groaning, whining, crying, etc. When they got 5 coins they got their reward.

 

I DO have a child that fights me over EVERYTHING. For the most part, we've worked it out. We still have our little battles. I don't know if he has learned that it won't do him any good or he's just matured.

[Crimson Wife]

I think this might be part of the problem because you have a choice. I'd approach it as though you are planning to homeschool and have started as of now and discipline accordingly.

 

:iagree:

Whose idea was it to HS? Yours or your DH's? I get the sense that you're not really committed to HS and your DD is probably picking up on that as well.

 

I would recommend committing to at least a full semester of HS, if not a full year. You need to give it a fair try, and a month just isn't going to cut it.

 

I'm not familiar with Memoria Press K but what you described sounds pretty writing heavy for a young K5 student. When my oldest started K5 at 4 yrs 10 mos, I discovered that trying to get her to write was like pulling teeth. She did much better when I adapted the materials I was using to require less writing.

[Food4Thought]

I'll chime in from the "Better Late Than Early" camp, and say that formal school (even the type you mention) may be too much at that age. If you think it's a discipline problem, then discipline accordingly. If it really does seem overly difficult for the child, her fine motor skills and visual skills may not have developed to the point that she is even able to do this type of work without a huge amount of energy.

 

My DS did K for the last two years. The first year, he wasn't ready - so my pushing made him despise school. Last year, I really eased up and read a lot of books with him and only did worksheets if he was really up to the task and well-rested. We finally hit our stride in February of this year, and finished all my planned K curriculum in May. I was so amazed, we threw a huge party.

 

Anyway, it may be that she will get it at a later date when her body and brain mature a little more. Then she'll really take off. Only you can decide that for sure.

[LibraryLover]

Is loving to learn the same thing as wanting to do worksheets? Me first! One can love to learn at the same time one wants to hurl at worksheets.

5 Five IV Five-ola Ivefay.

[Jean in Newcastle]

If she fights you on everything, you need to get a handle on that now, whether you send her to a brick and mortar school or not.

 

Here are the principles I've used over the years:

 

1. Decide what things to require and what things are optional. If it is optional, then make that clear.

 

2. If something is required, then make sure that it is developmentally appropriate. This is a very good place to ask about that. You will get a range of opinions to some degree, but most of the time, people are agreed on what a x year old child can do.

 

3. If something is required, then make it clear what the consequences are if it is not done. You don't have to threaten or beg, just calmly state what they are.

 

4. If something required isn't done, then follow through with the consequence - every single time.

 

5. If something can be done in a fun way (without too much time or hassle) then do it in a fun way!

 

6. If you expect a child to do what you tell them to do, they often will do it. I've found this even with children that are not my own. I will tell them to pick up a toy, see them hesitate, calmly thank them for doing it, then watch them do it.:lol: (This works best if you've been doing number 4 on this list).

 

7. I don't praise for things that are expected. But I do thank them and if they go above and beyond, I will praise them. I think we all need positive feedback when it is warranted.

 

8. Make sure that they really know how to do what you want them to do. Sometimes something will be developmentally appropriate, but a child still will not know how to do the task well (I'm thinking something like a chore as well as schoolwork).

 

9. Make sure the child has protein at meals and offer snacks or a rest when they start to break down.

 

10. If you can do something with a child, do so. Kids learn a lot from watching how we handle things too - plus it makes it more fun and less lonely.

[....]

Have you read Cathy Duffy's Top 100 Homeschool Curriculum Picks? This book was key to our success. Do you know your daughter's learning style? She sounds like she would be a great candidate for something like Five in a Row. Another good read is Boys Adrift and of course, The Well-Trained Mind.

 

Also, :iagree:with the other posters. If you're going to homeschool, you've gotta go into it with teeth gnashing and mohawks flying! Take no prisoners! If you have "I'm just going to send them to public school" in the back of your mind, it's going to end up a self-fulfilled prophecy.

 

Are you getting any family-member support in this? Are you friends with another family that homeschools? We're friends with another hsing family and that has been the most encouraging thing for us. We even get together and do our schoolwork - and then let them run off and play. You could also check out homeschool groups and co-ops for ideas/support.

[ereks mom]

I wanna say this without sounding negative...but, don't try to create public school at home. If there's negativity with schoolwork, there's going to be a big backlash against learning. If she's complaining or tired, just stop (in fact, if she's just going to ps, I wouldn't even work with her on academics). I accidentally drove my 7 yro to tears this week in math and I completely stopped - mid-math-problem. If they burn out, do NOT push them.

 

Also, don't forget...at that age group (and even with older elementary-aged kids)...do lapbooks, read-alouds, coloring pages, science experiments, art projects, listen to Ray Charles on Youtube (:D we did that last week during a Georgia state study), switch activities every 15 minutes or so...if you create a variety, they won't lose interest and they will be excited to see what's next. My son is huge on SnapCircuits right now. Because it's totally hands-on!! :) One of our activities for K today was to "walk like an animal". It sounds stupid, but 5 yro was laughing hysterically and hugging me afterwards. But, hey, she's also reading now, so, Woohoo!

 

I think I'm just trying to say, Be Positive! especially when you're first starting off...don't try to push academics too hard until they are really used to learning at home...

 

You can do it! Good luck!

 

:iagree:

[NanceXToo]

If it was me, I'd keep her home this year and do K VERY informally. Nothing forced... no you have to draw this specific picture, you have to learn to fully read by the end of the year, you have to write these sentences out... I'd do hands on, creative, fun educational things that we enjoyed doing together.

 

1st is time enough to start the more formal things you are describing (in my opinion) and one of the reasons I couldn't stand the public school Kindergarten my daughter went to was because of how much they pushed long days of academics with extremely little play or social or creative time for all those five year olds.

 

I think you should read the book 'Better Late Than Early' by the Moores. Even if in the end you don't agree with it or do it their way, you might just find some food for thought and a middle ground.

[Michele B]

I read your lists of "Things one can't do in public schools" to DD9. She laughed so hard about Shi Tzhus and math! We always have a cat or two sitting on the homeschool table to clean themselves during a lesson!!

 

 

But seriously, I sent DDs 9 and 6 to a private preschool. I feel like they learned so much about how "school" works. It still amazes me that they raise their hands when they want to say something! (not every time of course) I have been dedicated 100% to homeschooling since kindergarten, but I never regretted the two years they spent in pre-school. It allowed dd9 to play, and mess, and be noisy while I was nursing a baby. It then allowed dd6 to play, mess, and be noisy when I was doing homeschool with dd9. So I don't think it would be the end of the world if you let her go to kindergarten and "play" for a year. Of course she will pick up some bad habits and language, but it is a trade off. I think a year of kindergarten is not the end of her homeschool career.

 

Michele

[Teachin'Mine]

:grouphug: Lisa hang in there. Maybe you can have some fun time scheduled each day for when both of them are finished with school - definitely plan on one nice field trip every week or so. It keeps them enthused about home schooling, and they learn while having fun.

 

I agree about changing how you're thinking - with a bail out plan if all doesn't go well. Instead focus on what you can do to make it go right. One thought is that when she says she knows all the math already, tell her that's awesome and maybe you don't have the right books for her. Give her your son's math book and let her do those problems. ;)

 

You might want to make her school work about sitting on the couch with you and you reading a couple of books to her - maybe one you choose first, and one of her choosing next. For math, people are probably tired of hearing me say this :lol:, but bake cookies! Count them, talk about having three rows of four, talk about fractions, just talk. Count together. Bounce a ball back and forth doing skip counting, 5s and 10s, or do the same thing while pushing her on a swing. Make school fun for her. She's got enough years ahead of sitting still and doing work.

 

Rewards for doing the work without balking might help, but make sure that they're available for your son too. If this is your first year, then just give her and you time to get used to everything. Try different things and you're bound to find what works for you. :) Celebrate how well your son is doing too and involve him in the fun stuff too! :)

[mum]

I always dread starting up again, but remember ps isn't the worst thing that ever happened. I have one that loves it and thrives, and is walking out her faith and being a light. She's 11th grade. I hs the others and they love their situation. I love the conversations around the dinner table when the kids discuss what they each like best about their individual school situations. The kids start these up, and I just sit and smile.

[Lilymax]

I think my kids were most traumatized by the idea that they don't get to eat when they are hungry, but when the school says it's "lunchtime".

 

:lol: That's the biggest threat to my sons, too! And the 20 minute bathroom breaks. Thanks for the laughs--it's so true!

[Lilymax]

1st is time enough to start the more formal things you are describing (in my opinion) and one of the reasons I couldn't stand the public school Kindergarten my daughter went to was because of how much they pushed long days of academics with extremely little play or social or creative time for all those five year olds.

 

OMG, that is totally like the private kindergarten my poor first son went to. They even gave the kindergartner's a freakin' standardized test at the end of the year! Man, I wish I knew then what I know now...I think of all the crying we both did with sight word flash cards--he just wasn't ready. I wish I had a do-over button because I'd have let him stay home and play. (And I did do that--with very light academics--for DS2 and will do the same for my third.)

[Firestar Academy]

 

She just likes to fight me over everything. School, what she's going to eat for breakfast, when she is going to go to bed, what we are going to do for the day, etc. She knows it all, has done it all before, doesn't need to learn anything more. And it usually involves lots of eye rolling.

 

 

Don't mean to sound snarky, but, ummm why are you fighting with her over everything??

 

have you done the choice thing?? Ask her "would you like cereal or pancakes for breakfast? It's YOUR choice." or " would you like to read in your bed or draw with crayons in the bed? It's your choice. (either way she is in the bed in her room). The favorite in my house is "do you want to help scrub the floor or scrub the toilet? It's your choice. " or "Do you want to do a math lesson or work in the nature journal? It's your choice."

 

 

I do follow up with "it's your choice" so they have the power to choose. Sometimes they will come up with their own choice, " I would rather eat an egg for breakfast." or " I would rather do the dishes" or " I would rather do some grammer." I try to say yes to their choices.

 

just my opinion.

robin in NJ

[lisamarie]

Don't mean to sound snarky, but, ummm why are you fighting with her over everything??

 

have you done the choice thing?? Ask her "would you like cereal or pancakes for breakfast? It's YOUR choice." or " would you like to read in your bed or draw with crayons in the bed? It's your choice. (either way she is in the bed in her room). The favorite in my house is "do you want to help scrub the floor or scrub the toilet? It's your choice. " or "Do you want to do a math lesson or work in the nature journal? It's your choice."

 

 

Ex: Me: Would you like cereal, a bagel, or oatmeal for breakfast? Her: I want crackers. Me: You can have cereal, a bagel, oatmeal or nothing. Her: Ice cream. Me: Cereal, bagel, oatmeal or nothing. You have 30 seconds to decide or I am walking out of the kitchen and you will go hungry.

 

She ultimately chooses one of my choices, but rarely without trying to argue over it. I know down the road that her personality is going to serve her well, but it is difficult now.

 

Again I want to note that this is our SECOND year of HSing. We already did a full year last year. Maybe the problem is that MP-K is just not the right program for her. I thought it would work well, but it could just be too much seat work. She is my more artistic child so math sheets, copywork, phonics worksheets could just be the issue and not school in general. Last year she did mostly fine with MFW-K and seemed to enjoy it. She also liked the parts of HOD-LHFHG that she sat in on with my DS. So maybe I just need to scrap MP-K and use the LHFHG math and phonics for her and have her do BLHFHG with DS.

[Firestar Academy]

Ex: Me: Would you like cereal, a bagel, or oatmeal for breakfast? Her: I want crackers. Me: You can have cereal, a bagel, oatmeal or nothing. Her: Ice cream. Me: Cereal, bagel, oatmeal or nothing. You have 30 seconds to decide or I am walking out of the kitchen and you will go hungry.

 

 

 

oooohhh. i get it.... these type of arguements won't stop b/c she goes to ps, though.

 

i would try :

Ex: Me: Would you like cereal, a bagel, or oatmeal for breakfast? Her: I want crackers. Me: leave the kitchen/feed the other child/walk away.

 

wait for her to chose something from the list. when she does, I will gladly come back to the kitchen and make something from the given list. Until then, I've got things to do.

 

robin

[Cindyz]

I think this might be part of the problem because you have a choice. I'd approach it as though you are planning to homeschool and have started as of now and discipline accordingly.

 

 

I completely agree. If your heart isn't into it, I wouldn't expect hers to be.

[HS Mom in NC]

I'm trying to be very objective here and you did ask for input.

 

I can only go on the extremely limited information I have from your post but it looks to me like there's a parallel in her attitude and yours:

 

Child: After very little time spent spent on schooling for the day her response is, "I don't want to. I'm too tired. I can't."

 

You: After only days 2 you say you are ready to quit.

 

From the outside those look very similar.

[HRAAB]

Ex: Me: Would you like cereal, a bagel, or oatmeal for breakfast? Her: I want crackers. Me: You can have cereal, a bagel, oatmeal or nothing. Her: Ice cream. Me: Cereal, bagel, oatmeal or nothing. You have 30 seconds to decide or I am walking out of the kitchen and you will go hungry.

 

 

Especially at the age of 5, but even now with my older ones, I put the bowl of oatmeal or the pancakes on the table and tell the girls to come and eat. What I cook is what they get. I've found with mine when they were that young, giving them too many choices could be overwhelming. Especially when it comes to meals. The only time they get to choose breakfast is when they have cold cereal or they're old enough to cook it themselves. It sounds to me like you need to be making that choice for her.

[Crimson Wife]

Maybe the problem is that MP-K is just not the right program for her. I thought it would work well, but it could just be too much seat work. She is my more artistic child so math sheets, copywork, phonics worksheets could just be the issue and not school in general. Last year she did mostly fine with MFW-K and seemed to enjoy it. She also liked the parts of HOD-LHFHG that she sat in on with my DS. So maybe I just need to scrap MP-K and use the LHFHG math and phonics for her and have her do BLHFHG with DS.

 

This sounds like a good plan. With K5ers (especially young ones) you need to be flexible with curricula since readiness can vary so much from child to child. And it is very common for fine motor skills to lag behind cognitive skills. That's why I personally try to use programs that are "hands-on" at this age rather than writing-heavy.

 

For math, try having her to dictate the answers orally while you transcribe or allow her to use rubber stamps or stickers on the worksheet. For phonics, try using fridge magnets, letter tiles, stamps, or stickers.

 

Good luck!

[lisamarie]

Update: Day 3 went much better. Of course I wasn't even going to do school today because half of us are sick, but we were feeling better by the afternoon so I decided to do some school. DD did most of it without complaint and mostly laughed through it. I pulled out a few of the tricks that worked last year--used a timer to race it, bopped her on the head with a thin book for getting it right (my kids think this is hilarious for some reason), and we used the dry erase boards to do her math before pulling out the book.

 

I wonder if she is just not a morning person. DS and I are huge morning people and like to get everything done right away. I think I will experiment with times with DD to see if she does better in the afternoon.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Update: Day 3 went much better. Of course I wasn't even going to do school today because half of us are sick, but we were feeling better by the afternoon so I decided to do some school. DD did most of it without complaint and mostly laughed through it. I pulled out a few of the tricks that worked last year--used a timer to race it, bopped her on the head with a thin book for getting it right (my kids think this is hilarious for some reason), and we used the dry erase boards to do her math before pulling out the book.

 

I wonder if she is just not a morning person. DS and I are huge morning people and like to get everything done right away. I think I will experiment with times with DD to see if she does better in the afternoon.

 

I'm glad that day 3 went better. And good job finding what works for your kiddos! And yes, she just might do better in the afternoons.