Is there a writing program for child that hates writing?

[ange]

I have a very bright, and from all accounts, talented writer that tells me she hates writing. She's currently in 4th grade, private school. Has anyone a suggestion for a writing program I could look at for her? I am considering an IEW class for her next year (when asked why she hates writing, she replied she doesn't know what to write.) I would love to hear your experiences/ advice. Thanks!

[JessaMae]

Sorry I may not be much help! I am also looking for a writing program myself for my dds grades 3 and 4 :). However I thought I would mention "Training for Triumph - Meaningful Composition." I like the way it is set up and it looks like a good program. Unfortunately it must be new b/c I can't find many reviews on it. i am thinking about ordering it next year.

 

I've also considered CW (Classical Writing) and IEW. But I need something a little less teacher intensive at this point. :)

Edited March 31, 2010 by JessaMae
clarification

[EKS]

IEW is great for this problem. In fact, you can implement the keyword outline technique immediately and it may be all you need to get her going. In case you're unfamiliar with keyword outlining, here it is in a nutshell. Pick a passage about some topic you want her to write about. Make sure it is a suitable length (a paragraph is good to start with) and that it is at her reading level. Then have her pick three words from each sentence to remind her of what the sentence is about. Have her write these down, separated by commas, on line 1 of her outline. Do the same thing with the next sentence, writing the words down on line 2, and so forth. Then put the example paragraph away and have her write from her outline. It's even better if she does this the next day, without looking at the example again.

 

I don't particularly like the rest of IEW, but the keyword outline technique is really powerful, especially for kids with writer's block or who are not as confident.

[Colleen in NS]

(when asked why she hates writing, she replied she doesn't know what to write.)

 

Writing With Ease would help with this. But in a school setting, it might seem like it's taking her backwards, esp. if she is expected at school to come up with topics and then write about them right now. WWE works on the skills of reading from someone else's writing (books) and summarizing by learning to put her thoughts about the passage into words and putting those words on paper.

 

I also suggest listening to 3 audio downloads from Peace Hill Press - they begin with the words, A Plan for Teaching Writing (and WWE fleshes out the first audio lecture). If your child is to continue at school, you may be able to figure out how to implement these ideas in with what she is expected to do at school. The ideas will give a rock solid foundation in writing skills, but they may come in a different order (slower, but more solid, then set her free in high school to blossom) than what the school expects. If following the advice of the lectures, a student would learn the skills taught in WWE (or you can teach these skills on your own), then move on to examining and imitating other authors' writing via outlining and rewriting from that outline, and then move on in high school to coming up with her own topics and writing about the topic. The first two levels of skills are the foundation for this high school level.

 

hth

[ABQmom]

IEW is great for this problem. In fact, you can implement the keyword outline technique immediately and it may be all you need to get her going. In case you're unfamiliar with keyword outlining, here it is in a nutshell. Pick a passage about some topic you want her to write about. Make sure it is a suitable length (a paragraph is good to start with) and that it is at her reading level. Then have her pick three words from each sentence to remind her of what the sentence is about. Have her write these down, separated by commas, on line 1 of her outline. Do the same thing with the next sentence, writing the words down on line 2, and so forth. Then put the example paragraph away and have her write from her outline. It's even better if she does this the next day, without looking at the example again.

 

I don't particularly like the rest of IEW, but the keyword outline technique is really powerful, especially for kids with writer's block or who are not as confident.

:iagree: IEW has helped us a lot! And, really, it's not so teacher intensive as you might think. Yes, you do have to teach it, but you are told exactly what to do. And, if you'd rather, you can buy one of the SWI's and have Mr. Pudewa do the teaching for you. He's funny and a great teacher. All you have to do is sit and watch with your child so that you can answer questions and make sure child understands and is paying attention.

[Gratia271]

IEW

[melmichigan]

We just started IEW for my DD who has dysgraphia, I bought the combo so she could get started with the SWI right away. So far it is working.

[FawnsFunnyFarm]

Writing Strands is by far my favorite writing program. It's the first one that I found that my reluctant writer would actually do without much more than a sigh.

[siloam]

I have a very bright, and from all accounts, talented writer that tells me she hates writing. She's currently in 4th grade, private school. Has anyone a suggestion for a writing program I could look at for her? I am considering an IEW class for her next year (when asked why she hates writing, she replied she doesn't know what to write.) I would love to hear your experiences/ advice. Thanks!

 

Writing Tales?

 

Heather

 

[PeterPan]

Just out of curiousity, do you know what curriculum they've been using for writing in school? That might show you what direction NOT to go. And for informational purposes, you might also want to read this article, just to rule it out: http://www.davidsongifted.org/db/Articles_id_10435.aspx There's a difference between not knowing what to write (a content issue, easily resolvable with WWE/CW/IEW/WTM/WT) vs. dysgraphia (pain getting it on paper, little writing automaticity) vs. dyslexia (trouble with the whole process of capturing thoughts to get them on paper). I would just take some time with her and ask her questions. Ask her if her hand hurts. Ask her if it seems to take a long time get get her thoughts down on paper, even when she knows what she wants to say.

 

It could be as simple as that she was pushed into creative or original writing too soon, with truly nothing to say. Or it could be that she has some stumbling blocks. You can't know till you talk through it and do things with her. Just as a general statement, I would say my favorite writing program for a 4th grade girl is Writing Tales 2. It's easy to implement, fun, semi-independent for the tasks (once you teach the lessons), covers a ton of great stuff, and is just plain girl-friendly. I suggest you have her hand write her first draft and type the 2nd draft with corrections. That way you can start to see where her issues are. Who knows, it might be that going to a program with models to outline does the trick!

 

Oh, I agree with Coleen that you want to do WWE and the WTM suggested narrations. WT2 doesn't replace those. It's just the formal writing component. WWE and daily narrations form your small chunk, daily practice.

Edited April 1, 2010 by OhElizabeth

[BearWallowSchool]

Writing With Ease would help with this. But in a school setting, it might seem like it's taking her backwards, esp. if she is expected at school to come up with topics and then write about them right now. WWE works on the skills of reading from someone else's writing (books) and summarizing by learning to put her thoughts about the passage into words and putting those words on paper.

 

I also suggest listening to 3 audio downloads from Peace Hill Press - they begin with the words, A Plan for Teaching Writing (and WWE fleshes out the first audio lecture). If your child is to continue at school, you may be able to figure out how to implement these ideas in with what she is expected to do at school. The ideas will give a rock solid foundation in writing skills, but they may come in a different order (slower, but more solid, then set her free in high school to blossom) than what the school expects. If following the advice of the lectures, a student would learn the skills taught in WWE (or you can teach these skills on your own), then move on to examining and imitating other authors' writing via outlining and rewriting from that outline, and then move on in high school to coming up with her own topics and writing about the topic. The first two levels of skills are the foundation for this high school level.

 

hth

 

:iagree:

[EppieJ]

I have a very bright, and from all accounts, talented writer that tells me she hates writing. She's currently in 4th grade, private school. Has anyone a suggestion for a writing program I could look at for her? I am considering an IEW class for her next year (when asked why she hates writing, she replied she doesn't know what to write.) I would love to hear your experiences/ advice. Thanks!

 

I've posted this in a couple of other places today, too, but...

 

Have you tried giving her a journal to write in? The idea behind this is to just write. It is not to be graded at all. It is just for her to put thoughts on paper and grow a love of writing (or at least a tolerance). Knowing it's not being graded can really take the pressure off and allow her more mental freedom to just let loose on paper. If she's having trouble coming up with ideas, try giving her a list of writing prompts (a google search will quickly find you many), or have her write about her day, etc.

 

I did this with ds for about a year and he went from complaining about writing a sentence to writing his own novel!

 

It sounds like something like this might help her discover her inner author.

[Arch at Home]

I personally like Brave Writer for those who don't like to write. It starts with the parent taking dictation and works up from there. Writing becomes a group activity which doesn't seem so arduous.

[ange]

I appreciate everyone's thoughtful and helpful responses. I am looking at everything suggested. OhElizabeth, thank you for your thoughts and questions. I did not think about the possibility of her hand hurting or problems w/ handwriting. Her handwriting never seemed to be a problem (although I've always thought she writes so small that it must be uncomfortable). She is coming from a classical school and the writing tales sounds very similar to what she has been doing in school - they use classic literature such as Robin Hood or Beowulf and they do an outline, identify vocab words, identify plot, main characters, etc. They then re-write the story, including the vocab. I asked her about difficulty w/ handwriting and she did say her hand hurts when writing and she often mixes up the letters 'v' and 'x' and 'w' and 'y' (only with cursive). She says she writes better using manuscript. She said the problems w/ her hand hurting and mixing up letters are the biggest reasons she does not like to write, and lastly is she does not think writing is fun. If anyone has a suggestion about what I could do about her (hand)writing problem, I would appreciate your thoughts and experiences. I think that is what I will have to tackle first - then choose curriculum, which thanks to you all I have some good choices to look at.

[Colleen in NS]

they use classic literature such as Robin Hood or Beowulf and they do an outline, identify vocab words, identify plot, main characters, etc. They then re-write the story, including the vocab. I asked her about difficulty w/ handwriting and she did say her hand hurts when writing and she often mixes up the letters 'v' and 'x' and 'w' and 'y' (only with cursive). She says she writes better using manuscript. She said the problems w/ her hand hurting and mixing up letters are the biggest reasons she does not like to write

 

I think WWE, as a writing curriculum (not handwriting), would still help with the hand hurting problem, because it does not require much actual handwriting - it works on developing thought patterns (composition skills) first. The child gradually transitions to writing out about three sentences of well-thought out summary. But it also includes dictation, which will give her short practice in handwriting, as well as other composition skills.

 

I'd suggest working with her on what seems to be separate problems. First, the mixing up of letters - practice individual letters in cursive, then putting them together with other letters (the printing/cursive section of Writing Road to Reading book is one resource that has helpful instructions to you on how to do this - there are many other great handwriting programs out there, too. But you might be able to find WRTR in the library, and glean from the teaching instructions for a few weeks). Second, using a thought-developing program such as WWE to get her started on actual composition skills, but does not require too much actual handwriting yet.

 

You might want to go to the PHP website and read the sample chapters of WWE - the first two explanatory chapters especially.

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

I personally like Brave Writer for those who don't like to write.

 

:iagree:

 

If writing has become a chore to her, Bravewriter could make it fun again. It's wonderful.

[Guest]

Well, not everyone writes in cursive so I would let that one go. Second, I would give her a journal to write in with maybe a list of topic starters for over the summer. My boys are on their 3rd books for this. They love the freedom they have and love to write stories or summaries of their own choosing.

[KJsMom]

My dd hated creative writing. To get around this we started a story journal. We talked about the character we wanted to write about and I started the story. The next day she continued writing where I left off. Each day we take a turn adding to the story. I try to put the character in situations where my dd will have to really think to come up with a solution. I don't push correct punctuation or grammar, I just want her to enjoy the process of writing. She loves our story journal, so I hope to move on to a writing program. I just haven't decided which one!

[susankenny]

Hi,

 

My daughter is 8 1/2 & struggles with writing as well. Her biggest issue is like your daughter's, not knowing what to write. I have been searching for a curriculum for next year, but in the meantime, I've been sitting with her and just doing our own thing. It's looks like this....

 

Day 1: Brainstorm a topic. She writes down anything and everything that comes to mind. She does not need to use complete sentences, correct spelling, capitalization, etc. It doesn't need to be neat at all, but she does need to be able to read it later on.

 

Day 2: Choose your topic from Day 1. Make a list of everything you know regarding that topic (again, she doesn't focus on spelling, complete sentences, etc). She can use the internet or books to find out information if needed. Because of my daughter's age, this is not an in depth report. It is a basic introduction to writing about the topic at hand (the length of the final paper will only be a paragraph & we'll build in length as her skills develop).

 

Day 3: Use the list from Day 2 to write the first rough draft. Try to use complete sentences, correct spelling, etc. FWIW, using the list from Day 2 proved to be very helpful for my dd. She is basically turning a word or phrase into a sentence. Ex: 1)not really bald....2)feathers.... becomes "The bald eagle is not really bald. He gets his name from the white feathers on his head".

 

Day 4: Review rough draft & mom helps with corrections (I circle words that need capitalization & underline words that are misspelled. If the sentence is incomplete, I underline the entire sentence twice). If she needs help understanding something, we discuss the corrections orally & then she writes it down.

 

Day 5: Re-write rough draft with corrections.

 

 

Anyway, this is what we've been doing & my daughter actually seems to like it so far. She wrote about bald eagles last week & really enjoyed learning about them. Her spelling improved each time as well. This assignment wasn't overwhelming to her at all (which was awesome!). In previous attempts with other curricula it was either too overwhelming or it was to vague to give her the direction she needed to move forward.

 

I hope this helps you.

 

Susan

Edited April 6, 2010 by susankenny

[Researcher]

I agree with Colleen's suggestion of WWE. We've had great success with this approach since DS doesn't feel like he's having to search his brain to come up with the topic all by himself. Although, I can see that this may seem like she's going backwards from her current program.

 

That said, I also agree with the Journal idea. I gave DS a journal but I don't push it. Whatever he writes in it is his and I don't correct spelling, grammar, punctuation, or handwriting technique. To help with topics, I bought a journal idea book that gives me a new topic to suggest to him each day. He also likes to send something to Grandma occasionally and I always praise his effort.

 

My last suggestion is to give her a brief lesson in a different handwriting program. Sometimes the hand pain she's describing is caused by the way they are forming their letters and gripping too hard. A good friend of mine had this experience with both of her kids and taught them Handwriting Without Tears over the summer and they did very well. The pain was gone and the complaints were gone. :) I'm not sure what program they were using at school but the kids were really hating the act of writing, especially in cursive.

[littlebug42]

I have a daughter that struggles with the physical aspects of handwriting. A lot of things to be handwritten is a definite chore for her. We still practice handwriting and it is getting better. However, for assignments that are more about the thought process and composition, I let her use the computer. Her ideas flow a lot more easily if she is not bogged down with the physical component. For a recent assignment, I allowed her to compose on the computer but then when she was finished, she had to copy it onto paper by hand. It has been a struggle for several years with her and I don't really see the end to it just yet but this has helped us compromise and she still gets to do the writing assignments.

 

As for a program, I like Write Source. You can look at it at Rainbow Resource. It has a design that goes with a school format but it is very straight forward about different types of writing etc and it is very easy for my daughter to follow. I think it has been very easy to use. I got my copies of the older handboooks from paperback swap.

[ange]

My last suggestion is to give her a brief lesson in a different handwriting program. Sometimes the hand pain she's describing is caused by the way they are forming their letters and gripping too hard. A good friend of mine had this experience with both of her kids and taught them Handwriting Without Tears over the summer and they did very well. The pain was gone and the complaints were gone. :) I'm not sure what program they were using at school but the kids were really hating the act of writing, especially in cursive.

 

Handwriting was covered in the Riggs curriculum. I will look into other handwriting styles for her. I have noticed for some reason she writes very small for school. Just looking at it makes my hand hurt! Also she is left handed, so not sure if that has anything to do w/ any bad habits learned. Thanks for you ideas!