Do Parents attend meetings when touring universities? and other odd questions

[lewelma]

More questions!

 

We are meeting with students, professors, admissions, and undergraduate advisers in maths, and have a couple of formal interviews.  My DH and I will be with DS on the tour -so three of us.

 

So attendance expectations:

1) students - clearly we can all sit over lunch with a student and ask questions

2) formal interview - clearly ds has to do this by himself

3) professors -?

4) admissions -?

5) undergraduate advisers in math -?

 

So for 3-5 do all three of us go?  Just ds and ONE parent?  or just ds?

 

These next questions may seem goofy, but we have a cultural difference, so the answers would be different in the USA vs NZ.  For example, a GP or intern doctor in New Zealand has the title Dr, but a specialist returns to the title Mr.  It is very rude to call a specialist a Dr.

 

So here are my odd questions:

6) How do you address people?  Dr xxx or Professor xxx for Professors we are meeting. And  Mr/Ms xxx or first name for admissions people who have corresponded with us by first name? 

7) Clearly ds should be leading the discussions, should we pop in with questions at all?  or keep quiet?

8) Should ds have a list of questions he refers to?  

9) Is it ok for us to take notes in the meeting? or is that considered rude?

10) Is shaking hands expected?

11) Should DS send e-mail thank-yous or hand written ones?  

 

Please guide me in any other cultural differences I have missed.

 

Ruth in NZ

[regentrude]

In our department, the chair meets with families of prospective students. Often both parents are present with the student.

You cannot go wrong addressing academics by Dr. lastname. Professor lastname is fine as well. Some profs may not have a doctorate, but that is highly unlikely at the school syou will be visiting. And calling somebody a Dr who isn't is not considered rude.

 

With admin people, take your cue from the introduction. If they say "Hi, I am John with admissions", you call them John.

Handshake is normal when you first meet a new person. You also might shake hands at the end of the meeting.

Taking notes is not rude at all. They prefer not to have to answer your questions twice :)

List is fine.

He should lead, but it is perfectly appropriate for parents to have questions your DS might not have thought to bring up. Just make sure you stay in the background and let him handle as much as possible.

 

email thank you is better. What's in the inbox is kept/filed - what's on a  piece of paper gets lost/tossed. 

Edited July 14, 2017 by regentrude

[lewelma]

I'm not sure we are meeting any chairs.  Most of them have sent us to professors to talk to.  Are those professors expecting to talk about math/research or about what the program has to offer?

 

If admissions or academic advisors don't introduce themselves by any name, should ds use last name?  Which is the fallback in the USA?

 

We are only meeting with one admissions person, I'm wondering if I should try to make some other appointments.  Being an international homeschooler who is a dual citizen is a bit confusing I would think.  I wonder if I would want an admissions person who focuses on homeschooling or internationals?  I'm thinking homeschooling because they are used to seeing odd transcripts and all the documentation, but they will not know anything about ds's qualifications like someone focusing on internationals. In addition, it is unclear if ds is applying as a homeschooler or schooler.  I'm wondering if I need a separate answer from each admissions department and that they would need to see his transcript to make a determination.  That would require a meeting.

[Julie of KY]

I was with my son for all his meetings of professors, administrators, etc. I was ready to sit out but was invite in by all. I let me son take the lead on the discussions, but they also turned to me and asked if I had any questions. 

 

If they don't tell you how to address them, then I'd go with Dr. or Mr. 

[*LC]

We are only meeting with one admissions person, I'm wondering if I should try to make some other appointments. Being an international homeschooler who is a dual citizen is a bit confusing I would think. I wonder if I would want an admissions person who focuses on homeschooling or internationals? I'm thinking homeschooling because they are used to seeing odd transcripts and all the documentation, but they will not know anything about ds's qualifications like someone focusing on internationals. In addition, it is unclear if ds is applying as a homeschooler or schooler. I'm wondering if I need a separate answer from each admissions department and that they would need to see his transcript to make a determination. That would require a meeting.

Could you ask to meet with a homeschooling and international admission person at each school? I could see different schools handling your son differently.

[regentrude]

I'm not sure we are meeting any chairs.  Most of them have sent us to professors to talk to.  Are those professors expecting to talk about math/research or about what the program has to offer?

 

If admissions or academic advisors don't introduce themselves by any name, should ds use last name?  Which is the fallback in the USA?

 

We are only meeting with one admissions person, I'm wondering if I should try to make some other appointments.  Being an international homeschooler who is a dual citizen is a bit confusing I would think.  I wonder if I would want an admissions person who focuses on homeschooling or internationals?  I'm thinking homeschooling because they are used to seeing odd transcripts and all the documentation, but they will not know anything about ds's qualifications like someone focusing on internationals. In addition, it is unclear if ds is applying as a homeschooler or schooler.  I'm wondering if I need a separate answer from each admissions department and that they would need to see his transcript to make a determination.  That would require a meeting.

 

The professors will answer your son's questions to the best of their ability. They don't know what he wants to know. In our department, such meetings are done by the chair - who is a professor. Or the undergraduate advisor, who is alprofessor as well. Any faculty member should be able to tell you a bit about the department, but chair and advisor are best versed in intricacies of curriculum, course sequence etc - regular faculty will not know the details. They can all tell you about research, what the students do, etc - but specific questions about classes may need to be directed to specialized people who handle this aspect for their departments.

 

If in doubt, go with Mr lastname. They will most likely correct you and say "call me John". You can also always omit the direct address if in doubt :)

 

I would be surprised if they had an admissions person who is specifically focused on homeschooling. I also don't think there is "applying as a homeschooler" or "applying as a school student" - they will look at similar things, and especially test scores, college classes, and achievements like the math olympiad. The differences in coursework and sequence will probably not matter that much. 

[lewelma]

Well, the distinction between a school kid in NZ and my student will be *very* different, as we have followed an American transcript approach and NZ kids do the exam approach -- they don't have 6 classes for 4 years, they have 5 exams. Its really complicated, but trust me when I say the my ds's application will look not at all like a NZ school kid. 

 

I was assuming I had to have ds apply as a homeschooler otherwise I would not be able to bring in all the extra work he has done at home and with other vendors.  But DS has a proper NZ diploma that is no different from any other student.  MIT admissions told me to check the school-student box and then send in all the homeschooling documentation. I'm assuming they might be stricter on homeschooling admits, or have a quota? I haven't asked the other schools yet.

 

Regentrude,  what can the non-chair professors tell us?.  We have been sent to a prof at one of the elites who does a lot of outreach with highschoolers, so is used to talking to younger students I guess. Should ds ask about research opportunities, collaboration in classes, ability to enroll in upper level courses?  That kind of stuff?  I just can't imagine right now that ds has any questions to ask.  He has no idea what comes next.  He wants a challenging program with students at his level where he can work on collaborative projects.  He definitely wants to find a focus.  He does not want to be a theoretical mathematician, rather he wants to find a huge scientific project like CERN that needs mathematicians.  What he really wants is a place that will let him explore a bunch of options and interact with a lot of people with different passions so that he can find something he wants to pursue.  

 

In addition, my understanding is that some professors at non-elites can advocate for ds to gain entrance.  This is how it works at my father's university.  I'm just not clear on how ds makes a good impression.  He is best when talking math, not when taking administration.

Edited July 15, 2017 by lewelma

[regentrude]

Regentrude,  what can the non-chair professors tell us?.  We have been sent to a prof at one of the elites who does a lot of outreach with highschoolers, so is used to talking to younger students I guess. Should ds ask about research opportunities, collaboration in classes, ability to enroll in upper level courses?  That kind of stuff?  ... 

 

In addition, my understanding is that some professors at non-elites can advocate for ds to gain entrance.  This is how it works at my father's university.  I'm just not clear on how ds makes a good impression.  He is best when talking math, not when taking administration.

 

I have no idea how much weight a professor's word carries in the admission process. 

 

What the professor can tell you will depend on the individual and on the questions your DS asks. Think of it as a conversation. Some questions may not be answered, but he may also tell you things you did not know you wanted to know. It also serves to get a feeling for the atmosphere of the place. You can trust the people who "sent" you to talk to this person that they have chosen somebody who they know can interact well with prospective students, and not the quirky recluse who has trouble communicating. They wil have picked a person who can represent the department, knows something about the department, and is likely to be able to answer typical questions the prospective student may have.

Your DS should ask exactly what he wants to know -and where the answers have not obviously been on the departmental web page; that is always irritating and feels like a waste of time.

Edited July 15, 2017 by regentrude

[Guest]

 

 

I was assuming I had to have ds apply as a homeschooler otherwise I would not be able to bring in all the extra work he has done at home and with other vendors. But DS has a proper NZ diploma that is no different from any other student. MIT admissions told me to check the school-student box and then send in all the homeschooling documentation. I'm assuming they might be stricter on homeschooling admits, or have a quota? I haven't asked the other schools yet.

 

 

My public schooled son did not apply to highly selective schools, but the privates he applied to had spaces on the app for high school courses that asked for provider names. Its very common now for middle class high school students to have a mixed schedule as they have to take online courses or independent study in order to have a full load. No problem with multiple transcripts.

[Hoggirl]

We attended large info sessions with Ds and walked around on tours (at the back). The only one on ones he had were for trial music lessons (when he was considering majoring in music. Even beyond that when he wanted to consider accessibility to music teachers after he knew he wouldn't major in music). I did not attend those. If I saw the professor after they were finished, I said hello and thanked them for their time, but that was it.

 

It never would have occurred to me to interact specifically with professors/admit people, etc. I only interacted directly on issues related to money - FAFSA requirements for merit, if scholarships stacked, etc. Oh. And if making Alabama's deposit that was for BOTH housing and enrollment violated any ethics.

[Bootsie]

I would refer to the professors as "Dr. ..."  The admissions staff is probably used to going by their first names; personally, I would suggest that son call them Mr./Ms X until being told, "call me Jane" especially if it is in upper level admissions person rather than an admissions counselor who is closer in age to son--but I am in the south--so that is a cultural difference you will find within the US and I don't think it would be a make or break issue; it is more important that your son is comfortable and not focused on what he is calling the staff.

 

If these are not interviews but simply meetings with professors and admissions counselors, it will be OK for you to sit in on the meetings.  I would only pop in with questions if I had something that was very confusing that I wanted cleared up (a significant question) or if i saw that DS was at a loss of what to say and I could ask a question that I thought would put the conversation back on track for him.  I friendly, short question at the beginning or end would be fine; you just don't want to dominate the conversation.

 

Having a list of questions is fine as is taking notes; make sure the list is either on something small like a notecard he can hold in his hand or in a presentable notebook.  He should not take notes on his phone or a computer.  

 

As far as thank you notes, I think hand-written or email is fine.  Email will get there sooner, hand-written will be more memorable because they are less common today.

 

Remember that the people he will be talking to are experienced in talking with high school and college-aged people.  There will be a lot that they want to tell him about their school and programs.  Approach these like a conversation; they are not going to be concerned about "he should have asked XYZ and didn't"  It is more about getting to know each other.  

 

I would inquire with the schools regarding whom you need to talk to in admissions saying "I know we are in a complicated situation being dual-citizens, having homeschooled,..." Some schools have counselors who handle all homeschooled applicants; others do not.  Often the counselors handling international applicants are focused on student visa issues which aren't a concern for dual-citizens.  

 

[Hoggirl]

If these are not interviews but simply meetings with professors and admissions counselors, it will be OK for you to sit in on the meetings. I would only pop in with questions if I had something that was very confusing that I wanted cleared up (a significant question) or if i saw that DS was at a loss of what to say and I could ask a question that I thought would put the conversation back on track for him. I friendly, short question at the beginning or end would be fine; you just don't want to dominate the conversation.

I don't disagree that it would be okay for parents to sit in on the meetings, but I really don't understand why they would?? What is the purpose of the parents being in on these meetings? Maybe if you could give an example of the type of significant question you mean. I'm really not trying to be snarky or difficult, but I don't understand.

 

And, I would hope at this age a young person would not need to be guided into getting a conversation back on track.

 

As I wrote before we never did any meetings with admissions offices or department chairs or anything like that. Maybe we missed out - lol.

[regentrude]

I don't disagree that it would be okay for parents to sit in on the meetings, but I really don't understand why they would?? What is the purpose of the parents being in on these meetings? Maybe if you could give an example of the type of significant question you mean. I'm really not trying to be snarky or difficult, but I don't understand.

 

Since in most cases the parents are the ones financing the education, they want to have information and an impression of the school before deciding to invest sums that could be the order of magnitude of their home value. I would imagine that in many families, the decision which school to attend is made jointly in discussion between student and parents. Thus, the parents may want to form their own impression of the quality of the department, want to know whether faculty care, whether it is likely that the student can finish in four years, what opportunities the student will have - because all this info goes into the decision making. And if the parents are on campus, it makes sense that they simply listen to the info first hand than rely on their student reporting what was said.

 

In our department, it is completely normal that entire families visit. Nobody thinks this is odd.

 

ETA: Some examples: Parents may want to ask questions if the student has any unusual issues. A student may not feel comfortable talking about learning or personality issues.

A 17 y/o may not feel comfortable talking about the level of classwork he has already taken and inquire how his advanced level can be accommodated, because he may feel self conscious and does not want to come across as bragging. A parent can ask the question and phrase it in a factual, neutral way.

And in general, there may simpy be things that occur to a parent that have no occurred to the student. Something the prof says pops a question in their head. If that was not on the list of preprepared questions, the student may not think to ask it.

Edited July 15, 2017 by regentrude

[Frances]

I think it's fine for you to sit in or not on meetings. We chose not to. Because I was his guidance counselor, I did end up communicating via email or phone with a few admissions people regarding homeschool specific questions on transcripts and supporting materials.

 

Due to some of the sterotypes about homeschoolers, I was a bit concerned that being involved with all meetings might look like he wasn't really ready to be independent or didn't have normal social skills, but I was probably overthinking it. And he had taken lots of classes at our local LAC and grown up with his dad in academia, so he was completely comfortable interacting with faculty and staff on his own; certainly far more comfortable than I was at the same age.

Edited July 15, 2017 by Frances

[Bootsie]

I don't disagree that it would be okay for parents to sit in on the meetings, but I really don't understand why they would?? What is the purpose of the parents being in on these meetings? Maybe if you could give an example of the type of significant question you mean. I'm really not trying to be snarky or difficult, but I don't understand.

 

And, I would hope at this age a young person would not need to be guided into getting a conversation back on track.

 

As I wrote before we never did any meetings with admissions offices or department chairs or anything like that. Maybe we missed out - lol.

I think there are many situations as an adult, when important decisions are being made, to have another adult included in the conversation is helpful.  For example, DH recently had surgery.  I went to the doctor's appt before and after the surgery with him; there were questions that I asked that DH had not thought to ask   

 

The university wants students who are a good match for their programs.  They know that schools can start running together if a student is visiting a number of them.  They know it can be helpful when you get back home for a parent to be able to say "Remember what Prof X said about their international program.."  Sometimes a parent might hear a professor mention something that they think may be of particular interest to the student and they could ask for that to be highlighted.  So something as simple as a parent saying "Are these pictures in your office from some of the international student programs you have led?" or "Can you tell us a bit more about how your international programs are organized?"  can spur the conversation back to something the student is interested in.  

 

I would approach casual meetings and visits much differently than an interview; they are a chance for the school to get to know the student better and vice versa.  Parents don't want to take over a conversation so that the school is getting to know about the parents and not the student; but at that level of conversation I think it is fine for parents to be included as common ground and interests are found.  Universities are going to experience a wide range of parental engagement in those types of conversations and I don't think there is one right answer to the amount of engagement at that point.

[snowbeltmom]

When we took my son to visit the schools on his list, the coaches had planned a daily itinerary - some of the daily activities included my husband and me, other activities didn't  .  At every single school, my husband and I were  included in the meetings my son had with a faculty member. 

 

My husband and I definitely took a backseat in these conversations, but it was beneficial for my son to be able to discuss his impressions of these meetings with us later on.  My son's college decision ended up being decided based on the meeting he had with a faculty member.  My husband and I appreciated being included in these meetings.

[Kathy in Richmond]

We did day tours at CMU and U Michigan with our son, so I'll share our experiences in case it will help you. We also did MIT, but it was nothing special, just a typical info session + tour.

 

CMU: Ds was applying to both the Mellon College of Science as a math major and to the School of Computer Science as a CS major. CMU admits by school, but they allow you to apply to more than one & will give a separate admissions result for each. They also "strongly recommended" that homeschoolers interview on campus at that time, so we did. We traveled as a family, so we were all along for the visit:
 

We took the standard tour, and then ds did his scheduled admissions interview while all of us waited downstairs. It was pretty short...maybe 20 minutes? (he'd already interviewed in Richmond for MIT, and by contrast that was 2 hours long). At the end, there was a chance for us to meet the adcom and ask homeschool specific questions.

 

Then we had an arranged visit with the Computer Science department. They sat us down and went over lots of info about placement, course work, what they look for in students, what they do there. Ds picked a class to sit in on while we walked around campus. Then a student met us to take us on a tour of the facilities.

 

Lunch was on our own, & I also went by the math department to visit old friends. We went out to dinner informally with an old math prof of mine, and talked about that department.

 

U Michigan: Ds & I did this visit. Since we were flown up together, I was expected to attend everything with my son. It was kind of weird at first for me to tag along, but they were fine and gracious! We visited:

 

Math dept office - They gave us a general orientation and lots of pamphlets about their department.

 

Math professors (several) - I tried to stay in the background here & allow them to talk to ds about math courses and research interests. One asked why ds was so involved in math & computer science competitions (and not in an entirely nice way). I'd have an answer prepared in advance with a positive spin, just in case.

 

Lunch with a recruiter & student - This was just very casual. Ds asked questions about student life, and I asked the recruiter about scholarships.

 

LSA Honors College - Chance to evaluate their offerings & see whether or not it was a fit.

 

Admissions Office- Chance to ask questions back & forth.

 

Campus Tour- just the standard one. The huge size of the campus made an impression, especially that some of the CS courses were on a separate engineering campus involving a bus ride.

 

I went into both days with a folder with a list of questions and took notes at all the meetings so ds could concentrate on conversations. We came out with lots of handouts, especially at CMU. Ds brought along a copy of his transcript and resume.
 

Some of our questions:

 

Math department:

Extra opportunities available, especially research. REUs? or in house (like MIT UROPs)?

Summer internships? What companies?

What texts are used for honors math classes

Math clubs & how active

Career recruiting and grad school placement for recent grads

Putnam team - how active and how they're trained

How has the math dept built up or changed in recent years

Are there departmental scholarships available to OOS students

How are freshman placed in the math sequence? Is there placement by exam in addition to AP?

 

 

CS department: (CMU)

What programming languages do you use?

How project oriented is your program?

(+similar questions to math list)

 

Recruiter:(UM)

Scholarship opportunities (there was one for Virginians!) and deadlines, etc. How to increase chances of getting one?

 

Honors College rep: (UM)

How to make a huge university small

Honors college - how big? what types of classes offered? How do you get accepted?

Is honors college worth it for a math major (lots of liberal arts reqs!)

Foreign language req's & Latin offerings

 

Student:

What do you especially like about the department?

What clubs and research are you involved in?

What are you doing on campus this summer?

Freshman housing recommendations

How is the food? (important for this kid!)

What do you do for fun?

Where else did you apply/get in & why did you choose UM?

 

Admissions office:

Do you have a special officer for homeschool applicants?

Rolling admissions (UM only)...do you recommend having it in by a certain date for scholarships; how long till we can expect to hear back?

Financial aid...when do you hear? for finaid? for merit scholarships?

how does it work for out of state kids (UM)?

Do we need SAT2's and how many? which ones do you like to see?

New SAT vs old SAT (yes, it was an issue back then, too)

How is SAT writing test evaluated?

Do you want mom-grades on the homeschool transcripts?

Do you want course descriptions?

Do you want a reading list?

 

Tour:

Can we see the piano practice rooms?

Can we see a dorm room?

How are food allergies handled?

 

At UM, they volunteered helpful essay topics and that they'd like to hear about his academic interests besides math on his part of the applications/essays. At CMU, they had a surprisingly detailed list of factors they looked for in admissions, and the weighting given to each. They helped us choose recommenders, & they told ds that his essays must reflect both his math and CS interests.

 

 

[Hoggirl]

Since in most cases the parents are the ones financing the education, they want to have information and an impression of the school before deciding to invest sums that could be the order of magnitude of their home value. I would imagine that in many families, the decision which school to attend is made jointly in discussion between student and parents. Thus, the parents may want to form their own impression of the quality of the department, want to know whether faculty care, whether it is likely that the student can finish in four years, what opportunities the student will have - because all this info goes into the decision making. And if the parents are on campus, it makes sense that they simply listen to the info first hand than rely on their student reporting what was said.

 

In our department, it is completely normal that entire families visit. Nobody thinks this is odd.

 

ETA: Some examples: Parents may want to ask questions if the student has any unusual issues. A student may not feel comfortable talking about learning or personality issues.

A 17 y/o may not feel comfortable talking about the level of classwork he has already taken and inquire how his advanced level can be accommodated, because he may feel self conscious and does not want to come across as bragging. A parent can ask the question and phrase it in a factual, neutral way.

And in general, there may simpy be things that occur to a parent that have no occurred to the student. Something the prof says pops a question in their head. If that was not on the list of preprepared questions, the student may not think to ask it.

Did you meet with department chairs at the top-ranked schools where your dd visited? I am wondering if these folks are available and accessible to students at higher end schools. I can't imagine being able to do this at Stanford. Thousands visit and tour. They don't give one iota about demonstrated interest either.

 

I appreciate everyone sharing their different experiences and viewpoints. I was interested because I was recently (yesterday, in fact) talking with a homeschooling mom friend who said she (and dh on the visits he attended) and her dd met with admissions folks and faculty everywhere they visited. I was surprised as it was concept I was not familiar with, really. It would be outside of my parental comfort zone, but to each his own. :)

 

I am well aware of investing sums of education money equivalent to the purchase price of a home. ;) Any of those that didn't meet whatever standards were deemed important wouldn't be on a visit list in the first place. But, I didn't have a kid who had done lots of advanced work that needed to be accommodated anywhere. I could certainly see that being a pertinent issue at a smaller LAC. Or if a student had a very niche interest. So, maybe it would have been in my comfort zone if our situation had been more unique/specialized. Idk.

[regentrude]

Did you meet with department chairs at the top-ranked schools where your dd visited? I am wondering if these folks are available and accessible to students at higher end schools. I can't imagine being able to do this at Stanford. Thousands visit and tour. They don't give one iota about demonstrated interest either.

 

We did only three college visits. My DH and DD met with the Physics department chair at University of Chicago.

 

It had absolutely nothing to do with "demonstrating interest" to gain bonus points at admissions, but with finding out more about the academic department. 

 

Most students who do a generic campus tour never meet with faculty, but most of them also never specifically request a visit by contacting the academic department. The admmissions office does not arrange that.

 

ETA: Stanford specifically lists on its website about campus visits http://visit.stanford.edu/plan/guides/undergrad.html

 

Additional Activities

• Visit the Offices of Undergraduate Admission and Financial Aid to ask general questions.
• If you do not participate in our Discover Stanford program take a Campus Walking Tour. 

  Golf Cart Tours are also available by reservation.

• Pick up a self-guided tour map at the Visitor Center and walk around campus at your leisure.
• Explore the Cantor Arts Center.
• Meet with a faculty or staff member in an academic department of interest. (Please make an appointment directly with the department in advance of your visit.) 

Edited July 15, 2017 by regentrude

[Hoggirl]

We did only three college visits. My DH and DD met with the Physics department chair at University of Chicago.

 

It had absolutely nothing to do with "demonstrating interest" to gain bonus points at admissions, but with finding out more about the academic department.

 

Most students who do a generic campus tour never meet with faculty, but most of them also never specifically request a visit by contacting the academic department. The admmissions office does not arrange that.

 

ETA: Stanford specifically lists on its website about campus visits http://visit.stanford.edu/plan/guides/undergrad.html

Well, I guess I imagined wrong! Good information to have out there for others. I would be curious as to how often this actually happens, but clearly I have NO CLUE. I should acknowledge that Ds did meet with a music faculty member at Stanford as he had a trial piano lesson. This was during the summer before he started his summer program out there. We also compensated said faculty member for his time. I believe it was $150 for an hour. This is not uncommon for trial music lessons, however.

 

Guess ds missed the boat on meeting with a faculty member while visiting out there.

Edited July 15, 2017 by Hoggirl

[Frances]

We did only three college visits. My DH and DD met with the Physics department chair at University of Chicago.

 

It had absolutely nothing to do with "demonstrating interest" to gain bonus points at admissions, but with finding out more about the academic department.

 

Most students who do a generic campus tour never meet with faculty, but most of them also never specifically request a visit by contacting the academic department. The admmissions office does not arrange that.

 

ETA: Stanford specifically lists on its website about campus visits http://visit.stanford.edu/plan/guides/undergrad.html

At some of the LACs my son visited, admissions did ask in advance if he wanted to meet faculty members in a particular major and they did arrange it for him.

[Caroline]

Well, I guess I imagined wrong! Good information to have out there for others. I would be curious as to how often this actually happens, but clearly I have NO CLUE. I should acknowledge that Ds did meet with a music faculty member at Stanford as he had a trial piano lesson. This was during the summer before he started his summer program out there. We also compensated said faculty member for his time. I believe it was $150 for an hour. This is not uncommon for trial music lessons, however.

 

Guess ds missed the boat on meeting with a faculty member while visiting out there.

It all seems to have worked out ok for him, so...

[lewelma]

Thanks so much guys.  So much to think about.  I'll take some notes, give it some thought, and come back with more questions.  :001_smile:

 

I will say that the only way we have gotten all the meetings we have at the private elite universities is through an extended network.  My dad and others have put themselves out asking for personal favors from people they know at these universities. And those people have asked their friends for favors. 

[teachermom2834]

We did not tour elite universities but we did find ourselves in meetings with professors/advisors, etc. The plan was generally to take the cue from the person we were meeting with. My dc would be prepared to go in alone but if parents were encouraged to come along we would join in.

 

I think having parents there falls in the category of the 16 or 17 yo not knowing what they don't know. So sometimes a follow up question presents itself just because of the life experience of the parent. Or something said would be worth remembering to the parent but might have not even been noted by the kid just based on their lack of life experience.

 

I think it is fine either way, really. I am happy to let my kids go alone but I do see how parents can help further the discussion. Also important to remember that so many of the hive kids are advanced far beyond standard teens :)

Edited July 16, 2017 by teachermom2834

[saw]

I'm not sure we are meeting any chairs.  Most of them have sent us to professors to talk to.  Are those professors expecting to talk about math/research or about what the program has to offer?

 

If admissions or academic advisors don't introduce themselves by any name, should ds use last name?  Which is the fallback in the USA?

 

We are only meeting with one admissions person, I'm wondering if I should try to make some other appointments.  Being an international homeschooler who is a dual citizen is a bit confusing I would think.  I wonder if I would want an admissions person who focuses on homeschooling or internationals?  I'm thinking homeschooling because they are used to seeing odd transcripts and all the documentation, but they will not know anything about ds's qualifications like someone focusing on internationals. In addition, it is unclear if ds is applying as a homeschooler or schooler.  I'm wondering if I need a separate answer from each admissions department and that they would need to see his transcript to make a determination.  That would require a meeting.

 

My dds applied as international homeschoolers with dual citizenship, coming from six-year programs and a two-year gap between completion of the program with A-levels and APs in between -- so similar to your son. We did not have meetings with any AdCom folks, didn't really think of this as an option given the number of applications they would be receiving for the schools DDs applied to. At every informational meeting we attended, we made sure to go ask the AdCom rep about their situation and in each case they told us that they had on staff a rep who covered that particular area of the world and was therefore familiar with that particular educational system and the exams relevant to that system. I think this is true, although I am pretty sure that some of these reps have more experience than others. As for homeschooling, they claim they understand this and know what it's about -- I think that the truth of this varies by school tbh. If you can get a meeting with an AdCom rep, I'd say go for it. 

 

As for getting profs to advocate for your son, my DDs set up meetings with reps of the departments they were interested in at each school. I don't know what they discussed as DDs did this on their own. I know of one prof who offered one DD an "early read" -- that is, to review her application and then send it on to the AdCom. I know that at another school, one prof apparently gets to pick two people a year from arts supplements submitted in a particular field and then the AdCom will take this as a strong recommendation (I'm about 90 per cent sure this is an accurate representation of what happens, given what I know).  I strongly suspect that at least one of the profs DD1 met with advocated for her, as she ended up being DD's faculty advisor. 

[lewelma]

Kathy, thanks so much for all those questions!  So many I had not thought of!

 

This is what we've been able to set up at CMU and UMichigan

 

CMU

Campus tour

Formal interview

Meeting with acting director of undergrad studies

 

Michigan

Campus Tour

meeting with undergrad program director

meeting with honors program students

 

So compared to your tours, the main thing I'm missing is meeting with the admissions people and a student at CMU.  Sounds like Admissions gave you detailed advice on essays, recommenders, scholarships etc.  So is it worth me trying to squeeze it in? And how can I get a student at CMU? 

[Kathy in Richmond]

Kathy, thanks so much for all those questions!  So many I had not thought of!

 

This is what we've been able to set up at CMU and UMichigan

 

CMU

Campus tour

Formal interview

Meeting with acting director of undergrad studies

 

Michigan

Campus Tour

meeting with undergrad program director

meeting with honors program students

 

So compared to your tours, the main thing I'm missing is meeting with the admissions people and a student at CMU.  Sounds like Admissions gave you detailed advice on essays, recommenders, scholarships etc.  So is it worth me trying to squeeze it in? And how can I get a student at CMU? 

Ruth, I personally found our short meetings with admissions very valuable, since I can get more questions answered quickly in person than over email.

 

At CMU, we talked to the admissions officer after ds had his formal interview. I'd ask if that were possible, or whether it would be better to set up a separate appointment for you to sit down with someone in admissions to ask your questions.

 

I'd ask the math department at CMU in advance if there's a student on campus for the summer that you could meet with or take to lunch.

 

At UM, the admissions department didn't interview ds (sounds like it's the same for you), but they were still helpful with homeschool specific admissions questions. It might be worth trying to schedule a short meeting with someone in that office, too.

 

Edited July 16, 2017 by Kathy in Richmond

[lewelma]

Ok, I'll make it happen.  This whole thing is a ton of work!!!  

 

I'm making ds's resume now.  Wish he could have made it, but I didn't realize we were supposed to have one.  The NZ team just went to the conference center today, opening ceremony is tomorrow.  eeeek!  There is a 9 hour time zone difference (if you wake up early), ds has decided to do the 15 hour time zone difference by waking up later. Typical teen.  :thumbup1:  He had 4 nights to get it done.  :blink:

[Kathy in Richmond]

Ok, I'll make it happen.  This whole thing is a ton of work!!!  

 

I'm making ds's resume now.  Wish he could have made it, but I didn't realize we were supposed to have one.  The NZ team just went to the conference center today, opening ceremony is tomorrow.  eeeek!  There is a 9 hour time zone difference (if you wake up early), ds has decided to do the 15 hour time zone difference by waking up later. Typical teen.  :thumbup1:  He had 4 nights to get it done.  :blink:

 

Oh, wow, it's really happening!! Good luck to your boy!!!

 

[Corraleno]

Ruth, I personally found our short meetings with admissions very valuable, since I can get more questions answered quickly in person than over email.

 

:iagree:

 

Meeting with admissions was invaluable for us, and I think the more "unusual" the student's application, the more useful it is to meet directly with admissions and find out exactly what the process is, who will be reading the application, what they want to see, etc. 

 

For example, when I asked whether DS's application would be read by a regional rep or one specifically assigned to homeschoolers, the answer was neither — his application would go to a separate committee for recruited athletes. We were able to get an on-the-spot preread of DS's transcript, and when I asked if they wanted course descriptions or a book list or other supplementary info, we were told no, that the transcript looked great and had all the relevant info and they didn't need anything else. We also got some very useful information about the criteria and timeline for awarding merit aid (and how that intersects with athletic aid), which was more detailed and specific than what was available on the website, and we were able to get verbal answers to specific questions that they might have been reluctant to put in writing (had we just been emailing). Plus we came away from the meeting with a business card and contact info for the specific person we spoke to, so we can contact her directly with any additional questions instead of having to deal with whichever random work-study student happens to answer the phone.

 

ETA: When making the appointment, I explained the relevant details (homeschooler + recruited athlete + gap year) and specifically asked to meet with someone who was knowledgeable about those issues. That way we didn't waste time explaining everything only to have someone say they'd have to go ask someone else, or having to repeat the whole spiel several times as we moved up the food chain. So when you call or email to make appointments, I would be very specific about your DS's application (e.g. US citizen, NZ resident, education includes homeschooling, NZ exams, international math competitions, etc.) and ask to speak to someone who would be familiar with those specific issues.