MIL needs chemo and lives alone

[Kassia]

My MIL needs chemo and lives alone.  Does anyone have any idea what kind of help she would need and how much?  

We live nearby but want to be involved as little as possible due to how horribly she treated us and our family until she was widowed in 2020.  Well, she still doesn't treat us well but she's not mean anymore because she needs our help all the time (so many health issues, finances, car, home, yard, etc.).  We do help because we don't feel right ignoring her (even though we always vowed to do that when the time came) but do not much more than the minimum.  She only calls/contacts us when she needs something (which is often).  

I'd love to get an idea of what kind of support she'll need at home with chemo.  Fortunately, she's well off financially and can afford outside help even if she doesn't want it.  She'll still need us to drive her to/from treatments (which we're doing now - she's been trying an alternative to chemo and we just found out it didn't work, unfortunately).  

Thanks!  This is such a horrible situation for her because of her health issues and for us because of the resentment involved.  She's become such a burden and it just keeps getting worse.

 

[YaelAldrich]

23 minutes ago, Kassia said:

My MIL needs chemo and lives alone.  Does anyone have any idea what kind of help she would need and how much?  

We live nearby but want to be involved as little as possible due to how horribly she treated us and our family until she was widowed in 2020.  Well, she still doesn't treat us well but she's not mean anymore because she needs our help all the time (so many health issues, finances, car, home, yard, etc.).  We do help because we don't feel right ignoring her (even though we always vowed to do that when the time came) but do not much more than the minimum.  She only calls/contacts us when she needs something (which is often).  

I'd love to get an idea of what kind of support she'll need at home with chemo.  Fortunately, she's well off financially and can afford outside help even if she doesn't want it.  She'll still need us to drive her to/from treatments (which we're doing now - she's been trying an alternative to chemo and we just found out it didn't work, unfortunately).  

Thanks!  This is such a horrible situation for her because of her health issues and for us because of the resentment involved.  She's become such a burden and it just keeps getting worse.

 

If you feel inclined, keep to your boundaries.  She will likely need rides there and back.  It would be nice if she has someone to get her meds for post-chemo days.  She may need meals that she can tolerate (not everyone needs this).  She might need more toileting supplies as she might have diarrhea or constipation.  She might need medicines or gloves for chemo side effects such as cold sensitivity or neuropathy.

[Slache]

There is no way to answer this question. The difference might not be noticable, or she could react horribly and wind up in a nursing home. Talk to her doctor.

Stop helping her. She can pay for a ride. She made her bed, let her lie in it. I know you didn't ask that, but you sound like me and I wish someone said that to me earlier.

[Katy]

Only her oncologist could guess. There are different kinds of chemo and people vary in their reaction. She can pay for a taxi or an uber and get rides.  Some hospitals have busses for just this scenario.  You are not obligated to help at all unless you want to.

[Kassia]

20 minutes ago, YaelAldrich said:

If you feel inclined, keep to your boundaries.  She will likely need rides there and back.  It would be nice if she has someone to get her meds for post-chemo days.  She may need meals that she can tolerate (not everyone needs this).  She might need more toileting supplies as she might have diarrhea or constipation.  She might need medicines or gloves for chemo side effects such as cold sensitivity or neuropathy.

 

8 minutes ago, Slache said:

There is no way to answer this question. The difference might not be noticable, or she could react horribly and wind up in a nursing home. Talk to her doctor.

Stop helping her. She can pay for a ride. She made her bed, let her lie in it. I know you didn't ask that, but you sound like me and I wish someone said that to me earlier.

 

1 minute ago, Katy said:

Only her oncologist could guess. There are different kinds of chemo and people vary in their reaction. She can pay for a taxi or an uber and get rides.  Some hospitals have busses for just this scenario.  You are not obligated to help at all unless you want to.

Thank you!  

We don't have taxi/uber here (semi-rural area) but I think there is a county transit bus you can call for rides.  I've been telling DH for a while now that she needs to use other resources other than him but he hasn't done anything and I can only say so much since most of the burden is on him.  Since it's his mom, I feel like I have to let him do what he's comfortable doing.  Still, it depresses him that she's become such a burden for over two years now and it just keeps getting worse and worse. 

We'll talk to the doctor to find out what to expect.  She had chemo in 2012 and didn't tolerate it well at all but that was a long time ago (FIL was still alive then so he cared for her and we weren't involved at all).  

We have a nice senior center too that I can call with questions about resources available.

I feel like a terrible person that this news makes me think about how it affects us when she's facing all of this.  I don't want her to suffer but just like I wouldn't want anyone to suffer, not because she is special to us in any way.  

 

[Beth S]

Honestly, I would look into assisted living or rehab centers (likely more than the "senior center" you mentioned above).
You don't mention how old she is, but I wouldn't jeopardize your immediate family relationships for this.

I'm sure she's not the first cancer patient in this situation.

We were unable to care for both sets of our parents, so they are all in retirement villages.  We can manage/oversee their care . . . while others do the direct nursing care.

You can also hire a van to transport to/from treatment, etc.

Eventual sale of her house can go a long way in paying for her professional care.
I'm sure she will resist all of this change . . . but we just shrugged and said, "This is really the only viable option right now."

I know you're in a tough spot, but realizing that her needs are beyond what you can offer >> other solutions will come to light.

Edited April 13, 2022 by Beth S

[Slache]

43 minutes ago, Kassia said:

1. Since it's his mom, I feel like I have to let him do what he's comfortable doing.  Still, it depresses him that she's become such a burden for over two years now and it just keeps getting worse and worse. 

2.  She had chemo in 2012 and didn't tolerate it well.

3. We have a nice senior center too that I can call with questions about resources available.

4. I feel like a terrible person that this news makes me think about how it affects us when she's facing all of this.  I don't want her to suffer but just like I wouldn't want anyone to suffer, not because she is special to us in any way.  

 

1. This is a major burden effecting your family, which you are responsible for. This matters. You absolutely have the right to say something.

2. This is what I would expect again. Possibly worse because she's older.

3. Excellent idea.

4. No. This is heavier than you realize right now. You are allowed to think about you, it doesn't diminish your care for her as a person.

[Kassia]

5 minutes ago, Beth S said:

Honestly, I would look into assisted living or rehab centers (likely more than the "senior center" you mentioned above).
You don't mention how old she is, but I wouldn't jeopardize your immediate family relationships for this.

I'm sure she's not the first cancer patient in this situation.

We were unable to care for both sets of our parents, so they are all in retirement villages.  We can manage/oversee their care . . . while others do the direct nursing care.

You can also hire a van to transport to/from treatment, etc.

Eventual sale of her house can go a long way in paying for her professional care.
I'm sure she will resist all of this change . . . but we just shrugged and said, "This is really the only viable option right now."

I know you're in a tough spot, but realizing that her needs are beyond what you can offer >> other solutions will come to light.

She's 84.  She broke her wrist in January and was told she needs carpal tunnel surgery on it.  Then she fell a month ago and injured her rotator cuff.  I'm not convinced it's not torn and also needs surgery.  She's a mess and it's been one thing after another (had colon resection surgery last year after being diagnosed with colon cancer).  

The idea of moving her and selling her house is overwhelming right now.  We actually want to move and have an enormous amount of work to do on our own house if we want to sell - taking on another home seems like too much.  And a big part of this is getting DH and I to agree with what should be done.  I feel like he should have final say since it's his mom and he's doing the majority of the work with her.  I can offer ideas and resources but that's about it.  

Thank you.  🙂  

[Beth S]

Yes, when dealing with in-laws, you do have to tread carefully.  😉  They see things differently!

However, you can still tour local retirement centers, and do the legwork to see what rehab centers even have openings.

Also, you can hire a team to handle the emptying, cleaning, and sale of the house. 
Yes, BTDT.  Our husbands are usually stressed out already & won't have the margin to make these big decisions . . . until it's an emergency.

Yes, he definitely needs to oversee the care of his mom, but I would draw a sharp (refusal) line at you being her nurse in your house.

(This forum is an excellent resource for things like this . . . & I'm sure others will chime in to give you some great suggestions!)

Edited April 13, 2022 by Beth S

[Amy in NH]

If she needs that much help, she'll probably be better off in a nursing home?

[Katy]

In terms of managing a sale, check for estate sale companies in your area.  They will often do moving sales in this situation, will sort and price things, lock everything personal in one room, sell everything else (market value day 1, 25% off day 2, 50% off day 3, bundles of cheaper deals in the last 2 horus), and remove what doesn't sell by taking it to a charity shop.  They take a cut and MIL gets the rest.  It's a much lower stress way of sorting through a house you don't want to be in.

[Kassia]

24 minutes ago, Beth S said:

 I would draw a sharp (refusal) line at you being her nurse in your house.
 

LOL, that will never ever ever ever happen.  I don't even allow her in my home after she was such a bitch to me here so many times in front of my kids.  She hasn't been here in years.  

 

18 minutes ago, Amy in NH said:

If she needs that much help, she'll probably be better off in a nursing home?

Maybe...it's been very up and down with her the past year.  Rehab would have been helpful at times but not permanently.  

 

16 minutes ago, Katy said:

In terms of managing a sale, check for estate sale companies in your area.  They will often do moving sales in this situation, will sort and price things, lock everything personal in one room, sell everything else (market value day 1, 25% off day 2, 50% off day 3, bundles of cheaper deals in the last 2 horus), and remove what doesn't sell by taking it to a charity shop.  They take a cut and MIL gets the rest.  It's a much lower stress way of sorting through a house you don't want to be in.

I'm all for that but DH and MIL wouldn't.  We did that with my aunt's house years (OOS) years ago and it was great. Maybe I'm wrong though - maybe they would just need to look through everything first and decide what they wouldn't want to be part of the sale.  

[itsheresomewhere]

Does she want the chemo again? Has anyone asked her directly? That would be my first question.  Everyone reacts differently to chemo and some can have a bad first time and easy second time or vise versa.  My dad you wouldn’t have known he was on it the second time as he was doing everyone when the first time hit him hard.  My grandfather was the opposite.  Some cancer centers have a link with rides to the center for those who don’t have anyone else to drive them.  It can be free or a low fee.  

 

[Kassia]

5 minutes ago, itsheresomewhere said:

Does she want the chemo again? Has anyone asked her directly? That would be my first question. 

 

I don't know.  She doesn't know the alternative treatment (Keytruda) didn't work yet.  I just saw her CT results in her patient portal and she sees the oncologist (with DH) on Friday.  He said if the Keytruda didn't work, the next step would be chemo.  I feel like she has a very strong will to live even though she's so lonely.  

[Faith-manor]

Please keep your boundaries. Long periods of time commuting and sitting through chemo treatments fives her prime opportunities to abuse you. Ask me how I know! Learned that the hard way, and eventually gave my father a lump sum of money and said, "Find someone else to drive you because I will never take you again." So he found several local friends who were retired who took turns driving because he paid them for expenses and time spent.

First thing, does she really want chemo. You will want to establish that she in fact does. Some folks do not, and may not gain significant time while also losing a lot of quality. So your husband should check on that.

Beyond that, your county may have a center for the aging, and meals on wheels who can provide housekeeping and meals. We now have my mother in law signed up for four weeks of weekly housekeeping and they will even do laundry. She doesn't do meals on wheels because dh works from his office in her home five days a week, and she is capable of making her owns salads and sandwiches.

If she has the money, she can hire an in home CNA if she needs help bathing and what not. Chemo nausea is better managed these days with a lot of support drugs so she will be really fatigued, but not likely vomiting and dehydrated if she takes the meds. She may not have much appetite. But, let her doctors, the in-home CNA, her chemo nurse work on that. This stuff is fraught with opportunities for her to draw you guys in and then abuse you. BTDT got the t shirt.

Make sure she pays a lawn company or local teen for yard work so she isn't calling you about that all the time too.

If she needs a LOT of help, she would be better off in assisted living or a nursing home. You can't force her. You also do not need to let yourself be held hostage by her. There are consequences for abusing people and no one stepping up to care is one.

 

[Idalou]

If she chooses chemo, then she will most likely need help, especially at 84. Transportation, delivery of any nausea meds, foods easily digestible, a portable toilet if she is too tired or weak to walk to the restroom. Does she walk without any aid now? My relative was 80 and became very weak and needed a walker, and had to be helped down the porch steps to the car. They could not be depended on to cook meals or change sheets after throwing up. They needed a chair in the shower. Most of their mental capabilities took a big dive, which is sad no matter what. Is there a county offices of aging? They can sometimes have a health aid visit once or twice weekly during this. Or she could hire a temporary caregiver to assist her with meals and baths.

[mlktwins]

1 hour ago, Kassia said:

She's 84.  She broke her wrist in January and was told she needs carpal tunnel surgery on it.  Then she fell a month ago and injured her rotator cuff.  I'm not convinced it's not torn and also needs surgery.  She's a mess and it's been one thing after another (had colon resection surgery last year after being diagnosed with colon cancer).  

The idea of moving her and selling her house is overwhelming right now.  We actually want to move and have an enormous amount of work to do on our own house if we want to sell - taking on another home seems like too much.  And a big part of this is getting DH and I to agree with what should be done.  I feel like he should have final say since it's his mom and he's doing the majority of the work with her.  I can offer ideas and resources but that's about it.  

Thank you.  🙂  

I'm sorry you are dealing with all of this.  You've seen enough of my posts to know I get it!!!

She is starting to break bones and fall.  Rotator cuff surgery is a LONG recovery.  She has cancer.  The medical issues are only going to get more frequent and harder to deal with.

Having moved my dad to keep him safe, cleaning out his house of 50+ years (I did have a company come in for an estate sale after my sister and I took what we wanted), having a contractor come in, and then selling his house, I get it!  BTDT!  However, my dad is really declining now and I am SO GLAD I no longer have to worry about moving him, cleaning out his house, and getting it sold at this point.  There is enough for me to worry about and do in caring for him as it is (and that is with 24/7 care in his apartment).  And...that is saying something because doing all that 3.5 years ago almost killed me.

My in-laws didn't move either and they both passed away this time last year.  DH just finished doing their last set of regular taxes and the 1st set of estate taxes.  He is still working on dealing with their estate and finishing cleaning out the house and getting it sold is the last thing to do.  It's a lot.

But...whether now or later, it will have to be done.  If you can take maybe 3-6 months now and get her moved and the house dealt with, you will have less work down the road because she will be in AL or nursing home and the house will no longer be something for her/DH to deal with.  No yard, no repairs, etc.  And...you will not have to deal with the nursing care because she will be somewhere that is taken care of for her. 

Give it some thought!  The problem isn't going away.  Even when she is gone you will be dealing with the estate. 

Edited April 13, 2022 by mlktwins

[Kassia]

28 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

Please keep your boundaries. Long periods of time commuting and sitting through chemo treatments fives her prime opportunities to abuse you.

Beyond that, your county may have a center for the aging, and meals on wheels who can provide housekeeping and meals.

If she has the money, she can hire an in home CNA if she needs help bathing and what not. Chemo nausea is better managed these days with a lot of support drugs so she will be really fatigued, but not likely vomiting and dehydrated if she takes the meds. She may not have much appetite. But, let her doctors, the in-home CNA, her chemo nurse work on that. This stuff is fraught with opportunities for her to draw you guys in and then abuse you. BTDT got the t shirt.

 

She does get meals on wheels now through the senior center - one meal a day on weekdays.  They don't have housekeeping but we'll have to look into that.  I've wanted her to get someone for a long time now but she doesn't like strangers in the house.  I don't know how she's doing it on her own.  She does have yard service, too.  The CNA is a great idea.  We'll start looking into that after the oncologist visit on Friday if needed.  With the infusion treatment she gets now, DH drops her off and picks her up (fortunately, it's near our house).  She doesn't abuse us anymore now that she needs us so that hasn't been an issue.  

I'm sorry for what you've been through. Thank you for the support and advice.

 

 

 

23 minutes ago, Idalou said:

If she chooses chemo, then she will most likely need help, especially at 84. Transportation, delivery of any nausea meds, foods easily digestible, a portable toilet if she is too tired or weak to walk to the restroom. Does she walk without any aid now? My relative was 80 and became very weak and needed a walker, and had to be helped down the porch steps to the car. They could not be depended on to cook meals or change sheets after throwing up. They needed a chair in the shower. Most of their mental capabilities took a big dive, which is sad no matter what. Is there a county offices of aging? They can sometimes have a health aid visit once or twice weekly during this. Or she could hire a temporary caregiver to assist her with meals and baths.

She does walk independently now and gets one meal a day/5 days a week from Meals on Wheels.  We do have a county senior center that is a good resource for information but not really services.  We'll have to look into a caregiver though.  Thank you.  

 

14 minutes ago, mlktwins said:

I'm sorry you are dealing with all of this.  You've seen enough of my posts to know I get it!!!

She is starting to break bones and fall.  Rotator cuff surgery is a LONG recovery.  She has cancer.  The medical issues are only going to get more frequent and harder to deal with.

Having moved my dad to keep him safe, cleaning out his house of 50+ years (I did have a company come in for an estate sale after my sister and I took what we wanted), having a contractor come in, and then selling his house, I get it!  BTDT!  However, my dad is really declining now and I am SO GLAD I no longer have to worry about moving him, cleaning out his house, and getting it sold at this point.  There is enough for me to worry about and do in caring for him as it is (and that is with 24/7 care in his apartment).  And...that is saying something because doing all that 3.5 years ago almost killed me.

My in-laws didn't move either and they both passed away this time last year.  DH just finished doing their last set of regular taxes and the 1st set of estate taxes.  He is still working on dealing with their estate and finishing cleaning out the house and getting it sold is the last thing to do.  It's a lot.

But...whether now or later, it will have to be done.  If you can take maybe 3-6 months now and get her moved and the house dealt with, you will have less work down the road because she will be in AL or nursing home and the house will no longer be something for her/DH to deal with.  No yard, no repairs, etc.  And...you will not have to deal with the nursing care because she will be somewhere that is taken care of for her. 

Give it some thought!  The problem isn't going away.  Even when she is gone you will be dealing with the estate. 

Thank you so much.  Lots to think about and discuss with DH.  Gosh, this is all very hard and I know so many have been through this and/or are going through it.

[mlktwins]

1 minute ago, Kassia said:

Thank you so much.  Lots to think about and discuss with DH.  Gosh, this is all very hard and I know so many have been through this and/or are going through it.

Kassia, this is hard stuff!!  It isn't going to go away or get easier.  I really am sorry as I know we have our own homes, lives, families and long to do lists to deal with and care for.

Your DH would have to look through her house before an estate sale is done -- if he wants anything.

Just think short term and long term goals.   

If she lives another 5 years, would you rather her already be moved and in AL or nursing and the house dealt with in the next year (that is 4 years you are not dealing with as much), or deal with her medical needs, house, planning her funeral, cleaning out the house, fixing it up, selling it (which is now part of her estate), etc.  That is 5 years and then all the stuff after she passes. 

I'm sorry to just put all this out there.  Even if you move (whether close to her or far away), DH will still be dealing with the cleaning out and sale of her house.  Maybe from a distance at that point.  

[Kassia]

12 minutes ago, mlktwins said:

 

I'm sorry to just put all this out there.  Even if you move (whether close to her or far away), DH will still be dealing with the cleaning out and sale of her house.  Maybe from a distance at that point.  

Oh, please don't apologize.  This is exactly what I need to hear (read?) and I appreciate the info/support so much!  We live 10 minutes away and have always wanted to move so we didn't end up in this situation but had to get our youngest graduated first since she was doing DE at two local colleges and then covid came along plus I've had health issues for the past 5 years.  So we aren't even close to moving and now we have all of MIL stuff to deal with.  

Edited April 13, 2022 by Kassia