lgliser Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 My son is 8 and looooooves baseball. He plays on a competitive team - it's a new team this year. He's made one good friend on the team and gets along fine with most of the others. However, there is one boy who appears to have targeted Sam. He seems to just be a generally cocky kid. Thinks he's the best on the team. He flips kids' hats off their heads, etc. He has slapped Sam in the back of the head and in the face and also punched him in the back. Sam is a tough kid and said that the slap hurt but the punches didn't. Sam is rough and tumble himself so I am very aware that boys can be very physical, even when just playing. But he says that this kid is not just playing around. He's mean. We emailed the coach and asked how he planned to approach this and what he'd like Sam to do. He said have Sam come and tell him when this happens. So he did the next time. Coach had a talk with the team about touching each other (a bunch of 8 year olds boys goofing around.... I'm sure there's lots of pushing around playfully, but still... they are at practice and need to focus. But this kid doesn't stop. We sent another email tonight because Sam was punched again. Sam takes martial arts and knows how to defend himself but he doesn't. It kind of irks me! Like, he could at least aggressively yell STOP! And I don't even care if he'd push the kid away or something. Sam is getting really upset about this. Like I said, he's a tough kid but he was almost in tears telling me about this today. I want baseball to be a positive experience for him! How do you tell your kids how to deal with mean kids? What do you say?? Sam is blessed because he DOES have good friends so it's not like this is a way of life for him. I want to say something like, "Sadly, mean kids are a part of life...." but then what? I need a script! Oh and DH or I are always present at practice. Usually DH. He's seen this kid be cocky and annoying but ever seen any of the physical stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 Start with not emailing the coach. Pick up the phone (face to face works too but schedules can be tough), discuss it with him, and tell him what you have said here. Also be ready to offer solutions, be supportive of the coach, but make sure he accepts his role in guiding these boys properly. DH has dealt with this many times, usually with boys a bit older, and it will likely take more than a talk from the coach. Part of the problem will likely be that the other boy won't see what he is doing as being bullying/aggravating/whatever and the adults in his life need to take on the responsibility of teaching him what is acceptable. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starr Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 :grouphug: I'm sorry. I like the loud, "stop it!!" at the time of the incident. Maybe his martial arts instructed could go over that in class with all the kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lgliser Posted April 12, 2015 Author Share Posted April 12, 2015 We tried calling. He never answers. I agree it's better than emailing. We will do face to face after practice next time. Should we keep going through the coach or try to talk with the boy's parents I wonder?? Thanks so much :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 We tried calling. He never answers. I agree it's better than emailing. We will do face to face after practice next time. Should we keep going through the coach or try to talk with the boy's parents I wonder?? Thanks so much :) Give the coach another chance first. I would also email with some times you are available for a phone conversation and asks what works for him or if he prefers to speak after a practice. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
City Mouse Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 When my son had a similar issue, I did discuss it with his martial arts coach. My son would not defend himself even when he had the skills to do so. The coach takled with him but I don't know that it helped. What did help was talking to the boy's parents. The discussion wasn't "your kids is a bully" but I explained the problem and that I was letting them know because my son had been advised to defend himself and in the process of defending himself the other child could possibly get seriously injured. (This is what the martial arts coach had told me to tell the other parents). The parents must have talked to their kids (2 kids in 2different families) because the bulling did stop. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Word Nerd Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 Addressing the whole group with a general reminder about not touching one another is not the same as confronting the bully. It doesn't sound like the coach has done much at all to resolve the issue. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoobie Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 Can DH volunteer to be the dugout dad? Or you the dugout mom? There was a kid like that on my DS's team last year. DH was a coach, so he was on the field and not in the dugout where things usually fall apart behavior-wise. A mom who is a sheriff's deputy volunteered to take over dugout duty from a nice but clueless dad. She got order established! Also the other coach heard the kid say something in the field and immediately benched him mid-inning. They gave a team-wide warning after the first complaint, and then met 1:1 with the kid and his parents. He had to stay next to a coach at practice and sit in one spot in the dugout next to the gate where the dugout mom stood for the next week. He stopped after that. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alessandra Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 I agree with the face to face. If you still can't reach him after trying to set up a phone appointment or catch him after a game, the it s time to go to others in the organization, league, or whatever. In any case, it sounds as though the coach is not skilled in dealing with your kind of situation. The team does not need a group talking to. Both your son and the other boy need separate talks, with parents if possible. Perhaps there is another coach who is good at mediating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kroe1 Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 I would have skipped the coach and gone straight to the bully's parents. But, there is no one way to handle this. Just keep trying every possible option until you get results. Otherwise, pull your kid from the team if nothing works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5of5 Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 I think you should hire plansme to talk to the parents. (cf. http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/548355-what-are-your-unusual-talents/?p=6295124 ) :) 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisa R. Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 Oh and DH or I are always present at practice. Usually DH. He's seen this kid be cocky and annoying but ever seen any of the physical stuff. If your either you or your DH is always present, how come neither of you have seen any of the bullying? I'm always hesitant to involve others when hearing one side. Particularly because this is a situation when you and your DH are around, I'd observe closely to get an objective sense of what is going on. I certainly wouldn't contact the other parent until I'd see a bullying situation in this instance. Once I saw a bullying situation, I'd probably even step in and say something immediately at this age. I'd also carefully observe the situation to make sure my own kid wasn't contributing to the conflict or exaggerating. This way, you have a more complete picture to present to the coach and the other parent when you decide to confront this. Presenting the situation with a huge dose of humility goes a long way toward a peaceful solution. i.e. "I know how kids can be rough, and when I heard my son say some things about baseball, I wanted to make sure my own kid wasn't exaggerating or contributing to the problem. I know kids my kids aren't perfect, so I hope someone would tell me if my kids do something like this, you know? So after hearing several stories like this from my ds, I observed at practice what he was talking about. Your son hit ds in the back unprovoked and then later tripped him. I know our kids often do things contrary to the way they are raised. I'm just hoping we can work through this and have he kids be good friends and enjoy their sport together." 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harriet Vane Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 If your either you or your DH is always present, how come neither of you have seen any of the bullying? I'm always hesitant to involve others when hearing one side. Particularly because this is a situation when you and your DH are around, I'd observe closely to get an objective sense of what is going on. I certainly wouldn't contact the other parent until I'd see a bullying situation in this instance. Once I saw a bullying situation, I'd probably even step in and say something immediately at this age. I'd also carefully observe the situation to make sure my own kid wasn't contributing to the conflict or exaggerating. This way, you have a more complete picture to present to the coach and the other parent when you decide to confront this. Presenting the situation with a huge dose of humility goes a long way toward a peaceful solution. i.e. "I know how kids can be rough, and when I heard my son say some things about baseball, I wanted to make sure my own kid wasn't exaggerating or contributing to the problem. I know kids my kids aren't perfect, so I hope someone would tell me if my kids do something like this, you know? So after hearing several stories like this from my ds, I observed at practice what he was talking about. Your son hit ds in the back unprovoked and then later tripped him. I know our kids often do things contrary to the way they are raised. I'm just hoping we can work through this and have he kids be good friends and enjoy their sport together." To answer the question in blue-- People don't see bullies bullying because bullies are really, really good at getting away with bullying. It's part of the dynamic. As for what I highlighted in red, I would never, ever present my kid as possibly exaggerating or contributing to a situation in which I thought my kid was being bullied. It's not a good idea to show a bully weakness, and it's not an honest representation of what happened. You simply do not know if the kid gets his bullying from his parents or not, so it's not a good idea to give any of them a potential "out" to under-respond to the bullying. Strong boundaries have to be drawn. This does not mean you have to get rude or angry or create a scene. However, a firmly worded boundary is appropriate and necessary. With the coach--"I am concerned because so-and-so hit my son again. This has to stop. When can you speak specifically to so-and-so and make it clear that he must not punch or touch other players, ever?" With the parents--"Unfortunately your son has hit my son more than once, unprovoked. This has to stop." If the parent argues or blusters back, simply repeat, "Your son has to stop hitting my son." If the parents bluster back, then the coach should say something like, "If your son doesn't stop hitting other kids, he will not be able to play on this team." There has to be real consequences for this behavior. The coach has the power to make this stop because he's the cool coach. He needs to use this power to make it stop. And if it doesn't stop, complain up the chain of command. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasmama Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 When this happened to one of my sons on a sports team and our attempts to coach our son and empower him to handle it himself failed (he was 13 so a different dynamic was at play) , a meeting was held with the coach and the kid and his parents. When it continued, another meeting was held and the kid was talked to more strongly and told he would be booted off the team if he didn't knock it off. He knocked it off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ripley Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Does Sam realize he can use his martial arts skills to varying degrees? Is some of his hesitation rooted in thinking it's all or nothing? Maybe his instructor can review a few deflective moves with him. And explain that Sam should speak the kid's language, which is PHYSICALITY. Sam doesn't have to hit the kid back, take him down, or get overly physical. He just needs to respond in the same language this kid is speaking. And that means he needs to physically deflect a slap or punch. Maybe it's time to watch Karate Kid LOL. I know many martial arts schools teach that there's a time and place to use those skills. Sam, being rough-and-tumble, may not see this as one of those life-or-death situations requiring his skills. Maybe he needs (your? the martial arts instructor's?) permission to use defensive skills. They're aptly named, after all! I hope the boys figure it out and Sam's season ends up well. Most of all I hope this experience doesn't sour him on the awesomeness that is baseball. Good luck to you guys. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lgliser Posted April 13, 2015 Author Share Posted April 13, 2015 Wow, I really appreciate everyone's replies here. What an awesome community these boards are. We had sent the second email to the coach pretty much right before I originally started this thread and still haven't heard back. Next practice is tomorrow night so DH will talk to him face to face. Ideally before practice. To touch on a few questions/comments: If your either you or your DH is always present, how come neither of you have seen any of the bullying? I'm always hesitant to involve others when hearing one side. Presenting the situation with a huge dose of humility goes a long way toward a peaceful solution. i.e. "I know how kids can be rough, and when I heard my son say some things about baseball, I wanted to make sure my own kid wasn't exaggerating or contributing to the problem. I know kids my kids aren't perfect, so I hope someone would tell me if my kids do something like this, you know? So after hearing several stories like this from my ds, I observed at practice what he was talking about. Your son hit ds in the back unprovoked and then later tripped him. I know our kids often do things contrary to the way they are raised. I'm just hoping we can work through this and have he kids be good friends and enjoy their sport together." Well, like someone else said, I think mean kids can be good at hiding it. But also, sometimes practice is indoors and we simply can't see inside unless we peer in through a little window. Other times it's outside and if we get to chatting with other parents, or distracted by our other kids who may be with us, well... .you know how that goes. Also, I am totally with you on the humility part and I also agree that we are hearing one side. I've imagined what I would say if I approached the mom and it's something like, "I think our sons have gotten off on the wrong foot. I'm curious what Ethan's side of things is." In my head, yes I know boys will be boys and they can be rough and they can exaggerate. But I'm not going to say that, nor am I going to say that "my son is an angel and would never do anything wrong." I would just remain neutral and yes, humble too. I agree that addressing the team as a whole is not taking care of the problem. The kid probably thinks he's getting away with things by not being directly spoken to! This coach is not a dad himself and I think that makes a big difference. I really hope that we can nicely get through to him. I will be going higher up if things aren't taken care of. I want to see him step up and give this kid serious consequences to his actions. Does Sam realize he can use his martial arts skills to varying degrees? That's a good point. We have given him permission to defend himself... it's just that he's never had to do it before and I guess I'd imagine it would be somewhat scary to put what he knows into practice. I plan to have his instructor talk to him too and like you said, maybe show him that he doesn't have to put the kid down to the ground!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom2bee Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 1) Try and make time to speak to the coach face to face--perhaps email him right before a practice, but approach him after the practice and ask him for a few minutes "to discuss my latest email". 2) Brain storm and role-play with Sam some possible "track stopper" responses for when the other boy is doing something he doesn't like and try to come up with clear responses that are firm but gradually increase in intensity--such as "Hey, do not hit me." "For the 2nd time already, please don't ---- me, its not funny and you are upsetting me." followed with a "I have told you twice already that this is NOT fun for me, this is the 3rd time so I'm telling the coach/my parents." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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