S/O Awkward Conversation - DD Attention Seeking

[goldberry]

My daughter does a few of the same things the mother in the other thread is doing.  We work with her on it, but it makes me afraid if she will continue those behaviors into adulthood to her detriment.

 

She is very enthusiastic about things.  She gets easily over-obsessed or over-emotional about something, which is fine, but then she is hurt if not everyone shares that same level of intensity.  She takes that personally, like personally discounting something she is very involved with or cares about.

 

This morning's example.....her science group is talking about planning a banquet for THIS SUMMER.  DD is already fussing about what she wants to wear.  I am trying to get ready to start the day, and she comes in talking about, "You know how I wanted to wear such and such dress, now I'm thinking such and such... "  Often I listen to her and engage when she is talking about something important to HER, but this morning I said, "Honey, that is too far away and I really don't have time to talk about that right now."  She immediately got her "hurt face" on and left the room.  

 

When we have talked this through before, I have explained that it is okay for other people not to feel as excited about something as she does.  That is not discounting her as a person.  Her side is she feels you care about me, and this is important to me, so why don't you want to hear about it.  

 

She is also extremely attention demanding in all areas really, and hurt if the attention is not there.

 

We continue to have conversations, but I wonder what else I could be doing.  What are the odds she will grow out of this?

 

 

[TammyS]

She won't grow out of it, you have to train her out of it.  It's not that big a deal, really, yet.  Part of it is that you have to be ok with her unhappiness at not getting attention.  When she left the room this morning with "hurt face", did you let her go (the right thing) or did you go after her and try to make her feel better (thus training her that if she makes hurt face and sulks she'll get the attention she was initially seeking)?

 

It's better for her now to realize that the whole world isn't her stage, than to turn into the mother in the other thread.

[Ottakee]

Listening in here as I have one that is very similar.

[Zydruna]

:grouphug:   I can see a little of my dd in this too.  Whenever she starts talking obsessively about something that is months away, I might say something like "Wow, I can really see how excited you are about [whatever].  I really don't know how to advise you because it is hard for me to get excited about something like that so far in advance.  I am more likely to get excited right before it happens.  If you need to express your excitement, why don't you write down your ideas and share them with me when it is closer?"  Or something like that.  Just acknowledging that I know she has big feelings about this, but gently letting her know that I don't in a way that doesn't devalue (from her perspective) her enthusiasm. 

 

I am curious to see how others respond as well, since I am always looking for new tools to use to help teach this sort of thing. 

[TammyS]

Ok, mean mom confession here:

 

My oldest son can talk the skin off a person. I mean he will literally kill you dead from talking.  And more than once he'll be talking about his current obsession and I'll realize I can't take it anymore and I'll tell him to shut up about it (yes, I said shut up, and he didn't die from it) because I don't care about what his current obsession was.  And, I think that's perfectly ok.  I happen to be obsessed with yarn and spinning fiber.  I wouldn't expect him to listen to me talk endlessly (and dude, I mean end.less.ly) about it, either. 

[goldberry]

I did let her walk away.   That is what I usually do.  If it is a bigger issue (not like this one) I still let her walk away.  Usually wait until that evening or the next day, and have a similar version of the same conversation... "I know you were upset yesterday that I wasn't wanting to talk about such and such.  I know you are excited about it, and I'm glad, but it's okay for me not to be that excited about it.  It doesn't mean I don't care about you or what you are doing in life.  That is just one part of it."  Rinse, repeat. 

 

As I said, I wouldn't do that for something small like this, but if it was big enough I could tell she was REALLY upset, we would talk later or the next day. 

 

So I think I'm doing okay not rewarding the attention-seeking.  I just wonder how much good it's doing.

[goldberry]

Ok, mean mom confession here:

 

My oldest son can talk the skin off a person. I mean he will literally kill you dead from talking.  And more than once he'll be talking about his current obsession and I'll realize I can't take it anymore and I'll tell him to shut up about it (yes, I said shut up, and he didn't die from it) because I don't care about what his current obsession was.  And, I think that's perfectly ok.  I happen to be obsessed with yarn and spinning fiber.  I wouldn't expect him to listen to me talk endlessly (and dude, I mean end.less.ly) about it, either. 

 

I totally understand this and have felt this way.  She just takes it really personally.  She can't seem to grasp that me not wanting to hear about her lip gloss does not equal me not caring about what is "important" to her.  Important?  Lip gloss?  *sigh*

[Zydruna]

When she left the room this morning with "hurt face", did you let her go (the right thing) or did you go after her and try to make her feel better (thus training her that if she makes hurt face and sulks she'll get the attention she was initially seeking)?

 

 

 

 

I think there is a big assumption here about why she was making the "hurt face"- if you assume that she was making it in a pouty way as a ploy for attention, then it may be best to just leave her alone to sort it out.  However, if you believe that she was making because she was actually hurt either by the the dismissive tone or words (from her perspective, I obviously didn't hear the tone to know if it would have truly sounded dismissive) then I don't think that talking to her about it afterwards is the wrong thing. 

 

If I was excited about something that my DH couldn't care less about, and he responded to my excitement in a way that I perceived as dismissive, then I would be genuinely hurt and it would probably show.  I would hope that when he realized this miscommunication he would ask if he had hurt my feelings and apologize for doing so (assuming that wasn't his intention) and then explain that he didn't mean to dismiss me, but that he just isn't super excited about whatever it was, but he is happy for me that I am.  That doesn't mean that I expect him to allow me to rattle on endlessly about something he cares nothing about if he doesn't want to, but I would expect him to be considerate in how he lets me know that he needs a break. 

[TammyS]

 

 

So I think I'm doing okay not rewarding the attention-seeking.  I just wonder how much good it's doing.

 

It is doing good.  The minimum that she will get out of it is the knowledge that not everyone finds the same things as fascinating as she does.

 

You might also frame it in terms of helping her realize that she's taking other people's time and maybe she needs to evaluate just how important it is to her.  So, ask her, this: "I'm really busy doing this right now.  If this is very, very important to you, how about we talk about it later when I can give you my undivided attention.  If it's not, then you've got 30 seconds to talk, then I have to get back to work."

[goldberry]

I think there is a big assumption here about why she was making the "hurt face"- if you assume that she was making it in a pouty way as a ploy for attention, then it may be best to just leave her alone to sort it out.  However, if you believe that she was making because she was actually hurt either by the the dismissive tone or words (from her perspective, I obviously didn't hear the tone to know if it would have truly sounded dismissive) then I don't think that talking to her about it afterwards is the wrong thing. 

 

 

 

I agree with this.  Often she really does feel hurt about it, because we have talked about it and she expresses how she is interpreting things. That's why I usually try *mostly* to engage with her when I have the time and energy to do so, even though I am an introvert and it sometimes drains the life from me. :)  When I do have to say enough, I try to do so in a kind and neutral manner.  

 

It's just been going on since she was old enough to speak.  :glare:  It makes me worry for the future.

[Guest]

We are trying to teach the kids about appropriate time and place, appropriate conversation, and the level of detail. It's much harder for some people than others, and you're right they don't often grow out of it.

 

With something like obsessing over a summer activity we found the kids do better when they know there *is* a right time to talk about it and we aren't dismissing them but redirecting to the appropriate time. With my kid who struggles particularly with this right now I'd say "this isn't the appropriate time to talk about the details for that. I will ask you a day or two before and we can have fun with it then. Bringing it up again before the right time is inappropriate and bothersome, so let's wait for the *right time*".

 

This has actually worked really well - they know why they need to stop and that it bugs people, but that there is a correct time and place for their excitement. We discovered that deflates them a lot less than just cutting them off. If I've said it already and they persist we get sharper with the correction, but in our house this diffused both tantrums and endless situationally inappropriate levels of conversatiob that nobody else cares about ;)

 

We do try and balance our interest levels, too. I have obsessions, I get it! I'm trying to teach them that they can have the floor for a short discussion of their interests with everyone politely listening, and we return the favor for each member of the family. There is a beginning and end. Order. And respect by listeners and speakers for the attention span of the audience. If they want to talk more than that format allows they are learning to ask us first if we want to hear more about the subject and we can accept, decline, or direct them to a better time.

 

 

This is all just part of child training and teaching order, respect, and social expectations. Some kids seem to pick up on it naturally but some can't read the social cues as well, or just plain don't care. That has been where we have decided to be more explicit on the details ;)

[goldberry]

That's good stuff, Arctic Mama, thanks.

 

DD I think does understand the social implications of it...she just can't seem to control it sometimes!  She is a person who gets very excited about things and it just overflows until some people are ready to stab themselves with a dinner untensil.

[Guest]

Haha! I'm quite a bit like that, myself. I decided when I was in high school to just have those conversations in my head, with myself. So I get excited mentally going over the details, but don't necessarily share any of that with others unless asked. It works very well and I'm a lot quieter now than I was then because all the chatter is inside ;)

 

It really does help diffuse the urgency to work through these things in my head - it's almost as good as working it out with someone else. Really! And my own mother seemed shocked at how quiet I was the last time she was in the car with me. I used to talk her ear off and now I prefer zero conversation so I can think about things. Without distraction. Huuuuuge change, I think she was actually slightly worried about me :D

[Zydruna]

I have often found too, at least with my dd, it is not so much all of the details that she is wanting to get across to me, it is just the fact that she is excited that she needs me to hear.  Many times I have been able to just say something like "I can tell you are super excited!" and nothing else, and she would respond with a loud "woohoo" or something like that as she ran off to write/draw about the thing she is excited about.  She didn't really need me to be hashing out all the details with her, she was just using those as a vehicle to show me how excited she was.  I am guessing that it has to do with being an extrovert; like she has to share it with someone else to make it more real or something.  I am only guessing being an introvert myself.

[Chris in VA]

I get rather obsessive--currently I am very into preschool teaching. It feeds my soul and I've been known to overeat at the Table of Obsession!

I have learned how much I can share, and when I need to find another outlet to share with. Facebook and forums help a lot so that my family doesn't have to hear about stuff as much. Is there another place she can talk about stuff that's important to her?

I either am an Aspie or have strong tendencies (I'm currently hesitant to own the name in case I offend someone--long story). Anyway, it's part of my nature to want to analyse, discuss, delve deep, etc into the things that highly interest me. I know I can be annoying. It took a long time to see that.

[EndOfOrdinary]

As an adult, I can see the frustration.  However, as your daughter I can also see the major pain.  How many other people does she have to talk about things like lip gloss and what dress she wants to wear?  For her, at this point in her life, that might actually be her life.  That might actually be who she is.  It might just be that she is attempting to make connects with you that she cannot make with anyone else.  You acting like it is not important does in fact tell her that she is not important.  The not being able to control herself might actually be her trying to connect with you desperately.  It doesn't look like the way you choose to connect, but it isn't less important.

 

Have you considered taking a section of the day (like 45 minutes of tea time) and letting her talk about whatever she wants and you get to play excited for the entire time?  It doesn't matter if you are excited, you get to play excited and ask as many questions as you can focusing on only her.  It sounds like you have a person who is trying everything she knows to share herself with you and you are not picking up on what she is doing.  An adult would just turn off and disconnect, but she is your child.  All she might want is for her parent to recognize her in her way, not your way.

 

We seem to understand this as parents when dealing with a toddler who is freaking out over not having a banana.  In the toddler's world that banana is the most important thing ever. We have patience to the point of not indulging, but trying to understand where the child is coming from.  Then, as soon as the kid is older, we stop this practice.

 

Clingy normally is just a reaction to not giving or receiving love in the same language.  If you think about the number of things we ask children to bend to in the family dynamic, it is quote considerable.  Many times we tell kids that they are just supposed to follow even if they do not completely understand the level of importance a certain task has to everyone else.  It is an act of them trusting us as parents.  As parents, we often need to put ourselves on the flip side of this dynamic and just follow our kids in the same way.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I hesitate to say this as a mother of all sons and no daughters, but I do have friends with homeschooled daughters and I know a lot of young girls (LOL at my lame qualifications)...

 

Does she need more friends her own age? Some tween and teen girls seem to genuinely need that happy, excited, silly sharing thing in their life. If Mom can't provide it, that's what friends are for. Far be it from me to suggest potential peer dependency. I'd worry about that a lot of I had daughters. I don't know. Just throwing it out there. Some girls' packs of friends seem to be a necessary emotional outlet.

[Jyhwkmama]

My son has issues similar to this. He will talk NON STOP about video games. However, I am starting to see improvement. We read this book slowly and it has several pages dedicated to variations of the "have to talk about this right now" problem.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Social-Rules-Kids--Kids-Succeed/dp/1934575844/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1426108575&sr=1-1&keywords=social+rules+for+kids

[fairfarmhand]

:grouphug:   I can see a little of my dd in this too.  Whenever she starts talking obsessively about something that is months away, I might say something like "Wow, I can really see how excited you are about [whatever].  I really don't know how to advise you because it is hard for me to get excited about something like that so far in advance.  I am more likely to get excited right before it happens.  If you need to express your excitement, why don't you write down your ideas and share them with me when it is closer?"  Or something like that.  Just acknowledging that I know she has big feelings about this, but gently letting her know that I don't in a way that doesn't devalue (from her perspective) her enthusiasm. 

 

I am curious to see how others respond as well, since I am always looking for new tools to use to help teach this sort of thing. 

I've got one just like this and she's 17 so she's starting to get better. Lots of "You know that people who care very deeply about you really aren't that into ___. I mean if your brother talked for 45 minutes about Legos, you would still love him very much, but you'd tell him to knock it off after awhile right?"

 

Get her a Pinterest account for such things and say, "Why not pin some dresses that you like and when we're a month out from that activity we will check them out together!"

 

Also, I've also recently introduced my dd to personality types. I am an introvert and too much PEOPLE, chatter, blathering on and on just wears me out. I took an introvert extrovert test and my dd did the same. I'm a 7, she's a 97. So she was informed by a neutral third party that I just get tired by too much people.

It's not all about her. It's just me.

 

Also, I've pointed out that it is not good manners to monopolize conversations even if it is with your MOTHER.

 

I remind her that not only am I her mother, but I am also mother to 3 other people who don't need their mom worn to a frazzle by constant chatter. She also sees my youngest son who is quite the chatterbox about things that other people in this house feel are inane, and though we all love him very much, he can be exhausting.

 

 

 

I hesitate to say this as a mother of all sons and no daughters, but I do have friends with homeschooled daughters and I know a lot of young girls (LOL at my lame qualifications)...

 

Does she need more friends her own age? Some tween and teen girls seem to genuinely need that happy, excited, silly sharing thing in their life. If Mom can't provide it, that's what friends are for. Far be it from me to suggest potential peer dependency. I'd worry about that a lot of I had daughters. I don't know. Just throwing it out there. Some girls' packs of friends seem to be a necessary emotional outlet.

 

Yes, this Tibbie; As a mom of 3 daughters, having girl friends who are equally as fascinated by the wide world of lip gloss and nail polish is so helpful. My dd's getting an email address where she can send dozens of very silly emails to her friends was wonderful thing! We still have to walk the moderation line (as in limiting her time that she spends on frivolous emails,) but I don't get the drama over "You don't care about me!"

 

You are right to set some limits and gently walk her through these emotional moments.

[Ausmumof3]

I tend to say to my 8 yo ds "sorry Hun I'd like to hear about xyz but I am busy right now doing abc and I can't really concentrate on what you are saying. Can you tell me later?" Then I try to make a point of initiating the conversation about it later when I am in the frame of mind to deal with it.

 

I was like this as a teenager as are lots of teenage girls though some are more so than others. I think most normal people grow out of it to some degree but it can be kinder to learn social cues for reading interest levels from mum than by losing a bunch of friends.

 

We also talk a lot about looking to see if someone is listening or available to listen and whether you actually have their attention (mostly because I'm pretty bad with that kind of stuff and I want my kids to do better).

[PineFarmMom]

I get rather obsessive--currently I am very into preschool teaching. It feeds my soul and I've been known to overeat at the Table of Obsession!

I have learned how much I can share, and when I need to find another outlet to share with. Facebook and forums help a lot so that my family doesn't have to hear about stuff as much. Is there another place she can talk about stuff that's important to her?

I either am an Aspie or have strong tendencies (I'm currently hesitant to own the name in case I offend someone--long story). Anyway, it's part of my nature to want to analyse, discuss, delve deep, etc into the things that highly interest me. I know I can be annoying. It took a long time to see that.

This sounds like me. I have had to learn to sit with paper and pen near the internet and research, take notes, list my ideas, etc. Writing in general is really helpful to me with this. It just works better than pouring it all on those around me.

[EKS]

I think it is important to respond to children honestly.  Meaning that if my son is talking incessantly about whatever his current obsession is, I will tell him he's driving me nuts if he is.  Sometimes I want to engage about it and sometimes not and I'm honest about that.  I don't feel like I always need to respond positively to everything my kids say or do.

 

They both seem to be doing ok, BTW.