jkl Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 We are in the pick-an-agency stage and I'm overwhelmed already:) I just wondered if anyone had any BTDT advice or wanted to talk about adopting :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saw Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 My youngest is adopted from China. He's been home for over five years though, so my advice is quite dated. I can say he's an amazingly wonderful boy! We have been lucky to have had very few adoption-related negative issues up until this point. If I can answer any questions, I'm happy to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamolina Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 We just started the process! We are using Holt International because we found our little girl on their website. They have been great to work with so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkl Posted September 21, 2014 Author Share Posted September 21, 2014 My youngest is adopted from China. He's been home for over five years though, so my advice is quite dated. I can say he's an amazingly wonderful boy! We have been lucky to have had very few adoption-related negative issues up until this point. If I can answer any questions, I'm happy to. Thanks! I'm so glad everything is going so well! How old are your other children? We're hoping to adopt a child between the ages of our 2 youngest, and I think that's unusual... Another question, in no particular order...do you think it would be do-able for 1 adult to travel alone? Would that just be crazy to try? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkl Posted September 21, 2014 Author Share Posted September 21, 2014 We just started the process! We are using Holt International because we found our little girl on their website. They have been great to work with so far. So you found her first and then picked the agency? We just found a sweet boy on the shared list and would love to look at his file. How does that work? How long before you are able to bring her home? Is the time frame about a year when you find your child first? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 We had only one parent travel (me.) We adopted 8 years ago, so my info will be dated as well. We used America World. He was 2.5 years old when we adopted him. Dawn Thanks! I'm so glad everything is going so well! How old are your other children? We're hoping to adopt a child between the ages of our 2 youngest, and I think that's unusual... Another question, in no particular order...do you think it would be do-able for 1 adult to travel alone? Would that just be crazy to try? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonesinIndiana Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 Our information is dated as well. We adopted NSN in 2003 and 2005. We have had attachment issues due to developmental trauma (also known as PTSD). My suggestion would be to prepare for attachment-issues due to trauma and medical treatment while in China. Many down play the trauma aspect of adoption; the loss of birth mother and father, malnutrition, neglect, medical trauma, etc. but it is real and can be devastating. If you're reading blogs that say everything is **wonderful** , watch out. Parenting birth children is difficult but parenting children coming out of trauma that may include neglect, abuse, malnutrition, among other things is not for the faint of heart. Do your research. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East Coast Sue Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 I highly recommend Holt. We used them 9 years ago, and I continue to think highly of the organization and people in it. You didn't ask for advice on upsetting the birth order so ignore this if you want- I think it's in everyone's best interest to maintain birth order and give plenty of space for the adopted child to be the youngest. The adoption process involves enormous loss for the child and that takes a huge emotional and sometimes physical, mental toll on the child. I can private message if you want to talk it over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zimom Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 Take my advice or leave it. Two agencies that have long term good reputations with China adoptions: Holt and CCAI. Compare what you will get for what fees. My adoptions were a decade and a decade and a half ago. Birth order: professionals agree that families should rarely go out of birth order. You are indicating you would be adopting out of birth order, and based on ages of your kids, timeline of a China adoption, a 4+ year old. As a first time adoption, based on everything I know with years and years of research, seeing adoptions work well, ones that have not, adoptions that have been disrupted, kids that now live in residential homes/schools, I can't suggest strongly enough for your first adoption to adopt younger then your youngest child, and ideally and close to under 2 as possible with China. Obviously you would be adopting a waiting child: research, research, research. Both my kids were waiting kids, even 1 1/2 + decades ago. Become open to a variety of needs. They really aren't that scary. Try to remember this is a child, not a diagnosis :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beaners Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 We recently adopted from a different country. We adopted way out of birth order, multiple kids - very unusual. For our family it has been great, but I know a lot of families where it hasn't. Yes, expect trauma. Lots and lots of trauma. We've had a lot of joy too though. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bethben Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 We adopted through CCAI five years ago. She was a special needs child meaning that she had a repaired cleft lip and palate. She was 2 1/2 when she was adopted. The process was very we'll run, but took longer than expected-- even for special needs adoption, the wait was 3 years only due to the number of families the agency was dealing with. My friends who also adopted from China had a much shorter wait. On the other hand, CCAI does quite a bit of work with the children who are left behind and helps new orphanages to register children for adoption. My daughter is a direct result of their work in an under served area. Right now, she is fairly attached but at times we have some issues that come out especially after surgeries she's had to have. The first year and a half was very difficult. I felt like I had ruined my family and did not like my daughter at all. My daughter is fairly strong willed which didn't help the situation. It helped that she was the youngest in the family. It's turning out right now, but I won't lie-- adoption is not for the weak of heart. These kids come with giant holes in their hearts and sometimes love becomes a choice not a feeling. I actually dislike the adoption push some Christian organizations have without having the resources available to help when things get hard. Beth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zimom Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 I actually dislike the adoption push some Christian organizations have without having the resources available to help when things get hard. :iagree: I know I am in the minority, but I so agree with this statement. I just don't think one should adopt out of a 'mission'. I'm also probably in the minority in that adoption has always been a first choice for me, not a back up plan, not a 'let's have a few and then adopt a few'. I did not save my kids. One should adopt for basically the same reason you would have biological children, because you want a child. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HS Mom in NC Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 A good agency will make it clear to the parents that they will all be getting a traumatized child and they will prepare them for dealing with the trauma. You cannot move a child across the world into a new family without trauma. My youngest was adopted from S. Korea. She arrived in the US at 7 months. She was in an excellent foster home with a doting foster mother, worn all day, fed on demand, co-slept with (the norm in Korea) and given excellent modern medical care from birth through arrival in the US. She was still traumatized from losing her foster mom. She had sleep issues for years. There are adoptees who have had severe sleep issues for a decade. It's rare but it happens. Our first year was hell. Expect that. If it's easier for you than hell, great! If it's hell, you'll be prepared. We'd do it all over again and she's a perfectly normal kid but that first transition year was really very hard on everyone. I personally wouldn't consider taking a child older than my youngest. A good agency will have an Attachment Therapist on staff. If yours doesn't, get a name and number and schedule an appointment before your child arrives. My youngest is not a political statement, a charity case, a mission, or anything like that. She's my baby just like my bio kids are my babies. Adopt because you want to have more kids and you love the adopted kids the same as the bio kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saw Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 Thanks! I'm so glad everything is going so well! How old are your other children? We're hoping to adopt a child between the ages of our 2 youngest, and I think that's unusual... Another question, in no particular order...do you think it would be do-able for 1 adult to travel alone? Would that just be crazy to try? Other kids are 8 years older and 5 years older, eldest two are girls (twins) then a boy. We were quite specific about wanting a boy, to balance the girls, and to have a biggish age gap. My bio three are very very bright and we didn't want to set up the possibility that an adopted child would feel like he needed to compete or wasn't good enough. We were also clear about wanting cleft lip/cleft palate, because my brother was born with cl/cp and I wanted to be able to say to DS, hey you're just like your uncle. China was also a choice because my family has a connection to Asia. I would worry about the competition between an adopted child who may have delays/issues and a bio child who has been nurtured well since birth if they are close in age. In our case, however, we didn't get what we expected -- DS needed NO therapy with the exception of six months of speech, was advanced in fine and gross motor and displays exceptional musical talent. So be prepared for everything -- I was prepared for one end of the spectrum of possibilities and got smacked with the other! Be careful with your agency. Ours sounded lovely on paper and in emails. When it came down to being helpful in-country and in times of crisis (and believe me there will be times of crisis!) they were useless. There is a Yahoo group (or was) that allows you to post questions about agencies and get answers from people who have used them. Check out Love Without Boundaries too. They're a good organisation, not an adoption agency. They have some lovely children up for adoption and can give you info on the agencies the children are with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaffodilDreams Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 We used CCAI and had no regrets about our choice of agency. They kept us informed throughout the process, were always willing to take our calls (even stayed late to return a critcal dossier question, allowing us to get the docs sent out that night), and they still remember us 10 yrs later (our child was recently featured on the employee blog at the dossier mgr's request). The in-China reps were incredible. We were absolutely in the best of hands the whole time we were there. I highly recommend CCAI, and I'm happy to correspond via message if you have more questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkl Posted September 22, 2014 Author Share Posted September 22, 2014 Thanks so much everyone for sharing such personal information. About the birth order, we were thinking that our youngest would be 2-3 when our new little one comes home, and if we are matched with a child that is 2, he would be 3-4 when he came home. I have spoken with 2 agencies about adopting out of birth order, and both said that since we are "experienced parents" (both agencies used these words), it should be fine Is that a red flag to avoid these agencies? Maybe we should adjust our timeline. We aren't really young, so that's why we thought we should start the process sooner rather than later... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkl Posted September 22, 2014 Author Share Posted September 22, 2014 Did anyone have an International adoption dr review your child's file? What support services (besides the ones specific to the child's special need) should we have lined up before we come home? Did anyone use a small agency for their adoption? (CCAI, Lifeline, and Holt are all on our short list, but they all have so many families waiting to adopt a child with a minor need...) Thanks so much for the wise words on attachment. That is something we need to think more about for sure. We are pretty comfortable with the special needs aspect (specific special needs) since I was a special education teacher/therapist for 10 years before kids), but attachment and especially the trauma aspect doesn't seem to be discussed much and dh and I honestly haven't talked about that enough (before last nights 2 hour conversation, that is :)) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzanne115 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 We adopted our youngest daughter from China in early 2011. We used CCAI and highly, highly recommend them. They were wonderful from start to finish. For our first daughter's adoption, we used a smaller agency. They were great too, but they closed their doors a few years ago. Our Chinese daughter was 13 months at her adoption. She bonded very quickly to me, but she was terrified of my husband for quite a while. We were patient with her and now she totally adores her daddy. Adoption for us has been one of the biggest blessings of our life. Good luck on your journey! Suzanne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annie Elle Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 Our Chinese adoptions were in 2004 and 2007. You have already been given great advice but I will add that it will be harder than you expected, even if you did your best to educate yourself about adoption and attachment. But the rewards can be enormous. The first few years were really difficult. Parenting adopted children is different than biological. Mine are well attached now and we are fortunate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaffodilDreams Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 When you asked the question about adopting out of birth order, were you speaking with a seasoned social worker or an administrative member of the agency? If it wasn't a social worker, I'd recommend asking your question again, this time asking specifically for a social worker or a therapist in the post placement services department. I also urge you to read up on adoption related attachment issues before adopting. Hopefully, such self-education is a mandatory part of the process these days. Parenting a child who has suffered such tremendous loss early on is very different from parenting biological children. You may as well forget everything you "know" from parenting your biological children and come into this experience with an open mind. I suggest getting copies of Twenty Things Adopted Kids Wish Their Adoptive Parents Knew; Attaching in Adoption; and Adoption Parenting - Creating a Toolbox, Building Connections. It would also be a good idea to read up on PTSD in adopted children, Sensory Processing Disorder, Reactive Attachment Disorder, and anything you can find on trauma from early significant loss - particularly its effects on the brain. Reading up on cross-cultural adoption is a good idea, too. I am in no way trying to discourage you. Rather, I'm encouraging you to come into this new journey heavily armed with specialized knowledge and tools so you can be your child's best source of support. You might end up with a child who never shows any ill-effects from the time before you guys, but if that's not the case, at least you will be prepared and can seek help early on. One last word of advice, find a pediatrician who is very knowledgeable about adoption and previously institutionalized children. Leaving you with this - despite the challenges we've faced as an adoptive family (admittedly mild compared to some families I know), I have never regretted this path. We are so very lucky to be the ones to parent this child. Even after ten years, I am still in awe every day that we were blessed with her. Adoption can be a tremendously rewarding journey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cammie Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Just wanted to share a sweet story - my cousin was adopted from China 18 years ago by my Aunt. This year she starts college. They had a group of parents who all went to China together 18 years ago and who stayed in touch all through the years and helped and supported each other through the difficult times. They all just went out to lunch together to celebrate sending all the kids off to college. What a journey!! Good luck on your journey! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bethben Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Did anyone have an International adoption dr review your child's file? We got matched with a different child before our daughter. We were open to children with some orthopedic issues because of what our oldest son has gone through. This little girl had what was believed to be hip dislocation. We didn't want two kids in wheelchairs, so we got a doctor's opinion. Thankfully, our son's doctor is one of the best in the world for dealing with orthopedic issues. He looked at this very sketchy, very little information file and determined that even what they were putting down as normal behaviors were other issues this child was having so we turned this little girl down. She was adopted the same day as my daughter and she has a lot more issues than hip dislocation including suspected cerebral palsy, can't communicate all that well, and is currently using a wheelchair to get around. He was right. We didn't consult a doctor for my dd because she had a cleft lip/palate and there are usually no big surprises with it. My friend's contacted a doctor for their daughter with PKU before she arrived. Her condition was made out to be worse than it actually is and her case turned out to be pretty mild. For the more complicated medical conditions, I would consult a doctor with the file. You really want to try and get a handle on what extras to expect. The medical condition may be more or less than the file suggests, but it's always good to get a small grasp on it. Beth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagne Posted September 24, 2014 Share Posted September 24, 2014 We adopted our daughter from China in 2010, when she was 3. Our older kids were 5, 8 and 9. We used Hand in Hand International Adoptions and had an absolutely wonderful experience with them. Zero complaints. I have a few friends who've traveled alone to bring their children home from overseas, but I don't think I would be comfortable going completely alone. Dh and I both traveled to China, but he wasn't able to come to Europe last year to pick up our youngest, so our oldest son came with me instead. You've gotten some great advice, so I'll just echo how important it is to do your own research on attachment and to consult a therapist before your child comes home if you have questions or concerns. We ended up only seeing a therapist for a few months, but it got us off to a great start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted September 24, 2014 Share Posted September 24, 2014 But I have to say that even if we give birth, don't we feel it is our 'mission' to raise our children? I have heard raising children as being a 'calling' before by parents who aren't even religious, so I don't think it is that far fetched to call it a 'mission.' Maybe it is semantics, but I don't have a problem with says my mission in life is to raise my children well. Dawn :iagree: I know I am in the minority, but I so agree with this statement. I just don't think one should adopt out of a 'mission'. I'm also probably in the minority in that adoption has always been a first choice for me, not a back up plan, not a 'let's have a few and then adopt a few'. I did not save my kids. One should adopt for basically the same reason you would have biological children, because you want a child. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted September 24, 2014 Share Posted September 24, 2014 I don't know if you would call him a specific international adoption doctor, but he was a missionary overseas for many years and he is a doctor! Yes, we had him review our files. He happened to be my father, but our primary care physician would have gladly reviewed the file as well since he adopted two children himself from overseas. We didn't have anyone lined up and waited to bring him home to get his first physical. He has had 5 surgeries, although 4 of them were doubled up (for example, we had his tonsils and adenoids out the same he had both hands worked on.) Dawn Did anyone have an International adoption dr review your child's file? What support services (besides the ones specific to the child's special need) should we have lined up before we come home? Did anyone use a small agency for their adoption? (CCAI, Lifeline, and Holt are all on our short list, but they all have so many families waiting to adopt a child with a minor need...) Thanks so much for the wise words on attachment. That is something we need to think more about for sure. We are pretty comfortable with the special needs aspect (specific special needs) since I was a special education teacher/therapist for 10 years before kids), but attachment and especially the trauma aspect doesn't seem to be discussed much and dh and I honestly haven't talked about that enough (before last nights 2 hour conversation, that is :)) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scbusf Posted September 24, 2014 Share Posted September 24, 2014 But I have to say that even if we give birth, don't we feel it is our 'mission' to raise our children? I have heard raising children as being a 'calling' before by parents who aren't even religious, so I don't think it is that far fetched to call it a 'mission.' Maybe it is semantics, but I don't have a problem with says my mission in life is to raise my children well. Dawn When most organizations or people talk about it being a Christian thing to do to adopt kids, they are usually referring to wanting to "save" an orphan. Yes, it is my mission in life to have children and to raise them well. But we didn't adopt our 2 daughters from China in order to save orphans. We adopted them because we wanted more kids and couldn't have them biologically. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ We have 2 daughters from China, both with Cleft lip and palate. We adopted them when they were 21 months old and 18 months old. They are now 6 and 4. Attachment issues have been very real for us, especially after a surgery. We are dealing with some pretty intense things with our 6 year old, and we are in the process of getting help for that. I'm not sure yet if it is attachment-related, or not. Some social workers will NOT approve a home study where you are adopting out of birth order. I have known of families where adopting out of birth order turned out great, and some where it didn't. My biggest advice is to make sure the medical information is complete and that there are no inconsistencies. Yes, most kids that have been in an orphanage or foster care will have some developmental delays. Both of my daughters did and they have caught up and are now way ahead developmentally. But I have heard too many stories of situations where a family gets to China and the special need is more severe than reported. Or they get home with the child and discover the need is more severe. It's definitely tricky. Please educate yourselves as much as possible and be prepared for anything. Adoption is definitely not for the faint of heart, but I can't imagine our family without these girls! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted September 24, 2014 Share Posted September 24, 2014 Most? I don't think this is true at all. I think most organizations wish to give children homes, if you view this as saving, I guess, as I said before, it is a matter of semantics, but when I see an orphan, I want him/her to have a home too. This might be an issue I need to step away from as I feel so strongly about it, but I was adopted and I have an adopted child and I am a huge adoption advocate. Of course I don't want people who have no interested in adoption to adopt, but if someone has thought about it, might be interested, I do encourage them to look into it further. I adopted because I want to AND I was able to have more biologically if I had wanted to. Dawn When most organizations or people talk about it being a Christian thing to do to adopt kids, they are usually referring to wanting to "save" an orphan. Yes, it is my mission in life to have children and to raise them well. But we didn't adopt our 2 daughters from China in order to save orphans. We adopted them because we wanted more kids and couldn't have them biologically. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkl Posted September 26, 2014 Author Share Posted September 26, 2014 Thanks again, everyone, for sharing. I can see which areas we need to research more before we jump into the process. We have done tons of research on special needs but not so much on other important issues. If it's ok, I may pm some of you for further advice. You all were so helpful! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
violamama Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 We are 2 months home with our 20 month old daughter from China adopted through Holt. While her first month or so was tough (mostly for her), I have to say we have actually been surprised how smoothly our transition has been. She sleeps well, she adores her brothers and us, and I cannot believe how freaking awesome this kid is. It is probably not the norm, and we are prepared if issues should arise, but I wanted to encourage you. The current China Child of Promise (special needs anywhere from almost non-existent to more complex or severe) program is running around two years from initial application to family day. With any good agency you will get/ are required to take a lot of training. I say that not because I think training covers everything but because you are not alone in gathering the facts and resources you need if you do have a good agency. Holt talks a lot about finding a home for every child (not the other way around). They also support family preservation, have greatly improved the orphanages and helped introduce the idea of foster families, and have done a lot of work with children not eligible for international adoption. We recommend them. Good luck with your info gathering! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MomtoCandJ Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 What other countries adopt to the U.S besides Asian countries? Dh and I are in the very beginnings of maybe wanting to adopt in a few years (ok at least 4, there are 5 years between our 2 girls and I want to get my nursing degree). Any good books I should read? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freeindeed Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 We adopted from China through Holt. We will celebrate five years with our daughter this December. I believe in complete truth in adoption, so in that light, I will say that our daughter's special needs are much more extensive and severe than was originally disclosed. Just be aware of that possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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