Can we talk lack of motivation and the gifted child? (Specifically 2E children)

[AimeeM]

At p/t conferences this year, the same consistent concern was mentioned - lack of motivation and lack of keep trying. It's a valid observation; DD's worst fear is failure, and she would much sooner not try at all, or give up, than face possible failure.

 

Despite the headmaster insisting that this wasn't an uncommon trait among gifted children (specifically gifted and dyslexic/learning disabled), the school's method (threatening to demote to a less advanced class if motivation didn't improve) proved to be completely counterproductive; it only seemed to reinforce that quitting is a good option, she isn't smart enough to do this, and if she quits she can go back to her comfort zone, where she excels, without reaching further. Unfortunately the Head's mantra only reinforced this - "you only have to be good enough" (well, she was excelling in the regular math class, so why stretch herself in the advanced class - she was already "good enough" <---- just as an example).

 

DD is coming home next year, and I would love some feedback on how to handle this with her. How to keep her motivated, interested, and *somehow* help her to understand that failure is a learning experience, not something to be avoided at the cost of everything else.

 

Thoughts?

[Gil]

What is 2E?

[AimeeM]

What is 2E?

 

Twice exceptional; gifted w/ a learning difference (dyslexia, in our case).

[Gil]

And on a more related note: You see that Henry Ford quote in my signature? Those are words that we hear in our house every single day. I have said them at least 100000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 times since New Years alone. I have had to force my kids to do things because they don't want to lest it be 'too hard'.

Its one of the many reasons why MM was so perfect for us--no big jumps, nice steady incremental steps, lots and lots and lots of practice!

We often get failure quotes and discuss them. I have to keep the anti-fear-of-failing dialogue wide open and on going or we get complacent with "good enough."

 

This failure-averse behavior is another reason why we are trying a lot of new sports this summer while I have the time to coach them through it and push them to just do it already. We are slowly getting started with running and I can't wait to set up their personal best books so that they can focus on their OWN performance and not the proverbial "others." My boys are pretty into labels and status symbols but I'm constantly redirecting them to look beyond the surface, dig deeper and aim higher than 'good enough'

 

I openly point out as many of the times I've failed to do something as I can think of. Not because I want the boys to see what  screw up I was, but because I don't want them delusioned into thinking that *I'm* so great and dandy.  Its all good and fine for me to talk about how failure is okay and trying is what is most important but sharing my experiences (1000000000000000 times)  is what makes it real for them. With all of this extra non-fiction reading we are doing now, it is very easy to talk about great inventors, leaders, idealist and the things that are to be admired about them: perseverance, perseverance, perseverance!  Thomas Edison is a fantastic example of this, but he is far from the only one.

 

When I introduce new things to them, I constantly throw out lines like:

"Don't worry if you don't get it the first few times, just keep trying!"

"If you mess up, then good, we'll have something to talk about."

"Okay, lets look at the mistake together."

"Did you learn anything from that mistake?"

 

Its a process. Start young, start small, stay consistent with it.

[Crimson Wife]

My kids get sick of hearing me tell them that their brain is like a muscle and the harder they work it, the smarter they will become.

 

They also get sick of hearing me quote the famous Thomas Edison line about not having failed 10,000 times but just having found 10,000 ways that didn't work. And the one about how genius is 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration.

 

My baseball fan gets reminded that hitters who have a 2:1 ratio of outs to hits are considered excellent players.

 

The motivational issue I have is not that my kids won't try difficult things. It's that my oldest doesn't want to do anything that she can't see a "real life" use for. And unfortunately, she's gotten to the point in math where most of it ISN'T useful unless the person is in engineering or another quant-heavy field. She can do the math just fine, she just doesn't want to because she can't see the point to it.

[Gil]

My kids get sick of hearing me tell them that their brain is like a muscle and the harder they work it, the smarter they will become.

 

They also get sick of hearing me quote the famous Thomas Edison line about not having failed 10,000 times but just having found 10,000 ways that didn't work. And the one about how genius is 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration.

 

My baseball fan gets reminded that hitters who have a 2:1 ratio of outs to hits are considered excellent players.

 

The motivational issue I have is not that my kids won't try difficult things. It's that my oldest doesn't want to do anything that she can't see a "real life" use for. And unfortunately, she's gotten to the point in math where most of it ISN'T useful unless the person is in engineering or another quant-heavy field. She can do the math just fine, she just doesn't want to because she can't see the point to it.

 

Yeah, my Dali quote didn't really fly with the boys either. When I had them read it we got off on some whole tangent about birds, the cycle of life, African ecosystems and I think we might have even touched on the theory of evolution, honestly I'm not sure. All I know is that it went something like this

 

Me: Boys, read this and think about it. *gives them the quote from Salvador Dali from my signature*

Pal:....what does that mean?

Buddy: I don't know. What is ambition?

Me: *gives them the definition of ambition*

Pal: So if you don't have ambition your a penguin?

Me:....No.

Buddy: Naw, but you'd probably be like an ostrich...

Pal: But ostriches can't fly!

Buddy: Neither can penguins, dummy.

Me: Don't call names.

Pal: But ostrich wings are not used for anything! Penguins use their wings to waddle and balance and huddle together and... uhm....sled and stuff.

Me: The quote boys, lets focus on what it is telling us. (they ignored me completely)

Buddy:Ostriches need their wings for the mating dance, Pal! If ostriches didn't have wings, the whole African ecosystem would go off balance because the circle of life would break and everyone in Africa would die. So, ostrich wings are important!

Pal: Nuh-uh! They would adapt and it would be a square of life in Africa.

Me:....I'm going to check on the rice, you guys can go play.

[wapiti]

My only suggestion would be to use some sort of problem-solving supplement to whatever you're using for algebra next year, and work alongside her, making mistakes yourself, so that it becomes more of a puzzle-solving journey.  (I thought aops prealgebra was great for this for my dd, though it did take most of the book to see progress; unfortunately, her algebra class has been of the get-100s variety)

 

FWIW, for my ds11, we have bounced around in algebra even while using a lot of Aops - lots of 2e-ish stuff unrelated to math going on with him that has kept him from giving it his full attention.  Today I'm expecting a package containing Gelfand - I'm hoping to use it for more problem solving next year as part of algebra review (I also got the very straightforward Yang review book - hoping to combine them) - I can't be sure I'll use Gelfand until I look through it.  We may just end up back with AoPS.  That said, both Foerster and Dolciani contain lots of good problems, and of course there's always Alcumus.

 

Mathcounts stuff would work well too - there's a free practice packet with 30 pages of problems, though mostly at the prealgebra level - could be useful if you're doing, say, a weekly review, and/or it might be useful to work on problem solving on a math level below where she's at, i.e., do problem solving at a prealgebra level while she's learning algebra.  ETA, thinking about this some more, maybe it would be important to separate working on problem solving from learning algebra in this particular case.  I don't know - food for thought....  You could even sign her up for the on-line Mathcounts class, as the peer enthusiasm might get her over the motivational hump - might be more fun than working with mom, IYKWIM (hey, maybe I should make both ds11s do this, though not at the same time).  You could tell her that she can drop it after the first two classes for a refund if she doesn't like it...

 

I do think that the extra effort involved in the learning difference plays an important role, so if there's a way to work around it or make that part easier, I'd do it (e.g. reading to your dd?  for my ds where writing is an issue, I like to use a white board as much as possible)

[AimeeM]

I'm strongly considering using Jousting Armadillos for a pre-algebra review this summer, and then using both AOPS and the rest of the JA series for algebra 1 this fall. I like another poster's mesh of the two (on another thread).

 

I will definitely have to do with her, whatever she uses, as both programs seem wordy.

 

She actually likes reading! Her dyslexia presents much more in her writing and spelling than in anything. She can barely compose a paragraph. I did consider NOT doing IEW like I had planned, and just getting the MCT Town package (which, I believe, does paragraphs) and making it a relaxed ELA year for us... but I'd be lying if I said that not working intensively on writing this close to high school scares the daylights out of me, though :P

 

I think she would have much more enjoyable year, and probably be willing to tackle more difficult things in her other subjects, if I laid off the ELA a bit. She loves Apples and Pears spelling, so maybe that and MCT would make a relaxed enough atmosphere in that skill area that she would have more energy to tackle the other areas?

My only suggestion would be to use some sort of problem-solving supplement to whatever you're using for algebra next year, and work alongside her, making mistakes yourself, so that it becomes more of a puzzle-solving journey.  (I thought aops prealgebra was great for this for my dd, though it did take most of the book to see progress; unfortunately, her algebra class has been of the get-100s variety)

 

FWIW, for my ds11, we have bounced around in algebra even while using a lot of Aops - lots of 2e-ish stuff unrelated to math going on with him that has kept him from giving it his full attention.  Today I'm expecting a package containing Gelfand - I'm hoping to use it for more problem solving next year as part of algebra review (I also got the very straightforward Yang review book - hoping to combine them) - I can't be sure I'll use Gelfand until I look through it.  We may just end up back with AoPS.  That said, both Foerster and Dolciani contain lots of good problems, and of course there's always Alcumus.  (Still, in my mind, it's hard to beat the flavor of Aops prealgebra for this particular purpose)

 

Mathcounts stuff would work well too - there's a free practice packet with 30 pages of problems, though mostly at the prealgebra level - could be useful if you're doing, say, a weekly review, and/or it might be useful to work on problem solving on a math level below where she's at, i.e., do problem solving at a prealgebra level while she's learning algebra.  ETA, thinking about this some more, maybe it would be important to separate working on problem solving from learning algebra in this particular case.  I don't know - food for thought....  You could even sign her up for the on-line Mathcounts class, as the peer enthusiasm might get her over the motivational hump.  You could tell her that you can drop it after the first two classes for a refund if she doesn't like it...

 

I do think that the extra effort involved in the learning difference plays an important role, so if there's a way to work around it or make that part easier, I'd do it (e.g. reading to your dd?  for my ds where writing is an issue, I like to use a white board as much as possible)

 

[AimeeM]

I really *love* your quotes! Maybe I'll blow them up on poster board!

And on a more related note: You see that Henry Ford quote in my signature? Those are words that we hear in our house every single day. I have said them at least 100000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 times since New Years alone. I have had to force my kids to do things because they don't want to lest it be 'too hard'.

Its one of the many reasons why MM was so perfect for us--no big jumps, nice steady incremental steps, lots and lots and lots of practice!

We often get failure quotes and discuss them. I have to keep the anti-fear-of-failing dialogue wide open and on going or we get complacent with "good enough."

 

This failure-averse behavior is another reason why we are trying a lot of new sports this summer while I have the time to coach them through it and push them to just do it already. We are slowly getting started with running and I can't wait to set up their personal best books so that they can focus on their OWN performance and not the proverbial "others." My boys are pretty into labels and status symbols but I'm constantly redirecting them to look beyond the surface, dig deeper and aim higher than 'good enough'

 

I openly point out as many of the times I've failed to do something as I can think of. Not because I want the boys to see what  screw up I was, but because I don't want them delusioned into thinking that *I'm* so great and dandy.  Its all good and fine for me to talk about how failure is okay and trying is what is most important but sharing my experiences (1000000000000000 times)  is what makes it real for them. With all of this extra non-fiction reading we are doing now, it is very easy to talk about great inventors, leaders, idealist and the things that are to be admired about them: perseverance, perseverance, perseverance!  Thomas Edison is a fantastic example of this, but he is far from the only one.

 

When I introduce new things to them, I constantly throw out lines like:

"Don't worry if you don't get it the first few times, just keep trying!"

"If you mess up, then good, we'll have something to talk about."

"Okay, lets look at the mistake together."

"Did you learn anything from that mistake?"

 

Its a process. Start young, start small, stay consistent with it.

 

[AimeeM]

My kids get sick of hearing me tell them that their brain is like a muscle and the harder they work it, the smarter they will become.

 

They also get sick of hearing me quote the famous Thomas Edison line about not having failed 10,000 times but just having found 10,000 ways that didn't work. And the one about how genius is 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration.

 

My baseball fan gets reminded that hitters who have a 2:1 ratio of outs to hits are considered excellent players.

 

The motivational issue I have is not that my kids won't try difficult things. It's that my oldest doesn't want to do anything that she can't see a "real life" use for. And unfortunately, she's gotten to the point in math where most of it ISN'T useful unless the person is in engineering or another quant-heavy field. She can do the math just fine, she just doesn't want to because she can't see the point to it.

Autumn used to do that too - "when am I going to use THIS?!". Lol. It was difficult to work through. These days she doesn't mind doing things she considers impractical or not useful elsewhere - she just doesn't want to try ANYTHING that she isn't POSITIVE she will succeed at (and quickly - we have a huge issue here with patience; oh, and with that she wants it all to go the way she expects it to, or not at all - there is no in between for her).

[forty-two]

 

 

My kids get sick of hearing me tell them that their brain is like a muscle and the harder they work it, the smarter they will become.

I *love* Carol Dweck.  Her book Mindset was a game-changer for *me*.  She's got some sort of computer program for kids that teaches them about the brain being a muscle: http://www.mindsetworks.com/webnav/program.aspx .  Bit pricey for individual purchase ($79), but an option.  The book is definitely worth reading, imo, and it's likely to be in the library.  How Children Learn, by Paul Tough, extends the idea of a growth mindset to character - that you can improve your character through hard work just like you can get smarter through hard work.  ETA: And learning through failure was highlighted as a very good trait to develop.  Also, The Art of Learning discusses learning through failure, and the author described how he improved by continually seeking out stronger opponents and learning from his losses; he also contrasts a willingness to lose with one of his opponents' desire to be the big fish in a small pond - his opponent would rather stay mediocre than lose.

 

The movie Meet the Robinsons is about a gifted kid overcoming fear of failure (and is also just awesome!)

 

My oldest has fear of failure in spades.  I tell her all the time that learning is *supposed* to take effort, that when a new thing is hard she is building new connections in her brain.  And I both tell and try to model that failure is no big deal - just pick yourself up and try again :thumbup:.  Dh plays video games, and dd7.5 wants to play with him, and that's been a good source of "failure just means try again" practice; plus she sees dh fail and try again lots of times, too.  Educational apps are also helpful -she loves to play them, and the ones we have are extremely matter-of-fact about failure - no penalty, just try again. 

 

It's definitely a marathon, not a sprint.

[Laura Corin]

I wish I knew the answer.  The only thing that has worked, in the end, is having a goal to work towards.  When Calvin had stretching exams to work for (high school exams when he was eleven) or when he had to get particular grades in order to achieve some goal (university entrance) he pulled out all the stops, in the end.  The rest of the time?  He mostly did the bare minimum and shied away from anything that he perceived as not being his strong suit.

 

L

[Karen in CO]

One thing I found that helped for fear of failure was pottery classes.  A few months of wheel-throwing really helped my Dd get over that fear and learn to enjoy the process.    Improv classes helped a lot too.   A larger problem that she readily admits to is laziness.  Everything learning related is extremely easy for her.  She would much rather watch funny movies than learn something new.   We talk about this frequently.  If I had a solution to that, I'd be happy.   I do require that she spends part of her free time doing something new or challenging. 

[EndOfOrdinary]

My fear of failure still plagues me and I'm in my thirties. I totally stress panic and want to quit instantly even though I know it is very silly intellectually. I hate surprises with a level of irrational fear and am borderline OCD about planning. I even informed my husband that he needed to tell me he was going to propose the week he was considering it or I would probably react in a less than desirable way. I did not have to know exactly, but just that he was going to within the next 7-10 days so I could adequately prepare myself. It was extremely important for me that this not to happen with my son. So I deliberately sought out curriculum with no failure penalty. We removed tests completely for the first four years, and now only test when he feels comfortable with the material. He does not get to know how he scored. I tell him it is for me to see if the information has been explained well. I go back and retouch things that he still needs work on, but it doesn't happen much because he decides about the pace of the tests.

 

Sequential Spelling has no failure penalty. On top of that it is a very good program. The whole goal is to try and spell by ear. Teacher lists word, student tries to spell word, teacher then spells word and student corrects as needed. The only time you can lose points (if you even go with points) is if you do not correct the mistakes. Now I have my son spell aloud, but when we first started I made a big deal out of not paying attention so he could feel comfortable. The student work book also has quotes like "Mistakes are opportunities to learn" and the like.

 

Easy Grammar teacher editions have the work text on one side, then the answers on the opposing page. I would put a piece of paper over the answers and then have my son do the page. If he did not know an answer, he was encouraged to guess. When the whole page was done, he could self correct by removing the paper. No issue if he got some wrong. I was very clear to state that I would never know as long as he corrected it and learned it. There is a test every ten lessons. Those were the basis for his grammar grade. Tests are made up of problems from daily work, so as long as he corrected and learned from the mistake he could easily get 100 percent. With 18 tests per year, he could totally bomb a couple as well if necessary.

 

We watch or listen to a lot of Great Courses, then talk. No test. No workbook. Just talking.

 

Lots of reporting on material as assessment. Tell me three things you found interesting and why. What is something you did not like or found disturbing? Where is there a place you would like to further explore if you were forced to? What are some questions you would like to ask the author, director, expert and why? That sort of thing. There is almost no way he can get any of these wrong, but they often require him to explain himself and venture into talking with me about subjects he knows only cursory bits of information about. They also force him to express his lack of complete knowledge in a less threatening way.

 

I did not handle math very well, so no explanation there.

 

With foreign languages we use children's books in the language so he discusses what they did, not what he did. So we talk about conjugations and word order and such long before I ask him to begin speaking or constructing his own sentences. It is more a critique of someone else than a discussion of himself.

 

All this really de-emphasized making mistakes. It was never a big deal when he didn't know or got something wrong, so he did not really pay much attention to it. We would just move on like it was nothing and circle back later. Now I can point it out and no issue. We have moved to more testing and a faster timeline. He has anxiety still about thinking being gifted means perfect, but I do not know of any gifted kids that don't to some degree. Part of being gifted is a self awareness and coming to terms with the societal expectations of thinking differently.

[Dmmetler]

What I've found is that lack of motivation comes from two things:

 

The first is when something is disproportionately hard for the reward. For DD, anything involving writing by hand is usually disproportionately hard for the reward-but drawing isn't. So, writing is something that I'm willing to incentivize. For awhile, that was "put a sticker on this chart for each word or math problem-when you fill the chart, you'll get $1.00 towards.....(whatever goal she wanted-a trip to a local pizza/games place, a new outfit for a stuffed animal, money to spend on a trip, etc).  I had to do the same thing when she was working on her retained primitive reflexes, and when she had a dance teacher who was really big on form and it was extremely hard for DD to get her muscles to move that way, well, knowing that if she made it through class without having to leave because she burst into tears we'd stop at Sonic on the way home really seemed to make a difference-even though at the end of that recital she told me, flat out, that she was never doing a tap class again as long as she lived, nor was she ever doing a class with Ms. Christy again as long as she lived, and all the cherry limeades in the world couldn't make her!

 

The second is when it's easy, especially when it's mentally easy. If it's too easy, she can't keep focused attention to save her life, and she'll do much, much worse. If it's something done in a setting where it's already hard to keep focus (like anything done in a group vs individually), she really falls apart skill-wise, and then the tears and the "but I can't" stuff starts coming out. Challenge her a bit and give her something harder, and suddenly, motivation goes up, and so does success.

 

 

 

 

[raptor_dad]

What I've found is that lack of motivation comes from two things:

<...>

The second is when it's easy, especially when it's mentally easy. If it's too easy, she can't keep focused attention to save her life, and she'll do much, much worse. If it's something done in a setting where it's already hard to keep focus (like anything done in a group vs individually), she really falls apart skill-wise, and then the tears and the "but I can't" stuff starts coming out. Challenge her a bit and give her something harder, and suddenly, motivation goes up, and so does success.

 

I think this is especially true for VSL kids, which includes many dyslexics. For instance, DS7 was working on the square number chapter in Miquon today and working on the pattern for sequential squares... problems like 7^2 - 6^2 were frustrating and too hard... so we moved on to problems like 121^2-120^2 and 365^2-364^2 :). Both of which were very easy and showed the pattern we previously worked out with rods. Upping the challenge seems to engage my DS and allow him to move beyond the anxiety and perfectionism. Perhaps these problems were so outrageous that there was no ego hit in missing them or maybe they were just more engaging on their own merits... either way it worked ;).

 

[lewelma]

Honestly, it has been our science investigations that have helped my kids through the false idea that everything should be easy, that perfection is the goal, that if you can't do it perfectly you shouldn't even try. 

 

In our investigations, NOTHING and I mean NOTHING ever goes right.  The whole point of the project is finding a ways around that inevitable problems and challenges that arise over and over again.  Mistakes *are* what allows you to move forward and learn something new.

 

Scientific investigations have worked better than my daily words of advice (which I do like Gil), because they know that no-one has the answers for the science question they are asking.  So any scientist would go through the same thing in the same situation.  It appears different to them than mistakes in math or writing, because someone good at math just wouldn't make the errors they make. And a professional writer would not struggle with writing a little story.  But in science, even a scientist like me still NEVER gets it right. Ever.  So it just seems real to them.  And through these 2-month long projects every year, they have internalized the idea that you should not just expect mistakes, but that you should celebrate them because it gives you an opportunity to learn.  My grandfather was a chemist, and his best patent was ALL dishwashing detergent which he discovered while trying to make glue.  :001_smile:

 

Hopefully, Aimee, the hands-on science program that we designed will help your dd in the same way it has helped my kids.  You just need to reinforce that even a scientist would have to go through the trial and error of making and comparing silly putties, just as an example.  In contrast to her other subjects, a professional scientist would still go through the same struggles.  I certainly did when we were making silly putties.  In contrast to math, I could not say 'here is your problem, do this to fix it.'  Instead, I had to say 'Well, I don't know how to make the putty not be a sloppy mess on the table, let's see if we can brainstorm some ideas and try them out.'  Do you see the difference?

 

Ruth in NZ

[gracyomalley]

NO great advice here  - 2E son was my most frustrating kid this year by FAR....hit puberty head on, decided he was dumb in math so didn't do it (and therefore fell behind, felt dumb, etc....), did lots of science so he's "done" with what we had planned for middle school there (he's finishing 7th), read some, wrote maybe one paragraph all year, but at least will now write complete (although almost illegible and with such interesting spellings you must decode) sentence answers to questions...although everything I chose for him was either "TOO HARD - YOU KNOW I'M NOT GOOD AT THIS STUFF" or "THIS IS BABY STUFF>>>EVERYBODY KNOWS THIS"...

 

I even talked extensively with his pediatrician and the psychologist who originally tested him (we all work in the same office)...

 

He did turn on the juice with his music and gymnastics - and although still not practicing as much as he probably should (with his wanting to be a famous violinist and have a fancy car and only make music for a living...), he has advanced and is playing beautifully and confidently (He really has the potential to be a professional and make a living....not sure about the fancy car....but I drive 12 year old vehicles, so fancy to him could mean a place to plug in your Iphone...)...and he's skipped two gymnastics levels, now training with the boys who have done it for 2-3 years longer than he...and a shot of making it to college level.  Really the kid would be happy to work his hiney off in these areas...and learn tons of interesting stuff as long as he doesn't have to write anything down...EVER....

 

He seems tons happier now than 6 months ago, and everyone who's ever worked with him has pointed out the importance of his "islands of excellence" and his extreme anxiety with failure/risk aversion.....except now he's taking all sorts of risks musically and athletically....isn't the theory that this will spill over to his school work?  We even talked about brick and mortar school, but there are no options for a good private school that we can afford and keep him in music ( although I say he doesn't practice enough - he still does 2-3 hours of practice, classes or performing a day)...and the idea of public middle school for this kiddo gives me nightmares...not socially - he says if anyone thinks you aren't cool you just smile and do a standing back tuck and they "know you are cool..." - its academically that I can't imagine him there....his processing speed is still in the single digits percentage wise...

 

In desperation, I got him TT algebra last month and told him if he wants credit (mommy credit) for a year of algebra he has to finish it and 1/2 of TT algebra 2....he's on lesson 31...had skated through K12 pre-algebra last year (I was trying to limit writing) without learning much at all - then the 6 months of almost no math - so he's out of practice - but its getting a bit better....I've given up on formal spelling, he must write and we will correct - word processing, etc...he has started texting friends and uses his baby brother to help with spelling...so improvement or at least some effort going into learning it...he has an almost photographic memory - so as long as he doesn't try to apply all the phonics I taught him, he spells some words right!  We are setting goals for 8th grade and I am trying to get him to "own" what he wants to do with high school - basics to get through and into conservatory  - or more truely college prep....it is "killing me" to see this really very smart kid do basic work - but then I watch him play a concerto or do a double back into the pit at gym..and the smiles and confidence are huge...I just hope he can make a living someday!!!

[Pen]

This is a struggle here too.

 

I am using AoPS mainly to have something that forces it to be confronted, rather than a program where 100% is reached all the time.

[AimeeM]

This is a struggle here too.

 

I am using AoPS mainly to have something that forces it to be confronted, rather than a program where 100% is reached all the time.

 

I'm looking at AOPS too. I'm going to do a pre-algebra review with her using Jousting Armadillos this summer, and then see if she likes AOPS. Because it's so wordy, I realize it will be more team reading than independent, but I think I'm cool with that :P

[ElizabethB]

I'm looking at AOPS too. I'm going to do a pre-algebra review with her using Jousting Armadillos this summer, and then see if she likes AOPS. Because it's so wordy, I realize it will be more team reading than independent, but I think I'm cool with that :P

When my dyslexic students have been able to decode nonsense words, it makes everything else click and makes everything else easier, it's like a light bulb turns on in their brain. I would try a trial of a month or two just working on nonsense words and syllables and syllable divided words and see how she progresses.

 

I would definitely read everything else to her for a few months at least.

[SnegurochkaL]

I hear you!

I see the lack of motivations among my 2 oldest kids: DD11 and DS7. They are both accelerated students but their brains wired differently. My son's cursive handwriting is much neater than my daughter's. He is a very detail oriented person whose logical abilities are superior than my daughter's, but it takes a lot of efforts to motivate him to do  spelling verses to do the math. I do not need to ask my boy to build a model of a car designed by him few minutes earlier. My encouragement to work on spelling doesn't give the result I want to see-learning spelling on his own. Once he told me that it wasn't essential because he could diagram his designs using a special code instead of words.He has it in his head so no need to explain what all his signs mean.  Sometimes he does the same in his workbooks so I need to decipher what was written asking my daughter for some help. They both do not like spelling. They adore science, engineering, math and like making things. They are learning how to program. We use dry-erase board a lot so if a mistake is made it could be corrected immediately. For my daughter it is  easy to erase the whole word than finding the place where the mistake was made.

 

Any ideas how to motivate them to be better spellers?

 

P.S. My daughter is "writing" a book about time-traveling but it is more likely coding/narrating it to me  because she misspelled so many words( she skips vowels or switch letter places inside the same word). She is linguistically gifted having a good ear for foreign languages, but she struggles with English  spelling a lot.

I signed them up for 3 weeks Science Summer camps which are located 1 hour away, so I remind them that I will not be driving them there unless they work on their spelling. It works only for a short period of time and they need to be reminded again.