Help me with my two biggest obstacles in my homeschool right now

[plain jane]

We are having a good academic year so far.  The kids are eager to learn and compliant about doing their work.  However, we are not progressing as much as I would like and this problem is twofold.  One, my kids are highly distractible.  One child will comment how cute the puppy looks and next thing I know all 4 of them are petting it or at least staring at it.  Before I know it, 15 minutes has gone by.  This happens often.  If it's not the puppy, it's the mailman outside, or the fish, or .... well, you get the point.  How on earth do I cut this out?  I've tried punishing the one who distracts everyone else but it's hard to keep track of and then I get tears.  "Well, I didn't MEAN to get them all to look"  blah blah blah.  Clearly that is not solving anything.  I know I can't be the only mom who has this issue.  Truth be told, this is likely sucking up to two hours of our day each and every day.  Honestly.  We all sit down and start around 9:30 each day but by the time 8:00pm rolls around most days we are still not done.  But, it's not like they are working the whole time because inevitably, they have been distracted by _____ for long periods of time or so many different times that add up to one long period of time.

 

My next problem?  All the kids' subjects are very teacher intensive and they need me more often than I am free.  For example, my oldest 3 do R&S grammar.  That program doesn't really teach itself.  Well, it does, but then it is a TON of writing for them and they complain.  But if I sit and do it orally with them, it's 20min of time x 3 = one hour.  And I need to find things to keep the other 2 working on independently while I do grammar  with the one.  I eventually run out of things for my kids to do independently.  I am having a difficult time juggling four of them this year.  Yes, my 7th grader is very independent but she needs me for a lot of things simply because they are more complicated- BJU science, for example.  Even WWS2 is not very independent.  She can do it on her own but gets more out of it when I spend the time to do aspects of it with her.  This all takes time and my younger 3 can't do science on their own, nor can they do their writing programs 100% on their own (one is doing CC and the other is doing IEW).  I find it very difficult to keep them all going when they all need me so much.  The biggest challenge has been my K'er who needs me constantly.  I feel like I can never leave his side and this has caused the others to wait for me and fall behind.  So, I stopped working with him as much and now he is falling behind and not reading yet.  Round and round we go.

 

I don't even have that big of a family.  4 kids is not many to be teaching yet for some reason I'm finding it very complicated.  What am I missing?

 

Most days I can't get around to teaching Latin because we just run out of time.  And I'm running 3 Latin programs.  SF for my oldest, LC for middle, and PL for smallest.  Ugh.  I feel like they sit around waiting for me to teach them their lesson or review with them.  If I make them review on their own, they think they know the material when they really don't and we have had to back track weeks of lessons because they didn't really know the material.

 

I also have a child who is a complete dawdler.  It doesn't help when I try to time things so I work with one child and others are independent and then it's this child's turn to work with me and this child is no where near ready for time with me.  Often I make this child put the undone work away for homework so that I can continue with their lesson in the next subject but sadly, we never seem to get back around to the "homework" and that translates to picking up the next day.  Do that enough times and we end up behind.  Not horribly behind.  A week behind sometimes, before I say enough and make this child work Saturday and Sunday.  But that's no fun for anyone when we can't go swimming or to the park because one child needs to do work.  (child is not old enough to stay home alone and I don't always have dh around to stay home with them).

 

So how does it all come together?  I really need some tips.

 

ETA: My school aged kids are grades K, 2, 4, 7

[Mrs Twain]

Those are difficult questions! I just have a couple of ideas.

 

Could you start school earlier with you older kids? How about starting at 8:00 or 8:30 to go over math and grammar. When the older ones are doing their assignments, then start the younger ones on their school work.

 

I always do our most difficult subjects in the first 1.5 hours (math and grammar). Then we have a 30 min break. Then the next two hardest subjects (writing, spelling). Then a break. Etc. would scheduling breaks every 1.5 hours help? I find that my kids are drained after 1.5 hours of work and need a break to refresh.

 

It sounds like your kids are all together when they are working, perhaps at the kitchen table or a table in a school room? That doesn't work well for us. During the first half of the morning for all of our difficult subjects, my kids are working by themselves at their own desks in their bedrooms. Though it hasn't solved the problem completely because two of them share a bedroom, it has cut down on a a lot of the distractions.

 

These are just a few ideas in case they would help. Whenever I need wisdom I always ask God. He has helped more than any other source of advice!

[My3girls]

I have 3, but what I do is work with dd12 first in the morning For about 1.5 hours then send her off to do her independent work. Then I work with dd8, do lessons that can be done together for dd8 & 7, then work with dd7 for a total of about 1.5-2 hrs. When dd12 is done with her independent work then we go over it. We do our read alouds, tandem reads, and free reads in the evening all together. This takes about 5 hours of my time total, but dd12 does 6 hours of work and the youngers do 4.

[Ellie]

So, you have a 12yo, a 9yo, a 7yo, and a 5yo.

 

I would expect the 12yo and 9yo to do their R&S English pretty independently (you'd want to have them read their assignments carefully to be sure that they are not writing more than they are supposed to be). You should never have to spend more than about 5 or 10 minutes with the English, because everything the dc need to know is right there in their textbooks. Complaining would be a discipline issue. Your 7yo should be able to do much of his English independently, as well. Ditto on the complaining.

 

Being "distracted" by the puppy? Discipline issue. There's no reason for a 7yo, a 9yo and a 12yo to be "distracted" by random things that go on, such that they're going to all get up from the table and whatnot (unless they have other identified issues, which you did not indicate). I'd have a little more mercy for the 5yo...but not much.

 

If the three olders are all doing R&S for English, there's no reason to add in a separate, additional writing program. Even if you think the other writing programs are good, the fact is that R&S's writing instruction is also quite good, and it's already right there in their English texts.

 

I would not expect a 5yo to be reading "yet." If he needs you "constantly by his side," unless he has issues you didn't tell us about, that could also be a discipline problem.

 

A good goal for Latin and English would be for two dc to be doing English while you're doing Latin with the third, and then you rotate English and Latin around that way. Again, there will be discipline aspects of this.

[Guest pearlprice22]

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[Mrs Twain]

With R&S English, you could try it independently, with a standing assignment to complete all of the odd problems. I go over the review from the TM and the lesson from the student book with my kids, and then I pick which exercises to write. It does takes some time, but not as much as going through the entire lesson orally.

[Ellie]

Goodness, I think distraction is just a normal part of human behavior. I redirect. 'Yes, the puppy is cute. Now, we were working on our times tables' or whatever.

 

To a certain extent, of course. For the OP's dc, however, it turns into a free-for-all in a heartbeat, possibly multiple times a day, and she's losing a great deal of time over it.

[Ravin]

Loop scheduling has helped us get around to subjects that would be lost because they get shoved to the end of the day and not gotten round to. Do the children work on independent things while waiting for turns on the teacher intensive stuff?

 

As for the distractions, I can relate, even though DD has only herself to distract. Firm but gentle redirection helps some. Yesterday, it took her half an hour to set up to do band practice--brushing teeth, assembling music stand and instrument, etc. Baffling.

 

Planning ahead, is there anything you presently have broken apart that could be combined next semester or year ?

[boscopup]

I used R&S English independently with my 9 year old. I simply told him which exercises to do (roughly half). The writing helped get the grammar to stick well. I had him come do oral exercises with me if it was a new topic. If you assign half the exercises, it really isn't THAT much writing. My son is writing phobic and was able to do the grade 5 book's writing amount. He was also doing another writing program (we skipped some of the writing assignment lessons in R&S).

[Haiku]

My kids get distracted very easily, as well, in all aspects of life. During school, I just say, "That's not what we are doing right now. Focus." I have to say it multiple times a day, and it's annoying, but I just keep saying it. It does keep them more on task. I also do not allow them to get up from the table except during designated breaks.

 

For the challenge of having too many programs going on at the same time, is it possible you could combine the kids in some subjects? Or have them all working on math at the same time, for example, and just go from child to child, checking their work and answering questions? I have my kids working on the same subjects at the same time, for the most part. Also, you may just have to find less teacher-intensive programs. Having been through all 4 levels of WWE, I have to say that this is a program that was never meant to be done independently.  

 

I wouldn't expect a Ker to work independently. Try to fold him into what you are doing with the rest of the kids, giving him work or asking him questions at his level.

 

 

[Mom22ns]

So, you have a 12yo, a 9yo, a 7yo, and a 5yo.

 

No the OP has a K, 2, 4, 7. None of those are old enough to be very independent.

[Haiku]

No the OP has a K, 2, 4, 7. None of those are old enough to be very independent.

 

No, her kids are GRADES K, 2, 4, 7. That would be about 5, 7, 9, and 12.

[Mom22ns]

Oops. Thanks Tara. My bad!

[Ellie]

No, her kids are GRADES K, 2, 4, 7. That would be about 5, 7, 9, and 12.

 

Exactly what I said first thing in my reply. :-)

[Critterfixer]

It might be useful to see your schedule for working with your children and how you structure your day. You might also list the curricula for each child and the approximate time you think it takes them to complete that subject, (and how much time you think it should take for the dawdler!)

It shouldn't be taking you from 9:30 in the morning until 8 at night to get a full day of school done! I don't wonder that you are very frustrated.

[freesia]

We don't all work in the same place and at the same time so there is less distraction. Here is the "flow" of our day.

8:15 all together for Bible teaching, then spread around the house for personal devotions.

8:45 I meet on the couch with oldest, we go over his planner, I check is grammar (Rod and Staff), assign him to read the next section independently, assign exercises (usually odds). Sometimes I do the oral review. He then goes to work independently--on the couch, in the family room, or in my room if he is having a distract-able day.

 

9:00 2 youngest watch Cat in the Hat downstairs in family room. I meet with #2 at dining room table. I read her the Rod and Staff lesson and assign her odds. If we have time we might do some of it orally. We do spelling (Apples and Pears--parent directed), go over the math lesson, check her WWS, do a Greek mini-lesson. This all takes about 1/2 hour. No distractions bc we are alone.

 

9:30 Meet with child #3--again alone. We do Apples and Pears, math, handwriting, Daily Language Review, IEW. Child #2 and #1 are working in living room or her/his room or doing chores. Child #4 has been taught not to interrupt so she works on crafts, Starfall, plays with her stuffed animals, bothers the cat."-)

 

10:15 Break--lots of distractions

10:30 Memory work and history read alouds/activities

11:00 More work with #3(anything we didn't finish earlier), science or picture books with #3 and #4--others spread around house. Then I fit in some pre-school work with #4.

11:45 meet with oldest again for lit discussion or LTOW--others spread around the house

 

Then independent work, outside time, projects if I feel up to it, music practice, etc. I help children as they need help or when I can make time. They are usually spread around the house, but at this point I don't mind distractions bc they need to work until they finish, even, gasp, if it's after dinner.

 

So, really, my key is to have intense one on one time and then spread them around the house. LOL Sorry it took a book to explain it all, but maybe it will be helpful.

[plain jane]

It might be useful to see your schedule for working with your children and how you structure your day. You might also list the curricula for each child and the approximate time you think it takes them to complete that subject, (and how much time you think it should take for the dawdler!)

It shouldn't be taking you from 9:30 in the morning until 8 at night to get a full day of school done! I don't wonder that you are very frustrated.

 

I know!!  :willy_nilly:   They definitely are not working the whole time and we have an hour long break for dinner and around 45min for lunch... but still.  I know it shouldn't take this long.

 

I have not found a schedule that works.  Whatever I try seems to have some sort of flaw.  I can list what all they are doing ... maybe that will help?  I will list in a new post.... if I can get everyone settled and working.  :unsure: 

[Critterfixer]

 

I have not found a schedule that works.  Whatever I try seems to have some sort of flaw.  I can list what all they are doing ... maybe that will help?  I will list in a new post.... if I can get everyone settled and working.

It might give those with four or more a chance to figure out where you can save time or cut. I only have two, so I probably wouldn't be able to come up with a lot of suggestions for the scheduling, but there has to be something that would work! I mean, anything that cuts an hour or two off your day now would be an improvement, right?

[Lucy]

For my older kids, When they were complained about how long the day was, I once took a day with a timer and timed how long the actual work took for each subject.  For example:  I set the timer to start as they began history and then they pushed stop when it finished.  17 minutes.  Then we did math.  Then we timed reading.  Etc.  At the end of the day they totaled up their "work time" and saw that it was many hours shorter than they thought.  Then we talked about how quickly they could be done with the day if they didn't dawdle during transition time.  We also outlined other fun things they could use that saved time doing.  Worked really well!

[kbutton]

For my older kids, When they were complained about how long the day was, I once took a day with a timer and timed how long the actual work took for each subject.  For example:  I set the timer to start as they began history and then they pushed stop when it finished.  17 minutes.  Then we did math.  Then we timed reading.  Etc.  At the end of the day they totaled up their "work time" and saw that it was many hours shorter than they thought.  Then we talked about how quickly they could be done with the day if they didn't dawdle during transition time.  We also outlined other fun things they could use that saved time doing.  Worked really well!

 

This has helped us at times, though we've done it a bit differently than described here. There are many variations of how to show the kids what they are missing. If you think your kids would be responsive, I really recommend something like this. Some kids need help connecting the dots between actions and consequences, esp. as part of "group" behavior.

 

I have an Aspie with some anxiety around school issues and some attention issues. Our biggest trouble is that none of it is consistent. On any given day, he could be completely compliant and productive, completely the opposite, or somewhere in between. If your distractible, dawdler types are consistent, then you could take notes and formulate a game plan. This doesn't mean they won't pull out some unexpected strategies to derail things another way, but you have some options that you can work with. If one thing seems to be underlying a lot of the behaviors, you might be able to hit on one solution and work hard to implement it. If not, you might have to tease out one problem at a time (discipline or otherwise), and focus on each problem individually. If you are consistent, each successive problem should get a bit easier (esp. if you start with the "worst" behavior first).

 

Sometimes it's not behavior. For instance, last year, my Asperger's kiddo was reasonably fine until Thursday, and then it all went to you-know-where in a handbasket for days at a time. He couldn't handle being out "late" on Wednesday night for church. We had to quit Wed. night church. This year, it's going okay, but last year, it was just too much. If it's a discipline issue, the underlying cause probably won't require such a drastic solution.

 

My kids can't ever be in the same room unless we are doing exactly the same activity (both doing the same science lesson). Sometimes they can be together if they are facing different directions and not doing an activity that involves talking out loud with me, but we don't have much opportunity to work that way. Once you've separated them (if that helps), you'll have to find a way to keep tabs on them. You might have to train them as to exactly what you want them to do if they have to wait their turn for something after they are finished an assignment. Maybe you can give them a load of towels, and tell them to fold towels after their work is done until you get to them (or do a puzzle, etc. if they can handle switching between work and play). Training the kids to tell you when they are finished and find an acceptable thing to do while waiting is not necessarily easy, esp. if they are not in the room with you. Make it their problem if they "fall off your radar."

 

On the negative reinforcement side of things...sometimes it's been so bad that I need to penalize a child for dawdling. If he derails things for 1/2 an hour with totally pointless activity (or whining, stalling, etc.), sometimes I make him sit on the couch, the bed, etc. for half an hour doing nothing before he is allowed to work, play, etc. In other words, if he wastes my time (the family's time), I waste his right back. (Lest you think I'm totally mean and into retribution, the therapist that works with my son because of his Asperger's totally approved this strategy.) He takes it pretty seriously. My younger son doesn't need and could not handle anything this negative or heavy-handed. By the time they my older one is back to his work, he's now lost an hour rather than a 1/2 hour. It speaks volumes.

 

Also, it seems to be temperamentally part of my kids' personalities to not take things seriously until someone gets angry (not just irritated or peeved--angry). This appears to run in the family and probably reflects some of the soft skills that are missing because of developmental issues. Substituting negative reinforcement for getting angry is often the only way some kids will take things seriously. We also have trouble with the kids talking over each other, completely ignoring parents when the parents are talking, etc. We have to police that more harshly than we'd like to, or that feeds into the distractions.

[SnMomof7]

Some good ideas here. I have some dawdling going n here as well, but I couldn't do it at all with my 5 (only 3 schooling) without leaning heavily on self-directed materials for my oldest. 7-yo and 5-yo still need me for almost everything.