Best Geometry and Algebra Courses for Independent Learners

[Katie Jean]

I really need help deciding which Algebra and Geometry courses to order for my 9th and 10th graders next year. Both need lessons given and watching videos is best. Something that can monitor their progress would be ideal as well. TT is not an option. Not rigorous enough IMO but we don't want anything too intense either.

Anyone with experience with Kinetic Books? How about the D.I.V.E. CDs?

[Julie in MN]

My son used Math Relief for Algebra 1 and 2, There is a sample video here http://www.mathrelief.com/

Mr. Firebaugh is like the "Mr. Rogers" of Algebra, but he's done an excellent job of teaching a thorough coverage of Algebra for both my slower student and my very mathy student. It's Mr. Firebaugh's gift, I think.

 

Ds used Teaching Textbooks for Geometry. I am not sure I'd use TT Algebra, but their Geometry was just as good as others, IMHO. Well, we used Jacobs for the first half of the year and only used TT for the second half, but they meshed seamlessly. Jacobs was appealing to me, with real-life examples that led the student to the math or the proof reasoning. But my mathy kid said TT got to the point faster and used more mathy terms in proofs, which he was used to from being on a math team.

 

I haven't tried DIVE, but MFW recommends Saxon with DIVE so I know it's tried-n-true.

 

Julie

[Guest amjo324]

Gelfand's Algebra might be a good option. It's provides thoughtful exercise questions to make the content more easily absorbed.

 

If they prefer a video format, khan academy might be a good starting point to cover fundamental math.

[dbmamaz]

i think there are two different companies that make video-based upper level math at the homeschool buyers coop

[Teachin'Mine]

Definitely recommend Saxon and I've heard good things about DIVE, but we used just the texts.

[Jen the RD]

My 9th grade dd is using distance learning with Derek Owens. All of the videos are pre-recorded on the internet. Once you've registered, you get access to everything for that course. This has worked beautifully for my dd. She has done very well with this approach. She downloads the homework pages and tests, completes them, scans & emails, then Derek grades it and returns with a grade. She also emails occasionally with questions and usually gets a response back in 24-48 hrs. That has been a load off of me because I think geometry is the trickiest math to grade. There might be more than one way to approach a proof and I'm not sure I would always discern those possibilities. I pay $58 per month for his services and it has been worth every cent to me. He is a very gifted teacher. We also bought his physical science program, and have been equally pleased.

 

Here's the link: http://www.derekowens.com/

 

HTH,

Jennifer

[Katie Jean]

Seriously ladies, I cannot thank you enough for this insight. So very helpful! Thanks a million!

[dereksurfs]

We have been very happy with TabletClass. Before that we used MUS. However for secondary math we wanted something more rigorous and standards based. This has been quit a jump up in challenge for ds this year. But he actually rose to the challenge. The instruction is excellent and we allow him to grade his own work as we trust him in this area. So he uses the program very independently. We like it enough to continue next into Algebra 1 as soon as he finishes Pre-A which isn't far away.

 

http://www.tabletclass.com/

[Halcyon]

We have done a fair amount of research and are leaning towards tablet math for algebra next year also.

[AngieW in Texas]

Kinetic Books is fantastic for Algebra I and for Algebra II. Those are the only levels my kids have used. My two older girls both said that KB was the best math program they ever had. My 17yo would be using KB right now if they went past Algebra II.

 

My youngest won't use anything computer-based for math.

[hsmamainva]

Chalkdust

[OnTheBrink]

Videotext Interactive.

[BlsdMama]

After doing some research, we have just decided to switch our DS to Foerster's with the Math without Borders DVDs.

[Matryoshka]

We have been very happy with TabletClass. Before that we used MUS. However for secondary math we wanted something more rigorous and standards based. This has been quit a jump up in challenge for ds this year. But he actually rose to the challenge. The instruction is excellent and we allow him to grade his own work as we trust him in this area. So he uses the program very independently. We like it enough to continue next into Algebra 1 as soon as he finishes Pre-A which isn't far away.

 

http://www.tabletclass.com/

 

Hi Derek, know you guys haven't gotten to Geometry yet, but as the resident Tablet Class expert, thought maybe you could answer some questions on how TC works in general.

 

How does grading work with TC? Is it self-grading, or does a human have to grade it (either/both homework and tests)? Any idea how proof-grading might be handled in geometry with their set-up? Is any part of the course (worksheets?) off-line? Is there any teacher interaction included - ie is there a human to contact with questions if the student doesn't "get it" from the videos?

[Abbeygurl4]

My 9th grade dd is using distance learning with Derek Owens. All of the videos are pre-recorded on the internet. Once you've registered, you get access to everything for that course. This has worked beautifully for my dd. She has done very well with this approach. She downloads the homework pages and tests, completes them, scans & emails, then Derek grades it and returns with a grade. She also emails occasionally with questions and usually gets a response back in 24-48 hrs. That has been a load off of me because I think geometry is the trickiest math to grade. There might be more than one way to approach a proof and I'm not sure I would always discern those possibilities. I pay $58 per month for his services and it has been worth every cent to me. He is a very gifted teacher. We also bought his physical science program, and have been equally pleased.

 

Here's the link: http://www.derekowens.com/

 

HTH,

Jennifer

 

I totally agree with Jennifer! Derek Owens is awesome! My ds used Saxon through 8/7 and barely retained anything. Somehow, the way Derek explains things just clicks with my ds. It's worth every penny.

[Musicmom]

We used Videotext. It was excellent (ds and dd both developed very solid algebra skills as a result of using it) and it lends itself well to self-teaching.

[dereksurfs]

Hi Derek, know you guys haven't gotten to Geometry yet, but as the resident Tablet Class expert, thought maybe you could answer some questions on how TC works in general.

 

How does grading work with TC? Is it self-grading, or does a human have to grade it (either/both homework and tests)? Any idea how proof-grading might be handled in geometry with their set-up? Is any part of the course (worksheets?) off-line? Is there any teacher interaction included - ie is there a human to contact with questions if the student doesn't "get it" from the videos?

 

Hi Matryoshka,

 

TC does not perform automatic grading. Instead the answer key is given along with detailed solutions provided via video. The student works out all the problems on standard paper just like a normal math class. I actually prefer this because I want ds11 to develop the skill of showing his work, step by step. I try to emphasize neatness and double checking all his work before turning it in.

 

With regards to Geometry I really don't like the idea of letting a program grade proofs which can follow more than one pattern. Also with more complex math problems teachers have the freedom to provide 'partial credit' if for example all the steps are correct but there was a simple error. John Zimmerman, the instructor, is very responsive to student questions. We've asked for clarification a number of times and he has been quick to reply.

 

You can see a demo of the program online here. Although the demo doesn't show the tests, review notes, or extra problem worksheets.

http://www.tabletcla...efaultdemo.aspx

[Grantmom]

Derek,

The Tablet Class has an amazing sale through today only, where you get access to a whole year of a course for just $50. I was thinking that we would use Video Text Interactive, because I liked the idea of being able to use the same program all the way through. But I've heard so many good things about this Tablet Class too, and this seems like a great deal. What is your thought about the fact that he doesn't have Calculus or anything beyond Alg 2?

 

I was thinking that maybe I would even buy two courses, because you can even delay the start date until August. So buy one to start now, and then have the other one start in August, because it seems like a really good deal, and I don't think it will take DS an entire year to work through the first one.

 

What do you think? I am nervous to take the plunge. I keep hemming and hawing over which math curricula is best, most rigorous, good fit, etc. DS is very math and science oriented and definitely seems like he is on an engineering/physics or similar path.

 

Thanks!

[Grantmom]

Also, Derek, can you tell me how you incorporate AoPS too? I love the idea of AoPS and I really think it will be a perfect fit for DS, but I also want him to have another curriculum like Tablet Class or some other similar thing to have the videos, etc, for when I can't explain something.

 

Or maybe people just do the AoPS classes, and that provides the extra instruction they might want?

 

Does your DS do AoPS first, and then go back and reinforce with Tablet Class, or vice versa?

[wapiti]

I love the idea of AoPS and I really think it will be a perfect fit for DS, but I also want him to have another curriculum like Tablet Class or some other similar thing to have the videos, etc, for when I can't explain something.

 

Or maybe people just do the AoPS classes, and that provides the extra instruction they might want?

 

 

FWIW, AoPS has free videos for the "algebra 1" portion of the Intro to Algebra text. (These are extras - the lesson is learned by working through the lesson problems and full, detailed solutions to the lesson problems are included within the text of the lesson).

[dereksurfs]

Also, Derek, can you tell me how you incorporate AoPS too? I love the idea of AoPS and I really think it will be a perfect fit for DS, but I also want him to have another curriculum like Tablet Class or some other similar thing to have the videos, etc, for when I can't explain something.

 

Or maybe people just do the AoPS classes, and that provides the extra instruction they might want?

 

Does your DS do AoPS first, and then go back and reinforce with Tablet Class, or vice versa?

 

 

Grantmom, at $50 for an entire course I agree that you can't really fo wrong even if you end up using it as a supplemental.

 

ds11 used TC for Pre-A as his spine program this past school year. We used AoPS Pre-A and Khan along with it as supplements. I really like to use multiple sources, especially when hitting more challenging concepts. I think it provides them a more well rounded foundation. Anyway, my plan for Algbera 1 was to use two sources at a minimum and possibly extend it out over a longer period to really cement in Algbera skills. After completing TC Pre-A a bit early this year I had ds11 start with AoPS just to get a feel for where he was at and how he responded to their Intro to Algebra text. It turned out he really liked it and so we have just continued with that 'for now.' Though we do have TC Algebra which I would like to weave in. Yet we've got plenty of time for that in the coming year ahead. Now he is comfortable with both programs which I really like. This offers me as the instructor a lot of leaway in presenting more difficult subject matter as he progresses his Algebra training.

 

As Wapiti mentioned AoPS does have free lectures through Algbera 1 as well which are excellent BTW. For us it was more about having choices and being able to pull from these various sources. TC is very complete and the AoPS 'Intro to Algebra' text is like a work of art. Its simply an awesome book on the subject which no one will dispute, but also very challenging. Do you need both or could either stand on their own? You could easily just use one of them. That's just the way we did it and it seems to be working for us so far.

[Grantmom]

Thank! So, about the TC, what do you think about the fact that they don't have Calc?

 

I really feel like DS is going to love AoPS, from everything I've read, it's just really his style. He loves to figure stuff out and he hates doing anything that seems watered down or repetitious in any way. I was just thinking it might be nice to have another resource where they show you all the solutions worked out, etc, on the videos. That seems like maybe more of a crutch for me than anything. I think I am just feeling like I will need a refresher for that stuff when we get up to the higher levels.

 

I actually forgot that AoPS had videos. DS actually watched a lot of them and loved them. I think that is going to a good fit for him, again I guess I just feel like it might be helpful to have an extra source. Thanks!

 

Do you think I jumping the gun if I buy two courses? Since it is so cheap for a whole year access? Isn't it normally like $30/month?

[dereksurfs]

Thank! So, about the TC, what do you think about the fact that they don't have Calc?

 

I really feel like DS is going to love AoPS, from everything I've read, it's just really his style. He loves to figure stuff out and he hates doing anything that seems watered down or repetitious in any way. I was just thinking it might be nice to have another resource where they show you all the solutions worked out, etc, on the videos. That seems like maybe more of a crutch for me than anything. I think I am just feeling like I will need a refresher for that stuff when we get up to the higher levels.

 

I actually forgot that AoPS had videos. DS actually watched a lot of them and loved them. I think that is going to a good fit for him, again I guess I just feel like it might be helpful to have an extra source. Thanks!

 

Do you think I jumping the gun if I buy two courses? Since it is so cheap for a whole year access? Isn't it normally like $30/month?

 

 

Hmm, that's hard to say. I would probably just buy one and take my chances that another sale would happen at some point. But then again prices could go up too. So you never really know. I guess its a bit of a gamble.

 

Regarding Calculus I asked the owner this question a while back. If I remember correctly he said that he is planning to develop more courses. I just don't know what his timeline for that is. I guess I'm ok with not doing all the same thing all the way through Calculus. So I'm not too concerned about that one. Though it would be nice with such clear instruction. While AoPS has Calculus they have no video instruction yet. They are building that out slowly as well.

 

If you think there is even a slight chance he may like AoPS I would strongly encourage you to get the Intro to Algebra book which actually covers Algebra I & II. So even though it seems a little pricey its well worth it, especially for the quality. Even though some may become overwhelmed with AoPS as a spine it can still be a great supplement IMO.

[readinmom]

I just bought the geometry course for ds because at $50, if it doesn't work for him, I equal it to a night out. I watched the demos and followed the entire lesson. I am not a mathy person whatsoever. I was actually excited I understood the concepts.

 

Looking forward to getting a jumpstart on geometry this summer.

[nansk]

Do you think I jumping the gun if I buy two courses? Since it is so cheap for a whole year access? Isn't it normally like $30/month?

I think it is normally $100 a year.

 

I would recommend you have your son listen to the sample videos first. I listened to the sample videos from TC and from Derek Owens and *I* prefered Derek's voice and presentation. If I look at these courses for my dd, I will let her preview and choose the one she is most comfortable with.