fairfarmhand Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 And applied for farm assistance grants are you a recipient of government assistance? Background.... We have a farm and it is not our primary source of income. It is an income producing farm (however, it's mostly a money pit) since we sell beef cattle and raise our own food. We are not wealthy by any stretch of the imagination, and our farm is less than 50 acres. We apply for farm grants to help with improvements on the farm. For instance, we got a grant to pay for a bull to improve our herd, equipment for handling our cattle, and a hay barn. Currently, we are looking into a different kind of grant program. We had a sinkhole open up on our property. This sinkhole does not hold water, but is a part of the water table, so the water runs out an opening in the bottom. This is the only place on that part of our land to put a pond, so we are limited with what we can do with that part of our property since our animals won't have access to water there. There's a program that is designed to help farmers with sinkholes by assisting them in putting in a well with waterers for animals. The thoughts have been buzzing in my mind about Is this any different from welfare? The other threads are just stirring my thoughts on this issue. (I have come to a conclusion, but I want to hear other thoughts before I express them) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Corin Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Here's another example. Part of our garden is categorised as agricultural land - I have no duty to change this categorisation, as far as I know. Because of this status, we have to right to more-or-less unlimited amounts of sterile compost, made from government-collected green waste. All I have to do is pick it up. I can use it to put on my flowers if I want. Am I a recipient of government assistance if I take it? ETA: or I could put the compost on a veggie patch and help to feed my family. Laura Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fairfarmhand Posted December 13, 2012 Author Share Posted December 13, 2012 See someone on the other thread mentioned agricultural subsidies. We bought property 2 years ago that was part of the subsidy program. I am not sure how the program works (corn base, wheat base???) but just by buying the property we got a check in the mail. It wasn't much, but it paid the taxes on the property. (Laura, I would SO love it if they'd offer compost assistance on our farm!!!! That WOULD be awesome.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QueenCat Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 I would call it assistance but I don't see a problem with it. I do see a problem with large conglomerates receiving major agricultural subsidies as I feel it was meant for small farmers, like you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucyStoner Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 By definition, financial assistance which comes from the government is government assistance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKL Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Yeah, but is your real question whether it should be "stigmatized" government assistance? If it makes you feel better, there are many subsidies that exclude farmers on the theory that farmers have to look to the ag subsidies. My business accepted a local government forgivable loan for buying vacant property and placing it back in use. The local government wants to encourage folks from letting the area go to weed. The incentives impact business decisions, just as they are intended to. I did have to put up 100% cash collateral against it (my kids' education fund) for 5 years AND promise that several dozen new jobs would be created. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audrey Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 And applied for farm assistance grants are you a recipient of government assistance? Background.... We have a farm and it is not our primary source of income. It is an income producing farm (however, it's mostly a money pit) since we sell beef cattle and raise our own food. We are not wealthy by any stretch of the imagination, and our farm is less than 50 acres. We apply for farm grants to help with improvements on the farm. For instance, we got a grant to pay for a bull to improve our herd, equipment for handling our cattle, and a hay barn. Currently, we are looking into a different kind of grant program. We had a sinkhole open up on our property. This sinkhole does not hold water, but is a part of the water table, so the water runs out an opening in the bottom. This is the only place on that part of our land to put a pond, so we are limited with what we can do with that part of our property since our animals won't have access to water there. There's a program that is designed to help farmers with sinkholes by assisting them in putting in a well with waterers for animals. The thoughts have been buzzing in my mind about Is this any different from welfare? The other threads are just stirring my thoughts on this issue. (I have come to a conclusion, but I want to hear other thoughts before I express them) Yes, subsidies, stabilization programs and other such assistance is government assistance, or "welfare". I see no problem with using them if you need them, but don't kid yourself that they are any different from other government assistance programs. It is welfare for a business, as opposed to an individual, but the premise is the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denisemomof4 Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 I just want to say that I don't think anyone has the right to judge whether or not anyone applies for or receives help from the government. Glad I could add to this discussion. :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audrey Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 I just want to say that I don't think anyone has the right to judge whether or not anyone applies for or receives help from the government. Glad I could add to this discussion. :tongue_smilie: Absolutely! I assign no moral equation to government assistance. If it were not meant to be used, it would not be available. I just don't think that people should be trying to justify one type of assistance over another. It is all welfare, and there's nothing to justify or judge about any of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reya Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 It would categorize that more in the same area as tax rebates, personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reya Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 And to finish the sentence, "If I has a farm...." then my husband would probably leave me. :D Not made for the country life, my boy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane in NC Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 I do not share in the anti-government sentiment that is often expressed. Personally I am grateful for firemen and police officers, interstate and other highways, air traffic controllers, public health projects.. Because of federal student loans and state student subsidies, my husband and I became highly productive citizens who add a goodly amount to the tax base. We have more than repaid the government's investment in us.. My son participated in 4-H which is in part funded by the national and state agricultural departments. Do we call this government aid? All of us are recipients of some form of government assistance--direct or indirect. Personally I'd rather my tax dollars go to small farmers than defense contractors. Jane (who has a sweet spot for small farmers) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fairfarmhand Posted December 14, 2012 Author Share Posted December 14, 2012 I figure it this way....Improvements to our farm are so we can work it. I feel a bit better about that, because it's not JUST a handout. We have to be actually working a farm to get them. We actually have to have a minimum number of animals to even apply for these programs. Anyway, I've thought a lot about this. People spout about corporate subsidies, welfare, and government assistance, but don't they realize that almost everyone benefits from these in a roundabout way? I mean, wouldn't the costs of food be much much higher if not for farm assistance? Wouldn't the costs for anything be much much higher without subsidies? I mean, I am sure that eventually things would settle out if all of the sudden all government assistance were gone, but in the interim 3-4 years while people were adjusting wouldn't it be difficult? Am I missing something? I mean really, don't all people end up benefiting from government programs like subsidies and assistance? I think though what drives most people bonkers is the scale of these programs is that there is massive waste and fraud because there's just so much bureaucracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fairfarmhand Posted December 14, 2012 Author Share Posted December 14, 2012 I do not share in the anti-government sentiment that is often expressed. Personally I am grateful for firemen and police officers, interstate and other highways, air traffic controllers, public health projects.. Because of federal student loans and state student subsidies, my husband and I became highly productive citizens who add a goodly amount to the tax base. We have more than repaid the government's investment in us.. My son participated in 4-H which is in part funded by the national and state agricultural departments. Do we call this government aid? All of us are recipients of some form of government assistance--direct or indirect. Personally I'd rather my tax dollars go to small farmers than defense contractors. Jane (who has a sweet spot for small farmers) isn't it odd that people who are so outspoken against welfare are so quick to sign up for educational college grants and loans? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 I figure it this way....Improvements to our farm are so we can work it. I feel a bit better about that, because it's not JUST a handout. We have to be actually working a farm to get them. We actually have to have a minimum number of animals to even apply for these programs. Anyway, I've thought a lot about this. People spout about corporate subsidies, welfare, and government assistance, but don't they realize that almost everyone benefits from these in a roundabout way? I mean, wouldn't the costs of food be much much higher if not for farm assistance? Wouldn't the costs for anything be much much higher without subsidies? I mean, I am sure that eventually things would settle out if all of the sudden all government assistance were gone, but in the interim 3-4 years while people were adjusting wouldn't it be difficult? Am I missing something? I mean really, don't all people end up benefiting from government programs like subsidies and assistance? You're exactly right. I agree. I do think what you describe is government assistance, but I am not on the "government assistance is BAD" team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 Whoops, DP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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