breffe Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I am trying to make a decision for next year (September). I have been looking at so much curriculum my eyes are going crazy! I will have a second grader and Kindergartener (maybe 2 if my son doesn't not continue to receive special needs services). I have narrowed it down to these three choices. I *love* the look and feel of TOG. In fact we are doing the 3 week sample right now of the New World. I love that it has the extra activites spelled out for me! And the maps and writing! What I don't love is that I can't afford all those books and dh is not to keen on the price when in the end you don't even have all the books! I also don't like that it isn't all broken out for me in a weekly schedule. I have precious little time during the week to do a lot of planning. Also I am not sure it is something I would be able to do with my K'er and would have to add in a learn to read program for her. I have used two cores of Sonlight in the past. I love the rich literature and the open and go ease of that curriculum. What I don't like is that some of the books are over dd's head and it drives me absolutely batty that you only read a couple pages out of a book at a time. You have a pile of books in your lap, you read one or two pages and move to the next book! Insane I tell you! Oh and I would have to buy two whole cores next year because dd1 would be in Core 2 next year (currently doing Core1) and dd2 would need Core P4/5. Winterpromise is the other program I am looking at. I actually fell in love with the looks of the program when I looked at the website. I had decided on the Animal Theme because I could easily do it with a 2nd grader and a K'er. I love that I can use the same "core" for both girls (although in a couple of years I wouldn't be able to.) But then I started reading all the reviews on them as a company and the curriculum as a whole and I wasn't impressed. Aside from a core curriculum I will be using the following Teaching Textbooks for dd1 Horizons for dd2 WWE FLL Apologia Human Anatomy All About Spelling(still deciding on that one) Song School Latin 100 EZ Lessons for DD1 or the Sonlight K readers and LA Can anyone tell me the pros and cons of each of these three programs. Preferably if you have had experience with any of them? Also price is a huge concern. TOG is so expensive and I doubt the capabilities of my library! Sonlight books are all in the package as well as Winterpromise. Moneywise? The latter two are better value it would seem. For roughly 800-1000 I would have all the books for Sonlight or Winterpromise but only a third of the books for TOG. Help!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovinmomma Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Oh, how I understand your pain! I finally decided on TOG, but that won't help you because I don't use TOG normally ;). Also, I purchase all of my books or get the on PBS. So, I just wanted to give you a :grouphug:. You'll figure it out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovinmomma Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 (edited) P.S. I've owned all of the above. TOG. Yep. SL. Yep. WP. Done that one, too. :glare: ETA: What about Biblioplan if you need a weekly schedule and you can't afford TOG? Edited January 10, 2011 by lovinmomma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OregonNative Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I was really drawn to TOG this year, but decided to pass. I just wasn't interested in having everything tied back to history. WP-I'd search the board. I've read that many ppl did not think it flowed well, the CS doesn't have a good reputation and apparently several of the books contain mistakes. I really loved the look of the program, but decided against it due to reading posts here. SL-Almost did it this year. (Previously gave Core 1 a try a couple of years ago). We love to read, but it was just too much and didn't incorporate any hands-on ideas. They currently have a list for early elementary, but I feel they are pretty lame. Most families find that SL should be ordered a year behind. For example, I ordered Core 1 for a first grader-BIG mistake. Way over an average 1st graders head. When I looked at it this year, my friend who is a consultant recommended that I order 4/5 and then pick appropriate LA, Reading, Math etc. for my 3rd grader. She also told me that my 3rd grader would get plenty of History with the 4/5 package. I looked a boxed curriculum because I thought it would be easier. I have since found just the opposite to be true:001_smile: I don't feel like this helps much, but may give you some things to ponder:001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 This is my .02 so take it for what it is worth...... TOG is a great, fantastic program, BUT IMO it is written from the top down. By that I mean that it seems to have been written FOR older children and then adapted for younger children afterwards. It is also VERY teacher intensive. At the ages of your kids we found the books to be over their heads and not that engaging. We ditched it and went back to SL. SL: I refuse to do more than one core.....it is TOO much work! So, we all read together and the older ones read their readers or listen on CD to their readers. WP: This is my first year with WP. To say that I am less than impressed is an understatement. There are errors GALORE in the Language Arts instructions at least weekly, sometimes daily. And these aren't just typos, they are blatant grammatical errors (using *I* instead of *me", changing verb tenses in the middle of the paragraph and the list goes on..... We started with AC2 and LA 5 this year. I am continuing to do LA for now but that could change at any moment.....but for History I have added back in most of Core 4 as I was not impressed with their selections of books and I didn't understand the "go get this DVD or look this up on the internet" idea....I don't want to do MORE work after spending that much money on an IG! HOWEVER, I have heard good things about Animals and their Worlds and some of the earlier/younger grades. So, I wouldn't rule it out completely. My suggestion? Take a year or two off of SL, go do something else, and then if you want to come back to SL, combine the two kids in History and maybe readers and then add in their own grade level LA and Math. You might also look at My Father's World as they do a lot of combining. Dawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carol in Cal. Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Your children are the perfect age for Story of the World, all by itself! Really, it doesn't have to be that complicated! Start with SOTW1. Get the book, the AG, maybe an extra set of the coloring pages/consumables, the CD's, a wall map of the world or globe, and that's it. The first week, read the story. Summarize it in two sentences. Put them on the white board and use them for copywork. Look at any AG map work and do it. Do the coloring pages. Get one library book recommended in the AG and read it aloud. Maybe do one AG project or not. I never did more than one or two of those. Pop paperwork into a binder in chron order. The next week, do another story. Maybe after about 3-4 weeks, let your older one figure out the summary himself. Concurrently, play the CD's in the background when the children are building with blocks or doing other floor games. Or when you're in the car. Maybe start a timeline. Maybe not. It's not recommended for this age, but a lot of people do it. Your children will achieve a basic familiarity with world history that will be remarkable, and they will enjoy it. Do not worry about whether you get through a book in a year or not. Just keep doing the next thing until you are done. You can skip topics if you choose. You're the teacher. The curriculum police will not arrest you, I promise. I blended Bible history into SOTW 1, and it was wonderful but it took about 18 months. This was one of the best 18 month periods of our homeschooling life. Have fun with this! It's SO cool! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Random Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I can tell you the reasons why I chose TOG, but I haven't used SL or WP. 1) With TOG, you buy the year plan once, and can use it for any level student you have. Because of the ages of your children, you'll probably use the same year plan four times, instead of buying three additional history programs. 2)I love that everyone is studying the same era together. 3)That it is biblical is a huge bonus for me. 4)I love the teacher's notes. 5)I actually started TOG now, but I bought it for high school. I don't think there is a better high school program for teaching kids how to think. I may be wrong, though. :D 6)The books are expensive, but do you have a used bookstore locally? Half.com has really good prices, and I've been able to find many books there, for very cheap. I hope you find the right program! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WTMindy Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 The single best thing that I have done in my 9 years of homeschooling was Story of the World. (all 4 volumes) It gave my kids a love of history that has carried over into the times when history isn't as fun as it used to be! :-) We did at least one project every week, and I found most of the projects to be wonderful. You can keep your kids together and have them do narrations at their own level on the chapter. I'm a huge fan of SOTW!! We have used TOG for the second rotation (we are now on Modern Times, having used all 4 years of TOG) and I'm excited to use it for the third rotation too. One option if you like TOG, but don't like the price is that you could purchase TOG now and just do the SOTW reading and whatever other pieces you choose. (They list SOTW as an alternate reading assignment) and use this time to start collecting the books used for when you use it the next time around. It is possible to get most of the books used, and they do have a good resale value. So, I buy the books at .5-.75 of their value and then I can turn around and sell them for the same when we are done. It does take time to look for the books and piece together what you need, and what your library has, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truebluexf Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 With WP, all other negatives aside, you will still be reading a few pages from a stack of books each day. If you like SL, I'd probably continue with that out of your choices, and start doing the reading in rows instead of columns...it's easier than jumping from book to book. It's a much more solid program than WP, with better customer service, more used availability, tried and true books, etc. We did SL K and I found I just didn't keep up with the scheduling. If I were to go back to it it would be different as we are more settled now, and I'd likely just do the history core and read the book list for lit. This is our 2nd year using WP and I won't be using it again for a stack of reasons. They obviously do not preread or prewatch things. Books are way off target for ages, topics too, they had me buying extra books when the main book was reproducible, the projects are off target a lot of the times, refunds promised weren't given without reminders, extras promised for trouble were never sent. I'll be spending my money elsewhere in the future. I know they claim "growing pains" but have been for years...at some point things need to come together before they can keep expanding their programs. Just too many errors on many levels. We did the animal theme last year and they have changed it for this year. We did enjoy that program despite some issues. It might might be more worth your time to get the books and branch out from there (you could easily get the One Small Square books and make your own study for your age group based on each habitat. You could also get their animal notebook if you wanted.) My plan for next year, most likely, is SOTW1. I'd like to take our whole focus off of history and branch out some more. SOTW1 seems like it would be perfect for that, it's 2 days a week, leaving plenty of time for science and other subjects. It has a book list, it has projects, it has lots of support online...I'm sure we can find many other ideas online if we need them. It's also on mp3...which means I can save my voice for reading literature. ;) It's all in one, it's affordable, the books are at the library. These are the positives in my point of view anyway!!! MFW looks intriguing as well, but to me it's another all-encompassing curriculum and a little too bible-based for me. That said, their ECC level looks pretty amazing and is under consideration by me for next year to get a handle on geography for everyone, but would still be too advanced for your youngers. They really do have cool options for combining kids though!!! I'm pretty sure they have a k/2nd program too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TracyP Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 If you are not feeling very sure about this choice than I second (third?) just going with SOTW for now. Very affordable and you can decide later if you want one of these others. Can anyone tell me the pros and cons of each of these three programs. Preferably if you have had experience with any of them? Also price is a huge concern. TOG is so expensive and I doubt the capabilities of my library! Sonlight books are all in the package as well as Winterpromise. Moneywise? The latter two are better value it would seem. For roughly 800-1000 I would have all the books for Sonlight or Winterpromise but only a third of the books for TOG. Help!! I started TOG with a K'er and will be on my 3rd year of using it next year with a 2nd grader and K'er. I love TOG but it's not for everyone. On the bolded above I wanted to comment. I have not spent more than $150 on books yet per year. If you are making a $$ assumption based on Bookshelf you are seeing WAY more than you need. Maybe I am misunderstanding but you do not need to spend $800-1000 on TOG books for the age of your kids. Good luck in your decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prairiewindmomma Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 When I was in your shoes, I decided to do SOTW with AG. The author of TOG actually recommends SOTW when you have all littles. If $ is tight but your library is weak, then in addition to SOTW + AG, I would buy a few nice picture books recommended by the SOTW AG and the KHE.....you could do it all for under $100 if you have access to a used bookstore for paperback swap for your picturebooks. If you are just dying to use TOG, then I would use TOG as your outline of topics and fit SOTW chapters into that outline. We are doing that this year as I have just one who is entering into logic stage and my other is still very much at grammar level. I found WP to be too disjointed. We had too many books that weren't a good fit with SL and we needed more hands on activities (the SOTW AG is perfect for mapwork, narrations & fun activities). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhaddon Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 (edited) The only thing I would say is that with TOG after 4 years you'd have the four years purchased, everyone on the same schedual of history so less teaching of history, and then only the books. The first four years will be expensive, but break it down over the long run (if you plan on HSing all through). If you do Sonlight you have that purchase every single year for the first child, not just four years. You don't have to have every book, have you looked at the library to try and see how many they have? Do they have books similar in subject? I tend to always become distracted with Winter promise as well, but in the long run what I want to accomplish education wise doesn't fit long term. Pretty much the Animal one is the only one I'd do. Edited January 10, 2011 by mhaddon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom22722 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I have used all three. I have used SL p2/3, P3/4, cores 1,2, 4 and 5. I used WP animals and the first year of American History. I am using TOG Year 1 with a lower grammar, upper grammar and dialectic students. By far my favorite is SL. WP I found to be disjointed and the crafts not that great. TOG I have found to not be that great with the littles and I can't get the discussions. Most of the times my kids can't find the answers in the readings so I don't know where the answers are to come from. This week we read about the Hittites but there were question about all sorts of tribes of people not just the Hittites. This happens all the time. I also have used SOTW with my boys when they were little and enjoyed this. TOG in my opinion is too expensive and too much work finding answers, WP too disjointed maybe they have improved. SL I have loved everything except core 5. I loved the readers and read alouds but not the geography stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breffe Posted January 10, 2011 Author Share Posted January 10, 2011 All boxed curriculum aside I have also been falling in love with the idea of just do WTM book lists and make binders. I really appreciate all the advice! It has all kinda of gone along with my feelings exactly! With all of the great options I think SOTW with the activity guides would be great. I can't find the activity guides locally. I own SOTW 1,2 and 3 thanks to a well stocked Barnes and Noble! Now if I did just SOTW what would I do for leveled readers?? In all these curriculums they are layed out for me! Are their suggestions in the Ag for that? Or would I be better off looking at the reader list from SL? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnowWhite Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 With WP, most people either LOVE the program or it drives them batty. The one thing you said in your post that makes me think you might not like it is that you don't like the multiple books read daily in SL. One way to "fix" this issue is to read across the schedule instead of down. IOW, read four days' worth in one book each day rather than one day's worth in four different books. We have been in the "LOVE" segment for WP for several years. We are using our fourth and fifth programs from WP. We love, love, love Animals and Their Worlds. For me, things don't have to flow terribly well or be organized just right to work well. We did switch to BJU English (more because I wanted super-structured writing instruction than through any fault of WP's LA), but I LOVE the titles WP has chosen for readers for the most part. WP does use more non-fiction than SL does, which appeals to my boys. We have also had a fabulous time with most of the crafts. I can see that crafts are becoming less important as older ds gets out of the grammar stage. We intend to continue using many WP resources throughout our school career. Up next is World Around Me science for the to-be-second grader and perhaps Jiggle, Jostle, Jolt for the to-be-fifth grader. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siloam Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I *love* the look and feel of TOG. In fact we are doing the 3 week sample right now of the New World. I love that it has the extra activites spelled out for me! And the maps and writing! What I don't love is that I can't afford all those books and dh is not to keen on the price when in the end you don't even have all the books! I also don't like that it isn't all broken out for me in a weekly schedule. I have precious little time during the week to do a lot of planning. Also I am not sure it is something I would be able to do with my K'er and would have to add in a learn to read program for her. TOG is great, and I am somewhat stuck with it just because I will just tweak and mess with anything I use. TOG gives me the most pieces to play with. But I also haven't paid full price for a yearplan yet, and I would buy books either way. I do a lot of substituting of books, so you can use TOG with your library and just choose different books on the same topic. That is more work through. I have used two cores of Sonlight in the past. I love the rich literature and the open and go ease of that curriculum. What I don't like is that some of the books are over dd's head and it drives me absolutely batty that you only read a couple pages out of a book at a time. You have a pile of books in your lap, you read one or two pages and move to the next book! Insane I tell you! Oh and I would have to buy two whole cores next year because dd1 would be in Core 2 next year (currently doing Core1) and dd2 would need Core P4/5. We had the same content problems here. You could probably do well with SL if you stretch for a couple of years. Then you could read across the schedule instead of down. Read one of the books, but all the readings in that book for the whole week. Winterpromise is the other program I am looking at. I actually fell in love with the looks of the program when I looked at the website. I had decided on the Animal Theme because I could easily do it with a 2nd grader and a K'er. I love that I can use the same "core" for both girls (although in a couple of years I wouldn't be able to.) But then I started reading all the reviews on them as a company and the curriculum as a whole and I wasn't impressed. The choices of books in WP worked much better here. We did SL Core Pre-K 4/5, K, 1 and 2 then did WP AW and AS 1. The kids adored AW, and did fine with AS 1. I had to add for my oldest, who loves history and could have continued with SL. They didn't have the multi-layered programs back when I used it. One of the big reasons why I didn't continue with WP is their resale policy. Beyond that I would say that the Brooks have the best of intentions, but they are better at making the curriculum than running a business. Though even on the curriculum side they are pushed for time, and it shows up in the errors and such. That said you can avoid most of the problems in dealing with them if you simply only order the teacher's manual from them and buy the rest of the books from Amazon and other resources. Have you looked at MFW? I discounted it for a long time due to how it incorporates more topics than I need them to cover. I think if I was finally to give up my tweaking I would seriously consider MFW over the rest. Why? It has the lightest base schedule, but great additional book lists, so you can customize it. Basically that is how I am using TOG. I read aloud the LG or UG history, then assign reading from the other levels. It sounds like I could use MFW in the same way, but I would only have to plan what additional books to use, and maybe not even that. I haven't looked enough to know if they have a separate reading schedule for older children. Not sure if I am of much help, but I hope you find one that will work for you. Heather Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prairiewindmomma Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 There are suggestions for readers and read-alouds in the AG. We have enjoyed the suggestions immensely! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truebluexf Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Also with SOTW, I plan to look over the booklists on SL and such for more ideas. :) Readers, IMO, are the easiest part (at least for me now, 4 years into hsing LOL). We love to read at night so we have been plowing through the read alouds and adding extras of our own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterPan Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 My only advice is to aim for simplicity. You have a lot of little kids and want to keep to a budget. If you like SOTW, then that is a simple, one-step way to get there. Just keep it simple and focus on having fun. Add in some hands-on things, dress up, mummify, etc. Use the extra money to buy Playmobil, not curriculum. Have you seen the Playmobil ancient egypt stuff? Way cool. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OregonNative Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 (edited) Are their suggestions in the Ag for that? Or would I be better off looking at the reader list from SL? Yes, for each chapter. I usually do the age appropriate books as read-alouds with my 1st and 3rd grader. They do have more advanced suggestions though. This program is so well thought out and very easy to implement. I really think you'll like it. Edited January 11, 2011 by OregonNative Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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