LOST theory question. - Caution: Someone may post spoilers.

[KidsHappen]

Has anyone considered that the man in black's name may be Esau?

[Rhonda in TX]

I'm wondering if Jacob is actually the bad guy, rather than "Locke". How else would Claire turn "dark"?

 

I'm loving this season so far.

[mommy2be]

So emotional so far!

 

Sawyer is just breaking my heart! I've came to tears in both episodes so far!

[KidsHappen]

I'm wondering if Jacob is actually the bad guy, rather than "Locke". How else would Claire turn "dark"?

 

I'm loving this season so far.

 

I found myself wondering the same thing last week.

[KidsHappen]

So emotional so far!

 

Sawyer is just breaking my heart! I've came to tears in both episodes so far!

 

Every season I love Sawyer more and more. This season he is displaying more emotion than we have seen in the entire series. I was telling my family tonight that I love Sawyer even when he is bad but I don't like Jack even when he is good.

[SproutMamaK]

I'm wondering if Jacob is actually the bad guy, rather than "Locke". How else would Claire turn "dark"?

 

I'm loving this season so far.

 

Well, in the last supper promo photos (both of them), Locke was in the Jesus position, which would indicate he's the good guy.

[jujsky]

I'm wondering if Jacob is actually the bad guy, rather than "Locke". How else would Claire turn "dark"?

 

I'm loving this season so far.

 

I think so too. Last week in the season premier, Lapidus (the pilot) said something to Sun about how these people (the people on the Ajira flight -- the ones who are there to protect Jacob) say they're the good guys, and in his experience people who say they are the good guys are NOT the good guys. Ben always aligned himself with Jacob, and constantly told the Losties that he was one of the good guys. These people from the Ajira flight are aligned with Jacob, and they're saying they're the good guys. Flocke isn't saying if he's a good guy or a bad guy -- like he has nothing to prove one way or the other. If he's good, he wouldn't need to convince anyone.

 

The producers like to send us curve balls. It would be quite a curve ball if "black" was good in this case and "white" was bad. It reminds me of Stephen King's The Stand in a lot of ways. In that book there are people you would think of as bad people, and they are actually good. The bad side (which could be seen as "good" from an outside perspective) doesn't allow drug use, and has harsh, swift punishment for wrong-doing, yet that side is ruled by a completely evil person. In that story the good leader is a black woman, and the evil person is a white man -- again reversing the typical black/white roles.

[OhM]

I'm wondering if Jacob is actually the bad guy, rather than "Locke". How else would Claire turn "dark"?

 

I'm loving this season so far.

 

I agree that we could find the sides switched from what our perception is now!

 

But just wanted to point out - after Claire disappeared, wasn't she associated with Christian, who was apparently part of MIB's "side" (for lack of a better term.) Wasn't he the one who sent Locke off the island to bring the others back?

[KidsHappen]

I think so too. Last week in the season premier, Lapidus (the pilot) said something to Sun about how these people (the people on the Ajira flight -- the ones who are there to protect Jacob) say they're the good guys, and in his experience people who say they are the good guys are NOT the good guys. Ben always aligned himself with Jacob, and constantly told the Losties that he was one of the good guys. These people from the Ajira flight are aligned with Jacob, and they're saying they're the good guys. Flocke isn't saying if he's a good guy or a bad guy -- like he has nothing to prove one way or the other. If he's good, he wouldn't need to convince anyone.

 

The producers like to send us curve balls. It would be quite a curve ball if "black" was good in this case and "white" was bad. It reminds me of Stephen King's The Stand in a lot of ways. In that book there are people you would think of as bad people, and they are actually good. The bad side (which could be seen as "good" from an outside perspective) doesn't allow drug use, and has harsh, swift punishment for wrong-doing, yet that side is ruled by a completely evil person. In that story the good leader is a black woman, and the evil person is a white man -- again reversing the typical black/white roles.

 

That's what I was saying last week. There would be some quirk to work out but I suppose they could do it.

[elegantlion]

Every season I love Sawyer more and more. This season he is displaying more emotion than we have seen in the entire series. I was telling my family tonight that I love Sawyer even when he is bad but I don't like Jack even when he is good.

 

:iagree:I can't wait until Jin finds Sun, they'll be more tears. Jack is almost annoying me, at least he didn't tell Sayid to take the pill.

[Chris in VA]

I am a little confused about Jack's dad's appearances. He is said to be a manifestation of MIB, right? Well, why was he in Jacob's cabin--Ben said it was Jacob. Was the scene with him and Claire (long time ago--after she disappeared) in the cabin AFTER they found the ash ring around it had been disturbed?

 

Why the heck did they torture Sayid?

 

Claire's gone looney tunes--but I thougth the people in the temple are basically good--don't they worship the MIB/Smokey guy?

 

Oh boy, I JUST don't get this season.

I guess it's a good lesson--never try to figure out who's good and who's bad! lol

 

I did really like the new timeline Claire situation--it seemed right. Maybe that's what really happens, and that would be good. I'm liking the new timeline a lot now. Charlie may get help, but also gets justice and the chance for a new start. Rose and Bernard--she may still have cancer, but they are still together and their love is palpable. John L may still be in the wheel chair, but he seems ok with it. Hurley is now lucky--don't know where Hurley and John's stories are going...Sayid looks fine, like he is off to find Nadia. IDK--stay tuned!:D

[Jkodman]

I agree that we could find the sides switched from what our perception is now!

 

But just wanted to point out - after Claire disappeared, wasn't she associated with Christian, who was apparently part of MIB's "side" (for lack of a better term.) Wasn't he the one who sent Locke off the island to bring the others back?

 

I can't remember but why is Christian associated with the MIB "side"? Also, do we assume the "others" at the temple were going to kill Sayid with the pill or was the poison pill going to help him? I really hope things are really clear at the end. For Christmas this year I want the complete dvd set of all the episodes so I can watch it from beginning to end. That will be so cool to put all the pieces together.

[angela in ohio]

I can't remember but why is Christian associated with the MIB "side"? Also, do we assume the "others" at the temple were going to kill Sayid with the pill or was the poison pill going to help him? I really hope things are really clear at the end. For Christmas this year I want the complete dvd set of all the episodes so I can watch it from beginning to end. That will be so cool to put all the pieces together.

 

I thought it was full of the same ash/powder that they put around the house and the temple. I don't know if it would kill him or just the 'whatever' that is in him.

[Chris in VA]

Yeah, wonder what that ash is from?

Burned sacrifices, maybe?

 

Dooodoooodoooooo.....

[angela in ohio]

Yeah, wonder what that ash is from?

Burned sacrifices, maybe?

 

Dooodoooodoooooo.....

 

Ooooh, sacrifices for sins.....

[4kids4me]

Remember the first time we meet the MIB? He was sitting on the beach talking to Jacob. They were looking at the ship and didn't the MIB say the ship was bad because all the people did was come and destroy, and then Jacob said that no, it was good because it meant progress. I immediately felt like siding with the MIB. Who says progress is good? Maybe it's not good...and why isn't it good? There must be a reason why it's not good for the island, etc, etc.

 

Ya, just some random thoughts.

[jujsky]

I am a little confused about Jack's dad's appearances. He is said to be a manifestation of MIB, right? Well, why was he in Jacob's cabin--Ben said it was Jacob. Was the scene with him and Claire (long time ago--after she disappeared) in the cabin AFTER they found the ash ring around it had been disturbed?

 

Why the heck did they torture Sayid?

 

Claire's gone looney tunes--but I thougth the people in the temple are basically good--don't they worship the MIB/Smokey guy?

 

I have some theories on this, as I was up half the night thinking about it. I don't think Claire is necessarily infected with evil. I think she & Christian are both somehow aligned with the MIB/Flocke. I DON'T think that MIB/Flocke IS Smokey -- I think Smokey is aligned with or controlled by the MIB. Smokey is another misunderstood entity. Do we have any proof that he goes out and mercilessly kills anyone who is good? He reads/scans a lot of people and seems to cast judgment. If MIB is good, then Smokey was killing evil people when he knocked off a couple of the people from the Ajira flight.

 

The ash is (presumably) used at the temple to keep the MIB out. What if that wasn't Jacob's cabin, but the MIB's cabin, and the ash in that case was used to keep him IN? In all reality, Ben wasn't with the Others for that long. Many of the Others have been there forever. Was Ben really their leader? The guy at the Temple seems to be a lot more in charge than Ben. Maybe Ben was more like the #2 -- sort of a clueless vice-president in charge of everyday life. He admitted that Jacob never spoke to him. The ring around the cabin is disturbed at some point, so if the MIB was there, he escaped at that point.

 

I think the people at the temple are trying to keep out Smokey. They are the Others -- they kept Smokey out of Otherville as well with those electronic barriers.

 

This "darkness" the people in the temple spoke about.....is it darkness or enlightenment? Does Claire (Rousseau too, possibly -- more on that later) see the truth about who is good and who is evil now? Will Sayid? Are they afraid of having someone who knows the truth within their midst?

 

I did some reading on Jacob and Esau last night. Esau's descendants were called the Edomites, and according to some they founded Rome where Christianity eventually reigned. Jacob's name was later changed to Israel. I don't know where the producers are going with that if the MIB IS Esau (if they're portraying Jews as evil, they're going to tick off a lot of people!). Think about it though --Christian Shepherd is aligned with him. Shepherding in Christianity, maybe? I wonder too if this show is some sort of statement about people who say they believe in a higher power (not to offend anyone, but for lack of a better term I'm going to call them "Sunday Christians") and those who maybe follow no set religion, but live their lives in a good way. A lot of the people on the show have done bad things, but are basically good people (Kate, Sawyer, Jin -- pretty much all of the people on the flight). I don't know -- maybe I'm just completely talking out of my butt.

 

I've thought a lot about the character duality as well. Let's take Rousseau/Claire and Locke/Ben. Rousseau & Claire both turned up at the island very pregnant. They both gave birth to babies. Both of their babies had "A" names (Alexandra and Aaron). Both have their babies taken and raised by other people. Both apparently turned wild. If Claire is aligned with the MIB, was Rousseau? Claire has almost turned into Rousseau. Remember Kate said, "One of Rousseau's traps," and the Other with her said, "No, Rousseau has been dead for years." At the end of the episode Claire comes out of the jungle disheveled, wild-eyed, and wielding a gun -- the spitting image of Rousseau. Like Rousseau, she was setting traps.

 

I view Ben and Locke as almost lost souls. If there is a gray area in this very black side/white side situation, it is those 2. Both had disfunctional parents and unhappy childhoods. Both have an intense desire to belong to something and believe in something. Both have an insatiable love of the island. Both are nobodies. There is nothing remarkable or outstanding about Locke or Ben. The only outstanding feature is their faith. They both have faith and can believe in some higher force despite (because of?) the horrible life experiences they've had. In the Jacob/MIB battle, their souls are up-for-grabs.

 

One thing that made NO sense to me whatsoever in last night's episode was the reappearance of Ethan in this alternate reality (if that's what it is). Ethan was the son of Horace (one of the head Dharma people -- the little dude with the glasses who brought Ben & his dad to the island). If, in that reality, the island blew up in 1977, Ethan would be dead. He was there. Does anyone have any theories? DH and I started laughing when he said to Claire, "I wouldn't want to stick you with needles unnecessarily." Oh, the irony :D

[Avila]

Wouldn't Ethan have left when the women and children were evacuated? I guess that is what I thought anyhow. And I am thinking Juliet would never have been brought there to begin with.

 

I find it interesting that Jacob can leave (and obviously has, when the mood struck him), but MIB cannot. He seems to be trapped there. Jacob has had all the power, but why?

 

And did anybody else watch the repeat where the producer notes appeared at the bottom? What does it mean to have a flash sideways? Is that what WOULD have happened if the explosion worked, or is it an alternate reality of some kind? I am having a problem figuring out what it really is, since it isn't a flash forward or flashback.

[jujsky]

Wouldn't Ethan have left when the women and children were evacuated?

 

Ah! I'd forgotten that. You're right! :001_smile:

[gardening momma]

I'm wondering if Jacob is actually the bad guy, rather than "Locke".

That's what I've always thought, since he was the one who was bringing people to the island--the Black Rock, for example. Remember the conversation MIB and Jacob had on the beach?

[Jkodman]

I really hope at the end they have some highlight show that ties all this stuff together. I forgot alot of the stuff that happened in past seasons. I need the cliff notes!

 

Also, I read someone's idea that the "alternate reality" is actually the end of the show. We are seeing what happens at the end when Jack "fixes" everything on the island. The plane lands and life goes on, but their lives are still intermingled and they still have the same "growth" experiences in character that they would have on the island. When Juliet was dying she mentioned going dutch for coffee and she said "he fixed it". The idea is that Jack did fix it and Juliet somehow meets Sawyer at the airport maybe, and they go dutch for coffee. Who knows just an idea.

[LNC]

I keep reading about "MIB" here and on the Lost forums. Can someone tell me who or what that refers to?

[mommaduck]

MIB = Man in Black aka Flocke (fake Locke) aka Smokey.

[MomToJediKnights]

I really hope at the end they have some highlight show that ties all this stuff together. I forgot alot of the stuff that happened in past seasons. I need the cliff notes!

 

Also, I read someone's idea that the "alternate reality" is actually the end of the show. We are seeing what happens at the end when Jack "fixes" everything on the island. The plane lands and life goes on, but their lives are still intermingled and they still have the same "growth" experiences in character that they would have on the island. When Juliet was dying she mentioned going dutch for coffee and she said "he fixed it". The idea is that Jack did fix it and Juliet somehow meets Sawyer at the airport maybe, and they go dutch for coffee. Who knows just an idea.

 

This makes a lot of sense. I thought it was interesting in last night's episode when Kate saw Jack (she had already hijacked the cab). She looked at him like she recognized him.

 

I can't wait to see how this all plays out. Makes me sad at the same time because I'm not ready for it to be over!

[LNC]

MIB = Man in Black aka Flocke (fake Locke) aka Smokey.

 

Thank you!

 

Does anyone know how long Locke has been Flocke?

 

Was it from the crash on - the reason why he wasn't paralyzed on the island? When did the change happen?

[jujsky]

Thank you!

 

Does anyone know how long Locke has been Flocke?

 

Was it from the crash on - the reason why he wasn't paralyzed on the island? When did the change happen?

 

I think he's been Flocke since his body was brought back to the island. Flocke told Ben about Locke's last thoughts when Ben killed him, so I don't think Locke could have been Flocke prior to then.

[MomToJediKnights]

I keep reading about "MIB" here and on the Lost forums. Can someone tell me who or what that refers to?

 

He is referred to as "Man in Black" (I think it was the end of last season?) there was a scene with Jacob and a man in black sitting on the beach talking. The MIB came back to the island in Locke's body.

 

 

Something I don't understand...if Ben is/was on Jacob's "side", then why would he kill Locke and bring his body back to the island? Did I miss him saying who told him to do it?

 

Also if the guys at the Temple were told that Jacob said Sayid was to be saved, then why did they want to kill him after the fact?

 

I thought we were getting answers this season, but I'm finding I have just as many questions as every other season!! LOL

[Avila]

The producer notes at the bottom when it repeated said specifically that the scenes showing 815 not crashing are Flash Sideways and not Flash Forwards or Flashbacks. I don't know what it is, but that seems to say that it can't be what WILL happen. I don't know how they are going to reconcile the two realities, but having that one be the real ending doesn't seem to be what they are planning.

[Chris in VA]

Also if the guys at the Temple were told that Jacob said Sayid was to be saved, then why did they want to kill him after the fact?

 

Some are saying they don't want to kill him, they just wanted to give him the pill (may be filled with ash, as it looked like that and the samuri guy was mixing ash--sort of like they blew the ash around him and now wanted it inside of him) to get rid of "darkness," "sickness" that is inside of him (from...when?). It's supposedly in Claire, too--maybe from the time she was inoculated by the Others. IDK, but it seems maybe the Others who lived in the old Dharma place are different than the Others who are in the temple.

 

Jujsky said:I think she & Christian are both somehow aligned with the MIB/Flocke. I DON'T think that MIB/Flocke IS Smokey -- I think Smokey is aligned with or controlled by the MIB. Smokey is another misunderstood entity

 

I don't think so--MIB/Flocke pretty much id's himself as Smokey when he says to Ben something like, "I'm sorry you had to see me like that" after Smokey kills the 3 or 4 guys who come into the foot-area of the giant statue (Taweret). The writers have also said he's behind the manifestations of Walt, Kate's horse, and Christian.

[usetoschool]

I really hope at the end they have some highlight show that ties all this stuff together. I forgot alot of the stuff that happened in past seasons. I need the cliff notes!

 

Well, there is this: Lost in 8 minutes

[Michelle My Bell]

I find it interesting that Jacob can leave (and obviously has, when the mood struck him), but MIB cannot. He seems to be trapped there. Jacob has had all the power, but why?

 

 

 

Maybe Jacob is "Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour. 9Resist him, standing firm in the faith, because you know that your brothers throughout the world are undergoing the same kind of sufferings." 1 Peter 5:8-9 (New International Version)

 

Michelle