Paranoid - Live, Lived, Will Live

[asta]

What is it with the recent spate of where have you lived (exactly), where would you live, how many times have you moved, (in both cases people say where they *do* live), etc. threads? The mods have already deleted one of them.

 

I understand this is a homeschooling board. I understand the "Networking Board" section for people who have just moved to a new place or are considering it. But I am also paranoid as all get out about the sheer amount of information that has been being asked for (and given out!) just in the last month or so.

 

Yes, I realize that many people here are completely unconcerned, and are of the mind that, if something bad is going to happen to them or their family, well, that is just how it is.

 

Yet, I can't seem to reconcile this seeming disconnect with all of the *other* posts about:

- registered child molester in my neighborhood

- convicted sex offender at our church

- 'weird' 3rd cousin, should I be concerned? (that is obviously a composite...)

- terrified of sending DS, DD into 'dangerous' public school

 

There are scary things right next door, yet there is no compunction about advertising one's location to the ENTIRE WORLD? Kids names, ages, extracurricular activities and pictures - all posted on blogs linked off of a major site? Or, if not linked, usually easily found due to user name compatibility?

 

Here's something to think about: Did anyone else notice that this poster only had the four posts that were made in that thread? It was because they had stepped in to post salient information.

 

Homeschool moms and dads aren't the only people reading this site, folks.

 

 

a

[nd293]

I agree. I'll mention my country, but not city. I'll mention my name, but not family name or childrens' names. In the "where have you lived post" I was happy to say "3 cities in Country X" but even that made me a little uncomfortable (in fact, I may even have deleted the post before I finished writing it, I often do if I start to feel uncomfortable about what I am writing). Certainly, there's enough info for someone who knows me to identify me, but hopefully not enough for someone who doesn't to find me. It does worry me, but the idea of a whole "online alter-ego" makes me more than a little uncomfortable too. I once found out that someone I had corresponded with online was using a completely different name, and it felt ... odd. Even though she wasn't a friend, and I understood the motivation, I felt "lied to". Silly, but there you have it!

[IsabelC]

Well I don't really worry about that stuff. I don't have any enemies, I don't have any secrets, and I figure that if somebody was really out to get me they'd find a way. I do try my best not to inadvertently give out personal information about other people, though. There can be all sorts of reasons why people want to hold stuff back: family (eg troublesome ex-spouse), professional reason, or simple personal preference. And this is definitely a timely reminder not to assume that internet forums are private.

Edited January 30, 2010 by Hotdrink

[RegGuheert]

Well I don't really worry about that stuff. I don't have any enemies, I don't have any secrets, and I figure that if somebody was really out to get me they'd find a way.

I think the point of Asta's post is that if you make it easy, there are people who WILL prey on you and your family. The problem with the internet is that you are not limited to targeting by someone local. You have a whole world full of people with which to contend. Here's a recent example:

 

MomsintheGarden got what appeared to be a spam email from the gMail address of a friend of ours. The email said she was stuck in London and needed money to get home. So MomsintheGarden emailed this friend to let her know she may have a virus or something on her computer sending this stuff out. She got an *immediate*, hand-typed response saying that she REALLY was stuck in London, please help, etc. Because of the language and spelling, MomsintheGarden knew it was not her friend, so she picked up the phone and called her. Here friend answered the phone with "IT'S NOT ME!".

 

Someone somewhere in the world had taken over her gMail account. I assume she did not have a sufficiently secure password. From the email they could now read, they knew her name, address, phone number along with the names and relations of all of her family members and friends. They had access to her bank accounts and credit cards. One of her other friends had received the plea for help. He agreed to send the money if they could verify 10 pieces of information that only our friend should know. The response contained 9 out of 10 correct answers! :eek: It was not easy for our friend to get Google to shut down the account.

 

Because this friend did not secure her account sufficiently, much of OUR personal information is in the hands of someone we know to be malicious, including some details about some of our children. They also know our email address and we are sure they have tried to hack into our account in the same way. Once we learned of the issue, we immediately increased the strength of MomsintheGarden's email password. The implications of having our email accounts breached are quite terrifying, really.

[creekland]

I'm not the least bit paranoid. Since we do a bit of work on the net with our pony farm, people can easily find us if they so choose - coming from here would be a harder way. It's brought in buyers, but no boogieman, so we don't plan to change.

 

And we'd never send money from an e-mail nor click on those sent to us claiming this or that is wrong with an account. I don't even click on those with pictures from folks we know unless we've talked and I know there are coming. There are so many spams out there. Everyone should be aware of that.

[IsabelC]

Horrible, the things these people do.

 

It also proves how worthwhile it is to have

(a) 'strong' passwords

(b) different passwords

So many people don't follow the guidelines of using a random combo of alpha numeric and other characters, and it's very common to use the same or similar pin/passwords for everything.

 

I'm wondering whether email hacking is getting more common nowadays, as it's happened to several people I know just in the last few weeks?

 

(Meanwhile, the old-fashioned snailmail cons are still proliferating: just yesterday I got a hilarious Nigerian scam sent to me from sunny Valencia.)

[vkay]

Someone somewhere in the world had taken over her gMail account. I assume she did not have a sufficiently secure password. From the email they could now read, they knew her name, address, phone number along with the names and relations of all of her family members and friends. They had access to her bank accounts and credit cards. One of her other friends had received the plea for help. He agreed to send the money if they could verify 10 pieces of information that only our friend should know. The response contained 9 out of 10 correct answers! :eek: It was not easy for our friend to get Google to shut down the account.

Yikes! That is terrible! But how in the world did they get credit card and bank account access via the gmail account? I'm going to have to double check the type of info we keep in our email accounts.

[RegGuheert]

Yikes! That is terrible! But how in the world did they get credit card and bank account access via the gmail account? I'm going to have to double check the type of info we keep in our email accounts.

I think Hotdrink hit the nail on the head.

It also proves how worthwhile it is to have

(a) 'strong' passwords

(b) different passwords

So many people don't follow the guidelines of using a random combo of alpha numeric and other characters, and it's very common to use the same or similar pin/passwords for everything.

Let's say you get statements emailed from your banks. That would tell them which bank websites to try. If you use the same username and password as your gmail account, or some other account which emailed your password, then they might have access to your banking accounts unless they have extra protections in place. Some do and some don't.

[elegantlion]

I try to err on the side of caution. I would feel uncomfortable listing exactly where I live and where I have lived. It might be able to be pieced together if someone read all my posts, but I've never listed it specifically.

 

Many times I google something homeschool related and this is the first site listed. Through google images I've happened upon many blogs from posters here.

 

This is public forum and unless I go and delete my posts they will stay there. I try to keep that in mind and only post what I wouldn't mind out in the world.

 

Who know how the internet will play into my son's future. Will there be a time when employers and universities perform internet searches to get a better picture of who their candidates are? Even without a facebook or twitter page? I don't know, but I don't want my ramblings to hold him back.

[RegGuheert]

 

Who know how the internet will play into my son's future. Will there be a time when employers and universities perform internet searches to get a better picture of who their candidates are? Even without a facebook or twitter page? I don't know, but I don't want my ramblings to hold him back.

Those practices are already relatively common today, even for non-government positions. In the case of US Government security clearances, you are required to provide all aliases you have ever used in your lifetime. This information is certainly used to search for your activities on the internet.

[elegantlion]

Those practices are already relatively common today, even for non-government positions. In the case of US Government security clearances, you are required to provide all aliases you have ever used in your lifetime. This information is certainly used to search for your activities on the internet.

 

:svengo: I'm guessing the blog alias your mother chose for you at age ten would count too. :confused:

[creekland]

Who know how the internet will play into my son's future. Will there be a time when employers and universities perform internet searches to get a better picture of who their candidates are? Even without a facebook or twitter page? I don't know, but I don't want my ramblings to hold him back.

 

I just googled my sons' real names (and mine + hubby). Nothing related to them came up, but there are several talented people out there who share the names. If there's any association from names, it should help my guys!

[RegGuheert]

I do think you are more anonymous on the internet if you have a common name (first and last). Ever tried to find someone named John Smith? :tongue_smilie:

Edited January 30, 2010 by RegGuheert

[asta]

Another thing people don't think about is personal style. There are people who only write in one color. Or one font. No matter where they go on the internet (believe me - I've seen it). I guess it is their way of saying "this is ME! This is my SIGNATURE!"

 

Well, guess what? There are a lot of bored people in the world who sit on computers all day looking for patterns in things (and not all of them are govt employees, LOL) - usually, they are called hackers. We tend to assume hackers only make viruses and disable networks. That isn't all they do. They look for vulnerabilities "in general".

 

People don't tend to spill out their entire life in one place (although I have seen some pretty detailed blogs...) - they tend to show one part on one site, another part on another site, etc. etc. It isn't a problem if there aren't really any identifying things to link from site to site, but when SuzyQhomemaker who lists her children's names and ages and her favorite verse in her signature line uses the exact. same. data on every site she goes to - or bothers to change her log-in, but keeps the rest, or insists on always writing in hot pink with sparkles... you get the picture.

 

I understand how it could be a bit of a let down to discover that the person you thought you were talking to was actually someone/thing completely different, but this isn't real life - this is the internet. Anyone can be anything - or nothing at all. (and yes, I realize that that puts me and my advice in the same category, I'm not dense)

 

Oh - BTW - humans don't even have to be present for most of this "patterning" - that's what bots do, and why system admins work so hard to prevent them from infiltrating boards. But they can't keep them off of google.

 

My kid has ALL of his FB stuff blocked - no games, no quizzes, no external "looks" allowed - NOTHING. And he got a bot. We had to change all of our passwords.

 

 

a

[asta]

 

This is public forum and unless I go and delete my posts they will stay there.

 

I'm just going to keep saying this one: try and go back and edit or delete an old post - the option isn't there. "Edit" disappears rather soon after posts are written.

 

 

a

[LauraGB]

Well, asta, you've gotten me sufficiently freaked. I've changed my location - now I'm only from the Upper Mid West. This is the only place I go, but dh is all over the place for his business, so I suppose in the end, it really doesn't matter what I do.

[Jenny in Atl]

Well, my location is in my name... so I guess I'm toast. :tongue_smilie:

[asta]

Well, my location is in my name... so I guess I'm toast. :tongue_smilie:

 

Yeah, but ATL is HUUUUUGGGGGEEEE. And, for all intents and purposes, it includes Alpharetta, Marietta, Lawrenceville, Fayetteville, Stockbridge, Peachtree City, etc. etc.

 

No one says "I'm from Stockbridge".

:lol:

 

 

a

[LauraGB]

But then, doesn't sharing your address by buying or selling books kind of mess up the whole privacy thing? Either here, Ebay or elsewhere?

 

Last year some gentlemen from Washington state flew here for a football game and decided they wanted to see the "shop" in which dh makes his products. The "shop" is in our basement! They drove over (had the address and phone either from the website or thier pkg from shipping) and ended up calling us from our driveway - they assumed the shop was a regular business. Naturally, they came in, but NONE of us were prepared for visitors that morning!

 

So, so much for maintaining privacy. (They were really nice, btw, and thought they were super cool that they were in our house ;))

Edited January 30, 2010 by LauraGB
grammar

[Jean in Newcastle]

Well, lots of people in my city know where I live. I'm sure they could figure out fairly easily where I bank. Many even know my address. And they could easily find out my phone number. (For that matter at least 15 people on this board know where I live because I've met them IRL.) They even know my real name.

 

I'm more worried about people stealing mail from my mail box (which is a big problem around here) so that they can get my bank information off my statements etc. or steal my actual checks. Many people here have switched to locking mailboxes for that reason. I just take my outgoing mail down to the post office and stick in the actual box there.

 

I'm also more concerned about having a secure connection for online purchases or banking.

[Jean in Newcastle]

What is it with the recent spate of where have you lived (exactly), where would you live, how many times have you moved, (in both cases people say where they *do* live), etc. threads? The mods have already deleted one of them.

 

I understand this is a homeschooling board. I understand the "Networking Board" section for people who have just moved to a new place or are considering it. But I am also paranoid as all get out about the sheer amount of information that has been being asked for (and given out!) just in the last month or so.

 

Yes, I realize that many people here are completely unconcerned, and are of the mind that, if something bad is going to happen to them or their family, well, that is just how it is.

 

Yet, I can't seem to reconcile this seeming disconnect with all of the *other* posts about:

- registered child molester in my neighborhood

- convicted sex offender at our church

- 'weird' 3rd cousin, should I be concerned? (that is obviously a composite...)

- terrified of sending DS, DD into 'dangerous' public school

 

There are scary things right next door, yet there is no compunction about advertising one's location to the ENTIRE WORLD? Kids names, ages, extracurricular activities and pictures - all posted on blogs linked off of a major site? Or, if not linked, usually easily found due to user name compatibility?

 

Here's something to think about: Did anyone else notice that this poster only had the four posts that were made in that thread? It was because they had stepped in to post salient information.

 

Homeschool moms and dads aren't the only people reading this site, folks.

 

 

a

 

I don't know why this whole thread has gotten my panties in a wad but it has!

 

The registered sex offender (whether in my neighborhood or one searching the net) is more likely to find victims IRL through neighborhood kids, kids he/she meets at parks and playgrounds or at school yards than from trolling the net.

 

Ditto for the one who goes to church. Only difference is that he can also pick up kids who he grooms at church functions. And I can't see any way to avoid him finding out my kids names or ages.

 

The weird family member already knows all about your family and where to find them, what their names are and how old they are.

 

I have no idea what having a dangerous ps puts you in danger of - other than the actual people at the dangerous ps.

 

I understand not putting my kids names out there. I don't want someone sending a friendly e-mail to X in an attempt to groom them and lure them away. But their ages? I don't see the danger in someone knowing that I have a ds12. There are poll takers and survey telemarketers who know that I have a ds12 - not just because I might tell them in a survey but because they get information from different sources that have that information. I also don't see the danger of putting what sports my child might be in out there. There are a lot of 8 year olds in gymnastics all around the world. Even in my city I'm sure I would have a pretty long list of 8 year olds in gymnastics. I don't put my kids pictures up because I'm paranoid too but I laugh at myself because I think the chances would be rather slim of someone recognizing them on the street because of a picture I put up.

[LauraGB]

I don't put my kids pictures up because I'm paranoid too but I laugh at myself because I think the chances would be rather slim of someone recognizing them on the street because of a picture I put up.

 

I'm weird about the picture thing - not because anyone might recognize them or stalk them, but because I really wouldn't want pictures of my kids turning up...elsewhere...on the internet. Probable? No, but I'm okay with not taking my chances with that one.

[asta]

I don't know why this whole thread has gotten my panties in a wad but it has!

 

The registered sex offender (whether in my neighborhood or one searching the net) is more likely to find victims IRL through neighborhood kids, kids he/she meets at parks and playgrounds or at school yards than from trolling the net.

 

Ditto for the one who goes to church. Only difference is that he can also pick up kids who he grooms at church functions. And I can't see any way to avoid him finding out my kids names or ages.

 

The weird family member already knows all about your family and where to find them, what their names are and how old they are.

 

I have no idea what having a dangerous ps puts you in danger of - other than the actual people at the dangerous ps.

 

I understand not putting my kids names out there. I don't want someone sending a friendly e-mail to X in an attempt to groom them and lure them away. But their ages? I don't see the danger in someone knowing that I have a ds12. There are poll takers and survey telemarketers who know that I have a ds12 - not just because I might tell them in a survey but because they get information from different sources that have that information. I also don't see the danger of putting what sports my child might be in out there. There are a lot of 8 year olds in gymnastics all around the world. Even in my city I'm sure I would have a pretty long list of 8 year olds in gymnastics. I don't put my kids pictures up because I'm paranoid too but I laugh at myself because I think the chances would be rather slim of someone recognizing them on the street because of a picture I put up.

 

I believe you misconstrued my point.

 

I was saying that people will put anything and everything out on the net (a place where they have absolutely no control over who views their information), but be terrified of the weird third cousin that they can actually control access to.

 

The danger isn't in "DD12". The danger is in "DD12 - our regional champion gymnast" with the family location up in the corner, numerous other comments sprinkled throughout posts, and a link to the family blog talking about how proud one is of the Princess Panther Gym Team.

 

I'm obviously not talking about you - I made all of that up. But I have literally seen equivalent information here.

 

 

asta

[Jean in Newcastle]

But what do you think someone will do if they know that dd12 is the champion regional gymnast of the Princess Panther Gym Team? Most internet crime is centered around scams. So I suppose you could get a letter inviting you to join the Nigerian gym team - provided you send $300 USD for your registration fee. Most child targeted internet crime is centered around luring kids in chat room type settings. So, if your child has gotten someone's attention on a teen chat site, he could then look up more info on her and then use that info ("let's get together after the next gymnastics meet") to lure the child away. So I agree that there is some danger but I think it isn't from the blog info per se but from places like chat rooms for kids. So - I've banned ds12 from using those and other social networking sites at this point.

[asta]

You're still missing what I'm saying (can someone help me out here?).

 

I'm not talking about the internet.

 

I'm talking about real life.

 

Malicious people use the internet to gather information about other people.

 

Said malicious people then use that information to seek out those folk in real life to do them harm.

 

That "real life" may be identity theft, it may be regular theft, it may be stalking, it may be blackmail, it may be bodily harm.

 

If you know of someone, anyone who works in the intelligence field, ask them about some of the unclassified things they can tell you about this subject.

 

 

asta

[eternalknot]

But what do you think someone will do if they know that dd12 is the champion regional gymnast of the Princess Panther Gym Team? Most internet crime is centered around scams.

 

I think a common concern, especially WRT children and their information, is that the crime won't necessarily be via internet. It would be easy for anyone local to you IRL to fixate on your child just by your day to day activities, true enough. The world becomes smaller, though, online. Now someone in the next state over can fixate on your child as well. And grow a one-sided pseudo-relationship with him or her. Feel a false sense of knowingness or closeness, sort of akin to a celebrity stalker. It may be that such a 'relationship' remains unbeknownst to you (such as the case with various fetishes that snatch other people's photos of babies in diapers, feet, pregnant women, blonde preteens, etc.) Or it may be that this sense of relationship escalates into something worse -- real life contact, that again could just as well happen IRL locally to you but is now just as likely to happen OL as well since you've made your world that much smaller.

 

I don't necessarily agree with it, but that's my understanding of it. My sister posts everything about her life on her blog -- pics of her house, her school, her kids, her car and license plate, and she shares identifying information on a regular basis with her 1300 subscribed readers plus whomever else is reading. Like you, I err on the most conservative side. Another sister doesn't share any identifying information or pictures at all. It's a discussion we have often. Interesting how differently we feel, just within my own family!

[Aubrey]

Well I don't really worry about that stuff. I don't have any enemies, I don't have any secrets, and I figure that if somebody was really out to get me they'd find a way. I do try my best not to inadvertently give out personal information about other people, though. There can be all sorts of reasons why people want to hold stuff back: family (eg troublesome ex-spouse), professional reason, or simple personal preference. And this is definitely a timely reminder not to assume that internet forums are private.

 

I'd be worried about identity theft more than "enemies." I stayed out of those threads. I don't mind saying which places I've visited, but a quick google of my name doesn't leave enough options for me to also give a stranger a synopsis of everywhere I've lived.

[Jean in Newcastle]

But Asta - in real life, people could get a lot more basic information about my family, including my kids, through much easier ways than using the internet. So I don't consider the internet as a big source of physical danger for me or my family. Do you have statistics on physical crimes which involve the internet? And do you have statistics on what percentage of those might focus more on social networking sites like online dating services etc.?

 

If someone from this board suddenly wanted to meet me, then I might be more cautious. (But even then I have met at least 15 people from this board. In fact I invited a bunch of them to meet me at a local park last year. I suppose I could have been setting myself up to meet an axe murderer at our rendezvous but I felt fairly safe in a public setting. I hope they weren't too nervous that I was an axe murderer setting them up by inviting them to our WTM get-together.)

 

Financial crime is, I think, more prevalent on the computer. I've been the recipient of scam e-mails like most people have. But every time you use a credit card, you are opening yourself up for the possibility that someone is swiping it into one of those readers that captures the numbers. Most financial criminals aren't going to waste their time on a site like this, unless it was a troll, looking for sympathy money. So, be warned not to send money to people you don't know.

 

My real life stalker met me in real life. Yes, he could have found out more about me on the internet (though this was pre internet). But he found out just as much from trusting friends and family and from stupid old me. I honestly don't see how he could have made my life any more a living hell than he did.

 

You need to do something blackmail worthy to catch the notice of a blackmailer. I'll be sure not to post where the bodies are buried.:tongue_smilie:

 

Sure, if you were building a dossier on me you could find out all sorts of stuff about me through the internet. But normal crime doesn't require a dossier. And normal people aren't interesting enough to trigger the interest of someone who builds dossiers.

[Guest Katia]

 

My kid has ALL of his FB stuff blocked - no games, no quizzes, no external "looks" allowed - NOTHING. And he got a bot. We had to change all of our passwords.

 

 

a

 

Me too! I have no applications at all on my FB and I have it locked down as tight as possible.....and I still got a bot. Ugh. I did change my password to make it stronger, but now I know how/where to check for the bots and do it regularly.

 

I did not participate on those threads either. I'm sure if someone really wanted to find me it would be easy enough by reading through all my posts here, and although I do try to be careful with what I post, that personal information adds up.

 

And to Reg.....a pastor friend of mine had that very same scam of the "I'm stuck in London", only it happened to him as a message on FB. He, too, called his friend while he was typing/corresponding to the scammer and found out it was a scam. Weird! But until you posted that this happened to your wife, it was the only time I had heard of that scam.

 

I agree that we start to feel a sense of 'community' here and then give out entirely too much personal information; forgetting that anyone and everyone in the world can read it.

[LauraGB]

I did change my password to make it stronger, but now I know how/where to check for the bots and do it regularly.

 

 

 

If you don't mind, where are you checking? :blush5:

[Guest Katia]

If you don't mind, where are you checking? :blush5:

 

At the top of your FB page, in the blue bar, point on "settings" and a drop-down menu will appear. Click on "application settings". When that page comes up, look at the top right-hand side where it says: "show recently used" and there is a drop-down menu box. Click on the drop-down arrow then click on "added to profile".

 

That will show you everything on your profile. If you have something like "unknown app", click the "x" box to remove it as it is a spybot. Actually, I clicked on everything and removed it all.

 

To double check, just go back to "home" and then go through all of the above steps again, and if it's all truly gone there will be nothing at all on your "added to profile" page.

 

I just checked mine again.....no bots or unwanted apps. (those unwanted apps slip in there somehow, even when I don't authorize them!)

[asta]

The US Justice Department has a great website here that deals with cybercrime specifically. One of the links is to a site called Stay Safe Online that has some great info about how the internet "bleeds" into real life. That same site has a whole section on how to protect your personal information.

 

There is a book called Hacking: The next generation that outlines some of what I have mentioned regarding how none of this is about a simple phishing scam or whatever - in the words of Arlo Guthrie, "it's a movement".

 

All I'm saying is, hiding our collective heads in the sand for the sake of posting an adorable picture isn't going to make it go away. Anyone and everyone is free to disagree with me, but the data is there.

 

 

asta

[creekland]

So I don't consider the internet as a big source of physical danger for me or my family. Do you have statistics on physical crimes which involve the internet? And do you have statistics on what percentage of those might focus more on social networking sites like online dating services etc.?

 

 

 

I'm with you 100%. While I won't say there is no danger in the internet, I think the similarity is akin to worrying about a plane crash while happily hopping in ones car to drive to the airport. Plane crashes do happen, of course, but there is far more danger in the car trip. Neither are likely to happen.

 

Plus, I agree that one of the biggest dangers lies in chatrooms. No one in my family goes to any of those that are unmonitored.

 

Financially there is a big danger from scams - e-mail and otherwise. One needs to be extremely cautious with internet (or non-internet) dealings.

 

Other than that, I'm not the least bit concerned.

 

I have a friend that works in the State Dept. It's interesting to visit him as his life has become completely jaded pretty much assuming everyone out there is a criminal and/or terrorist. He'll even admit it - and admit that it's a side effect of his job.

[Scarlett]

But what do you think someone will do if they know that dd12 is the champion regional gymnast of the Princess Panther Gym Team? Most internet crime is centered around scams. So I suppose you could get a letter inviting you to join the Nigerian gym team - provided you send $300 USD for your registration fee. Most child targeted internet crime is centered around luring kids in chat room type settings. So, if your child has gotten someone's attention on a teen chat site, he could then look up more info on her and then use that info ("let's get together after the next gymnastics meet") to lure the child away. So I agree that there is some danger but I think it isn't from the blog info per se but from places like chat rooms for kids. So - I've banned ds12 from using those and other social networking sites at this point.

 

I read all the warnings and I still come up agreeing with you Jean. I just can't see worrying too much. I've become much more careful posting private information that would embarrass me or my friends or my son, but I am not afraid of being harmed in other ways from my visits to TWTM forum.

 

In the example of 'stuck in London', it all comes back to the individual being targeting using good common sense and not sending money without verifying the truth.

 

I have a real life similar example. I was in my early 20s and a man tried to talk his way into my house in an early morning rain storm. It was cold, he was wet, I felt sorry for him. He claimed to need to use the phone. I didn't let him in--I didn't even open the door. I used good common sense that I FELT at first was over the top. I few seconds later I watched him leave my front door, go around the side of my my house and stand peeking into my bedroom where I had been moments before the bell rang. When I told this story to my very pro-gun BIL he exclaimed, 'see! That is why you need a gun!' Huh? I protected myself by not opening the door. What good would a gun have done me? I didn't open the door. That is what saved me. Don't send money. That is what will save you from on line scams.

[unsinkable]

You're still missing what I'm saying (can someone help me out here?).

 

I'm not talking about the internet.

 

I'm talking about real life.

 

Malicious people use the internet to gather information about other people.

 

Said malicious people then use that information to seek out those folk in real life to do them harm.

 

That "real life" may be identity theft, it may be regular theft, it may be stalking, it may be blackmail, it may be bodily harm.

 

If you know of someone, anyone who works in the intelligence field, ask them about some of the unclassified things they can tell you about this subject.

 

 

asta

 

How about someone who uses her very popular blog to have contests in which the winners are invited into her remote ranch to stay in her beautiful guest house and interact with her 4 children?

 

To me, that sounds like the makings of a horror movie.

[RegGuheert]

In the example of 'stuck in London', it all comes back to the individual being targeting using good common sense and not sending money without verifying the truth.

No, the point of my post had nothing to do with using common sense to avoid scammers. That scam was so transparent that I don't think many would fall for it. And so what if you DID fall for it? You'd be out some money. Big deal!

 

No, the point was that our friend had someone take over her gMail account. THAT is a big deal and the information contained in your emails could be used to harm you and your family in many, many ways, both financially and physically. I'm sorry I wasn't more clear about that.

[TravelingChris]

Part of the very big problem is that making secure passwords that you can remember is hard. One option that I use is to make very secure passwords for financial stuff but write them down in a book. Can someone break in and access this? Well, yes they could but then they would have access to my bills and statements that have the same info in them. Most thieves come and get your tv, electronics and jewelry. WHat I don't like is all kinds of useless sites requiring passwords. I reuse those all the time. I am talking about things like newspaper sites that require a password to see an article or other such stupid requests. I am not filling up my head with even more passwords to please them.

[Scarlett]

No, the point of my post had nothing to do with using common sense to avoid scammers. That scam was so transparent that I don't think many would fall for it. And so what if you DID fall for it? You'd be out some money. Big deal!

 

No, the point was that our friend had someone take over her gMail account. THAT is a big deal and the information contained in your emails could be used to harm you and your family in many, many ways, both financially and physically.

 

For example? I'm not trying to be snarky....I must be dense, because I don't get it.

[Jean in Newcastle]

OK - I looked every one of those links. Perhaps I should bow out of this thread because my kids are not allowed to go to chat rooms, I monitor all on-line research (so that they don't accidentally run into p*rn), and have cautioned them about sharing personal information on-line. I also have my computer protected in numerous ways and use various passwords. I do not have a blog and while I've talked about some very personal topics on this board, I do it knowing that many people know who I am. The personal topics are discussed impersonally if you will, without names, places etc.

[RegGuheert]

For example? I'm not trying to be snarky....I must be dense, because I don't get it.

Here's what someone could learn if they got access to my gmail account:

 

- Names, addresses, email addresses and phone numbers of everyone in my extended family. I send out the invites for the family reunion.

- Relationships between some of the family members.

- Birthdates and anniversaries for some of the family members.

- Pictures of some of the people who also have gmail accounts.

- Names of all of our bank, investment and retirement accounts.

- Account names, aliases and sometimes passwords for internet sites where I have registered.

- Account names, aliases and sometimes passwords for sites where I have shopped.

- Lists of items we have purchased.

- Information about my/our travel itineraries.

- Where my children attend college and their exact classroom schedules.

 

The more I think about this issue, the more concerned I am. My gmail password is pretty strong, but I think I may need to make it *extremely* strong. I'm thinking about starting to use KeePass on my computer and my Android phone to allow me to accomplish this without forgetting them all. That program is fully open source and is supposed to be very secure. DS19 uses it and his fellow CS/Math buddies at school are confident it is safe. I'm also very close to deleting all mail kept on the gmail server. This will eliminate one of the strong benefits of gmail, but it will also eliminate much, but not all, of the information which is out there that could possibly be exploited. I really like the many benefits of gmail, but our friend's story was really a wake-up call for us.

 

BTW, I don't think our situation is that much different than that of many people who use gmail or similar services. Thoughts?

[Jean in Newcastle]

Here's what someone could learn if they got access to my gmail account:

 

- Names, addresses, email addresses and phone numbers of everyone in my extended family. I send out the invites for the family reunion.

- Relationships between some of the family members.

- Birthdates and anniversaries for some of the family members.

- Pictures of some of the people who also have gmail accounts.

- Names of all of our bank, investment and retirement accounts.

- Account names, aliases and sometimes passwords for internet sites where I have registered.

- Account names, aliases and sometimes passwords for sites where I have shopped.

- Lists of items we have purchased.

- Information about my/our travel itineraries.

- Where my children attend college and their exact classroom schedules.

 

The more I think about this issue, the more concerned I am. My gmail password is pretty strong, but I think I may need to make it *extremely* strong. I'm thinking about starting to use KeePass on my computer and my Android phone to allow me to accomplish this without forgetting them all. That program is fully open source and is supposed to be very secure. DS19 uses it and his fellow CS/Math buddies at school are confident it is safe. I'm also very close to deleting all mail kept on the gmail server. This will eliminate one of the strong benefits of gmail, but it will also eliminate much, but not all, of the information which is out there that could possibly be exploited. I really like the many benefits of gmail, but our friend's story was really a wake-up call for us.

 

BTW, I don't think our situation is that much different than that of many people who use gmail or similar services. Thoughts?

 

Would they get this from reading the stored e-mails?

[RegGuheert]

Would they get this from reading the stored e-mails?

Only these are in email:

 

- Names of all of our bank, investment and retirement accounts.

- Account names, aliases and sometimes passwords for internet sites where I have registered.

- Account names, aliases and sometimes passwords for sites where I have shopped.

- Lists of items we have purchased.

- Information about my/our travel itineraries.

 

And some of the above may also be contained in contacts. Some information is contained in calendars and other Google services. I also forgot to mention:

 

- Names, titles, addresses, emails and telephone numbers of all present and past co-workers.

- Names, titles, addresses, email addresses and telephone numbers of all present and past business associates.

[funschooler5]

What is it with the recent spate of where have you lived (exactly), where would you live, how many times have you moved, (in both cases people say where they *do* live), etc. threads? The mods have already deleted one of them.

 

I understand this is a homeschooling board. I understand the "Networking Board" section for people who have just moved to a new place or are considering it. But I am also paranoid as all get out about the sheer amount of information that has been being asked for (and given out!) just in the last month or so.

 

Yes, I realize that many people here are completely unconcerned, and are of the mind that, if something bad is going to happen to them or their family, well, that is just how it is.

 

Yet, I can't seem to reconcile this seeming disconnect with all of the *other* posts about:

- registered child molester in my neighborhood

- convicted sex offender at our church

- 'weird' 3rd cousin, should I be concerned? (that is obviously a composite...)

- terrified of sending DS, DD into 'dangerous' public school

 

There are scary things right next door, yet there is no compunction about advertising one's location to the ENTIRE WORLD? Kids names, ages, extracurricular activities and pictures - all posted on blogs linked off of a major site? Or, if not linked, usually easily found due to user name compatibility?

 

Here's something to think about: Did anyone else notice that this poster only had the four posts that were made in that thread? It was because they had stepped in to post salient information.

 

Homeschool moms and dads aren't the only people reading this site, folks.

 

 

a

 

I started the "where would you live if you could live anywhere in the US" thread. DH and I might be moving in the near future, and since I haven't traveled very much, I thought I'd ask the opinion of others who had. I wasn't doing it to get personal info (I don't think you were implying that, but I'm not sure). I didn't realize there were other threads recently about where people have lived. I didn't think there'd be much harm in finding out where people would *want* to live if they could.

 

I am changing my gmail passwords again, though. :tongue_smilie:

[Scarlett]

Here's what someone could learn if they got access to my gmail account:

 

- Names, addresses, email addresses and phone numbers of everyone in my extended family. I send out the invites for the family reunion.

- Relationships between some of the family members.

- Birthdates and anniversaries for some of the family members.

- Pictures of some of the people who also have gmail accounts.

- Names of all of our bank, investment and retirement accounts.

- Account names, aliases and sometimes passwords for internet sites where I have registered.

- Account names, aliases and sometimes passwords for sites where I have shopped.

- Lists of items we have purchased.

- Information about my/our travel itineraries.

- Where my children attend college and their exact classroom schedules.

 

The more I think about this issue, the more concerned I am. My gmail password is pretty strong, but I think I may need to make it *extremely* strong. I'm thinking about starting to use KeePass on my computer and my Android phone to allow me to accomplish this without forgetting them all. That program is fully open source and is supposed to be very secure. DS19 uses it and his fellow CS/Math buddies at school are confident it is safe. I'm also very close to deleting all mail kept on the gmail server. This will eliminate one of the strong benefits of gmail, but it will also eliminate much, but not all, of the information which is out there that could possibly be exploited. I really like the many benefits of gmail, but our friend's story was really a wake-up call for us.

 

BTW, I don't think our situation is that much different than that of many people who use gmail or similar services. Thoughts?

 

And what might they do with that info?

[RegGuheert]

 

And what might they do with that info?

You're kidding, right? :confused:

[Jean in Newcastle]

Here's what someone could learn if they got access to my gmail account:

 

- Names, addresses, email addresses and phone numbers of everyone in my extended family. I send out the invites for the family reunion.

- Relationships between some of the family members.

- Birthdates and anniversaries for some of the family members.

- Pictures of some of the people who also have gmail accounts.

- Names of all of our bank, investment and retirement accounts.

- Account names, aliases and sometimes passwords for internet sites where I have registered.

- Account names, aliases and sometimes passwords for sites where I have shopped.

- Lists of items we have purchased.

- Information about my/our travel itineraries.

- Where my children attend college and their exact classroom schedules.

 

The more I think about this issue, the more concerned I am. My gmail password is pretty strong, but I think I may need to make it *extremely* strong. I'm thinking about starting to use KeePass on my computer and my Android phone to allow me to accomplish this without forgetting them all. That program is fully open source and is supposed to be very secure. DS19 uses it and his fellow CS/Math buddies at school are confident it is safe. I'm also very close to deleting all mail kept on the gmail server. This will eliminate one of the strong benefits of gmail, but it will also eliminate much, but not all, of the information which is out there that could possibly be exploited. I really like the many benefits of gmail, but our friend's story was really a wake-up call for us.

 

BTW, I don't think our situation is that much different than that of many people who use gmail or similar services. Thoughts?

 

OK - here's what they could use it for.

 

The names and addresses they could use to run scams on your contacts. Sort of a way to cast the web wider so to speak.

 

Relationship info - you could get mother's maiden name that way. That used to be a common password for financial info. Still is used somewhat. Other relationship info. could be used in scams (I'm your brother X's good friend).

 

Birthdates are often used by businesses to identify you. I have no idea why it would help them to know anniversary dates- other than as a possible way to further spin a story to you.

 

Pictures - eh. Unless they were out specifically to stalk someone and needed their pictures, I don't see this as a danger.

 

Names of accounts - big red flag here. I've gotten e-mails from my "bank" before - "just enter your account info and it will lead you to the news update." I always always call the bank directly to check out if these bank communications are legitimate. (Your bank should already know your account number, btw).

 

Internet site info - I suppose someone could pretend to be you. If it is a closed site then they have entry under your name.

 

Lists of purchased items - I could only see this as a problem if it was a big ticket item. Or if your credit account info is attached.

 

Travel itineraries - know when to rob you because you're not at home?

 

Classroom schedules - I suppose if you had a stalker this would be a problem. I don't see how it would interest a financial criminal.

 

Reg- your opinions?

[RegGuheert]

To me, the answer depends on what kind of criminal got access to the account. I can think of many different types of criminals who could use this information: thief, identity thief, blackmailer, someone with a grudge, murderer, sexual criminal, child molester, etc. The list could go on and on. Since most are too painful to contemplate, let's consider what a thief would do:

 

1) Change the password on the gmail account. This would immediately block access to my account by me. It would also immediately disable my Android cell phone.

2) Go to the website of each financial institution and try the original gmail password. If that didn't work, click the "Forgot my password" button. Guess where the password resetting information goes? That's right, in many cases, it goes to the email address. (Yes, some banks will snail-mail this to the address on file. If the criminal is nearby, they could watch the mailbox and steal it when it came.)

3) Go to every shopping website, try the orignal gmail password and click "Forgot my password" button on each of them.

4) Go to every website where the account owner has ever visited and click "Forgot my password" on each of those sites, as well. At this point, I would be locked out of any form of online access to anything that I've used.

5) After locking out the original user, the goal would be to obtain cash and prizes as quickly as possible. Any bank accounts accessed could simply have withdrawals made and the mailbox watched or make electronic transfers to another account. Alternatively, the snail mail address could be changed. Phone numbers could be changed to try to block the original owner from blocking the account.

6) Go on a shopping spree. If access to Amazon was available, then put in a new shipping address and buy whatever you want until you hit the limit on the credit card. Then move to another card. The new address does not need to belong to the criminal. It could be the house down the street where the owners both work so that they could pick up the packages each day.

 

Regardless of how much actually got stolen, you can imagine that you would have a very tough time cleaning up from such an attack. What if your money was all stolen, you couldn't access any of your accounts or credit and you had to pay your mortgage?

 

With regard to all the other types of criminals: I doubt you would EVER know they had access to the account. They could simply collect current information whenever they pleased.

 

No, I'm pretty sure I do not want anyone to EVER access my gmail account!

Edited January 31, 2010 by RegGuheert

[joannqn]

Ok, ok...you've convinced me to do a better job with my passwords and protecting them.

[Scarlett]

You're kidding, right? :confused:

 

No. I am not. I realize that there are horror stories of people getting hit with this type of stuff and then it taking A LOT to sort it all out. I see it as a remote risk with, in my case, minimal amounts to lose.

 

I am more concerned about the person in my circle of close friends who turns out to be a child molestor. Or the 24 year old at my husband's office who starts sleeping with him and the subsequent fall out from that. I'm worried about the breast cancer that struck my mother and now the osteoporosis she now has that I believe was brought on my the chemo that saved her from the cancer.

 

I have enough to worry about in my real life. I won't be borrowing any today.

 

But hey, a stronger password is a good idea. My current one is horrible.

[RegGuheert]

 

I see it as a remote risk with, in my case, minimal amounts to lose.

I used to think of it that way. That was before we realized that someone (or some group) that does precisely what I described above has our gmail addresses and is actively trying to get into them. At this point, the odds of our accounts being compromised are based almost solely on the strength of our passwords.

But hey, a stronger password is a good idea. My current one is horrible.

So are most people's. That's the real point. You don't really want to be the low-hanging fruit or the odds of having YOUR account being compromised are MUCH higher. Edited January 31, 2010 by RegGuheert