If you use multiple simultaneous math programs, why?

[Ginevra]

How did you come to do this? Proactively (avoid potential problems) or Reactively (Holy Cow! They don't get it!)?

 

More to the point, how do you do it? If my dd spent her requisite hour on MUS and then I said, "Lovely job, dear. Now, just open up your Saxon book and begin Lesson 1..." I don't even want to imagine that scenario! Seriously. She's a wonderful, cooperative child and all, but I can't be draconian, here.

[LadyAberlin]

Well I did it to avoid problems, but for us to do MUS Alpha and Horizons K it only takes us 15 minutes to do both. If it took an hr for a lesson in only one program then yes it wouldn't be a good idea to do two programs unless you did them on different days.

[Sunshine State Sue]

We used MUS from K through Algebra. For several years, we supplemented with Singapore's Challenging Word Problems because MUS is weak on word problems. We do math 3x a week. We supplemented different ways, but the way that worked best was to do 2 pages of MUS and 3 CWP 3x/week.

[momtotkbb]

For us, it started by accident. My oldest was in public school and needed enrichment materials to keep busy ---so I put together whole pkts of work, heavy on math and science bec those were his passions, for him to complete each week while in school. When dd came along and we decided to homeschool she completed Abeka Math K and Math 1 in her first year. The next year she begged for more than Abeka Math 2 so I started using math literature and also gave her Moving with Math 3rd/4th grade. So, every year since then we've either used multiple programs, literature or additional resources.

 

In terms of how it works ---it's depended upon the dc and the year. For the most part we don't spend more than 45 mins - 1 hour on math, so if a lesson in one program takes that long we don't use a second one on that day. But, that's rare. On most days, at least my younger ones, can easily complete two lessons in that time.

[chaik76]

I know one family who does two math curricula a year...first they do one program, then they do the second program. They only do one program at a time.

 

We do it simultaneously. Sometimes I schedule both lessons the same day, sometimes I separate them. We usually use two concurrently, and then one that I will pull out for extra instruction.

 

I don't really see it as any different than the multiple LA programs that many people like to use.

[Karen in CO]

I have at times used 5 different programs. Most people cringe when they hear how I do math. But it works for us. I accumulated my various math programs as I was trying to help recover from completely not understanding how my dd learns math and turning her from a child that showed early math promise to a child that cried at the sight of a math book. I'll save the long story, but the short one is that my dd prefers complicated, tricky math problems and hates to repeat something she knows. If you give her 10 problems of the same type, she will find at least 10 different ways to work them out.

 

Right now I am using MEP as my primary math program which means that we do a lesson or two or a few problems from three or four lessons each day, for four days a week. She has also decided that she wants to be quicker on her multiplication and division facts so we spend about 15 minutes each morning with me reading multiplication and division word problems from Ray's New Intellectual Math. On the fifth day of math, she works Singapore CWP's for at least an hour or until she gets frustrated, whichever comes last.

 

My youngest is starting Miquon, so when she does Miquon, I also give the older dd a Miquon book and she chooses pages to work out of it.

 

We do annual testing, and we have previously used a whole BJU math book. I know that they structure their materail so that it will cover all that is needed for the tests. So, I will rotate her into a chapter of BJU at least once a month to make sure that has covered all the test things. BJU also does a really good job of building up knowledge slowly and deeply so if she is struggling with a concept, I will slow her down into a BJU chapter on that topic so that it can simmer, and she can get more confident.

 

Hopefully that helps. I know I am an extreme case of multiple-maths, but my dd now dreams of becoming a famous mathematician when she gets done studying art history in Rome.

[Bostonmom]

We did it as a "Holy Cow, he doesn't get it" reaction. We are using Singapore math, which my older kids have done really well with, but my younger ds has more trouble grasping concepts. Someone had given me a partially used Saxon 1 workbook, so we move slowly through Singapore and I give him the Saxon pages to do independently in the mornings before we sit down together. He finds those easier, so it boosts his confidence.

[TiaNKids]

I started off with Saxon and then switched to MUS. I wanted my dd to get more review in multiplication and I really liked how MUS explained the multiplication facts. So to make a long story short, I have been alternating between Saxon and MUS and if I had to do it again, I wouldn't :001_huh: It has taken her a year and half to get through both books but once she started she wanted to do and finish them both.

 

-Tia

 

 

 

How did you come to do this? Proactively (avoid potential problems) or Reactively (Holy Cow! They don't get it!)?

 

More to the point, how do you do it? If my dd spent her requisite hour on MUS and then I said, "Lovely job, dear. Now, just open up your Saxon book and begin Lesson 1..." I don't even want to imagine that scenario! Seriously. She's a wonderful, cooperative child and all, but I can't be draconian, here.

[ElizabethB]

This year we switched from MUS to Singapore. Singapore is working well, but we're going to do RS over the summer to help keep the math facts in her brain (the majority of them jumped right out last summer!)

 

I may also do some fun Miquon work this summer.

 

Next year, we'll do a mix w/ Singapore as the spine, but some RS and Miquon and MEP for variety. Maybe W, W, F Singapore, T/Th other math. I haven't decided yet, we'll try out a few things and see how it goes.

 

I use no less than 3 phonics programs, and usually at least 5 or 6, with most of my phonics students, so I am good at combining programs! If you do it right, you maximize efficiency and keep interest high.

 

We also use 3 different Spanish books, for those, I use one for a few weeks or a month until she starts getting tired of it and then switch to one of the other books.

 

I think handwriting is the only program where I have only one book! It would be confusing to switch between different types of letters, I think. (Although I do have different programs for cursive and print, but just one book for each type of writing.) Actually, I just have FLL for grammar! I looked at others at the convention, but they were all too workbooky for me. (But we do have some mad libs for fun, and we supplement with fun library books, my library has an amazing assortment of fun grammar books, who knew there were so many good fun children's grammar books.)

 

Edit: OK, I do have a ton of grammar books, but they are all for older children, and they are all books from the 1800's that I just couldn't pass up for $5 to $10 each! (Purchased before I had children or planned to homeschool.)

 

We switched from MUS to Singapore because MUS quit working for her, and it wasn't fun for her. Singapore is working better, and she especially enjoys the challenging puzzle parts of the IP books.

Edited May 30, 2009 by ElizabethB

[Cindyg]

Well, I do it because I read about something neat, usually here, and I can't resist it. We use BJUP as our spine for everything, so that's an automatic one program.

 

But I didn't want my son to miss out on Mr. Steve, so we watch the MUS DVDs. That's two. We certainly don't do an hour a day (which the OP mentioned). We typically watch one episode a week. That's maybe 5 minutes. You might think that 5 minutes a week of Mr. Steve won't do us any good. But it has. We love Mr. Steve, and we love how succinct he is!

 

OK, then I heard about Hands-On Equations. Being a Montessorian at heart, I just couldn't resist that. Program #3. That's 5 minutes a day, and it's been a huge hit. DS truly loves this program.

 

Well, we also heard about the RS Abacus. Being a Montessorian at heart, I couldn't resist that either. We no longer use the Abacus (ds is in 5th grade); but we did for a long time. Anything the BJUP curriculum calculated in beans or chocolate chips, we calculated with the abacus (much easier!). We loved it. It didn't really add any time to our math study; it was our favorite manipulative.

 

Oh, and we read about LOF. My son is a serious reader, and LOF seemed just perfect for him. And it was!! LOF can be done in minutes a day, just a little bit at a time. No big deal. (My son probably thinks that LOF is our spine and BJUP is just our worksheet/drudgery.) DS loves LOF and would be devastated if we quit doing it. Seriously.

 

What else? Oh, ds struggled with math facts, so we tried all the math-facts-memorization programs and gadgets. I should write a book. We're no longer using any of them (except flashcards), but that's not to say they didn't help at the time.

 

All together, I would estimate that we spend about 15 minutes a day on math together, and ds probably spends another 15 minutes a day on his independent work (BJUP worksheet).

Edited May 30, 2009 by Cindyg

[Lori D.]

Older DS is a math whiz, and always finished his math programs with 8-12 weeks left in the school year -- way too long a period of time, when combined with a 3 month summer break to go without math. So we would do a "skim review" of some other math program, dipping into topics he hadn't seen yet from the spine program.

 

Throughout the elementary grades, we did math with both DSs 4 days a week and did fun math games, fun manipulative math, etc. on Fridays for variety.

 

Younger DS struggles with math, so when in the younger elementary grades it was critical to have loads of supplements to go to when he "hit the wall" with the spine math program to have short things with manipulatives to go to and learn about some completely other topic and let the troublesome topic "simmer" in the back of his mind. Once we found MUS in grade 5, he connected more with math, and also finished early, so we used Singapore in the 8 weeks or so left in the school year to help him see math in more than one way to really have mathematical thinking and understanding. On days when the MUS only took him 20-30 minutes, I'd also have him do a page or two out of a Keys to Math workbook to review and keep other math concepts fresh.

 

So, we never did 2 complete math programs simultaneously, but did find that supplements were very important for switching it up during the school year, or finishing out a school year.

 

If your students are understanding the math from whatever program you're currently using, and it takes a more than 30 minutes, then it sounds like you probably have no need for more than one math program. Warmly, Lori D.

Edited May 30, 2009 by Lori D.
correction

[Bostonmom]

Just curious--what's LOF? :blushing:

[Karen in CO]

Life of Fred

[Ali in OR]

Using multiple sources can be a very good teaching practice. Think of "course curriculum" as the topics and concepts that you want to cover rather than one program you buy. The curriculum could be one text, but in many well-designed courses, multiple texts/books/authors may be used. I used to teach high school math. Our honors geometry course started with a month of logic using one particular text. Then a particular geometry book with good instruction on logical proof was used for most of the year. But we would also supplement with a different text that had wonderful problems with geometric solids and more real life applications. Anyway, different texts have different strengths and sometimes you can put together a richer experience by combining them.

[Stacia]

I do it so that we have practice seeing problems from different places, learning different ways to approach & solve problems, etc.... Dd uses MUS & LOF.

 

Often, dd will do 2 pages in MUS. If it's a concept she understands well, we may not complete all 6 pages per chapter -- it really just depends. Sometimes, I'll toss in a LOF chapter for the day instead of our MUS lesson (it takes about the same amount of time that we would normally spend on our MUS lesson). Sometimes, we'll work on LOF for a week, rather than MUS. Either way, we finished both programs early this year, so it wasn't a time issue. The programs complement each other very nicely & dd enjoys both.

[5ray2006]

We are currently working through 3 different math curriculums, although not at the same time. We just started using CLE math as our "main" program. We were using BJU Math 2, but I decided he would do better with a spiral math program. The jury is still out on whether or not my ds likes CLE math. He sometimes complains that the lesson is a lot longer than BJU. With CLE, the pages can be as long as three pgs. front/back. This is only b/c most of the instruction is in the workbook directed to the student. Sometimes we will finish up a CLE math lesson and do one lesson in BJU. Other times we do a lesson in BJU and follow up with 2 pgs. in Singapore Math. Singapore Math though is usually reserved for weekends and the summer. My ds gets bored doing the same thing over and over. I like to teach him different ways of doing problems so I can determine whether or not he has grasped a concept.

 

I plan to stick with these 3 programs until he gets to sixth grade. After that, we're moving onto Chalkdust Math for the long haul. ;)

[Spy Car]

Pro-actively.

 

But not to "avoid potential problems" so much as the desire to build deeper understanding. To teach variations of the same concept from slightly different angles. To find better, clearer ways to get concepts across.

 

To use some programs to stretch critical thinking skills (MEP, Miquon, Singapore) and others to help give "order" and cement low-level math fact retention (Right Start elements and games).

 

I find myself constantly trying to create, borrow, or steal good ideas. Looking for the "light-bulb moment" inducing explanations, and ways to make math both fun and deeply understood.

 

For me that means drawing on programs that bring something special to the table. Another sheet of math equations I need not. Timed drills with flash-cards, I'll pass.

 

But if I can steal a good idea from MUS, or a Japanese math book, or what-ever. I'll do it. If I can teach math with clarity, and a sense of fun. And it's ever-changing (or at least not always the same) interest remains high and no one gets frustrated. I love hearing: Daddy, lets play math!.

 

Bill

Edited May 30, 2009 by Spy Car

[sagira]

How did you come to do this? Proactively (avoid potential problems) or Reactively (Holy Cow! They don't get it!)?

 

More to the point, how do you do it? If my dd spent her requisite hour on MUS and then I said, "Lovely job, dear. Now, just open up your Saxon book and begin Lesson 1..." I don't even want to imagine that scenario! Seriously. She's a wonderful, cooperative child and all, but I can't be draconian, here.

 

I'm assuming you're talking about older grades here, but I'll bite :)

 

I come to this proactively as I, going to a stellar school and all, happen to have a very weak math foundation from 7th onwards. Forget algebra. Fractions are not embedded too greatly either :tongue_smilie: Drill and kill was the norm in elementary school for us, and I dreaded math from then on. For ds, I'm employing CM's methods of short lessons in the early years, progressing through longer sessions as his attention span increases. We're building his attention muscle so to speak. Right now (Kinder) we're alternating between one day of MCP Math Level A (first chapter, basic review of K) with one day of Miquon. I love the variety, so does he. Different ways of tackling problems -- problem-solving in the traditional sense with MCP (See, Plan, Do, Check) and the discovery, intuitive way with Miquon. Ds actually enjoys both. So do I. I can't make up my mind whether I want to continue alternating days (15 minutes each day of work on his part), or do MCP Math first in the day, and Miquon (much) later in the day to break it up :confused: But that is the subject of another thread :tongue_smilie:

 

If my ds were older (spending an hour on MUS e.g.) I would definitely just alternate days. M, W, F MUS, and supplement with something else on Tuesdays and Thursdays. Or maybe just once a week if you don't want to dilute MUS that much.

[sagira]

But not to "avoid potential problems" so much as the desire to build deeper understanding. To teach variations of the same concept from slightly different angles. To find better, clearer ways to get concepts across.

 

To use some programs to stretch critical thinking skills (MEP, Miquon, Singapore) and others to help give "order" and cement low-level math fact retention (Right Start elements and games).

 

I find myself constantly trying to create, borrow, or steal good ideas. Looking for the "light-bulb moment" inducing explanations, and ways to make math both fun and deeply understood.

 

:iagree: Bill, that's beautiful and eloquently put.

[FO4UR]

They are all tools in my "teacher tool-box." It's pro-active.

 

As I go, I am finding that I like to use one curric for introducing concepts and another for reviewing, expanding, and applying. It's not torture for my dc....for my dh who tries to wrap his head around what I do, perhaps:tongue_smilie:....but definitely not the kids.

 

Right now (subject to change LOL) - Miquon introduces us to a concept, Singapore cements the concept...MEP gives us the "wow - I never thought of it that way" kind of application of the concept....and Rightstart math games drill the concept. We don't do it all in one day, and not always in one week.

 

I plan week-by-week. I read all these TM's for fun:coolgleamA: - and so I know them pretty well and pull easily from one or another. It helps to use one as a "

spine" and just pull from the others as we go.

 

I rationalize my math curric addiction by telling myself that I have 3dc with 3 different learning styles, so having a wide range of tools to use is just being prepared.

[Mommyfaithe]

We are currently working through 3 different math curriculums, although not at the same time. We just started using CLE math as our "main" program. We were using BJU Math 2, but I decided he would do better with a spiral math program. The jury is still out on whether or not my ds likes CLE math. He sometimes complains that the lesson is a lot longer than BJU. With CLE, the pages can be as long as three pgs. front/back. This is only b/c most of the instruction is in the workbook directed to the student. Sometimes we will finish up a CLE math lesson and do one lesson in BJU. Other times we do a lesson in BJU and follow up with 2 pgs. in Singapore Math. Singapore Math though is usually reserved for weekends and the summer. My ds gets bored doing the same thing over and over. I like to teach him different ways of doing problems so I can determine whether or not he has grasped a concept.

 

I plan to stick with these 3 programs until he gets to sixth grade. After that, we're moving onto Chalkdust Math for the long haul. ;)

 

We did 3 math programs this year and we didn't finish any YET excpet for BJU 5. We used BJU 5, CLE 5 and LOF Fractions. We used BJU for the first 1/2 of the year so supplement LOF and then hit a brick wall. DD has been using CLE and we are now using LOF too. I plan on using BJU and CLE with my sons next year...CLE for good independent work and BJU for its manipulative practice and pretty worksheets. I'll add in LOF when we hit the 5th grade book. We also use lots of those cheapo Sam's books as extra practice while we ride in the car or sit at a swim meet books.

 

HTH

Faithe

[Ginevra]

Thanks for all the responses. Gosh, you guys amaze me! I am tempted to use LOF (beside MUS) with my dd, who enters 7th grade next year. But I am concerned that it will just slow the whole procedure down and will take twice as long to reach our (my) goals. With her in particular, I have a specific aim. She is most probably going to a private high school. I have looked at where I hope for her to be by 9th grade and how we can get there from here. It will be pretty "tight" on time, just using MUS, and that's assuming she moves along without hitting any "walls" in the meantime. So...I think we just need to concentrate on continuing MUS.

[5ray2006]

Thanks for all the responses. Gosh, you guys amaze me! I am tempted to use LOF (beside MUS) with my dd, who enters 7th grade next year. But I am concerned that it will just slow the whole procedure down and will take twice as long to reach our (my) goals. With her in particular, I have a specific aim. She is most probably going to a private high school. I have looked at where I hope for her to be by 9th grade and how we can get there from here. It will be pretty "tight" on time, just using MUS, and that's assuming she moves along without hitting any "walls" in the meantime. So...I think we just need to concentrate on continuing MUS.

 

Quill,

I just wanted to add that you don't have to do LOF at the same time as MUS. Your dd can do LOF over the summer and/or weekends. I've read a lot of positive reviews about LOF. It seems to be a fun math program that could be done independently by your dd at her leisure. That way, you can focus on MUS during the school year without feeling like you are slowing her down. Whichever way, I'm sure your dd will be well prepared for her highschool math journey. ;) Trina

[siloam]

RS is a teacher intensive program and I do the exclusively till 2nd grade. In 2nd grade I start Singapore 1A, which puts them a year "behind" Singapore levels but right on for US levels hitting Algebra in 8th grade. At that point the Singapore is on the easy side for them and they don't have many problems doing it independently after I have introduced the assignment to them. They keep up with the RS games by playing them together. If I play a game with them to teach them it, then that is their math for the day. :D

 

Right now my going to by 6th grader is doing RS D (2 lessons a day) and Singapore 4B. Ideally she would be doing RS Geometry this fall, but she still has a whole level, E to do before that. Ideally in Singapore she would be finishing 5B. Oh well! She is at least on track by US standards, and if that even slips as we start upper level math at least we know she will have a good foundation, which she can carry into college.

 

Why both? Well I started out with Singapore, which I agree with philosophically, but made logical leaps that my kids struggled with. Given I have 3 hands on learners I decided to add Right Start. RS has a similar approach, but doesn't make the logical leaps. I wouldn't do with out it now, and prefer it over Singapore in the early years. Why not drop Singapore? Well I plan to continue with Singapore upper level math, so I want the kiddos to be used to their thinking. It is really hard to just jump into Singapore, thus we do both.

 

Oh and sometimes the child can surprise you. My oldest is choosing to do extra math right now because she wants to be a vet, and she knows it will help her long term. I try to keep it lighter when they are younger so they don't develop an attitude towards math.

 

Heather

 

 

 

[Caroline4kids]

I think we use different programs at times just to keep from getting bored.:)

 

It is hard to look at the same book for months on end. My kids really like MUS, but I have been having them do Strayer-Upton too, especially when they have mastered their MUS lesson and yet I do not want to move on right away.

 

I should say that no matter how many programs we use I still keep math time between 20 min -40 min (including any video watching time).

 

Variety is the spice of life, you know. :)

[Ginevra]

Your dd can do LOF over the summer and/or weekends. I've read a lot of positive reviews about LOF. It seems to be a fun math program that could be done independently by your dd at her leisure. That way, you can focus on MUS during the school year without feeling like you are slowing her down. Whichever way, I'm sure your dd will be well prepared for her highschool math journey. ;)

 

Thank you for that suggestion, but I am not taking a summer break from math. She's continuing MUS straight on through the summer. *That's* how tight on time constraints we are if she has a hope of getting to Algebra for 8th grade.

 

Thank you for that little vote of confidence at the end of your post! I do believe she will be well-prepared for high school, I'm just a control freak and an idealist who goes pale at the thought that I will no longer be choosing and executing her curriculum. :rolleyes: There. I said it.

[dsacco]

OMG - it JUST occurred to me that I am doing 2 programs with my kids!! 4 total since both kids are doing different things...

 

DD (age 9) does Ray's Math with me orally (needs to work on math facts and it gets her thinking).... and is starting Saxon 5/4

 

DS (age 12) is starting Saxon Algebra I and then 1 day per week does Business Math from Simply Charlotte Mason - (you run a pretend store and work through inventory etc)

 

Honestly - it never occurred to me we were doing more than 1 math program! And that doesn't even include "The Math Games 1/2 hour!"