Agree. Getting quizzed FOR A GRADE on something not germane to the class??? What an incredibly stupid thing to do. That being said, telling the teacher it's dumb isn't going to win any friends.

Honestly, I would worry about that when the time comes. If he's not ready for AOPS pre-algebra after BA, he should be ready for one of the many other options that are out there. I know some people have used Jousting Armadillos and others have used TabletClass as a bridge to AOPS -- in some cases to Algebra and in some cases to Pre-Algebra. With respect to the acceleration, there are a LOT of options available other than plowing through the standard high school curriculum faster. Any reasonable high school should be accustomed to students who have completed algebra 1 and geometry in middle school (this is a fairly standard accelerated track) and once those are completed there are so many other options for enrichment. The AOPS number theory/C+P books are one possible enrichment, but there's also mathematical logic, set theory, advanced geometry, game theory/voting theory (there are math for liberal arts textbooks for these which are very interesting and require minimal algebra), statistics, and many other options.

The Prealgebra and Introductory Algebra course would be a combined pre-algebra and algebra 1 edition for students who have seen the material before and just need a review. I don't think it would be a good choice for a first exposure. Any edition of pre-algebra is fine, really. If you end up with one from the '80s there may be some rare computational techniques which are no longer necessary (the only one I found when I re-read my pre-algebra from then was extracting square roots, plus some outmoded calculator tips) but 99% of the book will be identical to a modern one.

Well, I'm glad you let me know :P

If you are doing this system, you would divide points earned by total points available.

HOE is awesome. It's not a high school credit but it is awesome prep and I seriously think that's why algebra 1, 2, and precalc were so easy for me.

I would recommend against it. I use glue all the time on superficial cuts after a good cleaning, but if I end up sealing some bacteria in, the worst that's going to happen is a surface infection. Your wound is a lot deeper and the consequences of accidentally sealing some bacteria in are a lot more serious.

I think you might consider Math U See. The problems are simpler, with fewer steps. Key to Algebra might be another option but I'd try MUS first.

Does she just Not Get It At All, or does she appear to get it at first and then forget what she's doing a few days later?

What has she done so far math-wise (before algebra), and how did she do in that? Do you see her as a visual learner?

A lot of temptation with little chance of being caught can be too much for many kids. I'd prefer to just cut them out of the book if possible.

If he *likes* Horizons and is doing well with it, why not just continue through the 4th grade book and start the 5th? It is a good, solid program. He should be able to "catch up" with their scope and sequence with some summer math, but even if he continues one year behind, that would still put him ready for a solid algebra course in 9th grade. I actually wouldn't start 5th grade math (whatever you use) until he's remediated both the phobia and lack of knowledge from 4th grade.

PEMDAS is definitely not meant to be done as multiplication before division, addition before subtraction. This is one reason that there's been a movement in some circles of math education to use something more like GEMS (grouping-exponents-multiplication-subtraction) and to emphasize that addition and subtraction are the same operation, as are multiplication and division. You'll notice that grouping still overrides exponentiation. Grouping symbols (such as parentheses) override the normal order of operations. That is why they need to be done first. A student who's been explicitly taught that exponents come before grouping symbols is going to have an issue with an expression like 4^(1.5+2), or 4^(3x0.5). I have no idea whether MCP really is teaching this, but if -- as the op says -- it is, it is wrong. Simply because, in some specific situations, they CAN be done first does not mean that grouping symbols do not have precedence. If I have 3+4+5x6, I can do the 3+4 first and get the correct answer, but multiplication still has precedence over addition. ETA: And the reason I keep posting is that OP needs to know (if the curriculum is indeed teaching this) that this is not considered correct by mathematicians.

If she's begging to go back to Saxon, let her. 2 hours a day on math is too much except for a kid who really likes math and WANTS to do that much a day. I would consider supplementation as Farrar said but not until she's gotten back into her groove. ETA: Doing Saxon 5/4 in 4th grade will put her (assuming she completes exactly one grade per year) doing pre-algebra in 7th grade, which is fine. If she struggles with that she can re-do pre-algebra with Algebra 1/2 in 8th grade and still be on track to do algebra in 9th grade, which is fine.

Yes. But if you have a non-integer exponent, your first method is non-applicable. Teaching kids a method (always do exponents before parentheses) that does not apply in more advanced math, that they are going to have to un-learn later, is not a good idea. An advanced student is going to recognize that they yield the same answer and choose the best method to get the correct answer. For example, if I see 2+3+5+7^2, there is no reason I can't do 2+3+5 = 10, 7^2 = 49, and then do 10+49 = 59, even though that does not strictly follow the standard order of operations.

Many UK ones won't accept under 16 because of the check, though. Cambridge accepted a 14-year-old as recently as 2010: http://www.theguardian.com/education/2010/jan/07/cambridge-university-14-arran-fernandez -- he graduated in June and came in first in his year. Oxford accepted a 14-year-old in 2005: http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2005/aug/21/highereducation.accesstouniversity -- the student in question graduated with his master's and went to Imperial College London. At the time, Oxford was planning on instituting an age limitation due to the onerous requirements of child protection, but it does not look like they did: http://www.admissions.ox.ac.uk/faq.shtml#10 Where (I think) it is going to be more difficult, is that usually here a 14 year old who is simply somewhat above average compared to 18 year olds can find somewhere that will admit them, I doubt this will happen in the UK. There was a big kerfluffle in the newspapers a few years back, because a 14 year old who had 3 B's on challenging A-levels had been unable to find a place anywhere -- basically, they'd told him that he was too young, to go do another set of A-levels or coursework from the Open University and re-apply when he was 16 with A grades.

I have no idea why they'd put "evaluate the powers" first. What if there are powers outside of parentheses? In that case, they cannot be evaluated first. -- for example: the square root of [5-(1-5)] -- in other words, [5-(1-5)]^.5

I think I'd treat facts and math as two separate subjects and practice both at different times of the day.

I know regentrude mentioned that her kids went into it from Saxon -- I think it'll be fine especially if you have Foerster's algebra around if you DO discover a gap.

Can he do them if you quiz him orally?

You can make them by taking a number with zeroes in it as the quotient, picking any number you desire as the divisor, and multiplying them together. If you specifically want a remainder, just add any number less than the divisor. Example: q = 405, d = 17, qd = 6885 -- let's have a remainder of 4 -- ok, kiddo, divide 6889 by 17.

I like the second method a lot better, and Lori D's response about doing all the steps with the 0 rather than just saying "Ah, unnecessary" is spot on. When your KID notices that you don't have to do all the steps with 0, that's when going straight to "Ah, unnecessary" works. Funny thing is that I didn't learn how to do long division until we did it with polynomials in algebra class. Suddenly a light bulb went off, and I said "Oh! This is what they were trying to make me do before! Just all the x's were 10s before!"

Yes to both. For a lot more information about using Saxon, check out http://www.homeschoolwithsaxon.com/newsletterpage-2012.php#0412 -- I've sent it directly to transcript but his newsletter has a lot of information.

Advanced Math is a 3-semester or 4-semester course for all but the most able students.

Yep. My mother had an old, excellent friend who messaged her and it went into the "other". It was there for about 2 months before I came to visit, sat down at her computer for a second, and asked her if she knew she had a message there.