What to do when other children hurt your child and the parent doesn't handle it?

[phathui5]

So I got home from work last night (I tutor from 6-7:30). Dh had had our children and the three year old I was watching. Apparently, when her mom came to pick her up, the child pushed my dd, spit on my three year old and hit the baby, all within minutes of each other. With the baby, she had been trying to take his dessert away after dh and her mom told her not to. She said she hit him because he wouldn't share. There was no provocation for pushing dd or spitting at ds3.

 

Dh said that her mom's only response was to tell her that what she was doing wasn't nice, "we" don't hit/push friends, etc. And something about finding her inner peace. This is her usual discipline method, to talk about your feelings. That would make sense to me if she were six, but the kid is three. And for having a mom who's into gentle discipline, she's the most violent child I've babysat.

 

I need some advice ladies. What do you do when another parent and child are in your home and the parent is basically letting the kid run amok and hurt people? Dh felt like he couldn't say anything because it was the mom's job to get her child under control, but that wasn't happening.

[Marylou]

RUN!

 

:confused: Oh wait a minute, it is your house. . . . no more babysitting that one if it were me.

[Melinda]

Yesterday at the library, we had a similar experience with another child attacking one of ours.

 

I was sitting at the computer (ours has been down) and my almost 2 year old was standing next to me. My almost 2yo had been out of hand and continually antagonizing my 4.5yo *all* day. Yesterday, he went to time-out, had to sit on my lap, and eventually ended up in his room.

 

Anyhow, we were there and this other kid (4yo?) came running from about 10 feet away, and was hitting/pushing my almost 2yo. I separated them and told him that we don't hit or push. When the mom said/did nothing about the situation, I said to my child (loud enough for the other mom to hear)... "It wasn't very nice for him to do that to you." Then I said more quietly, so that just my child could hear, "When you were hitting H(4yo) a few minutes ago, that's how you were making her feel." He nodded his head and amazingly, there were no more issues with the almost 2yo for the rest of the day.

 

I hope the issue is resolved quickly and easily. Not sure how I would handle it in a situation that was in my home with another person's child. I would probably tell her she needed to go to time-out even with the other mom there or I would remove my children from the situation (take them to the couch to read a book, maybe?) and tell the offending child that she may only sit there with you if she behaves nicely. Good luck!

 

There is a book called 1-2-3 magic that may be helpful to you.

[PCA]

Honestly, I would not subject my children to this child. I would tell the mother that her child is just too rough and poorly behaved for you to watch anymore.

 

If and when she is able to get his discipline problems under control then you will watch him again. But the fact that he is hitting your baby! He is just too dangerous to have in your home. Sorry you have to be the one to deal with this.

[Dooley]

If its in your home, your rules apply. When I used to daycare, if kids I watched (which I considered extended family) were out of control, or couldn't adhere to my (quite normal) rules, I would have to ask the family to leave. Sounds harsh, but its your HOME. Its your refuge, you do get to decide. I would of course, be very diplomatic and kind, but nonetheless...

 

Now, hop over to my thread labeled "Neighborhood/girl challenges" and tell ME what I should do!!

[JFSinIL]

I'd speak up and calmly tell the child to STOP and apologize. If the other parent didn't like it, tough beans.

[Friederike in Persia]

I'd speak up and calmly tell the child to STOP and apologize. If the other parent didn't like it, tough beans.

 

:iagree:

 

We get this sort of situation a lot, since children in our part of the world don't get disciplined much, esp. boys.

If the parent doesn't do something (and to be fair, they often would love to change their kids, but don't have the tools for it) I step in and make it clear to the child that it can't hurt mine. My house, my rules. I say it like that as well.

[SquirrellyMama]

I would deal with the child myself if it were my home. I'm not good at confronting other people about their children and I'm not very good at having people confront me about my kids :001_unsure:. I'm trying to get better about the last one.

 

If it continues despite your best attempts and you don't want to confront the other parent then I wouldn't allow them to play with your kids.

 

My own child can be rough and I'm trying my best to deal with it but it isn't always easy. Maybe she has a really hard time with that child and wants to give up. I've been there.

 

Kelly

[SonshineLearner]

Would you normally time out the child? I think I would say, at another time, "I didn't know if I was still suppose to time-out "Abby" or if you wanted to time-out her when you're here. Let's figure this out so that if it happens again, we'll both know what to expect. If she says that she's using a positive parenting approach, I'd explain that that's great! And at daycare, you use a "Love and Logic " approach, and that when the children hit or fight...that you do...(and then say what you do) I'd even have a book there to reference. Explain that since her child is so smart, that she's really old enough for it to work. (You know, people like to think about their child as smart) So, you hope that you can come to some resolution, because you don't want your children to hit hers...and you don't want her child to hit either....."Because, You are so right...hitting doesn't feel good to children." BTW, time out for hitting is for longer than a normal time-out. I would try to be that calm force that follows the time-out with modeling for what the mom should be doing. Ask her, "What do you need to do to make this as right as you can...."Apologize to the person I hurt." Right....now, how do you say you're sorry? "Look him in the eyes and say....I'm sorry, and I'll try not to hurt you again."

I believe in Positive Discipline, too...just a different way of using the term. I want to make sure that the discipline makes the child Positive...that they don't want to do it again.

Carrie:-)

[MrsMe]

Oh boy, you have a lot of work to do if a mom is telling a 3-yr old to "find her inner peace". Geez.

 

I wouldn't babysit and I certainly wouldn't have my kids at her house unless you were there. Your house, your rules, rule!

[phathui5]

So I talked to the mom tonight and she seemed to think that dh was overreacting (not his style, he's more gentle usually than I am) and had not thought that the behavior last night was a problem. I tried to explain that the issue was more her lack of intervening and stopping the behavior than the behavior itself, but she said that she did do something by talking to her about it. I let her know that if she does not remove the girl from the situation when that happens at our house that I will have to stop watching her.

 

But I still don't get the mindset. How is hitting and pushing something that you don't take the kid out of the room for? Or out of the house, since they were supposed to be leaving? How do you justify brushing it off as "being wound up"? It doesn't make sense to me.

[Karen sn]

I'd ask her if she seriously believes that a child who spits on another child AND HITS A BABY is going to respond to finding her inner peace.

 

Peace smeesh.

I believe that 3 is old enough to know better.

And the kid needs to have some consequences.

With a mother like that - I wonder what lies down the road.

[Colleen in NS]

.

Edited March 22, 2009 by Colleen in NS

[Joanne]

So I talked to the mom tonight and she seemed to think that dh was overreacting (not his style, he's more gentle usually than I am) and had not thought that the behavior last night was a problem. I tried to explain that the issue was more her lack of intervening and stopping the behavior than the behavior itself, but she said that she did do something by talking to her about it. I let her know that if she does not remove the girl from the situation when that happens at our house that I will have to stop watching her.

 

But I still don't get the mindset. How is hitting and pushing something that you don't take the kid out of the room for? Or out of the house, since they were supposed to be leaving? How do you justify brushing it off as "being wound up"? It doesn't make sense to me.

So I got home from work last night (I tutor from 6-7:30). Dh had had our children and the three year old I was watching. Apparently, when her mom came to pick her up, the child pushed my dd, spit on my three year old and hit the baby, all within minutes of each other. With the baby, she had been trying to take his dessert away after dh and her mom told her not to. She said she hit him because he wouldn't share. There was no provocation for pushing dd or spitting at ds3.

 

This is a child you get paid to watch? If so, it's *very* common for a child to be MORE when coming or going. (That's true of the home children as well). It helps to know that kids who are leaving parental care or leaving your/caregiver care often can't handle the "transition energy" that happens. These children need practice and coaching. "Child, when mommy picks you up, you feel all bubbly energy inside. That's ok. But you have to keep the energy from bubbling out and into trouble. When mom picks you up, you get your backpack, hug mommy, say good bye....." Then practice. Yes, really. Walk the children through a successful "coming" or "going". Remind them when they get there, remind them when they leave. Use code words.

 

Now, I know you from other places you you know that *gentle discipline* isn't supposed to be passive. So, please don't evaluate "the mindset" or passive/non parenting as embodying "gentle discipline".

 

If this were a friend "I am familiar with gentle discipline. What I am observing, however, is too passive for my family to be safe around yours. I need you to be more active and assertive or we'll have to limit contact.

 

In the case of a client: "I have a firm, non punitive discipline policy we use. We will continue to use that style while she is at my home, even with you there."

 

But, really, the issue is the lack of "energy" or "excitement" management combined with a passive mom. If she's open to it, my site has ideas on how to be FIRM and IN CONTROL without physical discipline.

[FloridaLisa]

I agree with Joanne that this sounds like a transition issue. That was my first instinct. I think preparing the child for the transition is helpful. Also, was the mom lingering and continuing to small talk a bit? That could frustrate the child who really needs mom's attention after the separation. If there is lingering and it agitates the child, perhaps you could have the child ready for pick-up (phone call from mom saying I'm on my way would help) and then mom could give the child immediate attention.

 

Now, the mom may not be a disciplinarian, but my bet is that she doesn't want to discipline (much as the child may need it) after she's been gone. That happens a lot. I remember so well the (sometimes painful) issues of childcare and transitions and my child's frustrations when I worked. Unless the child is out of control at other times, I would work with the situation and try to find a peaceful transition for all.

 

HTH,

Lisa

[FloridaLisa]

I agree with Joanne that this sounds like a transition issue. That was my first instinct. I think preparing the child for the transition is helpful. Also, was the mom lingering and continuing to small talk a bit? That could frustrate the child who really needs mom's attention after the separation. If there is lingering and it agitates the child, perhaps you could have the child ready for pick-up (phone call from mom saying I'm on my way would help) and then mom could give the child immediate attention.

 

Now, the mom may not be a disciplinarian, but my bet is that she doesn't want to discipline (much as the child may need it) after she's been gone. That happens a lot. I remember so well the (sometimes painful) issues of childcare and transitions and my child's frustrations when I worked. Unless the child is out of control at other times, I would work with the situation and try to find a peaceful transition for all.

 

HTH,

Lisa

 

ETA: Even dh hates to discipline right when he walks in the door. It's natural to want to enjoy the time together; those of us with the luxury of time with our kids can discipline without regret that we're *ruining* our *quality* time. I'm just trying to show what *may* be the mom's thinking *if* this is only an issue during pick-up or drop-off. Again, then, a peaceful pick-up routine may be really helpful.

[wide eyes & laughter]

I'd speak up and calmly tell the child to STOP and apologize. If the other parent didn't like it, tough beans.

 

 

this and would add to it: I would put myself between my dc and the offending child and maybe even ready my hands to stop hers - gently, but enough to make sure her fists stop swinging! I would not want my dc to think they should "politely' stand there and allow this from anyone.

 

I also liked Joanne's pov about the transition time. Perhaps coaching the mom with that info will give her what she needs to work with her daughter so that unacceptable behavior stops.

 

If it continues, however, I would assertively (tell them exactly why) drop the family from my babysitting roster.

 

Good luck w/ all of this.

[Ria]

I would call the mom, tell her that her child's behavior was completely inexcusable, that her reaction was inexcusable, and that she must find someone else to watch the child.

 

ETA: As for the mindset, I see it every. single. day. I work in retail pharmacy. Today a woman came in. While she waited and while she paid, her two kids (2 and 3) raced up and down in front of the pharmacy, shrieking and yelling. She said nothing. While she was paying, her 3-year old ran over to a large sign and managed to pull it over on himself (a bystander saw what was happening and ran over, preventing a catastrophe). Mom's response? Nothing except a slight glare at the helpful bystander and those of us in the pharmacy who were in the act of running out the door to try to stop the sign from falling. Last week a mom told me that she had to leave because her child wouldn't wait. This was a 3-yr old who was screaming and running away from the mom. I nicely suggested that Mom put the child in the cart. She gave me the most incredulous look and said, "She won't stay there." This was a 3-year old. Honestly, I feel sorry for the kids.

 

Ria

Edited March 20, 2009 by Ria

[Oak Knoll Mom]

This is a child you get paid to watch? If so, it's *very* common for a child to be MORE when coming or going. (That's true of the home children as well).

:iagree: I was once in a similar situation. We had two problems a) the child was rude and disobedient when mom came to pick him up and b) since the mom and I are friends, she saw this as social time when all I really wanted was for her to leave so I could feed my kids and get them to bed.

 

I had the mom start calling me when she left work and I had her child ready and all his stuff packed and waiting by the door. I also had to specifically tell her that pick up time was not a time to come in and visit. It was uncomfortable for a while, but made that transition ambiguity a lot easier.

[hornblower]

But, really, the issue is the lack of "energy" or "excitement" management combined with a passive mom. If she's open to it, my site has ideas on how to be FIRM and IN CONTROL without physical discipline.

 

Joanne, you're such a breath of fresh air. I appreciate your posts.

[Peela]

I would discipline the child myself, in front of the mother, if it got to that point. Tell her (the child) the rules in your home, strong and clear. It gives both the child AND the mother a clear message, and it is not unreasonable .

It would take me a while to get to that point- but by the time you are writing here, I would be at that point.

We have kids here that my kids babysit, every week. They live by our rules- and the youngest was 3 when he started coming. My dh is very strict and the parents either handle it, or they don't, but we are not taking on anyone else's baggage. We offer a gift, a service, not a dumping ground. The kids always love to come, because the rules are clear after the first few visits. Kids usually respond well to very clear boundaries and consequences.