Am I the only mean one?

[swellmomma]

I am a stickler for neatness in the kids work. I expect their best penmanship on all assignments and if they are being overly sloppy(typically due to laziness) I tear the page out their book and they start again. They immediately step the work back up to my expectations, though not without some tears/whining first. Anyway, apparently ds told grandma I do this last night, and today she decided to confront me on being a mean mom to him, that I would damage them doing this.

 

I have always done this even in gr 1 when they were in ps, they have always used excellent penmanship as a result. Since I know they are capable of excellent work I will not tolerate laziness that created sloppy work. Am I alone on this? I can't possibly be the only person who thinks it is important to do their best work in everything they do. Or am I?

[WTMCassandra]

Nope, mean mom here too. One child redos a lot more work than the other ; ), but I won't tell which one.

[beansprouts]

When I know my child is capable of doing better, I definitely raise the bar. I think it is good practice and not mean at all.

[Kris]

I have always done this even in gr 1 when they were in ps, they have always used excellent penmanship as a result. Since I know they are capable of excellent work I will not tolerate laziness that created sloppy work. Am I alone on this? I can't possibly be the only person who thinks it is important to do their best work in everything they do. Or am I?

 

 

Another Mean Mom here. I've always believed that kids -- heck, adults, too -- do what is expected of them. Expect less, and you get less.

 

I really couldn't help just laughing out loud when The Kid was younger and was trying to convince me that he just. can't. do it. it. is. toooooooooooooooo. hard!!!!

 

"Um, well, you could do it *last* week!"

 

The look on his face was priceless. I wish I had a shot of that. :lol:

[Mari]

I think it helps my children learn to take pide in their work. It's important...if you don't teach them with the little things in life, how are they to know it's expected in real life?

 

I think it goes hand in hand with developing a good work ethic.

[Grubbsfamily]

I also have standards and when they realize - (after a really long time with one of them) -that I am not going to give up and expect any less today than I did last week - THIS IS MY STANDARD, and that is just the way it is at our house.

 

I don't tear pages out of books but we have used a lot of erasers!

 

It all depends on how you are saying what you are saying when you do this. If it is loud, harsh, degrading and mean, then yes I could see how this could be harmful, but if you are calm and asking the child questions about the quality they are trying to "slide" by you then the whole process can be educational.

[dirty ethel rackham]

I guess I'll be the lone dissenter here. I don't expect my kids to have their BEST penmenship on everything. My goal for them is neat work, done well. Perfectionism (and the resulting procrastination) is rampant in my family and I am trying to break that cycle. When I know they can do better work (too many problems wrong, bad grammar and spelling), I will make them correct it. However, as long as it is legible and neat, I am not concerned about the penmenship. That said, my kids have decent penmenship. My oldest son struggles with perfectionism. He is very bright, but is afraid to start things because he is afraid to fail. This fall, he fell behind in some classes due to his procrastination on some papers. A wise mom told me that sometimes, "good enough and done" is more important than "perfect." That got her through some tough semesters in college. Don't get me wrong, I do have high standards. I just want to be sure that my standards are attainable. We all have bad days.

 

Treading gently here ... tearing pages out of the book and the resulting tears sounds very harsh. You run the risk of your children seeing you as unpleasable. What is your goal here? Are they learning? Is the work legible? Is the content acceptible? If your kids kids learn that anything less than perfect is unacceptible, they will start thinking of themselves as failures, and that can cause serious harm. Do you ever have a bad day, where you just don't give your best? Do you expect to be forgiven for that? Perhaps your children could do better with a little grace.

[Laura Corin]

My goal for them is neat work, done well. Perfectionism (and the resulting procrastination) is rampant in my family and I am trying to break that cycle.

 

I expect it to be easy to read, that's it. I see handwriting as a tool: if the reader can read it with no problem, then that's fine. For Calvin this can be a difficult goal in itself (he has coordination problems) so I really don't want to push it. For Hobbes, perfectionism is a real issue, and I don't want to paralyse his writing by excessive stress on how the handwriting looks.

 

Now I am a stickler for correct content, and have no problem with asking for things to be redone that have content problems. And if it's illegible, then rewriting is definitely necessary. I don't tear things out though: turning the page and rewriting seems just fine to me.

 

Laura

[Lizzie in Ma]

Is worth doing right the first time. Be it chores, school, craft, what have you.

 

If they had trouble, difficulty or other something that made sloppy the best they could do, that is a different story. You should see the 12 weeks of paperwork when my dd had a cast on. :)

 

But when a child capable of excellence gets sloppy, in my kids I call it lazy.

[Tree House Academy]

I expect their best at all times. And I do have a good idea of what their best is. It is not "perfect" nor always *my* best work, but I do expect the best they are capable of at the time. :)

[Pamela H in Texas]

I think it is reasonable if your kids CAN do it. Kids should do the best they can, imo. I'm fine with that.

 

Though please be mindful if you ever end up with a kid with dysgraphia. It would be terribly unfair to judge their handwriting when every single thing they put to paper takes so much work even though it looks horrendous.

 

But if my kids had been capable, I would have expected neat. Instead, I aim for legible which is still a stretch for one of them a lot of the time.

[lmrich]

I have two perfectionists. They erase all the time... not a joke. I tell them, "Don't worry if your "t" isn't perfect, just finish the sentence." My middle child apparantly heard all of this and she is so sloppy, but a great typist at 9 years old. I say again, each child is different and needs different things.

[Danestress]

I think it's an art in life to decide what you are going to do to the very very best of your ability, and what you are going to just get done and be done with it.

 

I don't fix the very very best meal I possibly can every single night. I don't try to make my house the absolute cleanest I possibly can. I don't dress myself to the nines every single day, and I don't keep my finances in absolute perfect order at all times. I could do these things. Maybe it seems lazy not to do these things. But see, I love other things too, like reading and knitting and taking walks with the dog, and so I cut some corners to make those things possible. I want my children to grow up knowing how to do things right, but also knowing how to maximize happiness by choosing what has to be "just right" and what has to be "good enough."

 

I don't expect my children to do their absolute "best" on everything. I don't expect anyone to do their best on everything they do, and I don't really enjoy being around people who are driven to always do everything just right.

 

So while I do sometimes make my children redo work that I think is messy, I don't have a "to the very best of your ability" standard on everything. If they are struggling with a written narrative or (as today) a science report, I tend to focus on somethings - content and sentence structure - and let other things be a little loose. Yes, they probaby COULD write more neatly, but it's just not the focus.

 

And for me, I can't accept a household that is full of strife and tears. I really try to cultivate a gentle and affectionate environment.

 

But I don't think my way is the only okay way to do things. I definitely think mothers will find different ways to manage these things, and what works for you may be different than what works for me, and we might have different end goals anyway.

[Pretty in Pink]

I don't require perfection but I do expect that a decent effort is made to keep the writing reasonably neat and legible. I have higher standards for copywork; this is where he is required to *focus* on his handwriting.

 

That said there are many times when I find my ds's handwriting unacceptable and I make him do it over. I don't rip out his pages but if the whole thing has to be done then I do make him take out the page and re-copy it (if he can read it, sometimes the writing is *that* bad and he actually has to re-do the entire lesson). If it is just spots here and there I ask him to erase the sloppy parts and re-write them.

[swellmomma]

Thanks for the replies everyone. To clarify I do not expect perfection but I do expect the best they are capable of. I do have 1 child with dysgraphia, I still expect her to be mindful and do the best she can. When I tear a page out of the notbook it is because it is so sloppy it is illegible. FOr example, my ds was doing a R&S grammar lesson yesterday with the beginning of diagramming. Those who know the book, it was the part where he makes the cross like shape and puts in the simple subject and simple predicate. His lines were all over the page, floating words not even on lines, spacing of 10 lines inbetween answers etc. Out right sloppy from laziness and trying to rush. That is the sort of work I make them redo, If they are mindful of their work and doing their best I do not make them redo it because it is not perfect. I am very calm and to the point about it, and simply say it was unacceptable and they have to redo it. If it is in a workbook I erase it or if it is only spots of it that are unacceptable I erase it but if it is completely unacceptable and in a notebook I tear it out. Which is what happened yesterday in grammar. He got to copy his work on to the new paper, I didn't make him figure out all the answers again, I just expected neater work, and he produced it and was done a few minutes later.

 

I don't expect perfection out of anything the kids do, nor do I expect it out of myself. FOr the example of not dresing tot he nines, best meals etc, no I do not expect that HOWEVER I do make sure even in what I do I am mindful that I am not being sloppy/lazy. The clothes are clean, neat and matching for example, the meal is well balanced not cereal for dinner. The same is in their work, it doesn't have to be perfect, but it has to be the best they are capable of and they are capable of having decent penmanship/neatness of work. Even my dd who has dysgraphia, she struggles with keeping letter the same size, floating letters etc, that would not cause a redo, however when she doesn't focus and be mindful you can not even read her work so it has to be redone.

[Danestress]

I know you don't expect "perfection." To be honest, I doubt you really expect your kids to do their best in everything they do, despite saying that. Maybe it's one of those things we say, but we don't really mean to be taken literally. It would drive any of us crazy to do our "best" in everything.

 

I took a look at your blog, and it doesn't appear to me that anyone is suffering too much in your homeschool:) They look like happy, beautiful kids, and you did a great job on the blog!

[swellmomma]

I know you don't expect "perfection." To be honest, I doubt you really expect your kids to do their best in everything they do, despite saying that. Maybe it's one of those things we say, but we don't really mean to be taken literally. It would drive any of us crazy to do our "best" in everything.

 

I took a look at your blog, and it doesn't appear to me that anyone is suffering too much in your homeschool:) They look like happy, beautiful kids, and you did a great job on the blog!

 

Thank you! I am behind on updating it, will have to make sure I get my report up this week.

[Erica in PA]

I think it's an art in life to decide what you are going to do to the very very best of your ability, and what you are going to just get done and be done with it.

 

I don't fix the very very best meal I possibly can every single night. I don't try to make my house the absolute cleanest I possibly can. I don't dress myself to the nines every single day, and I don't keep my finances in absolute perfect order at all times. I could do these things. Maybe it seems lazy not to do these things. But see, I love other things too, like reading and knitting and taking walks with the dog, and so I cut some corners to make those things possible. I want my children to grow up knowing how to do things right, but also knowing how to maximize happiness by choosing what has to be "just right" and what has to be "good enough."

 

I don't expect my children to do their absolute "best" on everything. I don't expect anyone to do their best on everything they do, and I don't really enjoy being around people who are driven to always do everything just right.

 

So while I do sometimes make my children redo work that I think is messy, I don't have a "to the very best of your ability" standard on everything. If they are struggling with a written narrative or (as today) a science report, I tend to focus on somethings - content and sentence structure - and let other things be a little loose. Yes, they probaby COULD write more neatly, but it's just not the focus.

 

And for me, I can't accept a household that is full of strife and tears. I really try to cultivate a gentle and affectionate environment.

 

But I don't think my way is the only okay way to do things. I definitely think mothers will find different ways to manage these things, and what works for you may be different than what works for me, and we might have different end goals anyway.

 

:iagree: And in addition, I'll just say that perfect handwriting is low on my priority list. It isn't anything I'd be a stickler about. As long as it is legible, I really don't think it matters that much.

[Pam "SFSOM" in TN]

I guess I'll be the lone dissenter here. I don't expect my kids to have their BEST penmenship on everything. My goal for them is neat work, done well. Perfectionism (and the resulting procrastination) is rampant in my family and I am trying to break that cycle. When I know they can do better work (too many problems wrong, bad grammar and spelling), I will make them correct it. However, as long as it is legible and neat, I am not concerned about the penmenship. That said, my kids have decent penmenship. My oldest son struggles with perfectionism. He is very bright, but is afraid to start things because he is afraid to fail. This fall, he fell behind in some classes due to his procrastination on some papers. A wise mom told me that sometimes, "good enough and done" is more important than "perfect." That got her through some tough semesters in college. Don't get me wrong, I do have high standards. I just want to be sure that my standards are attainable. We all have bad days.

 

Treading gently here ... tearing pages out of the book and the resulting tears sounds very harsh. You run the risk of your children seeing you as unpleasable. What is your goal here? Are they learning? Is the work legible? Is the content acceptible? If your kids kids learn that anything less than perfect is unacceptible, they will start thinking of themselves as failures, and that can cause serious harm. Do you ever have a bad day, where you just don't give your best? Do you expect to be forgiven for that? Perhaps your children could do better with a little grace.

 

Oh, this is such a wise post. If I could do it over -- oh my.

 

Starting in K, I would now expect four letter and four numbers per day to be "personal best." Then by second grade, a sentence (copied) per day. By fifth, a neatly executed person best paragraph every week, and then I would just let it be as long as it was legible and not indicative of stress. (My handwriting always took a nosedive as a child when I was under stress, and I've noticed it for my kids.)

 

It's helpful sometimes to sit and work with the child and do their work with your left hand. Try to do your personal best. It's not easy. Couple that with learning a completely new thing. Maybe learn some Latin, and do translations with your left hand. (Um, and this only works if you are right-handed, LOL!)

 

When our kids get the idea that what they do is never good enough for us, they get discouraged. We provoke them, but not to love nor to good works. We provoke them to learned helplessness.

 

Just be careful, is all I'm saying. Having a child give up or refuse to work hard at a new thing because they know they won't be good enough immediately is a hard thing to unlearn and can be a lifelong handicap. Concentrate on one thing at a time. While learning, perfection has to be low on the totem pole as far as importance. Successive approximations of good, better, and best is what you want.

[happyWImom]

We are just really getting into it, and I can see where letting them get away with being sloppy will become a huge problem in the future. I have let some of it go, but from now on am going to become a stickler!