bethben Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 So, my DS doesn’t want to get into college debt and has chosen the local college as his college of choice. He’s been accepted and has been awarded a $10k scholarship to attend the local college where he could live at home and drive to. He’s academically burnt out. He’s on track to get an AA degree by the end of next semester (he’s dual enrolled). He does want that. His classes have been easy for him-easier than the homeschool online classes I had him take previously. He’s just bored. He’s a hands on kind of kid. He doesn’t want to start a career like electrician only to find he hates it two years into the training. He wanted to pursue industrial design, but the job prospects are horrible, it doesn’t pay well, and the schools he would have to go to are out of state and expensive—not justifiable in his mind to take on huge debt for a niche field where starting salaries are $30k. Hiw would you advise this kid? We’ve told him he is welcome to take a year off and explore the world or do an apprenticeship, but he has to have a plan if he goes that direction. If he doesn’t have a concrete plan, we just want to send him to college for two more years to just get the degree that still just opens a door to a job. His associates classes are an automatic transfer. He won’t have debt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bethben Posted October 31, 2018 Author Share Posted October 31, 2018 I think he wants to be married younger if he finds the right woman. He also wants a job that doesn’t zap all of his time. He desires a job like my DH has-go to work,come home, and not spend all of your time after work doing your job. I think for him, a job is a secondary goal for his life but he wants to do something he enjoys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaConquest Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 What about doing some volunteer work while he figures it out -- something like Americorps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klmama Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 Has he looked at CAD? My dc's friend took the classes and found a high-paying job in industry right away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bootsie Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 When you say he is on academic burnout, how is that playing out? Is he voicing that? Or, is that showing up in his classwork? If it is that he is bored, it might be that he finds he receives more academic stimulation at the 4-year college (or maybe that is where he is attending now). Getting involved in some campus activities may help him explore where his interests are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bethben Posted November 2, 2018 Author Share Posted November 2, 2018 8 hours ago, jdahlquist said: When you say he is on academic burnout, how is that playing out? Is he voicing that? Or, is that showing up in his classwork? If it is that he is bored, it might be that he finds he receives more academic stimulation at the 4-year college (or maybe that is where he is attending now). Getting involved in some campus activities may help him explore where his interests are. His grades are OK. He could do better. He is bored with school and has expressed this. He has also said he just doesn't want to do school anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bootsie Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 It sounds as if it would be 10 months before he would be starting college, and IME a lot can change in that time. I think a lot of kids get senioritis and feel like they are tired of school, especially if there is not a specific major and a concrete career goal he is looking toward. Some kids have a lot of energy at that age and can find working at that age, even if it is not the kind of work they are going to do their entire life, much more stimulating than passively sitting in a classroom. One option would be for him to work, putting aside much of his earnings, so that he will have money available for college down the road if he decides he wants to do that. Or, maybe he could find a job with an employer that has tuition assistance as a benefit; then he could take classes later on if he wants to. At the same time, I would encourage him to look into college life opportunities. Are there campus activities he would enjoy? Is there a recreation center where he will be able to work out? Will he enjoy attending campus seminars or attending athletic functions? College may be more appealing to him if he sees it as more than a continuation of sitting in classes. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanetC Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 (edited) He sounds like he's not in a school that's an academic fit. Sometimes, it's worth it to travel away from home to get a better education. The best financial aid offers go to freshmen, not transfers, so if he's not sure what he wants, he shouldn't continue college classes past high school graduation. This could cost him financially. The getting good-not-great grades while bored is going to hurt him for merit aid, too. I'm assuming you've run net price calculators, and he's just not going to get the financial aid he needs anywhere? What is the budget your family can afford without financial aid? What is your EFC (google college board EFC estimator)? What is your home state? ETA: Your attitude to "get a concrete plan or we're going to do this" is just going to add to the pressure. Why are you so afraid of him not having a plan? Lots of young people don't have plans. Edited November 2, 2018 by JanetC 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bethben Posted November 2, 2018 Author Share Posted November 2, 2018 (edited) 46 minutes ago, JanetC said: I'm assuming you've run net price calculators, and he's just not going to get the financial aid he needs anywhere? What is the budget your family can afford without financial aid? What is your EFC (google college board EFC estimator)? What is your home state? We are in the middle of we make too much to get much financial aid and don't make enough to afford college for him that includes room and board. I tried running the price calculator at a school I thought would challenge him in the ways he enjoys, but we qualify for absolutely no financial aid the college board estimator is pitiful for us. We are a dual income family and live off of my husband's income because of my disabled son. We are trying to save as much as we can so that we can support him long term. No college is going to give us bonus points for seeing how we budget our money. DS really really doesn't want college debt. He did get merit aid. The 10K scholarship was for his high school academic achievement. Edited November 2, 2018 by bethben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almondbutterandjelly Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 (edited) Is his Associate's degree in a hands on field or is it just core academic classes? Our community college offers tons of hands on classes. Maybe your ds could take some more classes at the community college in the hands on fields to find out what he might like. Even if he already earns his AA. Edited November 2, 2018 by perkybunch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanetC Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 OK - so is the money you're saving for your disabled son in an IRS approved account (ABLE account)? https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/new-savings-accounts-able-disabled-people.html) If so, the money in that account is treated the same way as retirement money -- you don't have to report it on the FAFSA! Additionally, if you can document significant medical, occupational therapy, etc. bills for this son, that can be the basis for a financial aid appeal (professional judgment) that can be used to qualify for more aid than the formulas suggest. The reason I sent you to the college board estimator and not the one for a particular school is because the aid packages between schools vary widely. Some schools just have lousy aid. The college board estimator is going to give you an idea if it's worth hunting for need-based aid at all or if only merit aid will work. Am I to understand that the parent contribution for your college-bound son is zero? Or is there any money at all for him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katilac Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 4 hours ago, bethben said: We are a dual income family and live off of my husband's income because of my disabled son. Actually, many private schools will indeed take this into account! I would say most, actually. It doesn't even have to be a school that does the CSS profile, you can just sent a letter and documentation. He has to jump on those apps if he's a senior, though. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bethben Posted November 2, 2018 Author Share Posted November 2, 2018 But—-we use the money to put into our retirement accounts and pay off our house early. The house because we make a house accessible and if all else fails, at least we have a place to care for him. The retirement- because if we are sound financially, he will be also because we need to care for him. How could I really explain any of that and how it’s different for us vs. other people? ABLE accounts stink because the state can swipe any money in that account after the death of the person for whom it was created. And it has limits and regulations. We’d rather just put stuff under our names and use what we have for his benefit. Ds just wants to be done. I will ask him questions about the lifestyle he wants and help him think about his education better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bethben Posted November 2, 2018 Author Share Posted November 2, 2018 Also, we did do the fafsa calculator and there was very little aid. The parental contribution was around $3k which we could swing, but with the both, we were looking at about $4K with the remainder being loans. There is no way I am going to advise an 18 year old to take out $20-$30k per school year to go to college. He certainly doesn’t want it either. He’s saved about $7k, but it’s a drop comparatively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcadia Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 21 hours ago, bethben said: His grades are OK. He could do better. He is bored with school and has expressed this. He has also said he just doesn't want to do school anymore. My cousin took a year off to work after getting his associates in engineering. He was just tired of school but he wasn’t tired of taking exams so he took some trade certification exams. Knowing how much more he can earn in the same company with a degree did gave him motivation to go and finish his degree in engineering. Having a full time job during his “gap year” also helped him in getting jobs after college because it did looked good on his resume. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catz Posted November 3, 2018 Share Posted November 3, 2018 (edited) That just doesn't sound like incredibly mature mind set. You can't force a young adult to go to college. But you can baby step him toward independence and adult hood over the next 6-12 months and tell him what's it's going to look like if he doesn't go to college in terms of covering his own bills, being employed and working toward moving out. Not having a solid 5 year plan is not a very attractive quality in a potential spouse. I would flip the cards and say it's his choice but these are your expectations for an adult living in your house. I also think when you spend 40+ hours a week in a particular way, it's pays to think that through a bit. Maybe working full time for a while in a more no train type job might give him some direction. Does the associates have any job direction or was he just earning an AA fulfilling general ed credit toward a transfer. ETA - I totally agree cosigning for a 20K loan a year is a terrible idea. I don't think I'd do it for a kid who was begging. If he were going to finish his 4 year, I'd look for the most cost effective route. Edited November 3, 2018 by FuzzyCatz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bethben Posted November 3, 2018 Author Share Posted November 3, 2018 He did general ed for his AA degree. An emphasis in communication classes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanetC Posted November 3, 2018 Share Posted November 3, 2018 On 11/2/2018 at 2:29 PM, bethben said: Also, we did do the fafsa calculator and there was very little aid. The parental contribution was around $3k which we could swing, but with the both, we were looking at about $4K with the remainder being loans. There is no way I am going to advise an 18 year old to take out $20-$30k per school year to go to college. He certainly doesn’t want it either. He’s saved about $7k, but it’s a drop comparatively. Hang on -- both your retirement account (again in an IRS approved account) and the value of the home are not reported on the FAFSA. Those would not cut you off from aid. The value of the home is considered on the CSS/Profile (College board institutional method), but only for some schools. If your FAFSA EFC was 3K you are not too wealthy to qualify for aid. Maybe you just chose to run a net price calculator at a school that meets the remaining need with fistfuls of loans. The federal Pell grants are relatively small (so the federal forecaster will not show much aid, I think the max is 5K ish) but that Pell grant is often supplemented with funds from the college and sometimes from your state (depending on your state). Spend some time browsing debt by degrees (https://projects.propublica.org/colleges/) See if you can find some interesting schools that graduate kids with less debt and try the net price calculators there. This is, of course, assuming he'd like to attend college if he could find one that wasn't "easier than homeschool" and interested and excited him. I'm just trying to figure out whether money is foreclosing his options here. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlsdMama Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 On 10/31/2018 at 3:24 PM, bethben said: So, my DS doesn’t want to get into college debt and has chosen the local college as his college of choice. He’s been accepted and has been awarded a $10k scholarship to attend the local college where he could live at home and drive to. He’s academically burnt out. He’s on track to get an AA degree by the end of next semester (he’s dual enrolled). He does want that. His classes have been easy for him-easier than the homeschool online classes I had him take previously. He’s just bored. He’s a hands on kind of kid. He doesn’t want to start a career like electrician only to find he hates it two years into the training. He wanted to pursue industrial design, but the job prospects are horrible, it doesn’t pay well, and the schools he would have to go to are out of state and expensive—not justifiable in his mind to take on huge debt for a niche field where starting salaries are $30k. Hiw would you advise this kid? We’ve told him he is welcome to take a year off and explore the world or do an apprenticeship, but he has to have a plan if he goes that direction. If he doesn’t have a concrete plan, we just want to send him to college for two more years to just get the degree that still just opens a door to a job. His associates classes are an automatic transfer. He won’t have debt. Explain to me what industrial design is? Is it essentially like interior design with an industrial bent? My husband's undergrad is in industrial technology - industrial engineering. It's a step down from engineering, both in position, responsibilities, and degree "status" but, at the time at which we were raising a kiddo, were young, and had another on the way, it was a great choice for him. Economically it got his foot in the door of a place that pays pretty good both in salary and in benefits. Later he went back and received graduate degrees which then helped the climb. But, if I'm on the right track and he thinks he'd enjoy an industrial environment, this is a possibility? If I'm on the wrong track, disregard. All of this is no use to you. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanetC Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 On 11/2/2018 at 2:25 PM, bethben said: ABLE accounts stink because the state can swipe any money in that account after the death of the person for whom it was created. And it has limits and regulations. We’d rather just put stuff under our names and use what we have for his benefit. The limits and regulations on ABLE are the trade-offs for the tax, SSI eligibility, and estate-planning benefits. If you keep everything in your name, you need to consider your estate planning strategies for what happens if your son outlives you (or outlives your ability to care for him) -- Those strategies are also constrained by various regulations and trade-offs. There is no "uncomplicated" path. (And yes, it stinks that the rules force you to peer into the future to guess everyone's life expectancy, future medical prognosis and bills, and so on.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
berwif Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 Kids should really determine their passion first before deciding what course to take in college. It is very important to avoid burnout. Also, too much academic loads and and almost no social life could lead to burnout. They should also join some curricular activities that they enjoy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanetC Posted November 11, 2018 Share Posted November 11, 2018 On 11/6/2018 at 10:50 PM, berwif said: Kids should really determine their passion first before deciding what course to take in college. It is very important to avoid burnout. Also, too much academic loads and and almost no social life could lead to burnout. They should also join some curricular activities that they enjoy. 1. Many 18 year olds do not know their "passion" -- or they think they know their passion but then take college-level classes and discover a subject isn't what they thought it was when they were in high school (for the better or the worse). 2. There are multiple types of burnout -- the type of burnout caused by overwork and the type of burnout caused by under-challenge (forced to do mind-numbing work) are different. It's not quite clear what's going on here. It could also just be the uncertainty of growing up ("he doesn't' want to start something and not like it two years later") -- unfortunately, there are no guarantees and many/most people do change careers. Sometimes the pressure to "get it perfect on the first try" comes from within and sometimes from parents/peers/culture. I agree that students should have a mix of academics and extracurricular activities. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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