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Learning Disabilities and College Admission


AmyinMD
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I am strongly considering having my 16 year old daughter tested for Dyscalculia.  Is there anyone with any experience with college applications with either Dyscalculia or Dyslexia?

 

My daughter is a high school junior (always homeschooled) and is taking the ACT today for the first time.  The past two weeks helping her prep for the math made me realize just how bad it is and I think the math alone could sink her chances for college admission.  On one practice test this week she scored a 13 out of 60 on the math section.  She should get 12 right just from random guessing.  

 

She has worked with a math tutor 1-2 times a week for the past two years.  My husband and I both have engineering degrees and are able to help her with any math questions she may have.  My dh did math with her for years but it got to where we decided a tutor would be better.  She is awesome and very patient with my daughter.  She has gotten her to Geometry right now but last night my daughter asked me a question about a math problem and had no idea what an angle on a triangle was.  We had worked a bunch of problems with angles the past couple weeks and she couldn't even identify one last night.  She has also completely forgotten how to do slope intercept form and I know she spent months working on that with her tutor.  She is very motivated and an extremely hard worker.  She seems to have forgotten basic fraction operations and how to combine like terms or how to apply the distributive law.  I worry she would never get through remedial math classes she will likely test into in college.  I think her low math scores could prevent her from being admitted at all even though she is very strong in every other area.   We choose to have her do the ACT since the math was a smaller percentage of the overall score than on the SAT but I know schools will still be able to see her likely very low math score.  

 

What complicates this is she is an extremely motivated student and has pretty lofty career goals.  Right now she thinks she wants to attend Law School.  Her current first choice for majors is Political Science and she really wants to attend college in the DC area (we live about an hour outside of DC).  Her first choice of schools is University of Maryland-College Park which is probably the hardest Maryland state school to get admitted to but much easier than an ivy league school.  Other schools she likes are American University, UMBC, or Towson.  

 

She already has 12 college credits (humanities classes) all with As and is hoping to have at least 50 credits by the time she finishes high school so having her attend CC like my older dd is doing doesn't make much sense.  She is really into competitive debate which our CC doesn't have so she wants to attend a school that has a competitive debate team.  She is currently competing through Capital Debate in their regional program and she has gotten awards at competitions.   She also likes theater and has been in 20+ plays over the years and participates with a traveling vocal group, takes dance, and did soccer her freshman/sophomore years.  She is trying to get some more volunteer hours since she doesn't have many yet.  She is applying to pre-college programs this summer so she can live on campus and take credit classes this summer.  She spent part of last summer at Villanova University to attend debate camp.  I think she looks like a pretty strong applicant for most schools aside from math and I'm worried that will really hurt her getting in college.  I was hoping maybe if we got her tested for LDs that the low math scores may not hurt her as much.  

 

 

 

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Unfortunately, her test scores are going to matter a lot for certain schools. If she can increase her scores with appropriate accommodations, that is a possibility. But seeking accommodations at this point might be too late. She is just months from being a sr.)

 

You have a couple of other options you might want to consider: test optional schools (check out fairtest.org). Most require test scores from homeschoolers, but with all her DE credit, they might waive that requirement. The other is to ask about possible spring admissions. Only fall admits' test scores are factored into an institution's profile, so some schools are willing to admit students outside their profile via non- fall admissions.

Edited by 8FillTheHeart
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I would definitely get her tested. With learning disabilities, some schools will waive certain graduation requirements (like math) if it really doesn't have anything to do with the major. I'd be upfront in telling the schools about her learning disabilities. If the rest of her ACT scores are good, they may overlook her math score.

 

It sounds like she's already proven that she is a capable learner. Since she has taken college classes with good results, I think that will certainly help make her case that she would be a good student at any school.

 

In answer to your question, yes I have had a student admitted to a very competitive school with his learning disabilities. He is different in that he does test well (with extra time) so his test scores don't hold him back much. I was very upfront in my counselor letter about his difficulties with severe dysgraphia and mod. dyslexia. Told of some of his journey and that I thought he was quite ready and capable of college level work with appropriate accommodations. He had AP scores to back up his transcript, but no college classes.

 

 

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You should get her tested immediately. And with those results in hand you can explain the lopsided test scores. Some schools will listen, others won't, but either way, she will need test results for help in meeting math requirements or bypassing them all together when she is in college.

 

You will learn much about a school by their response to you on this issue.

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The other reason for testing would be to actually understand what is really going on since it will probably affect aspects of her life even as an adult.  There could be many comorbid strengths and weaknesses.  Getting a better grasp of those should help in many ways, not just testing accommodations for college admissions.

 

 

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Just chiming in to add that I'd definitely pursue testing ASAP and I'd include checking out developmental vision issues that may in turn hamper development of visual memory.  Not remembering what an angle in a triangle is sounds visual unless there's a language (naming?) component.

 

In the bigger picture, if she thinks she may be interested in law school, math isn't an important skill, though logic ability is critical and is a main component both of the LSAT and actual practice.  If she tends to be a logical person, I don't think this needs to be taught in high school; normally I'd recommend working with proofs for logic practice but unfortunately in her case you won't be able to use math (and I think that's ok).

 

Also consider posting on the Learning Challenges forum.

Edited by wapiti
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The concern I have for this student is getting testing done, getting the results back, having CB or ACT approve the accommodations, actually testing with accommodations, getting results back, all in time for fall applications (it is already mid Feb and application season can start in August.) If she can get in for testing quickly, it might be possible, but when we pursued testing, the waiting list time for testing was up to 6 months.

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You should get her tested immediately. And with those results in hand you can explain the lopsided test scores. Some schools will listen, others won't, but either way, she will need test results for help in meeting math requirements or bypassing them all together when she is in college.

 

You will learn much about a school by their response to you on this issue.

 

 

It is not appropriate to disclose accommodations or disabilities prior to admission. Disability test results can be used to apply for accommodations for standardized tests such as the SAT and ACT.  Accommodations are not guaranteed, though. It is up to the discretion of the ACT or SAT. The use of accommodations during testing is not disclosed to the universities with the score report.

 

Students apply through the regular university admissions process and must meet the minimum requirements along with all other students. Once admitted, a student applies to the university Office of Disability Services for classroom accommodations. 

 

Degree requirements cannot be changed to accommodate a disability. Appropriate accommodations can be made to give the student access to the tools they need to succeed, but the student still must take the required courses. 

 

There are some universities that have programs for people with specific learning disabilities. Some universities adjust university admission requirements for students entering those programs and some don't. Seats in these programs are very limited. East Carolina University has a program for students with dyslexia. 

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Degree requirements cannot be changed to accommodate a disability. Appropriate accommodations can be made to give the student access to the tools they need to succeed, but the student still must take the required courses. 

 

Not sure if it commonly done or not, but I know people who have had math or foreign language requirements waved for certain degrees.

 

I agree that a college degree should mean that the student is able to do college level work and satisfies the requirements for that degree. 

 

Definitely get tested as this is a big problem.

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It is my understanding that once a child has taken any tests through the college board, that they won't grant accommodations for future tests. We were told to make sure all testing was done and paperwork in place prior to taking PSAT, SAT or ACT. i would check into that before going through the lengthy and expensive testing process.

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Not sure if it commonly done or not, but I know people who have had math or foreign language requirements waved for certain degrees.

 

I agree that a college degree should mean that the student is able to do college level work and satisfies the requirements for that degree. 

 

Definitely get tested as this is a big problem.

 

That is not typically done, though. The students who didn't get the requirement waived would have a case if they decided to complain. The purpose of accommodations is to provide access, to level the playing field, not to exempt people from the work required. 

 

The testing is a big problem, but even after that, the accommodations from the testing boards are not easy to get, either. Testing late in the school career could work against a student, too. 

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It is my understanding that once a child has taken any tests through the college board, that they won't grant accommodations for future tests. We were told to make sure all testing was done and paperwork in place prior to taking PSAT, SAT or ACT. i would check into that before going through the lengthy and expensive testing process.

 

This isn't true. My ds had solid scores on his PSAT with no accommodations. We then did his application for accommodations and he was granted extra time and a keyboard by the CB. The ACT board also gave him the extra time we requested. Having tested successfully without accommodations made no difference.

 

OP, I would get testing done ASAP. If you can get testing done quickly, there is plenty of time to get accommodations in place before testing. The ACT board only took 2 weeks to approve our request, although CB was slower. You are not too late if you can find someone who will test soon.

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It is my understanding that once a child has taken any tests through the college board, that they won't grant accommodations for future tests. We were told to make sure all testing was done and paperwork in place prior to taking PSAT, SAT or ACT. i would check into that before going through the lengthy and expensive testing process.

 

If the student needs accommodations in college, the testing still needs to be done. 

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My question only relates to admission. I'm not trying to get her out of required coursework. For all the majors dd is considering she only needs one math class and it looks like Statistics would satisfy that. My 19 yo who doesn't really care for math although she is much better at it than my 16 yo is currently taking her one college math- Statistics for social science majors. I have looked at her book and I think my 16 yo could do it but passing a placement exam or scoring high enough on ACT Math to exempt her from the placement test are unlikely to happen.

 

I will at least do testing and see if that will help. I'm not sure why you wouldn't want to disclose the results on an application though as it seems like it could help explain low test scores. Extra time could help her some as she did say she could have done better with more time.

 

Our other possible thought is to have dd's tutor heavily work on Accuplacer when she is done with Geometry so hopefully she could test into Statistics or at least highest level remedial. Take Statistics at community college. Attend cc for fall of freshman year and apply as a transfer student for Jan admission. It seems like such a pain to do it that way. By that point dd might be running out of classes to take as she thinks she'd be at 51 credits at high school grad if she follows her plan. I also think a lot of schools only let you transfer in 60 credits because we have been looking for my 19 yo. She will be at 64 credits to finish AA but looks like she can only bring in 60 when she transfers.

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This isn't true. My ds had solid scores on his PSAT with no accommodations. We then did his application for accommodations and he was granted extra time and a keyboard by the CB. The ACT board also gave him the extra time we requested. Having tested successfully without accommodations made no difference.

 

OP, I would get testing done ASAP. If you can get testing done quickly, there is plenty of time to get accommodations in place before testing. The ACT board only took 2 weeks to approve our request, although CB was slower. You are not too late if you can find someone who will test soon.

That is good to know. I know several public school parents that had their late testing/accommodation requests denied because their students went through school and early testing without anything being documented. Our son has cerebral palsy and our neuropsych said he would need three rounds of testing! One early (middle school) to get issues documented, one later to show disabilities were addressed and improvement a possibility (high school), then one right before college testing because they current evals (junior or senior year). We used a large children's hospital for neuropsych and insurance paid for much of it because of cp diagnosis, so we didn't feel like neuropsych was recommending three rounds of testing just for their personal financial gains.
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My question only relates to admission. I'm not trying to get her out of required coursework. For all the majors dd is considering she only needs one math class and it looks like Statistics would satisfy that. My 19 yo who doesn't really care for math although she is much better at it than my 16 yo is currently taking her one college math- Statistics for social science majors. I have looked at her book and I think my 16 yo could do it but passing a placement exam or scoring high enough on ACT Math to exempt her from the placement test are unlikely to happen.

 

I will at least do testing and see if that will help. I'm not sure why you wouldn't want to disclose the results on an application though as it seems like it could help explain low test scores. Extra time could help her some as she did say she could have done better with more time.

 

Our other possible thought is to have dd's tutor heavily work on Accuplacer when she is done with Geometry so hopefully she could test into Statistics or at least highest level remedial. Take Statistics at community college. Attend cc for fall of freshman year and apply as a transfer student for Jan admission. It seems like such a pain to do it that way. By that point dd might be running out of classes to take as she thinks she'd be at 51 credits at high school grad if she follows her plan. I also think a lot of schools only let you transfer in 60 credits because we have been looking for my 19 yo. She will be at 64 credits to finish AA but looks like she can only bring in 60 when she transfers.

Have you looked at the transfer admissions requirements at the schools you mentioned? I think for UMD she probably wouldn't have to submit her test scores, but some schools are still going to require them. I did a quick google of American, and it looks like they will require them to be sent unless I am reading the page incorrectly (the testing codes on the side bar are what make me think they might still be required):

http://www.american.edu/admissions/transfer/transferinstructions.cfm

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Have you looked at the transfer admissions requirements at the schools you mentioned? I think for UMD she probably wouldn't have to submit her test scores, but some schools are still going to require them. I did a quick google of American, and it looks like they will require them to be sent unless I am reading the page incorrectly (the testing codes on the side bar are what make me think they might still be required):

http://www.american.edu/admissions/transfer/transferinstructions.cfm

I will check on that. I was assuming test scores were not needed for transfers. We were at UMBC on Friday and know transfers do not need to submit test scores because we spoke with admissions rep about it. My 19 yo is planning to transfer there. That is another MD state school so I'm hopeful it would be similar for other state schools but I will check.

 

I've been looking over Accuplacer math and really think she could pass that if we did some intensive practice right before. If she could do that then maybe she could just apply as a transfer student. If she could take Statistics in the fall she could be done with math. She'd still graduate spring of 2018 but she'd have more than 30 college credits by Dec so could maybe just apply for Fall 2018 as transfer. I think it is UMD that said if over 30 credits to apply as transfer. UMBC was fine with her applying as a freshman even with her credits but could possibly do as transfer.

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If you want testing to get accommodations for SAT or ACT purposes, our experience is you need a full psychoeducational evaluation completed for this. You also need to submit that the student uses the accommodation that she wants for the SAT or ACT. That means if you are requesting extending time the student needs to be able to say she normally gets extended time on exams. 

 

Understand that scheduling a full psychoeducational evaluation takes time. Getting the results takes time. Getting the request submitted and getting a response from College Board or ACT takes time. 

 

Our first testing was an AP test. For May AP testing we starting the process the prior September. My ds's psycho ed testing and reports were complete in November/December. It was March before we heard from College Board that our request was approved. 

 

Once you get through all that, it is up to your dd to decide whether to disclose the LD on an application. However, when you are doing your college search you can ask about disability services at each school and find what might be available after one is admitted. Some schools offer a lot of support, others not so much. Many will require psycheducational testing within 3 years to qualify for accommodations, so you can use the testing you had for the SAT or ACT accommodations.

 

For most schools, disclosing an LD on an application is not an advantage, unless it is kind of an an extra you can write about, but to stand out it would have to be more than "I have this LD and that makes math hard." Something more like " I couldn't read at all until I was in high school and I still managed to get through college level work before I finished high school" might look interesting to admissions. 

 

The other thing is disclosing an LD is not going make a school lower their admission expectations. Basically, most of the schools I've researched have said the student has to get in based on their own performance compared to other persons in the admissions pool  regardless of disability. 

 

Edited by Diana P.
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 I'm not sure why you wouldn't want to disclose the results on an application though as it seems like it could help explain low test scores. Extra time could help her some as she did say she could have done better with more time.

 

 

 

Disclosing a disability on an application opens the door to discrimination. If a student has accommodations and still scores low enough on standardized tests that an explanation is necessary, then the university very well may conclude that the student won't be able to succeed in their program and so they will deny admission. 

 

Be very careful about disclosure during the admissions process.  It can't be "undone." Conventional wisdom says don't do it unless you need accommodations for an admissions interview. 

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I've been looking over Accuplacer math and really think she could pass that if we did some intensive practice right before. If she could do that then maybe she could just apply as a transfer student. If she could take Statistics in the fall she could be done with math. She'd still graduate spring of 2018 but she'd have more than 30 college credits by Dec so could maybe just apply for Fall 2018 as transfer. I think it is UMD that said if over 30 credits to apply as transfer. UMBC was fine with her applying as a freshman even with her credits but could possibly do as transfer.

Is there a reason for waiting until fall 2018 to take statistics? Could she take it at the CC at the same time she takes a different math at home? Or in the summer after graduation? I know some report that schools view students that do that as transfer students, but not all do.

 

If she applies as a high school senior to UMD, it looks like she would apply as a freshman no matter the number of DE credits. https://www.admissions.umd.edu/apply/requirements.php

 

Here is the transfer page. https://www.admissions.umd.edu/apply/transfer.php

This sentance is interesting "Freshman applicants who apply for admission to the fall semester are also automatically considered for admission beginning in the spring semester"

 

Good luck to your daughter.

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Yes to the Diana and TechWife's posts. Admissions is not going to lower the standards due to a disclosed disability. If the accommodations can be in place in time to for testing, and she can bring her scores up to their acceptance range with the accommodations, the app never needs to reveal the accommodations. If she can't bring her scores up to a competitive range (looking at college data, UMD-- CP's 50th percentile range for math is 620-730 which converts to 27-32 math ACT; American's is lower and a conversion looks like a 24-29 range), finding alternative ways of applying without test scores is probably going to be her best chance for admissions. (I have had a niece with about 60 CR hours and a 4.0 admitted via spring admissions, so it is definitely an option. Applying as a transfer without test scores sounds like a good one as well.)

Edited by 8FillTheHeart
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