DS7 Dyslexic? Just not ready? Reading HELP!

[mmasc]

Please help me experienced homeschooling moms. My middle DS just turned 7.

Background: He did AAR Pre-level for K. Then for first we did MCP phonics until long vowels starting slowing him down. We worked on OPGTR at the same time and also the I See Sam readers. I've purchased Dancing Bears A to start with him. He's very busy/active, never wanted to learn to read, would always rather be playing than doing any school work.

Here's my question: How do I know if he's 'just not ready' or has an LD?

Here is an example: I've taken a bit a time off for reading, because he was so frustrated I thought maybe we'd have one of those 'took a break, now we're having a breakthrough' moments. But no. :(

I just had him read I See Sam Book 39 The Seed. Here were his struggles:

Trouble sounding out 'hand' and 'with'

For 'fat', he guessed 'fill' (maybe bc fill was used a lot?)

Trouble sounding out fans

The word 'weed' is on every.single.page. But he'd still say 'will' or sometimes weed

Couldn't sound out needs

Finally got 'hand', but then 'hands' tripped him up

(We've gone over the sounds ee and th make many, many times)

 

He acts like it's painful to read. He twists and turns. He either knows the words and says them, or he guesses a wrong word. He HATES for me to have him sound it out.

I feel like I'm failing him. I don't know what to do. Keep plugging along? Seek an evaluation? If so, with who? Where?

Thank you for reading this far. If you have any words of wisdom, I'll kindly accept them now.

[FriedClams]

First, he's young. Take a deep breath. :-) Second, it sounds like you've jumped around in approaches a lot, with lots of fits and starts. I'm of the school that a little bit, done every day, builds up.

 

If I were you, I'd have a little sit down with your son and DH. I'd lay out the plan... Every morning junior will do his chores and then go out and play for 30 minutes. Then, he will cone in, wash his hands, and you will sit together at the table for his reading lesson. Every day. 7 days a week. You pick the curriculum you can teach. One. He is free to play again when he's done for whatever time limit you set. Then it's math time. Reading can take 15 minutes or all day. It's up to him. Whining, complaining, etc will result in consequences (I'd have some ready - loss of screen time, etc). I think you'll see that it'll take a week or two with absolute consistency (and done long, disobedient testing mom to see if she's serious days) to get your routine set. I'd give it 8-12 weeks of super consistency before I remotely worried about LDs.

 

I would also have him read every night to you for 15 minutes. Every day. No fail. Whine, compassion, etc - off to bed. No arguments, no discussions. Keep it fun, light, connected, relational - but do it daily.

 

Again, I'm from one school. We practiced about 30 minutes a day learning to read. 15 minutes in the morning, 15 at night. I'd say we hit it 6 days a week. Some days were slow, others were great, but I think the consistency was huge at that age. I'd keep it as couch time, huggy, fun, light as possible, but every day...Every day... Hang in there!!!! You're doing great!!!

[mmasc]

Thanks FriedClams. :) Sometimes I need reminding that he's still young. I like your suggestion of the reading lesson right after active time outside. I'm going to try that! I've picked Dancing Bears and sticking to it. We will work 10-15 on it daily no matter what. I was trying to do one reading 'core' last year, then bouncing around on the readers of his choice. I was trying to keep it light and fun, but moving forward. In doing so, I may have just made it 'scattered'. What would you recommend for 15 minutes of night reading? Whatever he wants? Controlled vocabulary readers? Other?

[mmasc]

Has his eyesight been thoroughly tested?

We've only been to an optometrist.

[FairProspects]

Is he at the same level he was at 5 or is he making slow but steady progress? Still making the same or similar mistakes he did 2 years ago or different ones?

[Ellie]

Please help me experienced homeschooling moms. My middle DS just turned 7.

Background: He did AAR Pre-level for K. Then for first we did MCP phonics until long vowels starting slowing him down. We worked on OPGTR at the same time and also the I See Sam readers. I've purchased Dancing Bears A to start with him. He's very busy/active, never wanted to learn to read, would always rather be playing than doing any school work.

Here's my question: How do I know if he's 'just not ready' or has an LD?

Here is an example: I've taken a bit a time off for reading, because he was so frustrated I thought maybe we'd have one of those 'took a break, now we're having a breakthrough' moments. But no. :(

I just had him read I See Sam Book 39 The Seed. Here were his struggles:

Trouble sounding out 'hand' and 'with'

For 'fat', he guessed 'fill' (maybe bc fill was used a lot?)

Trouble sounding out fans

The word 'weed' is on every.single.page. But he'd still say 'will' or sometimes weed

Couldn't sound out needs

Finally got 'hand', but then 'hands' tripped him up

(We've gone over the sounds ee and th make many, many times)

 

He acts like it's painful to read. He twists and turns. He either knows the words and says them, or he guesses a wrong word. He HATES for me to have him sound it out.

I feel like I'm failing him. I don't know what to do. Keep plugging along? Seek an evaluation? If so, with who? Where?

Thank you for reading this far. If you have any words of wisdom, I'll kindly accept them now.

 

:grouphug:

 

Here's the thing: He's only 7, but you have already done three different phonics methods with him (and FTR, MCP phonics is not all that strong in phonics). It's possible that (1) you started very early with him, before he was really ready, and (2) you haven't stayed with one method long enough to see real results.

 

That he is guessing isn't that much of a concern to me since he really doesn't have a strong phonics foundation yet.

 

Of course, there could be a true learning difficulty, but OTOH, it could be that you really need to put that stuff away for some time while you do the research, know for sure what you're going to use and how to do it, and then start in again. Don't make him read aloud to you. 

 

[mmasc]

Is he at the same level he was at 5 or is he making slow but steady progress? Still making the same or similar mistakes he did 2 years ago or different ones?

He's definitely not where he was at 5. He has made progress, although it does seem slow.

[FriedClams]

Thanks FriedClams. :) Sometimes I need reminding that he's still young. I like your suggestion of the reading lesson right after active time outside. I'm going to try that! I've picked Dancing Bears and sticking to it. We will work 10-15 on it daily no matter what. I was trying to do one reading 'core' last year, then bouncing around on the readers of his choice. I was trying to keep it light and fun, but moving forward. In doing so, I may have just made it 'scattered'. What would you recommend for 15 minutes of night reading? Whatever he wants? Controlled vocabulary readers? Other?

 

I think at first I would work a lot on the habit - sitting still, focusing for 15 minutes, etc. I'd keep it pretty tight and focused and have your books and everything all ready to go before you start. For a while, I'd pick all the books. When you're in the habit, I'd start giving freedom at night - library trips and fun picks, alternating pages with both of you reading, etc. But, until you have the routine, I would stay very focused and tight. It'll be worth it.

FWIW, I'd also make sure he knows the basics well. I'd run through the Letter Factory videos, and make sure the basics are covered.

 

I totally hear you on the wiggly boys. Mine is almost 13 now... Hang in there. It'll get better. :laugh:  Really. Habit training when they're 7 really does make a HUGE difference when they're older. Don't get frustrated. Don't expect perfection. Don't compare. Expect wiggly. Expect silly. Gently redirect. All. Day. Long. You're the teacher, not a hostage. You set the tone. You can do it!!!! You can do it!!!

[mmasc]

:grouphug:

 

Here's the thing: He's only 7, but you have already done three different phonics methods with him (and FTR, MCP phonics is not all that strong in phonics). It's possible that (1) you started very early with him, before he was really ready, and (2) you haven't stayed with one method long enough to see real results.

 

That he is guessing isn't that much of a concern to me since he really doesn't have a strong phonics foundation yet.

 

Of course, there could be a true learning difficulty, but OTOH, it could be that you really need to put that stuff away for some time while you do the research, know for sure what you're going to use and how to do it, and then start in again. Don't make him read aloud to you.

 

Thanks for the hugs. I'm needing them regarding this issue. :)

I really appreciate your advice. Do you think my plan of Dancing Bears A every day will be a good choice? When you say 'don't have him read aloud', do you mean just until I get our game plan?

I think I went wrong with MCP Plaid Phonics. :( When that fact started becoming obvious, I pulled out my trusty OPGTR, but he really hated it. So I tried doing those lessons on the white board, but using I See Sam readers to reinforce. It felt so scattered!

I'm open to your suggestions Ellie. I've read your posts for quite some time. :)

[mmasc]

I think at first I would work a lot on the habit - sitting still, focusing for 15 minutes, etc. I'd keep it pretty tight and focused and have your books and everything all ready to go before you start. For a while, I'd pick all the books. When you're in the habit, I'd start giving freedom at night - library trips and fun picks, alternating pages with both of you reading, etc. But, until you have the routine, I would stay very focused and tight. It'll be worth it.

FWIW, I'd also make sure he knows the basics well. I'd run through the Letter Factory videos, and make sure the basics are covered.

 

I totally hear you on the wiggly boys. Mine is almost 13 now... Hang in there. It'll get better. :laugh: Really. Habit training when they're 7 really does make a HUGE difference when they're older. Don't get frustrated. Don't expect perfection. Don't compare. Expect wiggly. Expect silly. Gently redirect. All. Day. Long. You're the teacher, not a hostage. You set the tone. You can do it!!!! You can do it!!!

Yes, this. ^^^^ Thank you for the encouragement! :)

[FriedClams]

Thanks for the hugs. I'm needing them regarding this issue. :)

I really appreciate your advice. Do you think my plan of Dancing Bears A every day will be a good choice? When you say 'don't have him read aloud', do you mean just until I get our game plan?

I think I went wrong with MCP Plaid Phonics. :( When that fact started becoming obvious, I pulled out my trusty OPGTR, but he really hated it. So I tried doing those lessons on the white board, but using I See Sam readers to reinforce. It felt so scattered!

I'm open to your suggestions Ellie. I've read your posts for quite some time. :)

 

No, I'd have him read daily, 2x a day, but YOU pick the books and materials. Too many decisions - too easy to lose focus. I am old, so DB wasn't around when my kids were little. I will say that I remember there being a fairly large difference between the ability to write a that age and the ability to read. I had one read early and write later. If your curriculum needs a lot of writing I would separate the skills - copywork/writing/penmanship and then reading. At some point they'll merge - but it can be easy to get behind on reading when little dudes aren't ready to write a lot. A white board is a great idea for reading lessons. Again, relax. Stay focused. Every day. Fun.

 

I'd listen to Ellie too!!! I love reading her posts and she's WAY smarter than me!

[Ellie]

Thanks for the hugs. I'm needing them regarding this issue. :)

I really appreciate your advice. Do you think my plan of Dancing Bears A every day will be a good choice? When you say 'don't have him read aloud', do you mean just until I get our game plan?

I think I went wrong with MCP Plaid Phonics. :( When that fact started becoming obvious, I pulled out my trusty OPGTR, but he really hated it. So I tried doing those lessons on the white board, but using I See Sam readers to reinforce. It felt so scattered!

I'm open to your suggestions Ellie. I've read your posts for quite some time. :)

 

I think at this moment, you should not require him to do anything. I haven't seen Dancing Bears so I have no opinion about. I only have an opinion about letting him chill out for awhile before getting back in. You describe a child who needs that time off, until *he* indicates that he's ready to continue. That could be several months. FYI. :-)

 

As far as his reading aloud, I think you should just take it slowly. Wait. He does not have enough skills at this time to read aloud, and as I said, I'm not familiar with Dancing Bears so I don't know at what point his reading aloud would be beneficial. I'd just back off. Many children are never *required* to read aloud--my own included--and they still manage to become skillful, engaged readers. :-)

 

:001_smile:

[mmasc]

Well, he has always been my one to do it (whatever 'it' is) on his own time, when HE is ready! :) But that makes it hard sometimes to figure out if I need to wait, or give him a little push on whatever it is we might be working on.

[hepatica]

I disagree with the above advice. It's exactly what I was told when my oldest DD wasn't reading at 7 and it simply delayed figuring out what the problem was. 

 

He's 7. You've been working on reading with a variety of different approaches for 2+ years. He's not making much progress. Time to either get him tested or move forward with a program like Barton (or both).

 

I would repost this question on the learning challenges board if you want advice from moms with dyslexic kids.

[Pen]

I think the way to know if he "just isn't ready" or "has an LD" is to get him tested for LD.  If he is found to have an LD you can then do what needs to be done for it without him losing years of valuable time trying this or that or waiting and seeing.  If an evaluation does not show an LD such as dyslexia, you can relax a bit and give him more time.

[mmasc]

Hepatica and pen, thank you for your thoughts on this. If I decided to get him tested, where do I even do that? I wouldn't even know where to start. It's so stressful not knowing if he needs more time, or has an LD. :/ I can honestly see it being either with his personality.

[Pen]

It can depend on where you live and finances to some degree.  And also what you think should be first on list to try to get him tested for.  It does not sound from what you wrote like you suspect anything more than perhaps a developmental vision issue affecting reading or dyslexia, those usually have different people who do the evaluation.  A 
COVD" type optometrist for the vision and various possibilities for dyslexia such as a private neuropsychologist with a specialty in that area, a reading center that can do testing for that, in some places Scottish Rite centers apparently exist that can test for dyslexia.

 

You can probably get more people with experience if you ask this on Learning Challenges area.

[mom2samlibby]

This is a great website to look into.  It has some other possible signs to consider that it could be dyslexia.  It could be that he is still young and not quite ready, but I would look further into dyslexia.  I wish I would have when my young son was not reading.  I was told by other homeschooling mothers that he was young and a boy, so he just needed more time.  But, looking back, I wish I would have investigated earlier at a younger age. 

 

I would not push him to read every day until you have him evaluated.  If he does have dyslexia, the Barton program recommends not having them read until they have completed several levels of the program.  

 

http://www.dys-add.com/index.html

 

Good luck!

[hepatica]

A neuropsychologist who tests for learning disabilities is what you want for dyslexia testing. One way to find one is to check with private schools in your area to see where they send kids. Unfortunately, the testing is usually quite expensive and not always covered by insurance.

 

You could also start by doing the pretest on the Barton website. 

 

Also, get your hands on the Eide's book, The Dyslexic Advantage. I found this book indispensable in helping me too see the tremendous strengths that often accompany dyslexia, and in recognizing these strengths in my child (and myself).

 

 

[HomeAgain]

You've gotten some great suggestions, but here's one more: I think magnetic letters should be in the home of every child learning to read.  Real ones- lowercase, one or two colors only.  Reading can be tactile. It should be available whenever the child wants to play with them.  You can harness his energy by having him smash two together to make blends, do rapid review of endings or middle sounds.  Split words into tiny bites.  Add tactile methods into any program you chose, but just the body movement helps a LOT for kids who don't respond well to paper.

 

 

[mmasc]

A neuropsychologist who tests for learning disabilities is what you want for dyslexia testing. One way to find one is to check with private schools in your area to see where they send kids. Unfortunately, the testing is usually quite expensive and not always covered by insurance.

 

You could also start by doing the pretest on the Barton website.

 

Also, get your hands on the Eide's book, The Dyslexic Advantage. I found this book indispensable in helping me too see the tremendous strengths that often accompany dyslexia, and in recognizing these strengths in my child (and myself).

Thank you for the suggestions. Just to get an idea of what might be available, I emailed the Barton website to get a list of qualified providers. Not surprisingly, none are available in my state (neuro, edu psy). However, she listed two 'well-trained Dyslexia Consultants', stating that would be all I need since we homeschool. One is actually fairly close to me. Do you know if that would be sufficient? I'm assuming they're well-trained or they wouldn't be recommended by Ms. Barton ???

I'm starting to feel like if I could get him tested, and if he's not dyslexic, then I could just give him more time. Then start fresh with the above suggestions. But I'm terrified to give him more time, then start fresh, and after months of that realize something is definitely not right.

I've read that dyslexia is genetic. Does it matter that nobody else is our family has it? Or is that irrelevant?

Thank you ALL so much for your feedback on this thread. It is helping me so much.

[mmasc]

You've gotten some great suggestions, but here's one more: I think magnetic letters should be in the home of every child learning to read. Real ones- lowercase, one or two colors only. Reading can be tactile. It should be available whenever the child wants to play with them. You can harness his energy by having him smash two together to make blends, do rapid review of endings or middle sounds. Split words into tiny bites. Add tactile methods into any program you chose, but just the body movement helps a LOT for kids who don't respond well to paper.

Thanks for this suggestion! We have AAS tiles already. Would you suggest something different? If so, could you give me a link? Thanks!

 

(To clarify: We haven't started AAS. I have the tiles for older DS)

[PeterPan]

Well my ds got diagnosed with dyslexia at newly 6, so your ds is NOT too young to get diagnosed, no matter what is going on.  They now have a CTOPP (test of phonological processing) normed down to I think 4, so any psych who is willing to run the CTOPP or something similar on him can get this done.  They'll run IQ and achievement testing and then specialized tests like the CTOPP, stuff for visual motor processing, maybe an APD (auditory processing) screening, etc.  

 

You can go to a private psych, go through the ps, whatever your finances and insurance covers.  My ds has an IEP through the ps, and the ps also confirmed the SLD reading.  Your ds is NOT too young to get this sorted out.  They have normed tools and can figure it out, no problem.

 

Kids with ADHD will often have crunchy reading, and kids with reading disorder (dyslexia) will often have ADHD.  Which side of that he ends up on diagnostically, can't say.  What I will say is that even if it's NOT dyslexia, even if it goes ADHD, you're still going to learn a lot by going through the eval process.  Many kids with ADHD will benefit from an OT eval.  I don't know if my dd with ADHD had many retained primitive reflexes, but my ds has at least 3.  The book Stopping ADHD is very strong on the connection between a retained STNR and dyslexia, dysgraphia, and ADHD symptoms.  I'm not so sure that was the case with my dd, but it DEFINITELY is with my ds.  So time spent going well maybe it will go away is time you're not spending working on the actual things going on.  Here's a link on testing for retained primitive reflexes.  http://www.retainedneonatalreflexes.com.au/test-at-hom/  An OT will also look at sensory, midline issues, self-regulation, motor planning, etc., all of which can affect their attention and how they function with their school work.

 

Did anyone give you the Barton screening yet?  http://bartonreading.com/students_long.html#screen   It's NOT a dyslexia test, but it is a test to see if they have the most basic level of working memory and phonological processing necesary even to start Barton.  If he doesn't pass that, that would be a huge red flag.  It's something any 5 yo should pass.

 

[PeterPan]

Well, he has always been my one to do it (whatever 'it' is) on his own time, when HE is ready! :) But that makes it hard sometimes to figure out if I need to wait, or give him a little push on whatever it is we might be working on.

 

When somebody says that, to me that's the phrase that tells you it's time to get evals.  I'm just saying, irrespective of precise problems, that's what a lot of moms will tell you is so different about their kids.  You can't put your finger on it, but it's just it has to be on his timetable, when he's ready.  

 

I waited until my dd was 10-12 for her evals.  That's a mistake I did NOT make with ds.  I had him eval'd at newly 6, but in his case he probably should have been eval'd much earlier, sigh.  Anyways, there's no need to wait.  Evals give you information to make informed choices and catch early things that get really sad when left till later.  Early is really where it's at.

 

So I don't know your whole situation, and there's probably a lot you're not telling us.  I'm just saying what you said is one of those little phrases, then when you add it to the other things tips it over for me.

 

[HomeAgain]

Thanks for this suggestion! We have AAS tiles already. Would you suggest something different? If so, could you give me a link? Thanks!

 

(To clarify: We haven't started AAS. I have the tiles for older DS)

 

AAS tiles work.  Heck, homemade tiles work.  They allow the student to manipulate the sound physically, which is what I like to have available.  You can also use non-magnetic ones (we had a set that had raised arrows for tracing while they say the sound) but magnets keep them all on one tray. :)  I draw a long arrow on the tray to act as a reading line.  When the sounds are on the line, we say them.  When they're not, we don't.  Between The Lions used to have a fun activity called Gawain's Word where two jousters with a sound each would hit each other and combine to make a new sound.  LOL  It's a lot of fun for little ones to gallop the sounds toward each other.  Or they can slide or swap or..you just want them to be comfortable with any sound combination.  Manipulatives help the brain slow down when it needs to. 

[Pen]

 

Thank you for the suggestions. Just to get an idea of what might be available, I emailed the Barton website to get a list of qualified providers. Not surprisingly, none are available in my state (neuro, edu psy). However, she listed two 'well-trained Dyslexia Consultants', stating that would be all I need since we homeschool. One is actually fairly close to me. Do you know if that would be sufficient? I'm assuming they're well-trained or they wouldn't be recommended by Ms. Barton ???

I'm starting to feel like if I could get him tested, and if he's not dyslexic, then I could just give him more time. Then start fresh with the above suggestions. But I'm terrified to give him more time, then start fresh, and after months of that realize something is definitely not right.

I've read that dyslexia is genetic. Does it matter that nobody else is our family has it? Or is that irrelevant?

Thank you ALL so much for your feedback on this thread. It is helping me so much.

 

 

It is hard to know anything long distance over internet, but in your position, I'd probably call the two options you have and choose whichever sounds better to you. (Maybe ask for local references?)

 

 

I totally agree with this: "I'm starting to feel like if I could get him tested, and if he's not dyslexic, then I could just give him more time. Then start fresh with the above suggestions. But I'm terrified to give him more time, then start fresh, and after months of that realize something is definitely not right."

 

I went with the give more time, wait and see, and wish I had not. If he is normal then giving more time and later starting fresh should be fine. But if he does have dyslexia, then working to remediate it early is easier / better in the long run than waiting --in my experience. Btw. my ds had both amblyopia (one eye that would wander outward from time to time) and dyslexia problems, more than one problem is possible. In our case, the visual problem was found and worked on first, but then he still could not get reading. In retrospect the signs of dyslexia were there early and separate from the vision issue. But when the vision issue was found, it was easy to then work on that thinking that as soon as it was resolved the reading issues would go away, but due to the dyslexia part of the problem, they did not.

 

 

"I've read that dyslexia is genetic. Does it matter that nobody else is our family has it? Or is that irrelevant?" If someone else had it, the chances would be higher that he does too. But no one else having it does not mean that he does not. I am not sure what the statistical numbers are, but you could compare to some cancers, say melanoma, where if a close family member has it, the percent chance that another will goes up a great deal. That said, if someone in a family with no melanoma history shows signs the right thing to do is get looked at right away, not to dismiss the possibility because no one else in the family has had it.

 

The other side of this is that you have an older child to compare to, and presumably can see that this one is different in some way.

[MistyMountain]

.

[Love_to_Read]

I think that "highly trained consultant" is probably someone capable of diagnosing dyslexia, such as a retired teacher who knows what to test and has worked with students with dyslexia extensively, but might not be acceptable to the school for getting an IEP for lack of a formal psych degree. Sounds like a reasonable (and probably cheaper) place to start as a homeschooling family.

 

Dancing Bears works for some students with dyslexia, so it's probably the best program you've mentioned so far, and probably wouldn't hurt to do consistently even if that isn't his issue.  Barton might be better, though. I haven't personally used both, but I'll bet there are parents on the learning challenges board who could compare them for you.

 

The types of errors you describe him making sound familiar to me as a parent of a child with mild dyslexia.  The inconsistency of recognizing the word in one sentence but not later on the same page/next page, the guessing by the first sound, the missing of the word with the addition of just one more letter (the plural s)...I can't say for sure whether that's always dyslexia, perhaps some kids might employ similar guessing strategies with visual or attention issues, but...if it quacks like a duck....I would definitely be looking into dyslexia.  As others have mentioned, it's possible (common even) for it to be a combination of issues...at least 40% of people with dyslexia are thought to also have ADHD according to one statistic.  A certain percentage have scotopic sensitivity (I think that's also known as Irlen syndrome) in which the letters are hard to see because of the glare from the white background.  And then there's all the visual quirks that a COVD doctor can test.  Mine came home from the COVD optometrist with far-sighted glasses AND eye exercises to do.  Those helped the poor kid be able to SEE the letters in our still-necessary phonics program.

 

As someone mentioned above, Barton discourages making your child read additional material until after he has completed a certain level of phonics. I will tell you from experience that trying to teach my child to STOP GUESSING has been one of the most frustrating aspects of our journey, and the habit was ingrained by years of reading via context clues before receiving dyslexia remediation to learn how to really look at all of the letters to actually sound it out.  I would stop using readers from other programs, or random books in general. Use audiobooks to keep your child on track for developing a love of literature, but making him try to read aloud outside a controlled phonics lesson is going to backfire with his current levels of inconsistency.

 

That said, we did find that Progressive Phonics worked for one of my children with vision problems. They're free online readers available in pdf, so you can enlarge them to gigantic proportions.  They are NOT a great dyslexia phonics program with solid explanations, so I would still hold off until your son gets to equivalent level in a more appropriate program...to where he CAN sound out words without balking...but if you really, really, really want him to "read more books," you might try these as another source of controlled phonics readers that *might* be clearer to him if part of his issues are visual. Just try to match them up with what he has learned via his main program, whether that ends up being Dancing Bears or Barton, etc.

[Love_to_Read]

I also meant to ask...how did your ds do with AAR's pre-level program?  Did he seem to be blending, segmenting, substituting sounds when asked to do so?  Was he actually able to play the phonemic awareness games well, or did you have to kind of drag him through that part...? Or did he mostly do the workbook pages without the spoken games? 

 

When you say that he hates sounding out words...if you play a guessing game in which you tell him 3 sounds (in order) that make up a CVC word, can he tell you the word? How about 4 sounds? (so, a word with a consonant blend where you can hear each consonant seperately)  How about just 2 sounds? (at, to, on, in, no, ma, pa, am) 
 

 

[mmasc]

I also meant to ask...how did your ds do with AAR's pre-level program? Did he seem to be blending, segmenting, substituting sounds when asked to do so? Was he actually able to play the phonemic awareness games well, or did you have to kind of drag him through that part...? Or did he mostly do the workbook pages without the spoken games?

 

When you say that he hates sounding out words...if you play a guessing game in which you tell him 3 sounds (in order) that make up a CVC word, can he tell you the word? How about 4 sounds? (so, a word with a consonant blend where you can hear each consonant seperately) How about just 2 sounds? (at, to, on, in, no, ma, pa, am)

 

 

 

He seemed to do well with AAR Pre-level. We played the games and did the sheets. The only reason we didn't move to AAR 1 was because he seemed tired of the cut-and-paste activities. I feel I should have continued though. :(

He can blend as you mentioned. If I say /c/ /a/ /t/ he can easily respond 'cat' for example. I would say any 2 or 3 letter word, probably even consonant blend 4 letter words. Now if we reversed that, and I asked him to break down a word into individual sounds, it probably wouldn't work. He also seems to have a hard time with rhyming. He does fairly well with clapping syllables (probably gets 8 out of 10).

Edit: typo

[Love_to_Read]

Ok, so he has some phonemic awareness (able to blend), but struggles with segmenting and rhyming (and possibly deletion and substitution, since those also require some segmenting).

 

AAS doesn't have the cut and paste of AAR, and that's where I discovered that my dd couldn't segment, despite having learned to read with the guessing you describe, so that's one possible program. That said, even though it did help us to get through that, there were stops and starts where I had to really stretch the lessons with my own ideas to get over particular difficulties.  Barton has been around longer and includes both the rules for spelling and the rules for reading, and has an entire tutor support website to address areas that might cause trouble for individual children.  I'd probably go with either Barton, possibly Dancing Bears...but again...you'd need to ask people who've actually used both for a comparison.  I know Barton works very hard on the phonemic awareness skills in the first level.

 

If you can afford to get it confirmed via testing, go for it.  That opens up to you things like Learning Ally for support, research, and sources of recorded literature, and testing accomodations down the road, and just the peace of mind of knowing that it's a real thing and not in your imagination, not your fault or his fault.  If you can't, or if it's going to take a while to save up or to get an appointment, I'd probably go ahead with treating it as such in the meanwhile...research dyslexia over on www.dys-add.com , choose a curriculum for it, etc.  It won't hurt a neurotypical kid to go through Barton, other than wanting to do the lessons as fast as the child absorbs the material, to stave off boredom. (And the resale value is high, so you can get most of your money back when you're done.)  But it will slow down a dyslexic child to spend even more time fooling around with miscellaneous phonics programs waiting to see whether it's a real disability or just maturity.  I'm also a member of the "wish I hadn't waited" club, still sloughing through remediation in middle school because we didn't figure out that it was dyslexia until a few years ago. We have some great compensation strategies to make sure that we're still doing middle school work in everything but phonics, but the closer we get to the workload of high school, the more I wish we'd done this during the earlier years of elementary when there's simply more time available.

 

[mmasc]

Thank you so much for your insights, LovetoRead. We have AAS and I was planning to start that along with Dancing Bears. I'm glad to see that it did help you recognize some things with your dd.

I have no idea what the cost may be with a Dyslexia Specialist. But as you said, I believe it would be a more affordable and reasonable place to start.

Thank you so much for taking the time to help. I have a lot to think about!

[ktgrok]

Another aspect of this, is there are more issues than dyslexia out there. my son is not dyslexic, but had a horrid time learning to read. We later did neuropsych testing and learned he has a working memory problem, and processing speed issues. So if dyslexia isn't the problem, but he's not progressing, check into other things.