MamaSprout Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Looking ahead a year or so in our math/ science sequence, I'm considering skipping Earth Science. Looking at what we are already doing (4H Geology with a rock hounds club) and what we can easily squeeze in elsewhere (space seems to show up in several Physical Science books), I think we would only miss weather, which would be easy to cover with living books and BrainPop. If we don't need it as a place holder before higher math (we don't) do you think we can skip doing a whole year of earth science? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 No, you don't need to spend a year on Earth science. But there are a lot of fun and interesting topics that explain how the world works and that should be common knowledge - so I would make sure to cover the basics. I always find it sad when I ask my college students (all science majors) how many have heard about Kepler's laws of planetary motion before, and not even 25% raise their hands. Since it is usually not part of the typical high school science sequence, it is easier to fit the material in before high school. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcadia Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 From what is listed in the next gen science standards, you can easily cover the material with books and NOVA, BBC, National Geographic videos. Earth science is under physical science here as a subsection if I remember my state's standard's correctly. "Students in middle school develop understanding of a wide range of topics in Earth and space science (ESS) that build upon science concepts from elementary school through more advanced content, practice, and crosscutting themes. There are six ESS standard topics in middle school: Space Systems, History of Earth, Earth’s Interior Systems, Earth’s Surface Systems, Weather and Climate, and Human Impacts." (pdf link with details) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbmamaz Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I was an engineering major in college. I never took earth science past elementary school. I took 2 years of chemistry in high school. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted January 10, 2014 Author Share Posted January 10, 2014 No, you don't need to spend a year on Earth science. But there are a lot of fun and interesting topics that explain how the world works and that should be common knowledge - so I would make sure to cover the basics. I always find it sad when I ask my college students (all science majors) how many have heard about Kepler's laws of planetary motion before, and not even 25% raise their hands. Since it is usually not part of the typical high school science sequence, it is easier to fit the material in before high school. That seems more advanced than what I'm seeing in middle school earth science textbooks (I haven't looked through many, though) Where would this sort of thing be taught? What I'm seeing is a lot of re-run of material dd covered in elementary science in earth science, nothing involving any math. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 We are not going to spend a whole year on any field of science during middle school. Typically, we are running two science threads at once- a primary and a secondary. Maybe earth science topics could be a running, low-key secondary thread for your middle years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 That seems more advanced than what I'm seeing in middle school earth science textbooks (I haven't looked through many, though) Where would this sort of thing be taught? What I'm seeing is a lot of re-run of material dd covered in elementary science in earth science, nothing involving any math. I don't know when something "would" be taught, and I have not seen a single middle school science text that I liked. With my kids, I covered Kepler in 6th grade, when we studied the Renaissance and the development of a heliocentric world view. I am not talking about math. I am talking about a student knowing that 1. the planets move in elliptical obits around the sun 2. the planet moves slower when it is further away from the sun and faster when it is closer (showing that the line from sun to planet covers equal areas in equal times can be done via a graphical illustration) 3. if a satellite is moving in a circle around the earth, the time it takes to go around once depends only on how far away it is. So all telecommuncations satellites that you want to orbit the earth once in a day are moving in exactly the same orbit, and it gets pretty crowded there. There is nothing here that a 5th grader could not understand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiku Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 My kids learned about Kepler's laws this year from Holt Science and Technology Short Course: Astronomy. They are in 5th and 6th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jar7709 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I am biased. I'm in the earth sciences and have taught community college intro geology. We live in a geologically-active region, and I find it sad, sad, sad how little most high school graduates know about earth science. So while I'd never say it's something you absolutely must not skip, skipping it isn't something I'd encourage, either. :) I will say that important earth science topics are often not too hard to pick up in an informal way alongside of formal studies of other things, if you need to focus time on something else, imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TarynB Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 My kids learned about Kepler's laws this year from Holt Science and Technology Short Course: Astronomy. They are in 5th and 6th. My kid learned about them this year also, from CPO Earth science. I just asked him if he remembered what Kepler's laws were about and he rattled off the three things Regentrude listed above. And he was excited to see Kepler mentioned in WWS1 as well. Love those connections. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted January 11, 2014 Author Share Posted January 11, 2014 So what would be a "strong" science sequence for a science and math loving kid for middle school? Dd has requested (insisted?) we do a year of life science next year (roughly 5th grade). We always have a bunny trail component for science, but I'd like to "pencil in" our spines for 6th and 7th grade. If we want to leave open the possibility of doing the "regentrude" sequence in high school (conceptual physics, then chem, bio, physics with college texts), how do we get there from 5th grade? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 So what would be a "strong" science sequence for a science and math loving kid for middle school? Dd has requested (insisted?) we do a year of life science next year (roughly 5th grade). We always have a bunny trail component for science, but I'd like to "pencil in" our spines for 6th and 7th grade. I don't believe in a science "sequence" and the concept of one science per year. Cover whatever your DD is interested in, until she no longer is ;-) For the future high school science progression, it does not matter at all what you did for science in middle school; math is the factor that determines what is possible for high school. In the middle grades, I aim to create a broad knowledge base in science and use mainly library books and documentaries according to my students' interest. Some textbooks I found useful for my kids in the middle grades were Conceptual physical science by Hewitt and Suchocki; Conceptual Physics by Hewitt, Earth Science by Tarbuck, and the easier biology texts by Campbell. We did not cover any of these in their entirety, but only used portions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted January 11, 2014 Author Share Posted January 11, 2014 I don't believe in a science "sequence" and the concept of one science per year. Cover whatever your DD is interested in, until she no longer is ;-) For the future high school science progression, it does not matter at all what you did for science in middle school; math is the factor that determines what is possible for high school. In the middle grades, I aim to create a broad knowledge base in science and use mainly library books and documentaries according to my students' interest. Some textbooks I found useful for my kids in the middle grades were Conceptual physical science by Hewitt and Suchocki; Conceptual Physics by Hewitt, Earth Science by Tarbuck, and the easier biology texts by Campbell. We did not cover any of these in their entirety, but only used portions. Ack! I hope I didn't misrepresent you! Thanks for the insight. She's a great one for picking up big fat science books I leave on the couch, I probably need to add to our pile. She has read most of Kingfisher Science Encyclopedia (and Popular Mechanics and Jay Hosler books and whatever else she can find. She hasn't warmed up to Horrible Science, but likes Horrible Maths) She's watched pretty much everything NOVA, Science Friday, BrainPop and all of the science documentaries in the Children's and YA sections of the large city library system we use. I'm sure someone on here has put together a list of documentaries... I'll search. I'm not sure why she's so insistent on the life science this year. Labs, maybe? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmrich Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 We are enjoying it this year. It has been full of fantastic labs; my students are learning how to write a proper lab report. However it could be skipped if you need to move forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walking-Iris Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 I've been pondering this lately. My oldest knows the basics and I feel doing an Earth science with him may be a bit much. I may go ahead and do Earth science with my younger ds and let my oldest tag along anywhere he's interested (labs and projects, watching documentaries etc.). My oldest has always been interested in geography, and we've mostly only done cultural geo. But he's shown an interest in time zones, cartography, climate, etc. I really think I may just do a physical geography with him instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKS Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Both of my parents are geologists. I think earth science is important. Apparently however, most people, including colleges, don't think it is important. I say that if you want your kids to be educated human beings, you want to be sure they have a healthy dose of earth science. If you just want them to get into a good college, you can skip it altogether. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted January 11, 2014 Author Share Posted January 11, 2014 Both of my parents are geologists. I think earth science is important. Apparently however, most people, including colleges, don't think it is important. I say that if you want your kids to be educated human beings, you want to be sure they have a healthy dose of earth science. If you just want them to get into a good college, you can skip it altogether. Wait! I didn't mean not do any Earth Science. I just don't want to set myself up for a year of stuff we are most covering elsewhere. Please read my first post. We are doing earth science, it's just that lines are kinda fuzzy between courses and I don't want to leave holes. Or end up with a year planned, and find we've already covered the material. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrysalis Academy Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 I think earth science is important, but I also think the topics can be incorporated into other science topics, you don't necessarily need a year dedicated to it exclusively. I'm actually a huge fan of the integrated sciences approach articulated by people like Hazen & Trefil. Earth Science is relevant and can be connected to many other topics. Studying Astronomy? Well, formation of the solar system & planets (including earth) is included there. Studying origins of life in biology? Yep, Earth Systems Science is crucial to this too. If you're going to cover evolution, you will cover plate tectonics and major events in the earth's history. Studying Enviro Science? Yep, you're going to need to cover a lot of earth science to do that properly. Physics? Lots of air, atmosphere, weather stuff can be folded in there. Interested in studying climate science and the evidence for claims about climate change? Better understand your earth science! So yes, study it. But no, you don't have to dedicate a year to it exclusively. Down with artificial barriers between science topics! Right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKS Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Wait! I didn't mean not do any Earth Science. I just don't want to set myself up for a year of stuff we are most covering elsewhere. Please read my first post. We are doing earth science, it's just that lines are kinda fuzzy between courses and I don't want to leave holes. Or end up with a year planned, and find we've already covered the material. I guess I meant at a higher level than you'll find in elementary/middle school texts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share Posted January 15, 2014 I don't believe in a science "sequence" and the concept of one science per year. Cover whatever your DD is interested in, until she no longer is ;-) For the future high school science progression, it does not matter at all what you did for science in middle school; math is the factor that determines what is possible for high school. In the middle grades, I aim to create a broad knowledge base in science and use mainly library books and documentaries according to my students' interest. Some textbooks I found useful for my kids in the middle grades were Conceptual physical science by Hewitt and Suchocki; Conceptual Physics by Hewitt, Earth Science by Tarbuck, and the easier biology texts by Campbell. We did not cover any of these in their entirety, but only used portions. I just made it to the "big" library to take a look at the books suggested- they are really great. The easier versions are (surprising to me) smaller than the "middle school" textbooks local districts use. Thanks! ETA: I would be grateful for any "Marine Biology" resource suggestions. We have the "coloring book" but that's about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcadia Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 ETA: I would be grateful for any "Marine Biology" resource suggestions. We have the "coloring book" but that's about it. This thread http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/183971-marine-biology-resource/ I ended up borrowing the Castro book from the library and it is comfortable for a middle schooler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Marple Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Back in the day when my boys were young :) we didn't do "Earth Science" but we did use Runkle's World Physical Geography. It incorporates a lot of earth science and gets geography done as well. For me it was win-win :) We did this in 6th/7th grade. My boys and I found geology quite interesting. My oldest even contemplated changing his major from Petroleum Engineering to geology at one point in his college career because he found the subject fascinating as well. IMO, science done before high school should be interesting and as much hands on as possible. So don't bog down in doing a year of this or that. Do units, find a program that integrates it with other sciences...enjoy science. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbmamaz Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Earth science, have you checked out Nat Geo / Jason project (or whatever its called now?) I have to admit, I always loved science, but geology didnt feel like science to me, and I found geologists boring compared to other sciences! I mean, i'm glad they are out there, tho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share Posted January 15, 2014 This thread http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/183971-marine-biology-resource/ I ended up borrowing the Castro book from the library and it is comfortable for a middle schooler. Thank you- I knew this existed, but I kept getting military threads "Marines" when I tried to find it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share Posted January 15, 2014 Earth science, have you checked out Nat Geo / Jason project (or whatever its called now?) Parts of Jason are accessible through BrainPop, and we've done those. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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