Spin-off: Early Marriage or Not?

[DB in NJ]

That's actually not true. Even Christ said sexual immorality was just cause for a divorce.

 

 

 

Yes, I know that. But that is the exception, not the rule. And sexual immorality shouldn't mean an automatic trip to the lawyer's office. It's better to stay and try to work things out.

 

Obviously, and I would think this goes without saying, not every situation is the same. There are going to be circumstances where the staying is a very bad idea, but again, that should be the exception.

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

What I'm wondering is how young people who haven't finished school, or have jobs that can support them, expect to live? I am of the opinion that once you marry and leave home you are considered responsible adults and should be that. I don't believe in forcing anyone to finish college, but I do think there should be a source of income, and that newly marrieds should not expect to sponge off parents or go on welfare. JMO

 

 

That said, I married at 17, but dh was 24 and could support both of us.

[Jennay]

Thanks to everyone for their thoughts and opinions. I do think a key to an early marriage thriving is support of the parents. And that means more than just approval. It means active support - watching any kids when needed, possibly helping out finacially if possible, etc. I think it would be really hard for a couple trying to finsh college with kids if all their family lived halfway across the country!

 

I'm 35 and my youngest is only 9 months. Assuming I homeschool her until ages 18 (and we don't have any more dc) my "job" won't be done until I'm 53. I've had thoughts of what I might do after I'm finished homeschooling. Now I realize that if I actually encourage my kids to think of getting married young (if they meet the right perosn of course) that it will probably take a sacrifice of mine to make it successful. I'm okay with that. If my dc meet their future mate young, I don't want them to struggle spirtually and physically with abstinance while waiting for the "right" time.

[DB in NJ]

I'm not sure statistics are a terribly meaningful. Statistics on a topic likes this would have to be compiled from surveys, which are just opinions after all. What sort of statistics are you after? Or is your issue the mention of Christianity? Would you feel better if we said "The opinion and practice of the 'Divorce is not an option' view of marriage has led many people to remain in hurful, difficult and damaging relationships that they might otherwise have left." I have not met any non-religious people with such a strong disbelief in divorce, so while I did not write the original statement, I am left believing that it is indeed a conservative religous point of view. Since Christianity is the dominant religion in America, it seems likely it would be conservative Christianity. I don't think where the idea came from is really the important part of the message.

Rosie

 

My "issue" is that if someone is going to enter into an argument with someone else and attempt to convnce me of something, they need to back it up with proof. Otherwise, it's just an opinion. Opinions are subjective.

 

As for people staying in hurtful, difficult, and damaging relationships that they might otherwise have left, I believe in restoration. If there is sexual sin, abuse, incompatibility, etc., it shouldn't mean an automatic "out." It means it's time to get to work.

 

God instituted marriage; Jesus spoke of it, and he spoke against divorce (although there is an exception for sexual immorality).

[Rhonda in TX]

My parents would have supported the same decision and told all of us so. They said they would continue to pay our college costs, whether we were married or not. As my dad said (quoting Paul), "It is better to marry than to burn." ;)

[HSMom2One]

Thanks to everyone for their thoughts and opinions. I do think a key to an early marriage thriving is support of the parents. And that means more than just approval. It means active support - watching any kids when needed, possibly helping out finacially if possible, etc. I think it would be really hard for a couple trying to finsh college with kids if all their family lived halfway across the country!

 

I'm 35 and my youngest is only 9 months. Assuming I homeschool her until ages 18 (and we don't have any more dc) my "job" won't be done until I'm 53. I've had thoughts of what I might do after I'm finished homeschooling. Now I realize that if I actually encourage my kids to think of getting married young (if they meet the right perosn of course) that it will probably take a sacrifice of mine to make it successful. I'm okay with that. If my dc meet their future mate young, I don't want them to struggle spirtually and physically with abstinance while waiting for the "right" time.

 

I agree with this up to a point. I don't think parents should go too far with this. Marriage is for mature people and should be planned out carefully by both parties without too much input from parents. That's the purpose of marriage isn't it? Starting your own life together, leaving parents and having a family of your own? The saying is often true that "Two heads are better than one". Couples should figure out how to manage their finances, jobs, management of children, etc. together. It's been done very well by couples even in college without Mom & Dad's help. Oh, I don't mean Grandma and Grandpa shouldn't help with childcare and advice when it's asked for, etc. Family support is a wonderful gift. As hard as it is though, it is a parent's job to LET GO. No one ever told me this so I wasn't prepared with ds #1 grew up. It is painful, but it is our job. Help and support, yes, but we need to respect boundaries.

 

Even when our kids get married young, we as parents enter a new season of our lives that is rich and rewarding. I had a taste of it for a couple of years before dd age 9 entered the family and it wasn't too bad, I'm telling you! It just takes a little getting used to.

 

Blessings,

Lucinda

[HSMom2One]

As for people staying in hurtful, difficult, and damaging relationships that they might otherwise have left, I believe in restoration. If there is sexual sin, abuse, incompatibility, etc., it shouldn't mean an automatic "out." It means it's time to get to work.

 

God instituted marriage; Jesus spoke of it, and he spoke against divorce (although there is an exception for sexual immorality).

 

Pardon the highjack, but I would like to comment on this because it can be closely related to the issue of young people getting married.

 

I agree with the above quote, and it is possible! In rare cases if restoration is just not going to happen, the abused partner must remove themselves and the children from the situation without feeling shame. Family, church and support network need to wrap their arms around these people in either case.

 

Jesus was not in favor of divorce, but He had a bigger issue with remarriage. (He was also filled with love, compassion and grace toward the woman at the well who had been married, divorced and remarried many times.)

 

Blessings,

Lucinda

[Scarlett]

I don't think that waiting until you are older is the answer to the problems of marriage. I think the answers are that the 2 people have the same basic beliefs in terms of religion, approach to marriage, and common goals in life. I think it is essential to respect one another and to expect to work together. I also think that being best friends is so important- if you turn to someone other than your spouse with your problems, then you are setting yourself up for problems. I think that ultimately a commitment to marriage for the long haul is good. Obviously if there is abuse then divorce is warranted, but "incompatibility" doesn't even make sense to me (sorry- if you love the person enough to marry them, then there is something there that is compatible).

Furthermore, studies have shown that people who live together before marriage are twice as likely to divorce as those who do not.

 

Well said. I think there are a couple of BIG things that a couple should agree on before considering marriage. Religion, Children, and Money spring to mind, but there might be a few more. People often don't talk enough before getting emotions and hormones so involved that a rational decision is impossible.

[Scarlett]

Dh & I were married the summer after our sophomore year of college. Dh worked full-time & I worked part-time until we both finished college, then we both got full-time jobs.

 

We have struggled financially for our entire married life, and that stress has been tremendous. I think that our financial situation would have been much better if we had waited to get married until after college & becoming established in our jobs.

 

Dh was (is) definitely the right person for me, but our timing was probably *wrong*. I do not want my dc to struggle as dh & I have struggled. I think that both partners should be financially stable before marriage.

 

Was it really being married that caused you to struggle financially? Or did you have children early too..? I'm curious, because it seems to me you would have college costs (maybe debt too) whether you were married or not. I"m not trying to be argumentative...just want to understand as I think this issue through.

[Gretchen in NJ]

Would it be better to struggle together or struggle apart?

[Joanne]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DB in NJ

Why on earth would you find that insulting? Don't you get it that there are EXCEPTIONS to every rule? In no way was it put that *EVERY* older couple is creaky, impatient, and less than able.

 

I have to say that I totally agree here. There is an exception to every rule, but that doesn't mean that they rule should not exist.

 

I'm comletely *baffled* by these responses. I commented on the author's paragraph in which he makes a charicature of middle aged parents. The paragraph was full of (inaccurate) generalizations, assumption and opinion. There was no fact, no "rule", no absolutes. I called into question that paragraph as defense for his persepctive on early marriage (which I am not opposed to). :confused::confused:

 

Before we got married, dh and I both felt very strongly that divorce was not an option. And thank God we did! All too often - NOT EVERY TIME - it's an out for one person and nightmare for everyone else. But we've had that conversation already.

 

This is your own personal experience, much like my own personal experience that you feel is not valid enough without statistics. I'm thrilled for *every* thriving marriage, including yours.

 

The idea that "it's an out for one person" and a nightmare for everyone else is *also* opinion, not statistics. My own experience shows otherwise - that there exists a myth of the superficial divorce prevelence. My actual experience with now dozens of divorced people has revealed several very enlightening things, one of which is that it's rare for people around divorcing couples to be privy to "the whole story". As "common" as it it, divorce still carries a large stigma and most people are reticent about details.

 

"Divorce is not an option" is NOT a dangerous message. It's a biblical one. I know, you're going to talk about abuse and other awful things that can happen in a marriage where a person who has been abused lacks the strength to go against that advice and leave her husband. Again, there's the exception and the rule.

 

IMO and in my own research, the "God hates divorce" scripture is Truth as is all other scripture. But I believe it more accurately means "God hates a marriage that makes divorce necessary". Marriages that end in divorce are rarely the intimate, loving, healthy, spiritual, *Godly* marriage that is, IMO, the union of God's design.

 

 

 

I think your words are rational and make perfect sense. Personally, I think commitment, respect, loyalty, hard work and shared life experience are what make a successful relationship, marriage or no. Married people haven't cornered the market on these qualities.

 

Absolutely! I'm all for the official documentation and legal protection provided by an official marriage, but, in the end, a piece of paper is not a marriage.

 

I am saddened by the common-ness of divorce, but I think that has as much to do with our culture's promotion of immaturity as anything. It think it is painful and unhelpful to see divorce as merely a moral issue. It is so much more.

 

I'm, daily, deeply saddened by the rate of divorce and the misery it represents for adult and kids. I think it's terribly trite and insulting to make generalizations regarding the reasons behind the rate of divorce. It's a complicated issue.

 

Originally Posted by DB in NJ

Joanne said, "In application, "Divorce is not an option" has been a hurtful, difficult, and damaging idea from the conservative Christian community." This is stated as though it were a fact. I'd like to see the statistics that prove this as fact. If there is a scientific study out there that backs this up, great. If not, isn't this really just opinion?

 

Your posts in this thread on this rabbit trail have been equally opinion.

 

I have participated in a divorce class of 45+ people. I should add it was Christian based (Baptist church, but interdenominational), Christian Counselling, and participated on 2 Christian boards for families and parenting. I have also sponsored many women in recovery from addiction, widening my exposure to life experience and situations.

 

My observation - and personal experience - is that many, many men and women have been hurt by how a segment of the conservative Christian community percieves divorce and God's word. People representing that thought often elavate a paper marriage to an absurd degree, fail to admit that there are legal issues in present culture necessitating legal counsel (sometimes even when reconciliation is intended). More damaging, however, is the fact that the same crowd does *not* put the same amount of energy and focus on cultivating thriving, abundant, marriages. Often, when the "God hates divorce" and "Divorce is not an option" gets verbalized, the irony is that the marriage in jeopardy has not been a Godly, Biblical marriage for a long time.

 

I have personally met, talked to, and held many women who have felt trapped, abandoned, and powerless because of their understanding of "God hates divorce" which has been offered to them by their Christian brothers and sisters.( I am imagine there is a number of men who feel similarly, but it would not be appropriate for me to be in intimate friendship with them!).

 

"Don't get a divorce", "don't get an attorney", "work it out", "divorce is not an option" has caused great misery - for people who are already broken, hurting and miserable.

 

Ironically, I think one of the things that would *help* avoid marriages that make divorce necessary are in the OP's linked article. Community and family loving support *of an abundant marriage* (rather than to avoid divorce).

 

I'm not pro-divorce. I'm pro-healthy marriage and all the factors that make that happen.

 

 

 

 

My husband and I had a lot of problems in the first 4 years of our marriage and the only thing that prevented us from getting a divorce was that neither one of us could afford to leave We both threatened to divorce the other plenty of times. It wasn't until we became christians and we both decided that divorce simply wasn't an option that we made true progress in dealing with the problems in our marriage and we will be married 20 years next year and I wouldn't change a thing.

 

I was in a marriage in which my xh threatened divorce fairly often.

 

In this marriage, we have an agreement to not do that.

 

I'm glad you matured and moved past that and are celebrating 20 years in a marriage you would not change. The ramifications of the "leave" or "divorce" threat in a marriage are awful, as you know.

 

As for people staying in hurtful, difficult, and damaging relationships that they might otherwise have left, I believe in restoration. If there is sexual sin, abuse, incompatibility, etc., it shouldn't mean an automatic "out." It means it's time to get to work.

 

IME, the actual rate of restoratoin for sexual sin, abuse, and (less so) damaging relationships is very, very low. The above quote represents, in part, the thinking that *both* people have to be somehow involved in the deterioration of a marriage; that is not true for people involved with heavily unhealthy people.

 

I've seen (and been) women who wait *years* working towards the elusive "restoration", representing for their kids a miserable example of marriage (and one that is not Godly, in spite of the piece of paper).

 

 

 

God instituted marriage; Jesus spoke of it, and he spoke against divorce (although there is an exception for sexual immorality).

 

Again, of course God speaks against divorce. It's a horrible, awful thing for everyone when a marriage fails to that point. I hate it, too.

[Joanne]

Would it be better to struggle together or struggle apart?

 

That is situation specific.

[Scarlett]

My "issue" is that if someone is going to enter into an argument with someone else and attempt to convnce me of something, they need to back it up with proof. Otherwise, it's just an opinion. Opinions are subjective.

 

As for people staying in hurtful, difficult, and damaging relationships that they might otherwise have left, I believe in restoration. If there is sexual sin, abuse, incompatibility, etc., it shouldn't mean an automatic "out." It means it's time to get to work.

 

God instituted marriage; Jesus spoke of it, and he spoke against divorce (although there is an exception for sexual immorality).

 

I agree many many marriages that fail could have been saved. When we have intimate knowledge of a couple (like my brother and SIL) and their problems, it is easy to say, 'ok, if she had done this, and if he had not done this' they could have saved their marriage. However, you must realize that there are terrible things that go on in a marriage that outsiders are often not privy to. Sometimes one spouse can destroy a marriage and NOTHING the other one does can save it. That wounded/innocent spouse may be a private person and not want the world to know, but SHE/HE knows and God knows.

 

And if you are the wounded spouse, you might get a little irritated at people saying, 'it is just time to get to work!' when that spouse HAS worked VERY hard for many years to save a marriage that can't be saved. And I think what Joanne meant about 'Divorce is not an option' being damaging, is that a person who takes that to heart might find herself/himself continuing to live in unbearable conditions. That is dangerous. Because a person can be destroyed physically and or emotionally after many many years of unbearable conditions.

 

Jesus spoke of not remarrying if you divorce (except on the grounds of adultery). So clearly there could be situations where people could not live together anymore. Not living together anymore and/or a legal divorce are not alone scriptural grounds for remarriage.

[DB in NJ]

I agree many many marriages that fail could have been saved. When we have intimate knowledge of a couple (like my brother and SIL) and their problems, it is easy to say, 'ok, if she had done this, and if he had not done this' they could have saved their marriage. However, you must realize that there are terrible things that go on in a marriage that outsiders are often not privy to. Sometimes one spouse can destroy a marriage and NOTHING the other one does can save it. That wounded/innocent spouse may be a private person and not want the world to know, but SHE/HE knows and God knows.

 

And if you are the wounded spouse, you might get a little irritated at people saying, 'it is just time to get to work!' when that spouse HAS worked VERY hard for many years to save a marriage that can't be saved. And I think what Joanne meant about 'Divorce is not an option' being damaging, is that a person who takes that to heart might find herself/himself continuing to live in unbearable conditions. That is dangerous. Because a person can be destroyed physically and or emotionally after many many years of unbearable conditions.

 

Jesus spoke of not remarrying if you divorce (except on the grounds of adultery). So clearly there could be situations where people could not live together anymore. Not living together anymore and/or a legal divorce are not alone scriptural grounds for remarriage.

 

 

I absolutely agree with you! I have readily acknowledged that there are extreme situations where allowances should be made.

 

What I take issue with is when the problems in the marriage are NOT extreme; where one person decides they just can't do it anymore, etc. and so they divorce. I find it selfish.

[Scarlett]

I absolutely agree with you! I have readily acknowledged that there are extreme situations where allowances should be made.

 

What I take issue with is when the problems in the marriage are NOT extreme; where one person decides they just can't do it anymore, etc. and so they divorce. I find it selfish.

 

I have to remind myself sometimes how little we probably know about what goes on in a marriage.

[Caroline]

I have to remind myself sometimes how littel we probably know about what goes on in a marriage.

 

I think that is a very wise thought. Thank you for saying that.

[DB in NJ]

I have to remind myself sometimes how little we probably know about what goes on in a marriage.

 

Of course. That goes without saying.

 

I have a friend who was constantly crying on people's shoulders about how verbally abusive her dh was. She would call everybody and anybody, trying to get the pastor or the deacons or ANYBODY to give him what for and set him straight.

 

It was amazing how her tune changed once we were all in the same room to discuss it.

 

As I've said before, there aren't just two sides to the story when it comes to divorce (or any family issues). There are just as many sides as there are people in that family - mom, dad, and the kids.

[Gretchen in NJ]

Would it be better to struggle together or struggle apart?

 

That is situation specific.

 

I think that is what I said here:

I have to say that I totally agree here. There is an exception to every rule, but that doesn't mean that they rule should not exist.

[Greta]

Why on earth would you find that insulting? Don't you get it that there are EXCEPTIONS to every rule? In no way was it put that *EVERY* older couple is creaky, impatient, and less than able.

 

Maybe the author didn't state that EVERY older parent was that way, but she did clearly characterize older parents as generally being that way, and that is insulting. Describing people in their FORTIES as being "weary", "creaky-in-the-joints" and eager to drug their children is both insulting and ridiculous.

 

The author might have some good points about defending/encouraging younger parenting, but I don't think the advantages of older parenting should be dismissed so easily. Among my circle of friends, the ones that I believe to be the best parents, the ones I really look up to and try to emulate, ALL waited until their thirties or even forties to have children. I don't think that the wisdom, patience, and experience that comes with age should be brushed off without a thought.

 

Please know that I am not saying that I believe having children in your twenties is bad. That's what I did, and I believe it was the right choice for me (and probably is for many others as well!). I'm just saying I don't think that parents who opted to wait until they were older are even half as bad as this author is claiming.

[Joanne]

I absolutely agree with you! I have readily acknowledged that there are extreme situations where allowances should be made.

 

What I take issue with is when the problems in the marriage are NOT extreme; where one person decides they just can't do it anymore, etc. and so they divorce. I find it selfish.

 

This may well explain - at least in part - our widely differing perspectives on this issue.

 

I do not believe that (moderate to severe) dysfunction, abuse, infidelity/sexual sin are helpfully classified as rare extremes.

 

I used to believe that there were many more what I call "superficial" divorces, selfish divorces and easily made decisions to divorce; coupled with a reluctance to stay the course and make the marriage thrive. I no longer believe in the same numbers of divorce falling under this category. Of the people I *know* who have divorced, NONE fall under this category. All of them hurt in the marriage, in trying to work on the marriage, in the process of divorce and often after.

[Scarlett]

Barely 18. Dh barely 19. I think it was too young. I think even 2 more years for me would have made all the difference. However, I don't mean 2 more years of dating dh. I mean 2 more years before STARTING to date anyone. I would have not chosen my dh to be my dh if I had met him when I was 20 instead of 15 in 5th period gym. It wasn't the struggles we had of being broke or any of that. It was that we didn't clearly think through the kind of mate we both wanted. However, even as we are a case study of why people should not marry too young, we are also a case study of how mismatched people can stay married and be relatively happy. We have chosen to focus on what brings us together instead of what divides us.

 

I think girls can often be good wives by the time they are 20 or so. Men....not so much. I think most men aren't mature enough marriage until they are 25. Clearly, this is JMO, and entirely up to individuals.

 

I think 25-27 is a perfect age to start having children for women. And 27-30 for men. All JMO of course...based upon my observations of 43 years of living.

 

I do think that the lack of support we had from dh's family contributed to a lot of our struggles in the early years. They wouldn't come to the wedding. MIL screamed at me over the phone horrible things like I was trying to better myself by marrying into their family and that we would be divorced in 6 months and I was probably pregnant trying to trap him and she 'heard' around town that I was a immoral person (she used a vulgar word). She tugged so hard at dh for so many years that I really feel/felt sorry for him. She even promised him a down payment on a new house if he would leave me. That all makes me very sad. Even if she thought all of that, she could have kept her mouth shut to EVERYONE especially dh and prevented a lot of hurt.

 

So yes, I think family support is important. I don't think young couples should expect financial support, but I would have NO issue with continuing to pay for ds's college if he wanted to marry before he finished. If we can afford it, what would be the point of refusing? In my in-laws case they thought they would keep dh from marrying me. So guess what he did? He dropped out, got a job and married me. He didn't go back to college and get his degree until he was 33.

 

I think helping and supporting your kids-married or not is a fine line to walk to keep from overstepping your bounds. I am taking notes on how to be a good MIL. :)

[DB in NJ]

This may well explain - at least in part - our widely differing perspectives on this issue.

 

I do not believe that (moderate to severe) dysfunction, abuse, infidelity/sexual sin are helpfully classified as rare extremes.

 

I used to believe that there were many more what I call "superficial" divorces, selfish divorces and easily made decisions to divorce; coupled with a reluctance to stay the course and make the marriage thrive. I no longer believe in the same numbers of divorce falling under this category. Of the people I *know* who have divorced, NONE fall under this category. All of them hurt in the marriage, in trying to work on the marriage, in the process of divorce and often after.

 

 

The way I see it is this: when one spouse cheats on another spouse, there is a sin issue that must be addressed. I would be more concerned with the sin in my husband's life than I would be about how it effects me. He is the one out of fellowship with the Lord, and that, in my mind, trumps any hurt feelings I may have. I would look at him as a fellow brother-in-Christ, not as a man who has hurt me. Of course I would have trust issues with him, but my MAIN concern would be for him to get the victory over the sin and restore fellowship with both God and me.

[Joanne]

The way I see it is this: when one spouse cheats on another spouse, there is a sin issue that must be addressed. I would be more concerned with the sin in my husband's life than I would be about how it effects me. He is the one out of fellowship with the Lord, and that, in my mind, trumps any hurt feelings I may have. I would look at him as a fellow brother-in-Christ, not as a man who has hurt me. Of course I would have trust issues with him, but my MAIN concern would be for him to get the victory over the sin and restore fellowship with both God and me.

 

This is a perspective I can't comment on.

 

Although I've been a cheated on spouse, and I do have considerable experience with trying to make a marriage work (including Christian resources), the above dynamic is not something I could embrace.

 

Edited to add: I do not believe that adultery/porn addiction is an "automatic divorce" by the way. I think it can be a *consideration* for one, but I would not automatically divorce over adultery or other sexual sin. It would be, to use my own jaded term, situation specific.

[Scarlett]

the above dynamic is not something I could embrace.

 

Me either. If dh cheats on me, my first thought will not be 'how can I help restore you to Christ.' Maybe I'm selfish? :confused:

[ereks mom]

Was it really being married that caused you to struggle financially? Or did you have children early too..? I'm curious, because it seems to me you would have college costs (maybe debt too) whether you were married or not. I"m not trying to be argumentative...just want to understand as I think this issue through.

 

It wasn't college costs either, because we both had a lot of financial aid and no student loans. I think that the real problem was that we were too young and inexperienced in managing money. We spent unwisely because we just didn't know what we were doing. Each of us had lived at home with our parents, then went to college and lived in the dorm, but neither of us had ever had to budget or manage a household.

[Joanne]

Me either. If dh cheats on me, my first thought will not be 'how can I help restore you to Christ.' Maybe I'm selfish?

 

For *me*, this perspective would be too co-dependent. I come from many years of recovery from addiction and activity in that community. "Helping" a spouse to improve is often not a good idea; so my framework is biased, perhaps.

 

To *me*, it would be too much like being my spouse's Holy Spirit. ;) And he has a better one than me, should he choose to listen. :D

[DB in NJ]

For *me*, this perspective would be too co-dependent. I come from many years of recovery from addiction and activity in that community. "Helping" a spouse to improve is often not a good idea; so my framework is biased, perhaps.

 

To *me*, it would be too much like being my spouse's Holy Spirit. ;) And he has a better one than me, should he choose to listen. :D

 

HUH????? How is it not a good idea to help your husband when he has sin in his life??? If it were a friend, would you not help? Good grief.

 

I completely disagree that it's like being a spouse's Holy Spirit. It's being a good friend and a sister in Christ.

[HSMom2One]

The way I see it is this: when one spouse cheats on another spouse, there is a sin issue that must be addressed. I would be more concerned with the sin in my husband's life than I would be about how it effects me. He is the one out of fellowship with the Lord, and that, in my mind, trumps any hurt feelings I may have. I would look at him as a fellow brother-in-Christ, not as a man who has hurt me. Of course I would have trust issues with him, but my MAIN concern would be for him to get the victory over the sin and restore fellowship with both God and me.

Perhaps DB has never been cheated on. It is a noble perspective, but IRL quite different. I was in a marriage where my spouse cheated and it was worse than stabbing me in the heart with a knife. We reconciled, restored the marriage and then it happened again, and again until finally I could bear no more. I had three children to consider and I was not a martyr.

 

Blessings,

Lucinda

[DB in NJ]

Perhaps DB has never been cheated on. It is a noble perspective, but IRL quite different. I was in a marriage where my spouse cheated and it was worse than stabbing me in the heart with a knife. We reconciled, restored the marriage and then it happened again, and again until finally I could bear no more. I had three children to consider and I was not a martyr.

 

Blessings,

Lucinda

 

You're wrong.

[Scarlett]

HUH????? How is it not a good idea to help your husband when he has sin in his life??? If it were a friend, would you not help? Good grief.

 

I completely disagree that it's like being a spouse's Holy Spirit. It's being a good friend and a sister in Christ.

 

It isn't just 'sin in his life'. Adultery is a personal sin against his wife. If someone beats you up and robs you and you are in a hospital room with broken bones and an empty wallet, I hardly think you are the person to restore the robber/assaulter to Christ.

[HSMom2One]

No offense intended, DB. We each have to deal with these things as we are faced with them in our circumstances. My previous marriage also included abuse and other complications that added to the pain. I do know that God has walked beside me through everything and it all contributed over time to the deep, abiding spritual relationship I now have with Him.

 

Blessings,

Lucinda

[ClassicMom]

young. I know, I'm probably an oddball here. As long as God sends them husbands that have jobs that can provide for their families, we are all for it. I agree with the poster who said they didn't want their son's and their wives living in the basement. But if they can provide and the maturity is there... We have raised our daughters to have that maturity and to be those wives.

 

Dh and I decided to get married at 18 but waited until we were almost 23 and didn't start our own family until I was 27 (adopted our first one;long story). I very much wish that we would have started having children much, much younger because by the time we did start, my reproductive system was already starting to shut down.

 

Due to constantly developing cysts on my ovaries, I ended up getting a hysterectomy at 37. I wanted to have more children and couldn't . We have three of our own and two that are adopted and I love them all dearly, but I feel that if I would have started earlier perhaps our family would be larger.

 

As far as waiting until you are financially stable. Well, I can attest to the fact that money comes and money goes and stability is in the hands of God. Twice we've had it and twice he's allowed it to be taken away. I think it can happen to anyone at anytime. And yes, it is prudent to have some savings before starting a family. Waiting for the perfect time and perfect amount...well, it can go as fast as it came IYKWIM.

[DB in NJ]

No offense intended, DB. We each have to deal with these things as we are faced with them in our circumstances. My previous marriage also included abuse and other complications that added to the pain. I do know that God has walked beside me through everything and it all contributed over time to the deep, abiding spritual relationship I now have with Him.

 

Blessings,

Lucinda

 

No offense taken.

[DB in NJ]

It isn't just 'sin in his life'. Adultery is a personal sin against his wife. If someone beats you up and robs you and you are in a hospital room with broken bones and an empty wallet, I hardly think you are the person to restore the robber/assaulter to Christ.

 

You're comparing sin in the life of the man who I vowed to stay with forever to an act of crime committed against me by a total stranger.

 

Truth be told, I *would* feel sorry for the guy because more likely than not, he's a lost soul. Would I make it my business to restore him? No. But I AM my brother's keeper. And my husband is the dearest brother I have. Of course there are hurt feelings and trust issues that need to be worked through (and believe me, they took time), but my main concern was for the broken man standing before me confessing what he had done. His relationship with God is more important to me than his relationship with me. He's a wonderful man, and he was restored to both of us.

[Scarlett]

You're comparing sin in the life of the man who I vowed to stay with forever to an act of crime committed against me by a total stranger.

 

Truth be told, I *would* feel sorry for the guy because more likely than not, he's a lost soul. Would I make it my business to restore him? No. But I AM my brother's keeper. And my husband is the dearest brother I have. Of course there are hurt feelings and trust issues that need to be worked through (and believe me, they took time), but my main concern was for the broken man standing before me confessing what he had done. His relationship with God is more important to me than his relationship with me. He's a wonderful man, and he was restored to both of us.

 

Actually, in my mind the analogy was of a member of your congregation doing the robbing and assaulting, but your point is taken. And I'm glad you are that noble....I just don't think that would be my first thought---how can I help restore this man to Christ. More likely, how can I keep from committing murder and thereby ending up in prison. ;)

[abreakfromlife]

I hate coming into a thread this late - I've really skimmed all the replies and didn't see a couple of things posted. Someone posted an interview and article discussing this very thing last week. - Mark Gungor interview

Against Eternal Youth article I would also throw in A Nation of Wimps book - not a marriage book, but a maturity/independence issues book.

 

 

Dh and I are very much in support of early marriage, and will probably encourage our kids to do as much. Whether or not they get married, we want them to be fully mature, independent adults by the time they are 17, 18. I would not encourage early marriage if the person wasn't mature, and in most cases today, late teens are not mature in any way to get married.

 

I just don't understand the thinking that a person should go off to college first, and that they are missing out if they don't go off, or that they shouldn't get married before they graduate. If struggling financially automatically stops when you graduate from college and get a job, then why is there such a credit/money crisis in America now, LOL. It's just silly to tell kids to ignore their sexual urges for 10, 15 years, until they get a good job, and then get married.

 

Dh spent one year at a christian college and the atmosphere was awful. Granted, it would be even worse at a secular college, but he was surrounded by so much porn, awful movies, awful video games, terrible music.....Most of the kids were there b/c their parents made them go, not b/c they were true christians trying to live a pure life. I think that is a very damaging environment to send a person into, no matter how strong their faith is.

 

Getting married young, and being married while you go to school takes care of that problem. And it can be good for a marriage to struggle together. Not to struggle alone, develop all sorts of bad habits, or just your own personal habits, and then having to relearn living together habits when you get married down the road.

 

 

I disagree with the initial article as far as young having babies goes. That has been the one thing that has made our life more of a hardship. Dh and I were 21/20 when we got married, and we already had one baby, and in the 6 years since, we've added 4 more kids, and a college degree. Raising 5 kids on a starting salary is enormously difficult.

 

But even with the struggles, I am still glad we are married. I love having a purpose to my life. I sit and look at everyone else my age, just working or going to school, and going out every night partying, just living for the weekend - how pointless! They are just throwing years of their life away on meaningless things.

 

There is no shame in being poor, or struggling. If the two are mature and focuses, struggles can draw them closer to each other and closer to God. We need stress and struggle in order to mature, and in order for our brain to continue developing properly. And we need struggles to keep us close to God. We don't stay close to him b/c everything is happy-go-lucky.

 

So, yes, I am very much in favor of raising kids to be mature, independent people with the goal of early marriage.

[Kay in Cal]

My dh and I married what I would consider to be "young" (22), one year after graduation. I only had one friend who married younger--most couples we knew waited at least until after grad school. It worked for us because we had found the right person already. In fact, I think we were the youngest couple to get married in our recent family history--our parents both met in college, but married 2-3 years after graduation.

 

I think my expectation would be that my children finish college before getting married, my hope would be that they finish their entire education, including graduate degrees. But hopes don't always work out, right? Right person, right timing, I'd support marriage early--though not "early" like before 21.

[ereks mom]

I don't know... I actually remember with fondness the years dh and I would scrape change so we could put a few gallons of gas in our car. Sure, we struggled, but that is part of what matured us. Perhaps, to use Tevye's words: we were so happy we didn't know how miserable we were. :lol:

 

I do have fond memories of our early years (of all 28 of our years, in fact :)), but not the struggling.

 

If I had it to do over again, I would've still married dh, but I would've waited at least a couple of years so that we could get our feet down financially, first separately, then together. The financial struggles of those early years is something we've never been able to overcome. It's not like we were/are deeply in debt, just that we've always lived paycheck to (skimpy) paycheck.

 

Dh is a minister, a notoriously poor profession, especially if you're in a small church (which is where we've always felt led/called). Five years ago, dh felt led to start his own business; as is usually the case with a start-up business, it has been a roller coaster ride, and last year was the first time that the business showed a profit, meager though it was.

 

We have a son who has just graduated from high school and is about to go to college, and there were so many things we wanted to give him -- not material goods, necessarily, but experiences (vacations, etc.) besides what we do here at home. But they never became reality. We just couldn't afford it.

 

I know that our situation has shaped our dc into who they are, and I wouldn't change them at all! But I will always feel guilty that they, as children, had to know that we could rarely if ever afford to take them on a real vacation, or to the movies, or even out to eat for a birthday...

[Scarlett]

I do have fond memories of our early years (of all 28 of our years, in fact :)), but not the struggling.

 

If I had it to do over again, I would've still married dh, but I would've waited at least a couple of years so that we could get our feet down financially, first separately, then together. The financial struggles of those early years is something we've never been able to overcome. It's not like we were/are deeply in debt, just that we've always lived paycheck to (skimpy) paycheck....

 

In your other post about this you mentioned that you both had very poor money managing skills. Do you think that if you both had been better informed in that area it might have made a difference? Less struggle maybe? I am just thinking through how we (the collective we) might assist our children in this area if they did want to marry young.

 

And hugs to you about not being able to give your kids all you wanted to give them. I think we all struggle with that feeling. I think of my poor mom who couldn't afford anything! :( It helps me now to realize that mom suffered more with that than I did (as a kid). Meaning, ds8 doesn't go around thinking how deprived he is.

[Joanne]

Truth be told, I *would* feel sorry for the guy because more likely than not, he's a lost soul. Would I make it my business to restore him? No. But I AM my brother's keeper. And my husband is the dearest brother I have. Of course there are hurt feelings and trust issues that need to be worked through (and believe me, they took time), but my main concern was for the broken man standing before me confessing what he had done. His relationship with God is more important to me than his relationship with me. He's a wonderful man, and he was restored to both of us.

 

FWIW, theory aside, in practical application......

 

What I would require as the cheated on spouse are the very things that *would also* bring restoration to relationship with Christ. (The below assumes more than a one night stand, by the way, and not repeated offenses)

 

1) The presence of remorse and a desire to repent

2) Absolutely willingness to cut off any ties/communication whatsoever with the woman (I'm assuming woman here, a homosexual affair would be more complicated)

3) Individual and couple therapy

4) Accountability to a Godly Christian (male) leader

5) Active church involvement and the development of a prayer life/devotional time

[abreakfromlife]

I am just thinking through how we (the collective we) might assist our children in this area if they did want to marry young.

 

I know Dave Ramsey has a kids program that we are planning on using when our kids are older.

[lighthouseacademy]

We did not have support of parents. In fact, my mil was plotting right until the end how to convince us not to marry and my mom did not meet my dh until we had been married 2 yrs because she boycotted our wedding because she thought I was too young to get married. My grandma did give us some financial help 2 yrs into our marriage because she took pity on my working 20 hrs per week and taking 21 units per QUARTER but we would have done it without her help as that was volunteered to easy my burden. I would have been nice to have family support when we have had children, but it hasn't happened. With our 3rd, we didn't have anyone to watch my other 2 while my 3rd was born, so dh had to be coach and daddy at the same time. It is wonderful when the family pitches in with support, but I don't think that will make our break a marriage.

 

Thanks to everyone for their thoughts and opinions. I do think a key to an early marriage thriving is support of the parents. And that means more than just approval. It means active support - watching any kids when needed, possibly helping out finacially if possible, etc. I think it would be really hard for a couple trying to finsh college with kids if all their family lived halfway across the country!

 

 

[AmyB]

I would prefer my children to be older and financially and emotionally stable before marrying. Financial stress is hard on young couples and young families. Fortunately dd isn't even slightly interested in boys, despite the article's claims. She has her head in the right place. She trains around lots of gorgeous guys, but they are just friends.

[Heather in the Kootenays]

I've seen lots of good reasons put forward to marry young. For me it would depend on the circumstances. I can rationalize both.

[ereks mom]

been taught how to manage money and then had to put it into practice individually before we got married. Neither of our parents were well-off, and I guess it didn't occur to them to teach either of us the fine art of money management. In both of our parents' homes, financial matters was always the domain of adults, and was kept private/secret from the kids. I guess our parents didn't think it appropriate to discuss it with us kids -- ignorance is bliss, you know?

 

In your other post about this you mentioned that you both had very poor money managing skills. Do you think that if you both had been better informed in that area it might have made a difference? Less struggle maybe? I am just thinking through how we (the collective we) might assist our children in this area if they did want to marry young.

 

 

P.S. Thank you for the hugs!

[Wendy In KS]

So, hopefully this worked-

 

[ But I know my nature, and if I'd enjoyed a single career life or even a double-income no kids life for a very extended time I would have really struggled to step away from that in the name of sacrificing for a husband or children. Not that others are naturally that way, I'm just a pretty self-centered person unless worked upon by outside forces. :001_smile:

 

Jami

 

This is me to a tee. DH and I started dating midway through our sophmore year in high school. We found out we were pregnant at the end of junior year. We married a year after we graduated from high school. That was nine years ago. We now have five kids. He finished college and has a wonderful corporate job. I got an associate's degree, but quit school when I decided to homeschool on focus on my kids' education in stead.

 

It was a lot easier for me to adjust to being a wife and a mother having never had the opportunity to be a young adult on my own. I, too, am very selfish in nature, and I would've had a hard time giving up free time to my husband and kids.

 

That being said, I read this article a long time ago, and I found it interesting. I would never try to push my kids into marriage at a young age, but I will make sure that by 18, they are ready to be an adult. I have seen way too many examples from my own generation of "kids" that just don't want to (and b/c of their parents, don't need to) grow up. I believe that dating as a teen, allows for growing into adulthood.

 

Dh and I have had our struggles as a young couple- financial and otherwise. Every marriage has these difficulties no matter what age (or level of income) you marry at. Both of our sets of parents have been married for over 30 years (and were all very young when they married), but what I hope sticks with our kids isn't the age you are at the committment, but the committment itself.

[CarrieF]

I, too, was highschool sweethearts with my husband. We were married at 22 while still in college (5 year plan!) and I am SO glad we didn't wait any longer. It was comforting, gratifying, satisfying, etc. to be sharing our lives together as we finished college and began our careers. Having said that, being married young (er)was hard, just like any marriage is hard, and probably has some of its own unique issues; however, I would be thrilled if any of my sons found their spouse at an early age and were married young. I've actually prayed that God would bless them in this way - and they are all under the age of 6! : )