Those with depression experience pls read!

[Heidi]

Thanks for all the advice!

Edited June 20, 2012 by hmsmith

[JudyJudyJudy]

I personally would start with a counselor and then go from there. Then again, I'm leery of meds. (I won't get into why at the moment.) Having said that, are you sure meds would ruin his career? My brother-in-law is retired military, and I'm almost positive he was on meds for bipolar disorder for about the last five years of his military career.

[Alphabetika]

The fact that he realizes his dark thoughts are illogical but can't seem to control them.......that is a classic depression symptom. So are many of the other traits you list. If meds truly would ruin his career, then I can understand why he wouldn't want to use them, but would they truly or is that just his perception? If you find out otherwise, perhaps he would consider a combination of meds and counseling. Sometimes it takes some chemical assistance just to get to the mental place where you can even accept counseling.

 

If you are a Christian and he could talk to a pastor or someone else with a likeminded spiritual focus (likeminded to him, I mean), that could also be a starting point.

 

:grouphug:

[gardenmom5]

I would start out with a Naturopath and getting any nutrient deficiencies under control.

 

 

there are supplements that will help with mild depression. they are enzymes/neurotransmitters that are naturally occuring, but often deficient in someone on the depressed side.

l-theanine

gaba

fish oil

vitamin b complex, focusing on the b12's. (my son's ND put him on thorne b complex#12 as it has b12 in all three forms. amazon has it.)

[AnnaM]

My DH also deals with depression. I agree with the natural remedies and we would add cashews and niacin(high doses). Both of these have done wonders for my DH, though he does still have "episodes" they are shorter and more spaced out. Having some time where he is on a "high" gives him the chance to actively search for the good in his life. When he hits a low we muffle through. There was a time when I thought I wouldn't be able to deal with this the rest of my life.

[MamaSheep]

Yes, you can definitely do counseling without meds, and I think that would be a great place to start. Meds can also be a very good thing in situations like you describe. If he's at a "place" where he needs other people to make decisions for him because he freezes up, he might need you to insist on counseling in order to get there.

 

I've never been associated with the military so I don't know, but honestly I would find it surprising if going on depression meds would really ruin a military career. I can see where they might not want people with severe depression on the front lines, or something, but I would kind of guess that depression is fairly common in the military and would really hope that they have some ways of helping the guys in that situation get help while keeping their jobs. Being unmedicated if you need it can also be detrimental to a career. As you pointed out, depression interferes with your ability to think things through clearly, and can also really sap your physical energy, and neither of those qualities is good for career advancement.

 

It might be that counseling will be enough on its own, and that would be great. It might be that he actually could go on medication and still keep his career, and that would be great too. It might be that he needs to see a counselor, and have the counselor help him through shifting to a different career in which he can get the medical treatment he needs without worrying that it will affect his career opportunities.

 

But yeah, you're definitely describing someone who needs help. And who CAN be helped, if he'll allow it.

[Little Nyssa]

I had a family member very much like this who was helped by:

 

1. seeing a Dr and getting a thorough medical checkup

2. counselling (in this case it was very short-term, but it did help)

3. focus on getting a very good night's sleep (=no late TV or snacking)

4. focus on good nutrition

5. focus on getting exercise

6. the book "Feeling Good" by David Burns

7. regular meetings with clergy

8. regular talks on phone with long-distance friends

 

This person did not happen to require meds, but these are some good ideas even if your DH does need them.

 

And I agree, it is very wearing for family members. :grouphug:

[Jean in Newcastle]

I would start out with a Naturopath and getting any nutrient deficiencies under control.

 

 

there are supplements that will help with mild depression. they are enzymes/neurotransmitters that are naturally occuring, but often deficient in someone on the depressed side.

l-theanine

gaba

fish oil

vitamin b complex, focusing on the b12's. (my son's ND put him on thorne b complex#12 as it has b12 in all three forms. amazon has it.)

 

:iagree:

[kubiac]

Another vote for fish oil. Start with fish oil.

 

Wellbutrin + talk therapy has changed a lot of lives. I highly recommend it, but he has to be willing to participate.

[Heidi]

NM.

Edited June 20, 2012 by hmsmith

[Munchkins_mama]

My DH is similar. On the inside he is the same way, on the outside, he is a fabulous, good at everything, kind of guy. Bi-Polar II runs rampant through his family but he refuses to get treatment. I constantly walk on eggshells. :( The older I get, the more it hurts. I would recommend counseling for yourself, to help YOU deal with the effects of HIS issues. Whether he is willing to get help or not.

[elfgivas]

something you could try on your own would be

"learned optimism" in conjunction with little to no media time, lots of outdoor time, etc.

 

here's a review of one of seligman's books.

Martin Seligman, a renowned psychologist and clinical researcher, has been studying optimists and pessimists for 25 years. Pessimists believe that bad events are their fault, will last a long time, and undermine everything. They feel helpless and may sink into depression, which is epidemic today, especially among youths. Optimists, on the other hand, believe that defeat is a temporary setback or a challenge--it doesn't knock them down. "Pessimism is escapable," asserts Seligman, by learning a new set of cognitive skills that will enable you to take charge, resist depression, and make yourself feel better and accomplish more. About two-thirds of this book is a psychological discussion of pessimism, optimism, learned helplessness (giving up because you feel unable to change things), explanatory style (how you habitually explain to yourself why events happen), and depression, and how these affect success, health, and quality of life. Seligman supports his points with animal research and human cases. He includes tests for you and your child--whose achievement may be related more to his or her level of optimism/pessimism than ability. The final chapters teach the skills of changing from pessimism to optimism, with worksheet pages to guide you and your child. --Joan Price

 

 

how i think i'd use it.....

there may be a genetic component. so there are skills you can teach your children which will help mitigate some of the negative outlook/explaining that can happen. if you do it as a family, then your dh will be involved in the exercises, too.

 

 

eg. one of the things seligman recommends is a journal of positive things. at dinner each night, each person says three positive things that happened in their lives that day. they need to be specific. (eg.. not "my teacher was nice to me", but "my teacher noticed my pencil was broken and loaned me his".) we record them in a thankfulness journal each night at dinner. it doesn't change our day, but it changes the things we focus on.

 

 

so i found the book for working with children easiest to use with adults, too.

In The Optimistic Child, Dr. Martin E. P. Seligman offers parents, teachers, and coaches a well-validated program to prevent depression in children. In a thirty-year study, Seligman and his colleagues discovered the link between pessimism -- dwelling on the most catastrophic cause of any setback -- and depression. Seligman shows adults how to teach children the skills of optimism that can help them combat depression, achieve more on the playing field and at school, and improve their physical health.

 

As Seligman states in his new afterword for this edition, “Teaching children optimism is more, I realized, than just correcting pessimism . . . It is the creation of a positive strength, a sunny but solid future-mindedness that can be deployed throughout life -- not only to fight depression and to come back from failure, but also to be the foundation of success and vitality.â€

 

hth,

ann

[elfgivas]

what i didn't say in the previous post is that more would help. (eg. councelling, meds). but becoming unemployable wouldn't help. so anything that might help which wouldn't disqualify him from flying would be a good start, and then you can see.

 

one piece of the puzzle may be that he isn't aware that ways of thinking are habits and can be changed. this doesn't negate in any way the biochemical influences on outlook and thought, but is an additional piece to the puzzle. its like looking at a picture..... if you change the colour of the matting or the frame, it brings out different aspects of the picture. we don't get to choose much about our daily "picture", but we do get to choose the frame we put around it.

 

:grouphug:

ann

[Heidi]

My DH is similar. On the inside he is the same way, on the outside, he is a fabulous, good at everything, kind of guy. Bi-Polar II runs rampant through his family but he refuses to get treatment. I constantly walk on eggshells. :( The older I get, the more it hurts. I would recommend counseling for yourself, to help YOU deal with the effects of HIS issues. Whether he is willing to get help or not.

 

:grouphug: to you too.

Edited June 20, 2012 by hmsmith

[Heidi]

what i didn't say in the previous post is that more would help. (eg. councelling, meds). but becoming unemployable wouldn't help. so anything that might help which wouldn't disqualify him from flying would be a good start, and then you can see.

 

one piece of the puzzle may be that he isn't aware that ways of thinking are habits and can be changed. this doesn't negate in any way the biochemical influences on outlook and thought, but is an additional piece to the puzzle. its like looking at a picture..... if you change the colour of the matting or the frame, it brings out different aspects of the picture. we don't get to choose much about our daily "picture", but we do get to choose the frame we put around it.

 

:grouphug:

ann

 

Thanks, I will definely look into those books. I was actually thinking about starting a thankful journal with the family, at least with the kids.

Edited June 23, 2012 by hmsmith

[Heidi]

Another vote for fish oil. Start with fish oil.

 

Wellbutrin + talk therapy has changed a lot of lives. I highly recommend it, but he has to be willing to participate.

 

I will look into all of the natural remedies as well. Thank you!

[Heidi]

something you could try on your own would be

"learned optimism" in conjunction with little to no media time, lots of outdoor time, etc.

 

here's a review of one of seligman's books.

Martin Seligman, a renowned psychologist and clinical researcher, has been studying optimists and pessimists for 25 years. Pessimists believe that bad events are their fault, will last a long time, and undermine everything. They feel helpless and may sink into depression, which is epidemic today, especially among youths. Optimists, on the other hand, believe that defeat is a temporary setback or a challenge--it doesn't knock them down. "Pessimism is escapable," asserts Seligman, by learning a new set of cognitive skills that will enable you to take charge, resist depression, and make yourself feel better and accomplish more. About two-thirds of this book is a psychological discussion of pessimism, optimism, learned helplessness (giving up because you feel unable to change things), explanatory style (how you habitually explain to yourself why events happen), and depression, and how these affect success, health, and quality of life. Seligman supports his points with animal research and human cases. He includes tests for you and your child--whose achievement may be related more to his or her level of optimism/pessimism than ability. The final chapters teach the skills of changing from pessimism to optimism, with worksheet pages to guide you and your child. --Joan Price

 

 

how i think i'd use it.....

 

there may be a genetic component. so there are skills you can teach your children which will help mitigate some of the negative outlook/explaining that can happen. if you do it as a family, then your dh will be involved in the exercises, too.

 

 

eg. one of the things seligman recommends is a journal of positive things. at dinner each night, each person says three positive things that happened in their lives that day. they need to be specific. (eg.. not "my teacher was nice to me", but "my teacher noticed my pencil was broken and loaned me his".) we record them in a thankfulness journal each night at dinner. it doesn't change our day, but it changes the things we focus on.

 

 

 

so i found the book for working with children easiest to use with adults, too.

In The Optimistic Child, Dr. Martin E. P. Seligman offers parents, teachers, and coaches a well-validated program to prevent depression in children. In a thirty-year study, Seligman and his colleagues discovered the link between pessimism -- dwelling on the most catastrophic cause of any setback -- and depression. Seligman shows adults how to teach children the skills of optimism that can help them combat depression, achieve more on the playing field and at school, and improve their physical health.

 

As Seligman states in his new afterword for this edition, “Teaching children optimism is more, I realized, than just correcting pessimism . . . It is the creation of a positive strength, a sunny but solid future-mindedness that can be deployed throughout life -- not only to fight depression and to come back from failure, but also to be the foundation of success and vitality.â€

 

hth,

ann

 

I just purchased The Optimistic Child. It looks great! Thanks for the recommendation.

[Laurie4b]

Regular aerobic exercise is as good as anti-depressants in most studies. If he's not already getting that, start there. Really anything good for overall health will help depression: good nutrition, adequate sleep, social contact, etc. A form of counseling that has research based evidence that it helps is cognitive behavioral therapy . It is not your stereotypic "tell me about your childhood" therapy that a lot of people dread; rather, it helps clients acquire the skill sets to deal with the things that are feeding their depression. It is a relatively short-term therapy as well.

[gardenmom5]

what i didn't say in the previous post is that more would help. (eg. councelling, meds). but becoming unemployable wouldn't help. so anything that might help which wouldn't disqualify him from flying would be a good start, and then you can see.

 

one piece of the puzzle may be that he isn't aware that ways of thinking are habits and can be changed. this doesn't negate in any way the biochemical influences on outlook and thought, but is an additional piece to the puzzle. its like looking at a picture..... if you change the colour of the matting or the frame, it brings out different aspects of the picture. we don't get to choose much about our daily "picture", but we do get to choose the frame we put around it.

 

:grouphug:

ann

 

:iagree: I came from a very negative family. You can learn to be more positive. gratitude journals are very helpful for changing focus. again, it is just one piece of a puzzle.

[LucyStoner]

*Fish oil capsules and vitamin D- in high doses. High doses of fish oil have been show in studies to alleviate depression symptoms better than daily Wellbutrin. I have taken both and that has proven correct for me. However, I would not discourage anyone from using meds they find helpful or need.

*Better diet- axe processed foods and cut way down on sugar or eliminate

*Sleep hygiene- how much is he sleeping? How well? How long? Work on cleaning up bad sleep habits- computers late at night, TVs on all night in the bedroom, irregular sleep schedules.

*Exercise (though I assume if he is military he is getting good exercise in?)

*Meditation/Yoga can really help.

* Consciously creating lists of positive things and creating an environment that makes you happy. Learned optimism is a great way to think of it.

[fraidycat]

Along with supplements, maybe he would try tapping?

 

EFT - Emotional Freedom Technique - I actually first learned of it at a military spouses conference. A Chaplain and his wife did a presentation on it and told us that they are using it with PTSD veterans.

 

I "attended" (online) this World Summit last year and learned more about it and have used it for myself for emotional upsets, as well as my sister and DH for Anger Addiction (both anger quickly and easily) and it has helped. I mostly notice it in them more than myself, simply because their issue was more "visible" to begin with.

 

http://www.thetappingsolution.com

[Catherine]

I agree. Meds aren't nearly as helpful for people whose symptoms are very long standing and incorporated into their personality. I would seek CBT and non-med therapies like regular exercise.

[----]

.

Edited September 12, 2014 by amana

[JudyJudyJudy]

I thought of something today that reminded me of this thread. 3.5 years ago I changed my diet because of physical health problems (thyroid disease, arthritis, and more). I went both gluten- and yeast-free, which meant that I basically cut out processed foods at the same time (I also avoid preservatives, food dyes, etc.). I'm very sensitive to chemicals, so I avoid synthetic chemicals, including fragrances, as much as possible, too.

 

These changes greatly improved my physical health. I was able to wean completely off thyroid meds after being on them for ten years (I have Hashimoto's disease), and I rarely have arthritis flare-ups anymore (I always know the trigger when I do). In addition to these benefits, I saw an enormous improvement in my mental health. I don't have depression for no reason like I did in the past, and more important for my family, I don't "lose it" over small things.

 

Besides the changes I already mentioned, I should add that I also take probiotics, which have been shown to reduce depression and anxiety. I began taking probiotics before the study discussed in the article to which I linked even came out, but now I'm really glad that I did.

 

Others mentioned fish oil, which I think is also a good idea. I haven't found a fish oil that I can tolerate, and I'm allergic to flax seed, so I haven't been able to take extra Omega 3s. However, by changing my diet, I'm getting more of the good fats than I did before anyway.

[jacqui in mo]

Judy, can you share what probiotics you take?

[JudyJudyJudy]

Judy, can you share what probiotics you take?

I'm sorry; I'm just now seeing this. I take Renew Life Ultimate Flora Critical Care, 50 billion. I get mine from a health food store instead of ordering them online, though.