Mommyfaithe Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Ok...my kids believe Jimmy Buffett when he sings "Math Sucks!"....however, we still need to do math .... Now for the ?? Dd is beginning 9 th grade. She is only 1/2 Way through CLE 700. Not for lack of doing math....daily....every day....since she was 4!! We used Miquon, BJU, some singapore, my own fun math stuff, and worked through CLE levels 400 - 705ish .... We are starting high school no matter what this fall. She is academically reedy across the board....sans math. She reads and writes well above grade level...and is ready to begin Rhetoric level studies... Then there is MATH!!!! How would you remediate her?? NYS only requires 2 math credits to graduate...so I have thisbyear to get her ready for Algebra. She will NOT be spending the larger part of her day facing Math...that would cause me to have one depressed, rebellious teen on my hands. I need something very focused...no fluff....no extras, But to the point, GET IT DONE Algebra Readiness. We will not be doing the most rigorous Algebra program. This kid does not NEED it. My job, where this one is concerned, is to open the door to math, introduce the concepts, get her ready for SAT's and send her on her merry way to CC where she can continue maths or NOT according to her degree program....which is looking more and more Arts based. Anyway, our math saga continues.....and advice on getting her ready to approach Algebra?? I know she needs more help with fractions, decimals, percentages, and equations where she needs to do opposite operations. I am taking this week to order her materials...and this is the last subject I need for this year.... So, please...your best recommendations for remediating towards Algebra in one year. Thanks, Faithe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

snowbeltmom Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 The "Key To ..." series provides a lot of drill for the topics you mentioned. Hands on Equations may also help your dd get ready for algebra. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

mom31257 Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 How about doing Lof Fractions, Decimals & Percents, then at least one of the Pre-Algebra books along with some CLE LUs? I used those 3 along with part of 8th grade CLE for dd when she was in 8th. She's not my math loving kid, but she's done well with Algebra this year. The humor is a nice change of pace, and dd enjoyed the story format much more than a regular math book. Originally Fractions and Decimals & Percents were his two books for Pre-Algebra. I think he added some more books to give more word problem practice before Algebra 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

hsmamainva Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 My new find! A Fresh Approach. They offer Algebra I, Algebra II & Geometry. The books are nice! Black and white, hardcover, but have lines for writing in the book (if you want to use it as a workbook). 20 Chapters are in Algebra I, broken down into roughly 4-7 Parts. Each Part has anywhere from 10-20 problems. All the answers are available. The odd numbered answers are in the back of the text. The even numbered answers are available in a separate teacher key -- and those show how to work the problem. I absolutely love it!!! I switched my 12yo over to this curriculum after using Teaching Textbooks since 4th grade. TT just didn't seem to cover the material that I wanted it to cover. So I'm now set for math for at least three years! She's working on a prealgebra program at the moment and then she said she's tackling precalculus / calculus. I'm just hoping she'll have it completed by the time my 8th grader is in the 11th grade! Here's a link to the site: http://www.aplusses.com/zencart/textbooks-c-1.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

Mommyfaithe Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 How about doing Lof Fractions, Decimals & Percents, then at least one of the Pre-Algebra books along with some CLE LUs? I used those 3 along with part of 8th grade CLE for dd when she was in 8th. She's not my math loving kid, but she's done well with Algebra this year. The humor is a nice change of pace, and dd enjoyed the story format much more than a regular math book. Originally Fractions and Decimals & Percents were his two books for Pre-Algebra. I think he added some more books to give more word problem practice before Algebra 1. I tried Fred with her.....there was too much bang...not enough buck...kwim?? she was not really interested in the story...too much story...not enough math. My younger kids love Fred....not her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

8filltheheart Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Hi Faithe, I would try MUS. I have a niece who absolutely could not pass algebra. I lent my sister our MUS and her dd did great w/it and managed to finish 3 yrs of math (through alg 2). While I would never recommend it for avg students as their sole high school math program, I think it has its place for kids that are really struggling. (it also requires a very short time commitment w/ blank pages so it helps w/distraction issues----which is why find it successful for young kids.) HTH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

Love_to_Read Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Did she ever master her multiplication facts? As a high school algebra tutor, my advice varies depending on where she's at on those. If she hasn't mastered them, then she'll need support like a times table cheat sheet, or at least divisibility strategies, in order to work on fractions. What type of learner does she seem to be? Hands on? Visual? Auditory? Have you ever considered Math U See? Not sure if it's fast enough for your purposes, though. But possibly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

Greta Lea Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 My older son sounds a LOT like your dd. He will be a senior in the fall. We've been doing some review using MUS over the past couple of months, but today he starts private tutoring with a friend (wonderful math teacher) who is gonna focus on just what he needs to do well on at least part of the ACT math section. I'm now using MUS with son who will be in 9th grade in the fall. He struggles with math, but nothing like his older brother has. I plan to stick with MUS no matter what with him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

4wildberrys Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 I 3rd the suggestion for MUS! It was the ONLY program that allowed dd to actually get through Algebra and Geometry---Alg 2 was NOT going to happen! My biggest regret also,is not sticking with MUS with her, as we used the original Foundations and Intermediate and she was doing GREAT! I then figured she was ready for something more rigorous, so we switched to Saxon, which ruined, ruined her love for math and sent us into s spiral for close to 3 years. She began MUS Prealgebra midway through 10th, and was finally able to comprehend and finish Alg 1 and Geometry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

TippyCanoe Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

Matryoshka Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Hi Faithe, I would try MUS. I have a niece who absolutely could not pass algebra. I lent my sister our MUS and her dd did great w/it and managed to finish 3 yrs of math (through alg 2). While I would never recommend it for avg students as their sole high school math program, I think it has its place for kids that are really struggling. (it also requires a very short time commitment w/ blank pages so it helps w/distraction issues----which is why find it successful for young kids.) Not to hijack, but how fast do you think a kid could get through MUS as review? My dd is getting through the end of Lial's AlgI, and does okay on the tests but doesn't seem to be retaining anything when it comes up for review. :glare: My friend suggested having her go through the MUS dvds - actually about half of what she's struggling with is on the beginning of their Alg2 dvds (rational equations, and she's just getting to quadratics). Do you think I should have her watch these this summer? Expensive, but she did say she liked the MUS videos she sampled much better than Khan or Brightstorm (which don't seem to have helped at all). She's going to take a placement test in late August to see if she can take geometry in the fall (at ps) or will have to re-take Algebra (she bombed the first placement, and they're kindly letting her retake it after the summer). A lot of this seems to be a confidence/math anxiety/overthinking issue - I'd be happy having her retake Algebra if I weren't worried it would crush her confidence completely and just have her tune math out. How fast do you think I could get her through this (considering she's already taken Algebra - it's like she needs a big review/refresher to cement it). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

Heather in VA Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 My new find! A Fresh Approach. They offer Algebra I, Algebra II & Geometry. The books are nice! Black and white, hardcover, but have lines for writing in the book (if you want to use it as a workbook). 20 Chapters are in Algebra I, broken down into roughly 4-7 Parts. Each Part has anywhere from 10-20 problems. All the answers are available. The odd numbered answers are in the back of the text. The even numbered answers are available in a separate teacher key -- and those show how to work the problem. I absolutely love it!!! I switched my 12yo over to this curriculum after using Teaching Textbooks since 4th grade. TT just didn't seem to cover the material that I wanted it to cover. So I'm now set for math for at least three years! She's working on a prealgebra program at the moment and then she said she's tackling precalculus / calculus. I'm just hoping she'll have it completed by the time my 8th grader is in the 11th grade! Here's a link to the site: http://www.aplusses.com/zencart/textbooks-c-1.html I found this at the HEAV convention and I really like it too. Unfortunately for me I found it for my middle daughter who is going into Algebra II next year and the woman told me Trig/Pre-Calc is 3 -4 years away. But at least we can use it for one year. Heather Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

MIch elle Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 ... and worked through CLE levels 400 - 705ish .... Then there is MATH!!!! How would you remediate her?? Anyway, our math saga continues.....and advice on getting her ready to approach Algebra?? I know she needs more help with fractions, decimals, percentages, and equations where she needs to do opposite operations. So, please...your best recommendations for remediating towards Algebra in one year. Thanks, Faithe Finish CLE math 705-709, and then she's ready for TT alg 1, imho. LU 710 has 2 lessons you may want to do - lesson 3 & 12. If she needs remediation while doing TT, then I would do it as she goes with what she needs to do TT. Do you have TT alg. 1 ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

mom31257 Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Finish CLE math 705-709, and then she's ready for TT alg 1, imho. LU 710 has 2 lessons you may want to do - lesson 3 & 12. If she needs remediation while doing TT, then I would do it as she goes with what she needs to do TT. Do you have TT alg. 1 ? If she doesn't like LoF, then I agree with just finishing CLE 7th grade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

hsmamainva Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 I found this at the HEAV convention and I really like it too. Unfortunately for me I found it for my middle daughter who is going into Algebra II next year and the woman told me Trig/Pre-Calc is 3 -4 years away. But at least we can use it for one year. Heather I'd never even heard of it before the HEAV convention! I was shopping with my youngest in another area and my hubby found it. Bought it on the spot. :) If the Precalc is out in 3 years that will be perfect. Otherwise, I'll be searching for suggestions here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

Heather in VA Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 I'd never even heard of it before the HEAV convention! I was shopping with my youngest in another area and my hubby found it. Bought it on the spot. :) If the Precalc is out in 3 years that will be perfect. Otherwise, I'll be searching for suggestions here! I hadn't heard of it either. I wish I had because my daughter would have preferred it for Alg I and Geometry too. But at least we can use it for one year. Meanwhile I'm already wondering what to do for Pre-calc. Heather Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

Greta Lea Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 ...the placement test to see where his weak areas were. Then I taught those lessons to him. My ds struggles greatly with word problems (the only big drawback to the Key To series, which we've used), so he does almost all word problems in the book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

swimmermom3 Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Faithe, you have been homeschooling for many more years and with several more children than I have so you are welcome to kick this advice all the way back across the country. I'll just duck.:D I am not liking your plan. I don't think it is about the curriculum choice for this particular child. Correct my memory if it is wrong, but isn't this particular dd rather bright with a definite mind of her own? If I have this right, then please do not sell her short by saying that she is not a STEM candidate and that you can keep the math really basic. Kids grow, mature, change their interests. Light bulbs go off. If I had not been obsessed with The Preppy Handbook in high school, I probably would not have taken four years of math and three years of science. Everyone "knew" I was a liberal arts candidate. I could hold my own in math and science only by working twice as hard as I did in my other classes. I could not see the relevance. No one that knew me would have predicted my pursuing a graduate degree that involved statistics and mathematical models. Thankfully, I had the foundation. Please do not deny "The Doctor" (right?) the foundation, keep fighting for it even though it makes your hair gray and leaves welts on your head from beating it on the wall. We have done years of remedial work here for the older two kids thanks to the horrible timing of a complete shift in math programs during middle school at the public school. True progress has seldom been due to the curriculum, but more to my sitting down for 60 to no more than 75 minutes every day and working through the problems with them, often discussing math the same way we discuss history or literature. They know their minds can't wander because I am right there, but they also know that when the time is up, we are done even if we only tackled five problems. Faithe, I am sorry. I don't mean to be preachy. I know how hard it can be and maybe my instinct about this child I have never met is wrong. It is just that in our previous conversations, she reminded me so much of Swimmer Dude... :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

Oakblossoms Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 I don't know but we just had the yearly math rant in my house this morning. I switched to Teaching Textbooks because I have been so overwhelmed with life. It seemed like an easy way out:tongue_smilie: My oldest seems fine with it for Pre-algebra. He has Aspergers and I am just happy he has gotten this far. My 6th grader was complaining that he wants to change again. He doesn't want to do MUS again. I told him he just needs to finish this level. I am not changing right now. And, I just switched my 9yo to MUS from Teaching Textbooks. He was stuck and not really learning anything. He is doing really well with MUS. Then I think maybe I should just do MUS or maybe I should have done Saxon from the start. Bleach. The simpler the program the more likely it is to get done in this house. I really like teaching textbooks. But, I wonder if the passivity of it is a poor fit for my kids. Sorry to derail. To catch up in Algebra...hmmm. My oldest hated math for quite awhile and literally took a few years to complete MUS alpha after coming out of public school for a second time in Grade 4. But, he spent middle school just speeding through MUS. he would just watch a lesson and do one worksheet per lesson. I did a test every few chapters. If he passed he could keep going at that pass. Otherwise we went back and reviewed the problem lessons and did more worksheets per lesson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

sunflowerlady Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 She sound like my dd in many ways. She has been working through level 7 ACE paces and we have hit a wall. After some research, I decided to have her cement her decimal and percent skills with the Key To series. Then she will either do Key To Algebra (yes, for an Algebra 1 credit-I researched and am satisfied it will be okay for a credit) Or, I will possibly try Principles from Patterns:Algebra by Cornerstone Curriculum. It includes Pre Algebra and Algebra concepts and used manipulatives. I looked at samples and it might be a good fit for her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

Susan C. Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Both dc are liberal arts based. Things went much better using BJU for my youngest. There is a different format for 7th and 8th grades. The BJU Prealgebra book worked well for dd, then she went to BJU Algebra 1 and we started using their dvds Algebra 1 on. Ds (older) used BJU Algebra 2 after being over his head with Chalkdust, and it was a breath of fresh air. Lessons every day, tons of instruction and going over problems, and a reasonable workload. Do figure out which format works best for your dd, the concepts in order, working on one thing at a time, or the spiral approach. Spiral was a disaster over here. For me, the key was finding a format and level of difficulty that worked and sticking with it. I see what Lisa is saying, but you can't go too hard with math, or your dc will forever say they are not good at math (and will hate it). Better to go easy and have them able to do it and with confidence. More will be remembered. You can always retake in college at a harder level if it is needed. Sometimes artsy kids never get that good at math, or they are late bloomers with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

4wildberrys Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Both dc are liberal arts based. Things went much better using BJU for my youngest. There is a different format for 7th and 8th grades. The BJU Prealgebra book worked well for dd, then she went to BJU Algebra 1 and we started using their dvds Algebra 1 on. Ds (older) used BJU Algebra 2 after being over his head with Chalkdust, and it was a breath of fresh air. Lessons every day, tons of instruction and going over problems, and a reasonable workload. Do figure out which format works best for your dd, the concepts in order, working on one thing at a time, or the spiral approach. Spiral was a disaster over here. For me, the key was finding a format and level of difficulty that worked and sticking with it. I see what Lisa is saying, but you can't go too hard with math, or your dc will forever say they are not good at math (and will hate it). Better to go easy and have them able to do it and with confidence. More will be remembered. You can always retake in college at a harder level if it is needed. Sometimes artsy kids never get that good at math, or they are late bloomers with it. :iagree: Very well said! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

8filltheheart Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Not to hijack, but how fast do you think a kid could get through MUS as review? My dd is getting through the end of Lial's AlgI, and does okay on the tests but doesn't seem to be retaining anything when it comes up for review. :glare: My friend suggested having her go through the MUS dvds - actually about half of what she's struggling with is on the beginning of their Alg2 dvds (rational equations, and she's just getting to quadratics). Do you think I should have her watch these this summer? Expensive, but she did say she liked the MUS videos she sampled much better than Khan or Brightstorm (which don't seem to have helped at all). She's going to take a placement test in late August to see if she can take geometry in the fall (at ps) or will have to re-take Algebra (she bombed the first placement, and they're kindly letting her retake it after the summer). A lot of this seems to be a confidence/math anxiety/overthinking issue - I'd be happy having her retake Algebra if I weren't worried it would crush her confidence completely and just have her tune math out. How fast do you think I could get her through this (considering she's already taken Algebra - it's like she needs a big review/refresher to cement it). Hmmmmm, I'm really not sure. To give you a gauge, my kids completed the combo book (which is MUS's alg and geo books combined w/o the honors questions) at pretty young ages in 34-35 weeks. They had never had alg before (went straight into the book from Horizons 6). I would guess they spent about 30-45 mins on math/day (w/o counting the day they watched the video, though Demme's videos are short and NOTHING like Mosely's lectures in length.) I have never seen the MUS alg 2 course, so I have no frame of reference for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

txhomemom Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 This is an interesting thread because I have banging my head on the wall for the past couple of weeks related to a math dilemma with my dd. She is struggling so much right now to transition to prealgebra and algebra concepts. It just seems like she is not ready for it. We were going over exponents and that completely fried her brain. She understands the concepts, but just gets in a hurry and multiplies wrong. I also think she is having trouble recalling pretty much everything in math we did this past year, fractions, decimals, percents, boy do I feel like a failure. I tried Derek Owens prealgebra, but she just did not click with his video lessons. So, then I went to using Chalkdust's Basic Math textbook so we could review concepts, but that is when we discovered her difficulties with exponents. So, today I have been trying to decide what to do. I have a local homeschool convention coming up this weekend so will probably look at MathUSee while I am there. I never thought I would use MUS, but I can see where she needs more practice problems, a different unique way of presenting the concepts, and MUS just might be the right fit. I am seriously thinking of taking her back to Epsilon level or even lower so I can have her review everything. In some ways it feels like a step backwards, but I don't want her to move forward without having a clear understanding of math even if she never ends up in a math oriented career (she is a pretty artsy girl). I also really like the look of Algebra Fresh Approach, but my dd is not ready for the pace of it yet, she needs a lot more review and prealgebra concepts before moving into that series. I wish they made a prealgebra book. If worse comes to worse, I will put my dd in prealgebra in 9th grade so she has more time to understand everything or possibly stretch out Algebra 1 over two years starting in 9th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

4wildberrys Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 This is an interesting thread because I have banging my head on the wall for the past couple of weeks related to a math dilemma with my dd. She is struggling so much right now to transition to prealgebra and algebra concepts. It just seems like she is not ready for it. We were going over exponents and that completely fried her brain. She understands the concepts, but just gets in a hurry and multiplies wrong. I also think she is having trouble recalling pretty much everything in math we did this past year, fractions, decimals, percents, boy do I feel like a failure. I tried Derek Owens prealgebra, but she just did not click with his video lessons. So, then I went to using Chalkdust's Basic Math textbook so we could review concepts, but that is when we discovered her difficulties with exponents. So, today I have been trying to decide what to do. I have a local homeschool convention coming up this weekend so will probably look at MathUSee while I am there. I never thought I would use MUS, but I can see where she needs more practice problems, a different unique way of presenting the concepts, and MUS just might be the right fit. I am seriously thinking of taking her back to Epsilon level or even lower so I can have her review everything. In some ways it feels like a step backwards, but I don't want her to move forward without having a clear understanding of math even if she never ends up in a math oriented career (she is a pretty artsy girl). I also really like the look of Algebra Fresh Approach, but my dd is not ready for the pace of it yet, she needs a lot more review and prealgebra concepts before moving into that series. I wish they made a prealgebra book. If worse comes to worse, I will put my dd in prealgebra in 9th grade so she has more time to understand everything or possibly stretch out Algebra 1 over two years starting in 9th. Great idea to look at MUS in person. I relate to your fears of putting your dd in a lower level of math than she 'should' be in. But I will just say that I had Epsilon in hand when my dd was in 8th, and decided against it for the same reasons you are stating. I felt she should be in Prealgebra, even though now I realize she didn't have the bases covered yet. So I sent the MUS back and put her in a Prealgebra program the she struggled in, and then an algebra program she struggled in and on and on :001_huh: It would have been so nice if I was as wise as I am now back then, because so much time and money and struggle would ave been saved for us. :glare: Homeschool allows us to work our children on THEIR level, not on society's 'supposed to be' level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

Mommyfaithe Posted June 19, 2012 Author Share Posted June 19, 2012 Did she ever master her multiplication facts? As a high school algebra tutor, my advice varies depending on where she's at on those. If she hasn't mastered them, then she'll need support like a times table cheat sheet, or at least divisibility strategies, in order to work on fractions. What type of learner does she seem to be? Hands on? Visual? Auditory? Have you ever considered Math U See? Not sure if it's fast enough for your purposes, though. But possibly. Yes...she has her facts mastered. I think she is a visual learner. I would have said hands on...but she tends to get frustrated with " real" hands on....drawn " hands on" she likes. I am not sure a program like MUS would work for her. She hates manipulatives AND video based programs.... Maybe we will just stick with CLE and follow it through until we get to Algebra? I am just afraid it would take too long to get there...kwim? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

letsplaymath Posted June 19, 2012 Share Posted June 19, 2012 Sometimes a different way of explaining something can really help. You could continue with what you're using, but also add some prealgebra videos from here: http://www.artofproblemsolving.com/Videos/index.php?type=prealgebra My daughter really loves watching this guy. He takes some pretty tough problems and makes them make sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...

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