Literary Lessons from LOTR - ??

[A.J. at J.A.]

My 13yo DS really likes LOTR and is interested in studying it more in depth. I've seen a lot of people mention Literary Lessons but was surprised at how expensive it is. I don't see it available used either. :(

 

I would appreciate any feedback. Is it worth the expense?

 

Blessings,

Angela

[elegantlion]

I found my set used, but I was prepared to pay full price. For us it has been well worth it. The additional notes in each chapter and the unit studies really round out the study. We have not been doing any fill in the blank work or writing assignments (due to ds's writing level). We have been doing vocabulary quizzes and the tests, we've used them as skill building exercises too.

 

There are some decent free online sources if you're not convinced about the investment.

 

Here's one site I also considered using: http://www.hmhbooks.com/features/lordoftheringstrilogy/

 

We had not read LotR before, so obviously some of the magic for us comes from Tolkien himself not the study, but I'm glad we decided to approach LotR this way.

[Lizzie in Ma]

It was worth it for us. The beautiful student edition becomes a treasure as it is worked through. I did get mine used, long ago. But I would have bought it new.

[sunflowerlady]

Dd will be using this next year. :) I found a used student text at a book sale and bought the TE used from Amazon. We are borrowing the novel from a relative.

 

It looks really good and I think it is worth the price new. If I couldn't have found a used TE, I was going to buy the set new.

 

Since it is an inclusive language arts program, I don't think it is really much more expensive than buying a separate curriculum for literature, writing, vocabulary etc.

[A.J. at J.A.]

Thank you so much! I think we'll give it a go!

 

Blessings,

Angela

[Lori D.]

I don't see it available used either.

 

 

That just means that when you go to resell yours, it will be snapped up in a hurry, and you'll "rebate" some of your initial cost when you're done with the program! ;)

[TeaTotaler]

We have been using the 1st Edition Teacher's manual this year for 8th grade. Ds and I have enjoyed it. However we have done it mostly orally - ds has done the vocab quizzes and tests but none of the writing assignments. Our goal was to enjoy the books and learn more through the related unit studies. I had never read the books before so this has been a fascinating study.

 

With the 2nd edition you do need both the Tr and Student books.

 

 

My 13yo DS really likes LOTR and is interested in studying it more in depth. I've seen a lot of people mention Literary Lessons but was surprised at how expensive it is. I don't see it available used either. :(

 

I would appreciate any feedback. Is it worth the expense?

 

Blessings,

Angela

Edited May 16, 2012 by TeaTotaler
Corrected the editions in my post

[A.J. at J.A.]

We have been using the 2nd Edition Teacher's manual this year for 8th grade. Ds and I have enjoyed it. However we have done it mostly orally - ds has done the vocab quizzes and tests but none of the writing assignments. Our goal was to enjoy the books and learn more through the related unit studies. I had never read the books before so this has been a fascinating study.

 

With the 3rd edition you do need both the Tr and Student books.

 

I don't see a 3rd edition - just a 2nd edition...is that what you are referring too?

 

Thanks,

Angela

[A.J. at J.A.]

That just means that when you go to resell yours, it will be snapped up in a hurry, and you'll "rebate" some of your initial cost when you're done with the program! ;)

 

I like the way you think! :thumbup:

[Trish]

Is this a full year study? Or less than that?

[TeaTotaler]

Oops, sorry I meant that I use the 1st Edition, the 2nd edition is the newest one.

I'll try to edit my post if I can. Sorry for the confusion.

 

I don't see a 3rd edition - just a 2nd edition...is that what you are referring too?

 

Thanks,

Angela

[A.J. at J.A.]

Oops, sorry I meant that I use the 1st Edition, the 2nd edition is the newest one.

I'll try to edit my post if I can. Sorry for the confusion.

 

Whew! Thanks so much! I tried to order today but their $5 off a purchase of $100 discount was not working. I'm waiting to hear back from them.

 

DS is going to be so excited!

 

Blessings,

Angela

[TeaTotaler]

It is a full year study. If you take rabbit trails with the Unit studies it may stretch out even longer!

 

Is this a full year study? Or less than that?

[regentrude]

With the 2nd edition you do need both the Tr and Student books.

 

Thanks for the heads-up. What has changed compared to the first edition to make this necessary?

[TeaTotaler]

Thanks for the heads-up. What has changed compared to the first edition to make this necessary?

 

In the older edition all of the student pages are included in the Tr edition, of course, with the answers filled in. We were planning to use the program mostly orally so it wasn't a problem for us. For the first few chapters I read the summaries out loud and had ds fill in the blanks. He had no problems recalling the info so from that point on we just read the summaries and vocab lists together and he would answer the questions orally. My main goal of using this curriculum was to explore the books together, discuss, and learn, so for our needs the 1st edition worked well.

 

HTH

 

Hope Lori D. the LLfLOTR queen ;) will chime in.

[regentrude]

In the older edition all of the student pages are included in the Tr edition, of course, with the answers filled in.

 

So that is no longer the case in the 2nd edition?

 

We were planning to use the program mostly orally so it wasn't a problem for us. For the first few chapters I read the summaries out loud and had ds fill in the blanks. He had no problems recalling the info so from that point on we just read the summaries and vocab lists together and he would answer the questions orally. My main goal of using this curriculum was to explore the books together, discuss, and learn, so for our needs the 1st edition worked well.

 

I was planning something similar and though I'd just get the teacher's edition. So, what is different now?

[Lori D.]

Hope Lori D. the LLfLOTR queen ;) will chime in.

 

:lol: I guess I do cheerlead this program a lot, don't I... :blush:

 

 

The original (first) edition program -- copyright 2009 and older, I believe -- had a TM was identical to the student book, but just with the answers inserted in the blanks.

 

So the student book had:

- comprehension question work pages

- vocabulary work pages

- chapter notes/teaching material for every chapter (written to the student)

- discussion questions

- the 12 units of additional material, with discussion questions

 

The TM had:

- all of the above, with answers filled in

- writing assignment ideas

- teaching resources

- the appendices (one of which was an additional optional unit of material)

 

 

The newer (second) edition (I want to say c. 2010 and more recent) drastically reduced the size of the TM, removing all the student material (which also allows it to be perfect-bound, rather than the older original which is 3-ring binder), so that it is now

- JUST answers (to the vocab, comprehension, and discussion questions)

- writing assignments, and the appendices and teaching resources.

- teaching resources

- the appendices (one of which was an additional optional unit of material)

 

All of the actual teaching information, chapter notes, vocab worksheets and comprehension/discussion questions are in the student book. While I have not done a content comparison, I don't believe the material itself has been changed much from the original edition to the second edition -- mostly a matter of organization, layout and printing difference.

 

 

I imagine too many people were cutting the cost of the program in half by only purchasing the TM (which had everything), and use much of the material orally, rather than also purchasing a student book for the student to fill in, AND a TM for answers. Hope that helps answer your question on differences! Warmest regards, Lori D.

[regentrude]

double

Edited May 17, 2012 by regentrude

[regentrude]

Lori D., thank you so much for the detailed comparison.

 

What a bummer, this means one has to get both, as they do not sell the first edition Teacher anymore :-(

 

One more question: does anybody have the ISBN of the LOTR version that goes with the first edition?

[TeaTotaler]

Lori D., thank you so much for the detailed comparison.

 

What a bummer, this means one has to get both, as they do not sell the first edition Teacher anymore :-(

 

One more question: does anybody have the ISBN of the LOTR version that goes with the first edition?

 

Here you go:

ISBN 0-618-26025-0 (one volume pbk)

ISBN 0-618-26024-2 (one volume hdbk)

ISBN 0-618-34399-7 (one volume pbk)

ISBN 0-618-34584-1 (one volume hdbk)

ISBN 0-618-26029-3 (three volume pbk in slipcase with film covers)

[TeaTotaler]

:lol: I guess I do cheerlead this program a lot, don't I... :blush:

Lori D.

 

I hope you know I'm just teasing you Lori. You really should get a commission for promoting the curriculum. Reading your posts over the years made me take a closer look at it.

[regentrude]

Here you go:

ISBN 0-618-26025-0 (one volume pbk)

ISBN 0-618-26024-2 (one volume hdbk)

ISBN 0-618-34399-7 (one volume pbk)

ISBN 0-618-34584-1 (one volume hdbk)

ISBN 0-618-26029-3 (three volume pbk in slipcase with film covers)

 

Thank you so much!

[Lori D.]

I hope you know I'm just teasing you.

 

Indeed yes! ;)

[A.J. at J.A.]

Got my order in today - should ship Monday. DS#1 was super excited!

 

Thanks for giving me that little push I needed!

 

Blessings,

Angela

[Sunshine State Sue]

Is it worth the expense?

IMO, yes. You may read my review here.

[tvaleri]

May I ask a question? My 15 yo is an avid LOTR fan. I am afraid of killling his love of the trilogy if we study it. Thoughts?

 

TIA,

Teresa

[Lori D.]

My 15 yo is an avid LOTR fan. I am afraid of killling his love of the trilogy if we study it. Thoughts?

 

 

Not Sue to whom you directed this question, BUT... being an avid fan of both Tolkien's trilogy and the LLftLotR program, I'm going to jump in here. :) One question: you mentioned DS is an avid fan -- is that just of the movies, or has he indeed read the books and is a fan of the books? I ask, because the movies are very different... My comments below are based on my assumption that he is an avid fan of the books...

 

 

We had read the trilogy aloud as a family at least twice if not three times in the years before we did LLftLotR. It is, without question, the entire family's favorite book (trilogy of books, rather). So, there was a slight fear we would turn this beloved work into "dull schoolwork."

 

However, Amelia Harper, the author of LLftLotR has so obvious a love and passion for the work that is evident in every single set of chapter notes and the 12 units of additional material, that it totally comes across as passionately loving the work and wanting to share the hidden treasures in it. If anything, seeing all that inspired Tolkien, and all the amazing things he put into the trilogy for us to discover, is like finding buried treasure, through re-readings or through having a guide such as LLftLotR to help guide you to the treasure. It really made us all love the trilogy even more (one DS went on to re-read the trilogy again on his own after doing LLftLotR).

 

To further reduce the potential of "killing the love" of the trilogy, skip the fill-in-the-blank comprehension questions for each chapter (your DS obviously already *knows* and understands what happens in each chapter), and skip the vocabulary worksheets and quizzes (if DS has read the trilogy previously, then he will feel comfortable with and understand the vocabulary. No need to do the two "worksheet-y" things that might kill some of the joy of the program. Focus on the chapter notes, and the discussion questions at the end of the chapter notes; enjoy the 12 units of additional material; consider reading some of the works discussed in those units that were an influence on Tolkien (The Iliad, The Odyssey, Beowulf, Sir Gawain and the Green Knight, King Arthur works, etc.) as you do the program to see for yourself what Tolkien was drawing on.

 

 

But as I say, these are comments from a fan. ;) Don't know how your DS would look on it all -- though, at age 15, I would take a guess that he might really enjoy the depth and new layers of appreciation LLftLotR provides. Always helpful to take a look for yourself -- and have DS take a look, too:

 

samples

links to additional resources of interest

scope and sequence

table of contents

 

 

Just my 2 cents worth! BEST of luck, whatever you decide! Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited June 24, 2012 by Lori D.

[tvaleri]

Thank you so much! We are all fans. Ds 15 has read the trilogy a couple of times and seen the movie several times (we own it =) Your insights are most helpful.

 

Smiles,

Teresa

[Sunshine State Sue]

May I ask a question? My 15 yo is an avid LOTR fan. I am afraid of killling his love of the trilogy if we study it. Thoughts?

I am the avid fan in my family. It only increased my love of the book. I agree with Lori. Ds, who rolls his eyes at my enthusiasm, gave it 7/10 on his end of the year evaluation.

[Lori D.]

Thank you so much! We are all fans. Ds 15 has read the trilogy a couple of times and seen the movie several times (we own it =)

 

 

Glad to help! :) We own the movies, too. I have a real love/hate relationship with them :tongue_smilie: -- so many details and moments done perfectly; so many drastic and uncalled-for changes to characters and motivations; such a focus on spectacle / special effects / battling at the expense of theme and depth of character... sigh...

 

 

And, don't know if you have other DC, BUT, this is a super program for doing together -- even with kids down to grade 5 or 6, from what others on this Board have said; young ones will enjoy hearing the story and chapter notes aloud, and if you have grade 7 or 8 and older, they can discuss along with the 15yo and yourself! :) Enjoy your journey through Middle Earth via LLftLotR! Warmest regards, Lori D.

[redsquirrel]

This is a free lesson plan from Houghton Mifflin

 

http://www.hmhbooks.com/features/lordoftheringstrilogy/lessons/index.jsp

 

It is not as long or a comprehensive LA program, but it is free.

 

Edited to add: and from the same source are what they call 'teacher's guides"

http://www.hmhbooks.com/features/lordoftheringstrilogy/teachers.jsp

 

It has discussion questions and some vocabulary work etc.

Edited June 25, 2012 by redsquirrel

[A.J. at J.A.]

IMO, yes. You may read my review here.

 

A supplement I enjoyed was The Atlas of Middle-Earth by Karen Wynn Fonstad

ISBN 0-618-1258805

 

Sue!! I just wanted to let you know that my son is loving LL - LOTR and just today even told me how much he appreciates having the atlas you recommended. He said it has really helped him visualize the places in the book.

 

To anyone else considering - my son is giving this a big thumbs-up! :thumbup:

 

Many blessings,

Angela

Edited September 28, 2012 by A.J. at J.A.

[Lori D.]

I just wanted to let you know that my son is loving LL - LOTR... To anyone else considering - my son is giving this a big thumbs-up! :thumbup:

 

 

:hurray: Hurray! So glad it is a hit, and we didn't just talk you into an expensive flop! :tongue_smilie: Enjoy your continuing adventures through LLftLotR! Warmest regards, Lori D.

[Jaz]

My ds and I are loving LL - LOTR too! I really like how it is open and go. My ds is doing well with the vocabulary. We enjoy the discussion questions. I think my favorite part is the short teaching section in each lesson.

 

Off to look at the atlas! :)

[Sunshine State Sue]

Sue!! I just wanted to let you know that my son is loving LL - LOTR and just today even told me how much he appreciates having the atlas you recommended. He said it has really helped him visualize the places in the book.

I learned about the atlas from 2cents in this thread.

 

I'm so glad you are enjoying it. Just talking about LOTR makes me want to read the books again...;)

[Lori D.]

Just talking about LOTR makes me want to read the books again...;)

 

 

I am getting to this year! AND getting to use parts of LLftLotR -- I'm leading a homeschool co-op class this year of 10 students, gr. 7-12, on a Journey Through Middle Earth. I'm using LLftLotR as a bit of a springboard, but going much more in-depth in how to analyze literature by writing my own guided questions for each chapter. Whew! This is a lot HARDER than I imagined!

 

I'm also teaching basic composition as well. Warmly, Lori D.

[Sunshine State Sue]

I'm leading a homeschool co-op class this year of 10 students, gr. 7-12, on a Journey Through Middle Earth.

Better you than me.... ;)

[M&M]

I see you have TOG 4 in your siggy, are you doing TOG and LL fLoTR? If so, how?

[A.J. at J.A.]

I see you have TOG 4 in your siggy, are you doing TOG and LL fLoTR? If so, how?

 

DS #1 does LLfLoTR pretty much independently in addition to his other language arts and history work. We do TOG for history, so we do some work together and then he does his independent work from that as well. They haven't really overlapped - so I just schedule both and we hope for the best.

 

I feel like I'm not answering your question though - what is your specific concern? We do school for most of the day, but DS enjoys LLfLoTR so much that he would definitely NOT want to cut that out.

 

Blessings,

Angela

[M&M]

I guess my question for you was , are using the literature from TOG or anything else beside the history? I just never thought that I could do LlfLoTR unless I dropped TOG. I picked it up used and never really looked at it - it was soooo big- before I sold it. Of course now it regret selling as it was the first edition.

[Susie in CA]

We love LLotLotR at our house. I didn't even know about the atlas--just ordered one! Thanks for mentioning it.

[A.J. at J.A.]

I guess my question for you was , are using the literature from TOG or anything else beside the history? I just never thought that I could do LlfLoTR unless I dropped TOG. I picked it up used and never really looked at it - it was soooo big- before I sold it. Of course now it regret selling as it was the first edition.

 

My boys still do their history reading and even assigned reading based on literature suggestions from TOG. We aren't into Rhetoric yet, so maybe that would have changed things. For us it is working fine to do both - just time consuming. DS views them as two different things so he doesn't balk at being assigned both.

[A.J. at J.A.]

We love LLotLotR at our house. I didn't even know about the atlas--just ordered one! Thanks for mentioning it.

 

:thumbup:

[Zoo Keeper]

This is a free lesson plan from Houghton Mifflin

 

http://www.hmhbooks.com/features/lordoftheringstrilogy/lessons/index.jsp

 

It is not as long or a comprehensive LA program, but it is free.

 

Edited to add: and from the same source are what they call 'teacher's guides"

http://www.hmhbooks.com/features/lordoftheringstrilogy/teachers.jsp

 

It has discussion questions and some vocabulary work etc.

 

Thanks for these links; I wanted LLftLotR, but my budget couldn't hack it.

 

Those FREE guides are giving my oldest more meat to chew on; he just loves Tolkien. Takes after his mom. :D

[dbmamaz]

The original (first) edition program -- copyright 2009 and older, I believe -- had a TM was identical to the student book, but just with the answers inserted in the blanks.

 

. . . . .

 

The newer (second) edition (I want to say c. 2010 and more recent) drastically reduced the size of the TM, removing all the student material (which also allows it to be perfect-bound, rather than the older original which is 3-ring binder), so that it is now

- JUST answers (to the vocab, comprehension, and discussion questions)

- writing assignments, and the appendices and teaching resources.

- teaching resources

- the appendices (one of which was an additional optional unit of material)

 

All of the actual teaching information, chapter notes, vocab worksheets and comprehension/discussion questions are in the student book. While I have not done a content comparison, I don't believe the material itself has been changed much from the original edition to the second edition -- mostly a matter of organization, layout and printing difference.

.

 

Wait, what? I just purchased the 2nd edition last month, and the teachers manual has all the forms (with answers filled in in bold), and its in a 3-ring. I HATE that its in a 3-ring. I wish it was otherwise. It is 2nd edition.

 

also, i'm wondering how you'd use a different version of the book, since reading assignments are by page number

[Lori D.]

i'm wondering how you'd use a different version of the book, since reading assignments are by page number

 

 

The reading assignments are 2 chapters a week, so that's not a problem. What can be a problem is some of the discussion question answers have quotes which list the specific page. Not a problem here, as we had the books virtually memorized, but if you have never read the book, or had only done so once before, you'd probably want the specific edition used by the program.