School of Hard Knocks

[JennifersLost]

Has anyone had a relative who went to "the school of hard knocks" and did well enough, thereby thinking that all kids should attend this particular school?

 

I don't mean over-the-top crazy - I just mean that they think that kids shouldn't get everything handed to them. That they figured out everything on their own so just leave the kids alone, don't make it easy for them and let them fight for their own place in society.

 

I'm dealing with this. I can see their point - they DID attain a lot more skills than I (as a coddled kid) did. But do all kids in that situation? I don't know.

 

What do you think?

[elegantlion]

As my dh and I are both graduates of the "school of hard knocks" I can say we will NOT be sending ds there. While we do okay, having to learn the hard way is painful!!! I wouldn't wish some of our life on my enemies.

 

My parents assumed the public school would teach us about life, like financial skills, household training, how to deal with people etc.

:glare:

 

DH had a widowed mother who worked full-time and went to school full time. His two older sisters took care of his two younger brother and dh was left on his own. Not a good thing for a teenage boy.

 

So while my dh is self-employed and supports his family we will training ds otherwise. He may end up self-employed, I'm not bashing that, but I hope he has some long term thinking. We did not have that in our "youth". We have a laundry list of things we were not taught, but wish we had been. We are slowly working on those with ds.

 

I would never intentionally send a child into the world unprepared.

[Jen500]

Well, sort of. My parents fully paid for my college and part of grad school. Dh was totally on his own after high school-he worked and paid his way through college and grad school. My career is much better paying than dh's, and I enjoy my work more than he enjoys his. I think it has more to do with family values and attitudes than what kids are given or not given.

[Tarheel Heather]

Has anyone had a relative who went to "the school of hard knocks" and did well enough, thereby thinking that all kids should attend this particular school?

 

I don't mean over-the-top crazy - I just mean that they think that kids shouldn't get everything handed to them. That they figured out everything on their own so just leave the kids alone, don't make it easy for them and let them fight for their own place in society.

 

I'm dealing with this. I can see their point - they DID attain a lot more skills than I (as a coddled kid) did. But do all kids in that situation? I don't know.

 

What do you think?

 

 

My brother went to this particular school, and he is actually a very loving parent. I think he sees where he went wrong in some of his choices and is somewhat trying to correct to make sure that the same things don't happen to his dc. He is in the military now, so that has helped him a lot, and his family. Not sure if this what you wanted.

[Tracey in TX]

There is a happy medium between the true school of hard knocks and the helicopter parent who hovers over child. I HOPE we've found that balance, but if not we lean toward the hard knocks mentality. You can tell a child repeatedly to not touch the stove, but if he chooses to do so anyhow he won't need to be told again. (This is not a literal example, so don't flame me.) I would rather be given a leash of freedom and be able to fail on my own accord instead of someone always there to catch me. Isn't it better to let a child make small mistakes and learn from then instead of making huge mistakes as a young adult where to consequences are far greater?

 

My parents tried to mandate every move I made as a kid, but really had to learn about life through my own experiences. Most of my kiddos are very similar and have life's little experiences to prove this.

[KellyGirl]

A little bit of learning the hard way is sometimes a lot more effective than a lot of being told what is right over and over. But it should be controlled, in little doses when mom and dad can see that there is no real long term damage to come from those lessons.

 

To leave a child totally to themselve to learn all they need to sucseed is probably not the best option. But always being there and meeting every need isn't either.

 

I landed on my own at 17 since my stepfather hated me. I did get pregnant at 19, but other than that have made it this far with very few bumps in the road. My mother had taught me to be responsible with money. I learned on my own (and rather quickly) to make phone calls, pay bills, clean, cook and do laundry - all things I had not really been taught.

[Hen]

My dad was that way as a parent, and he recently told me he regretted some of it- specifically he regretted the rule he had that he automatically would not give or get us anything we asked for...I guess to rule out begging and whining, but he realizes now that he robbed us of childhood wishes and dreaming. It sounds horrible, but we did get some things we wanted, the way we did it was to let mom know what we wanted for Christmas...we just could never ask him or let him know.

 

I also bought and maintained my own car, upkeep, insurance and my own clothes and expenses since I was in highschool- I broke down numerous times and I swear I will not do that to my girls...and funny thing is, my dad would be horrified now if we raised them the way he did me...they are even bugging us about saving for their college...which for me, growing up in the school of hard knocks, was my responsibility.

 

My dad did have a very hard upbringing, and he has done very well and is a hard worker.

[JennifersLost]

HenJen, that's the kind of thing I'm talking about. This relative comes from a long line of people who were given nothing and whose dreams were not encouraged in the slightest. Everything they wanted they had to earn and get for themselves.

 

It's a valuable lesson - it's just where is the "line"? And how do you help those people get past the idea that if they weren't given help, then no one should be given it?

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

I don't mean over-the-top crazy - I just mean that they think that kids shouldn't get everything handed to them. That they figured out everything on their own so just leave the kids alone, don't make it easy for them and let them fight for their own place in society.

 

What do you think?

 

I don't think kids should get everything handed to them. But I do think that parents should help children prepare as much as possible for that day when they will be leaving the nest to fly on their own. And they should make it clear that they are expected to learn how to fly.

 

My own kids have been told at an early age that after high school graduation, as long as they are not attending any kind of further education, they will have a job and pay rent, if they expect to live at home. Once they are old enough to have a regular part time job, they are expected to pay some of their own personal expenses, and ALL of their "fun" expenses. We also buy them a file box, and show them how to set it up to file their important papers. They have savings accounts from the time they are born, and once they get a job, we help them set up a checking account and get an ATM card. We also tell them to expect to buy their own cars, and pay for their own gas, we can not afford to, nor we do we think that is a parent's responsibility.

 

We will always be there to answer questions or help with practical information, but they will be expected to take care of themselves. No hand holding.

 

We have also said that after the age of 25, they will not be permitted to live in our home, even earlier if they can't abide by the house rules.

 

Sometimes I have wondered if our policy would help our hurt our children, but so far it has only helped. When our daughter went off to college she was responsible for all personal expenses, we paid for schooling. When she came home pg, she paid her medical expenses, and paid me child care while she went to work. She paid all her and her child's personal expenses, and I also had her pay room and board because she wouldn't pick up after herself. In spite of that she managed to pay cash for a used car and pay for the insurance and gas herself. Sometimes I felt like a heel for making her do all that, but she never complained. Looking back I know it was the right thing to do.

[Sharon H in IL]

. This relative comes from a long line of people who were given nothing and whose dreams were not encouraged in the slightest.

 

And how do you help those people get past the idea that if they weren't given help, then no one should be given it?

 

1) It's very sad to hear about a childhood like this. It evokes a tug of compassion in all of us. You know it's left scars that won't go away.

 

2) You can't help them get past their ideas. It's a self-protective mechanism that is based in jealousy that others didn't have the pain they carry. Don't even try to make them see differently. Just pass some bean dip if they start telling you how to raise your children. It's really none of their business, is it?

 

Good luck. And don't let their negativity make you question your own good sense and your well-thought-out decisions.

[LynnG in Arizona]

I don't have any answers . . . but it sure is an interesting question! It's extremely difficult to find the "balance". DH and I struggle with this issue regularly.

[Jean in Newcastle]

The "school of hard knocks" almost killed me - a couple of times. That being said, there is something to learning to forge your own trail in life. I think that the principle that "with freedom comes responsibility" is a good one. With each new stage of life and the accompanying freedoms, a young person should have additional responsibilities. They should learn to make some of their own goals and to achieve them. This might be deciding to earn x amount of money and then figuring out how to (legally) earn it - and then following through on doing it.

 

The balance though is that I think that we also need to learn how to accept grace from God and others. It isn't bad to be blessed on occasion. And it takes just as much capacity to accept grace graciously as it can be to deal with some of life's hard knocks. It's ok to give Christmas and birthday gifts for example - if the person has the capacity to really appreciate them. But we don't usually make those gifts really big or take "orders" for them (like in a list). If our children want something really specific they need to earn the money for it themselves.

[Rosie_0801]

Has anyone had a relative who went to "the school of hard knocks" and did well enough, thereby thinking that all kids should attend this particular school?

 

I wonder more about those who got bad grades at the school of hard knocks, but still recommend it. My sister was teased constantly at school and is only now in her mid 20's learning how to have a social life. She freely admits that she doesn't have any friends other than her boyfriend. Yet she still tells me that I shouldn't protect my kids from bullies because it's character building. Obviously... I trust that I'll know when it's time to let them out into the world. I don't think age 5 is the right time.

Rosie