Child predators

[Scarlett]

This may be a little OT, but how do you decide to trust people enough to let any of your dc spend the night at a friend's house? My kids have only had 1 sleepover and generally it doesn't come up, but I'm just wondering. One of my first reactions to the story was kind of disbelief that they would allow this boy to sleep over at the coach's house. I can understand naviete, but it is a bit harder in 2011 (2006 when I think this happened.) At any rate, I would certainly be suspicious of a coach wanting my son to spend the night, but even still concerned if it were just at a friend's house.

 

Coincidentally, my ds' baseball coach's son is my son's friend and the coach casually mentioned sleepovers to me. This would be a tough one for me, because it is based on ds' friendship. Still, I don't really think sleepovers are necessary anyway.

 

Me either. I've allowed a few here at my house....and ds slept over at a friend's house with 3 other boys when he was 9. I think one other time he spent the night at my neighbors...I felt confident about both of those families I had known the families for at least 10 years each.

[lionfamily1999]

This may be a little OT, but how do you decide to trust people enough to let any of your dc spend the night at a friend's house? My kids have only had 1 sleepover and generally it doesn't come up, but I'm just wondering. One of my first reactions to the story was kind of disbelief that they would allow this boy to sleep over at the coach's house. I can understand naviete, but it is a bit harder in 2011 (2006 when I think this happened.) At any rate, I would certainly be suspicious of a coach wanting my son to spend the night, but even still concerned if it were just at a friend's house.

 

Coincidentally, my ds' baseball coach's son is my son's friend and the coach casually mentioned sleepovers to me. This would be a tough one for me, because it is based on ds' friendship. Still, I don't really think sleepovers are necessary anyway.

Late games could be one reason (I don't know if they did away games, but many of ours got me home around one or two in the morning. If my mom could have she would have left me to sleep at school). Another is... kids lie. We recently found out that a teen at our church was telling her parents (who do not attend church) about youth sleep overs that didn't exist. She had been using that excuse to sleep over at her bf's house almost every weekend. The parents thought she was in a safe group setting, no one at church had an idea, and in reality she was living with her bf on the weekends. It's not that hard for a child to lie in such a way that the parent thinks everything is hunky dory, ESPECIALLY when they have an adult willing to lie to corroborate their story.

[Laurie4b]

I would be suspicious of pretty much any man who wanted to spend one-on-one time with one of my kids. However, I do let them ride with people, attend Scouts, go on camp outs, etc. We TALK about the dangers and have freely for years. The Boy Scouts have a good film on abuse prevention and the scenarios I watched on there remind me a lot of the stuff that's come out with Sandusky. I believe talking is more important than constant shielding. Neither alone is a sufficient strategy but an empowered kid is what I'm after. As a pp mentioned, a kid doesn't even have to be alone with a molester for something to happen.

 

There was a man in our community in a trusted position of authority. When the charges of inappropriate touching first came out, it turned out that many moms had just quietly moved their kids out of his sphere of influence. There were things that didn't feel right to them in his behavior, but nothing that in and of itself would be reportable. however, the pattern was very clear in hindsight. There was a lot of time alone sought with children, offers to babysit, to take them to movies, and gifts (but only for girls.)

[Laurie4b]

When kids are little, supervision is probably the most important factor.

 

As they get older, they have to also learn to think protectively themselves.

 

I could decide to never let my teens be alone with a man, but that seems like it would detract a lot of value from their lives. Obviously I still use wisdom and judgement, but I also want my boys to be courageous, to experience new things, to form relationships that matter.

 

So at this age (13), while I do still keep an eye on things, I also talk to them about predators and help them to be wary themselves.

 

:iagree: We've used the Sandusky info as a springboard for talking. I've focused on the grooming behaviors so my young teens could spot it coming if they were ever in a situation like that.

[Jennifer3141]

I believe talking is more important than constant shielding. Neither alone is a sufficient strategy but an empowered kid is what I'm after.

 

I LOVE this! This is what we are endeavroing to do with our kids too.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I understand exactly how you feel. My ds just turned 12 and I've still not let him go unescorted with other adults. I volunteer with 4-H and swimming so that I am there for his safety's sake. I do also enjoy the volunteering, so it's not 100% about the safety issue, but that is probably the main part of it.

 

Predators seek out positions where they can manipulate their victims. Scouts, sports teams, charities, churches, youth organizations -- these are all places rife with opportunities for predators because adults feel that those are "trustworthy" organizations and tend to drop their guards.

 

I never drop my guard. Never.

 

:iagree:

 

Last night DH and I re-committed ourselves to watching out for our boys.

 

This was a no-brainer when they were little. I never let my little ones out of my sight. We have a little one, a tween, and two teens now, and we've had to study up on how to keep them safe. We've concluded that we'll just keep on being there. No dropping off, no sending with, no sleepovers. There are four kids and two of us so we ought to be able to always have a parent on the ground.

 

As you say, Audrey, the organizations we believe in do need our assistance, anyway. All of the 'good guys' in our kids' activities are constantly asking parents to be hands-on and involved. DH will join Civil Air Patrol as a senior member. I'll keep logging my hours at TKD. We'll keep doing charity and community activities as a family instead of sending the kids on their own.

 

I think our own involvement in these good things is the key to helping our teens not feel smothered, as if they have a bodyguard escorting them through life. Families working together. That's a much more positive tone.

[macpuffins]

:iagree:

I've seen this with Wolf. He takes the kids to the park, etc...and it never fails to upset him when Moms there react like he's lurking in the bushes, trying to lure their kids away with promises of candy and a puppy, just b/c he's at the park, and male. With his own children. :glare:

 

Around here, there are SO MANY Dads, Grandfathers, Uncles, Mom's Boyfriend, etc., who take children to the park that a man's presence with a child is perfectly fine.

I'm really skittish around guys at the park that don't seem to have a child with them (to the point, I've walked up to a couple of them and asked "so, whatchya doin'?" and had reactions that fall into both the categories of:

1 - BAIL!

2 - "trying to figure out how to get in there, get my kid out, and get home w/o someone calling the cops because my kid does NOT want to leave the park")

 

Hubby tells me he's gotten the evil eye from more than one Mom for taking MissB to the park w/o me. They're getting used to him at that park (and he's brought me along a couple times to make sure they see there's someone else there).

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I'm not scared of men. My husband is one. My dad is one. My grandpa is one. I'm raising four.

 

Any man acting normal has absolutely no reason to fear the stink-eye from me. Men are allowed to talk to my children, too.

 

Good men have some things in common:

1. They already know our society is sick, so they are careful to be above reproach.

2. They don't try to get between parents and kids, physically or emotionally. Not even with teens.

3. They don't offer rides, email, call, or invite my kids somewhere alone.

4. They keep their own wives and/or kids around while they interact with children.

5. They maintain body boundaries and avoid hugging, sitting or standing too close, etc.

6. They may be kind to my kid, and encourage him or mentor him in a shared interest, but they choose adults for their friends and don't try to get teens to be their buddies.

 

I see some fear of men in this thread. I'm thankful for these good men who aren't afraid of kids. Like mamakimberly's husband, they learn the rules so moms aren't alarmed and they mentor/encourage our kids from that safe distance. God bless each one.

 

For example, our church has a new youth pastor. He's not a new member to the church, but he's only been the youth pastor for a year. He told the elders that he'd only take the job if everybody understood that old models of youth group put kids at risk. He educated them about predators in churches, and about how youth groups can mess up the bond between parents and teens. He always has his wife along on every little thing he does with the kids. (She is a saint.) He says he can't tell the kids not to go alone with men if he ever models being alone with them. He expects some parents to be at every event and activity, or the activity is canceled. All of the teens in our church are much safer now that this youth pastor has educated the church and consistently enforced his rules.

[SweetMissMagnolia]

no---I'm even afraid to let him go to the bathroom by himself when we're out shopping sometimes......

[Impish]

Around here, there are SO MANY Dads, Grandfathers, Uncles, Mom's Boyfriend, etc., who take children to the park that a man's presence with a child is perfectly fine.

I'm really skittish around guys at the park that don't seem to have a child with them (to the point, I've walked up to a couple of them and asked "so, whatchya doin'?" and had reactions that fall into both the categories of:

1 - BAIL!

2 - "trying to figure out how to get in there, get my kid out, and get home w/o someone calling the cops because my kid does NOT want to leave the park")

 

Hubby tells me he's gotten the evil eye from more than one Mom for taking MissB to the park w/o me. They're getting used to him at that park (and he's brought me along a couple times to make sure they see there's someone else there).

We had a situation a few yrs ago...Little guy, about 3 yrs old, was at the park, barefoot. Broken glass *everywhere*. He stepped in it. Wolf ended up carrying him home (neighbour child) so he could get shoes on.

 

I wasn't there, and we talked about how he could have ended up in trouble for carrying a kidlet that wasn't his, but he couldn't see leaving the child with glass on his feet unattended. What's a good man to do?

 

Course, the kid was back at the park, barefoot again, in under 15 mins. :glare:

[Tammyla]

Ugh. I feel so bad for those Sandusky victims. I am so disgusted by the entire grooming process and Sandusky targeting vulnerable kids from at risk homes.

 

I have been very very cautious with my ds....he is 11 1/2 now and a few times in recent months I've felt slightly over protective....after this I don't!

 

So I got to wondering ab

Edited November 17, 2011 by Tammyla

[pdalley]

I'm not scared of men. My husband is one. My dad is one. My grandpa is one. I'm raising four.

 

Any man acting normal has absolutely no reason to fear the stink-eye from me. Men are allowed to talk to my children, too.

 

Good men have some things in common:

1. They already know our society is sick, so they are careful to be above reproach.

2. They don't try to get between parents and kids, physically or emotionally. Not even with teens.

3. They don't offer rides, email, call, or invite my kids somewhere alone.

4. They keep their own wives and/or kids around while they interact with children.

5. They maintain body boundaries and avoid hugging, sitting or standing too close, etc.

6. They may be kind to my kid, and encourage him or mentor him in a shared interest, but they choose adults for their friends and don't try to get teens to be their buddies.

 

I see some fear of men in this thread. I'm thankful for these good men who aren't afraid of kids. Like mamakimberly's husband, they learn the rules so moms aren't alarmed and they mentor/encourage our kids from that safe distance. God bless each one.

 

For example, our church has a new youth pastor. He's not a new member to the church, but he's only been the youth pastor for a year. He told the elders that he'd only take the job if everybody understood that old models of youth group put kids at risk. He educated them about predators in churches, and about how youth groups can mess up the bond between parents and teens. He always has his wife along on every little thing he does with the kids. (She is a saint.) He says he can't tell the kids not to go alone with men if he ever models being alone with them. He expects some parents to be at every event and activity, or the activity is canceled. All of the teens in our church are much safer now that this youth pastor has educated the church and consistently enforced his rules.

 

 

:iagree:

 

We have a program at our church called 'Safe sanctuaries' The rule is that there should always be two unrelated adults with children/youth at any activity. Everyone who works with either children or youth must have a background/criminal check. It's not completely safe but I think it's wise.

 

I've never been one to drop and go with my kids. I just am not wired that way and neither are they. I make a point not to interfere. I just observe. I do leave if the situation is comfortable - lots of adults and I trust them. But they have to earn my trust. If I got a 'spidey sense' I would not leave. Period. I've had too many close calls myself that later turned out that my spidey sense was all to accurate to ignore that.

 

The majority of men are good people with no ill intentions. As usual it's the few that make people fearful of the many.

[YLVD]

Have I allowed my kids to spend time alone with any man beside their father.

 

No. Absolutely not. I have personally known too many victims of pedophiles, and my research into this subject in the past has also rendered me permanently paranoid.

 

This is to protect both parties and keep me from worrying about my friends.

 

Yes, my creep-o-meter has been known to go off. Yes, I pay attention to it.

 

In one case, someone I knew set off my creepometer and I learned later that the creep in question (husband of a friend) did actually molest his 3yo daughter on multiple occasions. The friend second guessed both what her daughter said (which was both specific and graphic) and what she saw (what my friend, the mother, saw--actually, really SAW WITH HER OWN EYES). Ultimately even though this friend left her husband, she continued sleeping with this man and allowed him unfettered access to their daughter. DCFS declined involvement because of the young age of the child and the lack of physical involvement. They considered the mother "protective" despite the unfettered access and continued s@xual relationship. There was literally nothing I could do to protect this child, and it haunts me still.

 

Another time I discovered a man at the ice rink chatting up my ds. I cannot ice skate due to bad knees so I hang out at a table where I can see the rink and get some work done. Ds was puzzled as to why I was upset about "stranger danger" because ds thought he would get in trouble if HE (ds) approached a stranger, but that since the nice man approached him it must be okay. :eek: (Yes, we had a talk about that!!) The nice man hastened to assure me that my ds wasn't bothering him at all (!!!) and he would love to continue chatting with ds. :eek: Both the nice man and ds were quite clear on appropriate boundaries when I was finished talking to them--that man was a STRANGER who I did not know and ds would not be continuing in conversation with him!!!!! Yes, my creep-o-meter was screaming on that one.

 

There was another occasion at a church long ago wherein a man who was the husband of a nursery volunteer would come down to the nursery during the sermon. If a child was fussy, or if a child was unbelievably adorable, this man thought it was fine to take that child from the nursery either to walk the halls to calm the child OR to take the child with while he chatted with friends in the hall. I pitched a fit and actually had to argue with church leadership about how unbelievably inappropriate it was for this large man to take a child not his own alone down the halls.

 

I could go on. The bottom line is that I have never, ever regretted being protective. I have known too many victims, and I spent too many years working in the inner city, to question my instincts on this.

 

I totally understand. I've worked in the criminal justice field and I've seen a lot.

 

But, I have seen a lot of instances of fathers molesting kids. In my experience, fathers, older brothers and uncles are the ones most likely to do it.

 

Of course I am not saying that your H would do that. Just that plenty of fathers molest and assault kids.

[Harriet Vane]

I totally understand. I've worked in the criminal justice field and I've seen a lot.

 

But, I have seen a lot of instances of fathers molesting kids. In my experience, fathers, older brothers and uncles are the ones most likely to do it.

 

Of course I am not saying that your H would do that. Just that plenty of fathers molest and assault kids.

 

:iagree: Yes, I too am all too aware of just exactly how often the perpetrator is known by the victim. I've known too many who have been hurt. That's why I have the rules that I do. It keeps my kids safe AND it keeps me from worrying about my friends.