Do you teach your boys to be gentlemen?

[Cindyz]

If so, in what ways?

 

I teach my son to hold the door and to let ladies go first. I've taught him that you never ever hit a girl...ever. Lately, I had an occasion where I taught him that he is to be a protector of girls and found myself telling him that girls are more gentle and he should be a bit more careful when playing with girls than when playing with boys. This was after another boy said to him, "Let's chase the girls!", and he did. A girl ended up getting pushed down in excitement (not in meanness or anger) and then told a teacher that my son touched her "private parts". They did not make a big deal out of this because they saw it happen and he touched her bottom as they were falling down...but....still that could have been a real scene.

 

So, do you teach your boys to be gentlemen? How do you do it? Is your husband a good example? In what ways is he an example of being a gentleman? I wonder if it's a good idea to teach my son that girls are weaker or more fragile and that he should be more careful? Will it teach him to be patronizing or is it a good idea because it will teach him to be more of a gentleman?

 

What are your thoughts? :)

[Gratia271]

Yes, my son has been taught how to be a gentleman largely through the example of my husband. In fact, DS is rather doting on me and never had to be taught many gentleman-like qualities. I guess he was born old in this respect.

 

I will say that teaching a son to be a gentleman is not the equivalent of teaching him that females are weak or fragile. I don't believe that, and I wouldn't teach my son that. For me personally, that idea has nothing to do with being a gentleman.

[theYoungerMrsWarde]

I don't think you need to teach your boys that girls are weaker or anything like that. Instead I would say (and will say when my boys reach that age) that they deserve special respect. In "The Dangerous Book for Boys" there is a great part about girls and how they're different, and how they are not necessarily going to like the sort of things boys do (like make invisible ink with urine, though I would have thought that was really cool at that age...)

[Cindyz]

 

I will say that teaching a son to be a gentleman is not the equivalent of teaching him that females are weak or fragile. I don't believe that, and I wouldn't teach my son that. For me personally, that idea has nothing to do with being a gentleman.

 

I agree and it felt wrong as soon as I said it which is why I questioned it. But at the same time, I do feel like he should be more careful with girls when playing. They seem to get hurt more and complain more (when falling down or involved in rougher play) and he may be more likely to get into trouble if he plays with a girl the same as he might with a boy. I feel like it's a bit of a sticky situation. I did tell him that he should be the protector and not the chaser of girls and I do feel good about that. At the same time I told him in a generic way that I didn't think chasing anyone was a good idea. If you are playing tag and everyone is playing, that's great, but just random chasing isn't a good idea.

Edited January 28, 2011 by Cindyz

[Cindyz]

I don't think you need to teach your boys that girls are weaker or anything like that. Instead I would say (and will say when my boys reach that age) that they deserve special respect. In "The Dangerous Book for Boys" there is a great part about girls and how they're different, and how they are not necessarily going to like the sort of things boys do (like make invisible ink with urine, though I would have thought that was really cool at that age...)

 

I like that book and bought it for my nephew. I think it's time to get a copy for my son. :D

[theYoungerMrsWarde]

I was just reminded of a book, "How to be a man: a book for boys, containing useful hints on the formation of character" by Harvey Newcomb. It was written in the early 1800's, and it is based on Christian character. I have read more of the "How to be a Lady" but I understand the first few chapters are the same. It is availabvle for free download in a variety of formats. The language could be a challange, but it is one I relish (I'm just weird like that :001_smile: ) I will be printing it out for my boys to read somewhere between the ages of 8-10 years old.

 

http://www.archive.org/details/howtobemanbookfo00newcrich

[Peela]

Not directly.

However, dh, while not exactly a gentleman in the traditional sense (not a door opening kinda man), provides an example of male leadership and care that our son has naturally absorbed. I have heard ds say to his friends things like "guys pay for girls, right?" in regards to taking their girlfriends out. I am quite surprised sometimes by this because ds is not the most generous person at home, yet to his girlfriend he is very kind and generous, and they have been together for several months.

And I myself come from a feminist background- my mother earned a higher wage than my father (which probably contributed to their marriage break up) so it never occurred to me that men "should" support their wives completely, yet that is what my dh does. And I am glad for that model for my ds.

My dh is quite old fashioned in some ways, but not really a gentleman. Can be gentle, but its not his normal modus operendi!

[SailorMom]

Yes - and when they were small they used to get mad!!! I would make them let the girls go first at the playground (took many years for them to understand that one :) )

Now, "gentlemanly things" are reflex for them, for the most part.

[MeaganS]

I would say one of the best ways would be through example. We don't have sons yet, but my husband is very gentlemanly. He opens the car door for me most times still and has always done his best to treat me as I should be treated. I hope that my daughters can learn that they should expect to be treated with respect.

 

On a side note, earlier this week my husband opened a door for a lady at his school and she said, "Oh, ok, you didn't have to do that but whatever," all sarcastically at him, like she was offended. He told me he considered saying, "Oh, I didn't think you could open a door all by your feminine self," but because he's such a gentleman, he didn't. :lol:

[Joyofsixreboot]

Well, I've taught all my children to be polite and respectful of others. That however sometimes does not translate to sibling relationships and after my 12yo dd took down her much bigger 15yo brother no one here is buying the 'don't hit girls' thing. For the record, she got so grounded.

[Mejane]

Absolutely. And he is. :001_smile:

[LazyDazy]

Yes, we do teach our boys to be gentlemen. They hold doors, let girls go first, and don't play rough with girls. As far as the "rough play" part we've explained that "most" girls don't like it so they should only play that way with boys. We have made it clear that boys need to speak kindly to girls, what boys find funny may be offensive to girls. My husband will do things and say things when it is just the "guys" pointing out which discussions are inappropriate to have around girls - including Mom. It is a work in progress ;)

[Laura in CA]

On a side note, earlier this week my husband opened a door for a lady at his school and she said, "Oh, ok, you didn't have to do that but whatever," all sarcastically at him, like she was offended. He told me he considered saying, "Oh, I didn't think you could open a door all by your feminine self," but because he's such a gentleman, he didn't. :lol:

 

Several men have told me they hesitate to open doors for female strangers because they've gotten yelled at. Years ago I read a column in the Wall Street Journal where the author said a woman had said to him, belligerently, "Did you open the door for me because I'm a woman?!" and he answered, "No, because I'm a gentleman." Love it :001_smile:

 

~Laura

[FaithManor]

The boys are young enough yet that when they hold a door open for a woman, offer to help carry a package or lift something, they are considered "Cute". So far, no ill will. We started teaching them the gentlemanly stuff early one and so I remember one day at church when dh was traveling, having two boys - six and five - rushing to the door to open it. The wind was blowing hard against the door and it took both of them to manage it. I let them know how much I appreciated it. Ds, nearly 14, is the ONLY boy in the youth group who shows any gentlemanly arts. If he plays pool in the rec room, he always lets her break. If they play pingpong, he always lets her serve first, always, always, always, and he's constantly opening doors for the girls. The down side of this is that I have been told that a number of junior high age girls think he's "the man"....NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO....I CAN'T HEAR YOU!!!!! LA, LA, LA!

 

The one thing we struggle with is that the ds above loves to wear hats. Not baseball caps, but dress hats with his wool pea coat. He looks quite handsome. But, he never, ever, ever remembers to remove his hat when he enters a building. We've gone over this enough times that we feel like the proverbial broken record. You'd think it would have sunk in by now.

 

Faith

[Gratia271]

Wow, I think our boys are twins. My son is a "dresser" too. People ask us what country we emigrated from. Apparently, he doesn't dress like American boys.

[Gratia271]

I agree and it felt wrong as soon as I said it which is why I questioned it. But at the same time, I do feel like he should be more careful with girls when playing. They seem to get hurt more and complain more (when falling down or involved in rougher play) and he may be more likely to get into trouble if he plays with a girl the same as he might with a boy. I feel like it's a bit of a sticky situation. I did tell him that he should be the protector and not the chaser of girls and I do feel good about that. At the same time I told him in a generic way that I didn't think chasing anyone was a good idea. If you are playing tag and everyone is playing, that's great, but just random chasing isn't a good idea.

 

I agree with you. There is absolutely a different standard for boys treatment of boys versus girls. I have found that this must be explicitly taught since girls are often instigators and, of course, boys are responders.

[Parrothead]

If so, in what ways?

 

I teach my son to hold the door and to let ladies go first. I've taught him that you never ever hit a girl...ever. Lately, I had an occasion where I taught him that he is to be a protector of girls and found myself telling him that girls are more gentle and he should be a bit more careful when playing with girls than when playing with boys. This was after another boy said to him, "Let's chase the girls!", and he did. A girl ended up getting pushed down in excitement (not in meanness or anger) and then told a teacher that my son touched her "private parts". They did not make a big deal out of this because they saw it happen and he touched her bottom as they were falling down...but....still that could have been a real scene.

 

So, do you teach your boys to be gentlemen? How do you do it? Is your husband a good example? In what ways is he an example of being a gentleman? I wonder if it's a good idea to teach my son that girls are weaker or more fragile and that he should be more careful? Will it teach him to be patronizing or is it a good idea because it will teach him to be more of a gentleman?

 

What are your thoughts? :)

As the mother of a girl, I say thank you for this. The last neighborhood we lived in had dd and two (sometimes 3) boys. At least once a week during the summer I was outside chastising the boys for chasing dd (and her friends) or throwing things at dd (and her friends) or stealing/breaking her toys. The parents would just chalk it up to boys being boys.

[Gratia271]

As the mother of a girl, I say thank you for this. The last neighborhood we lived in had dd and two (sometimes 3) boys. At least once a week during the summer I was outside chastising the boys for chasing dd (and her friends) or throwing things at dd (and her friends) or stealing/breaking her toys. The parents would just chalk it up to boys being boys.

I have seen a lot of this behavior too. At the same time, I have witnessed many girls instigating things with boys and being quite physical only to turn around and place blame on the boys. I have taught my girls that teasing/taunting behavior WILL backfire big time down the road.

[simka2]

I agree and it felt wrong as soon as I said it which is why I questioned it. But at the same time, I do feel like he should be more careful with girls when playing. They seem to get hurt more and complain more (when falling down or involved in rougher play) and he may be more likely to get into trouble if he plays with a girl the same as he might with a boy. I feel like it's a bit of a sticky situation. I did tell him that he should be the protector and not the chaser of girls and I do feel good about that. At the same time I told him in a generic way that I didn't think chasing anyone was a good idea. If you are playing tag and everyone is playing, that's great, but just random chasing isn't a good idea.

 

Yes, we do teach our boys to be gentlemen. They hold doors, let girls go first, and don't play rough with girls. As far as the "rough play" part we've explained that "most" girls don't like it so they should only play that way with boys. We have made it clear that boys need to speak kindly to girls, what boys find funny may be offensive to girls. My husband will do things and say things when it is just the "guys" pointing out which discussions are inappropriate to have around girls - including Mom. It is a work in progress ;)

 

I was just thinking that these posts would make my dd very sad.. I love the fact that I can look out my window and see her playing tackle football with an entire troop of neighborhood boys and her brothers.

 

She is strong, confident, rough and tumble...but will also out dress me in the feminine dept! She is beautifully demure when her brothers open the door, but a complete tomboy when it comes to playtime. Heck! She's 9 and wrestles a rather large, hot blooded arabian.

 

Boys...they tiny in comparison ;).

She's a wildflower.

[FaithManor]

Gratia, I agree with you about that instigating thing! Here I am trying to teach my boys to be gentlemen but truthfully, it's getting pretty rare to meet up with a little girl whose been taught good manners. My niece is an instigator. She LOVES to try to get her cousins to wrestle her (we have ZERO tolerance policy for wrestling because dh hates rough housing and we've got hard wood floors so someone is likely to break a head - not to mention mixed gender wrestlingis frought with scary problems) and then claim she's been attacked. Fortunately, she's tried this several times when others were watching though she didn't know it. So, she got called on the carpet for it....though her mother still defends her. UGH! She is not the only little girl I've seen absolutely provoke, provoke, provoke, and then scream bloody murder when a boy touches her. It's a two way street. I'd like to see girls being taught their ladyship manners as well.

 

Mostly, we just have a society with very, very low standards for what should be taught to children as it pertains to manners, social graces, and appropriate behavior.

 

Faith

[simka2]

As the mother of a girl, I say thank you for this. The last neighborhood we lived in had dd and two (sometimes 3) boys. At least once a week during the summer I was outside chastising the boys for chasing dd (and her friends) or throwing things at dd (and her friends) or stealing/breaking her toys. The parents would just chalk it up to boys being boys.

 

 

Oh ya this wouldn't fly!!! Unless I armed her with a airsoft gun ;).

They should definately be careful when it involves different types of play. Girls being girly...and boys being (ummm I'm not sure how to answer that ;))

[FaithManor]

Simka, I understand what you are saying and it would be nice if mixed gender younglings could play a friendly game of a contact sport if the girls are willing and strong enough. That would be wonderful! Unfortunately, it has been my experience that this is an excellent way for boys to be accused of being perverts. One cannot play a rough and tumble contact sport and not wind up with some kind of contact. Many of parents of girls do not see things the way you do.

 

But, if girls were taught manners and how to think about a situation, then if their hineys were accidentally touched during a routine game of football such as when the ball is being hiked or there is a tackle, then they'd understand that this isn't a "sexual" attack. But, it seems that the good touch, bad touch conversation for most children does not include "if you're playing basketball in the front yard and the boy is attempting to steal the ball from you and that means that his arm accidentally comes in contact with your front...don't let him have the ball and don't scream 'I've been molested' either." In our area, it's amazing what boys will be called perverts over.

 

Faith

[Parrothead]

I have seen a lot of this behavior too. At the same time, I have witnessed many girls instigating things with boys and being quite physical only to turn around and place blame on the boys. I have taught my girls that teasing/taunting behavior WILL backfire big time down the road.

 

Gratia, I agree with you about that instigating thing! Here I am trying to teach my boys to be gentlemen but truthfully, it's getting pretty rare to meet up with a little girl whose been taught good manners. My niece is an instigator. She LOVES to try to get her cousins to wrestle her (we have ZERO tolerance policy for wrestling because dh hates rough housing and we've got hard wood floors so someone is likely to break a head - not to mention mixed gender wrestlingis frought with scary problems) and then claim she's been attacked. Fortunately, she's tried this several times when others were watching though she didn't know it. So, she got called on the carpet for it....though her mother still defends her. UGH! She is not the only little girl I've seen absolutely provoke, provoke, provoke, and then scream bloody murder when a boy touches her. It's a two way street. I'd like to see girls being taught their ladyship manners as well.

 

Mostly, we just have a society with very, very low standards for what should be taught to children as it pertains to manners, social graces, and appropriate behavior.

 

Faith

Oh, I don't doubt it happens as you've described. For us though it was things like dd and her friend being in my back yard playing in the grass minding their own business then the boys coming out of nowhere with a handful of rocks to throw at the girls.

 

Or dd being on her scooter and the boys forcing her off so they could take it from her.

 

Or dd in the back yard chasing frogs and the boys coming round the back yard with sticks chasing her into the house.

 

A good dose of how to treat girls would have gone a long way instead of boys will be boys.

[Parrothead]

Simka, I understand what you are saying and it would be nice if mixed gender younglings could play a friendly game of a contact sport if the girls are willing and strong enough. That would be wonderful! Unfortunately, it has been my experience that this is an excellent way for boys to be accused of being perverts. One cannot play a rough and tumble contact sport and not wind up with some kind of contact. Many of parents of girls do not see things the way you do.

 

But, if girls were taught manners and how to think about a situation, then if their hineys were accidentally touched during a routine game of football such as when the ball is being hiked or there is a tackle, then they'd understand that this isn't a "sexual" attack. But, it seems that the good touch, bad touch conversation for most children does not include "if you're playing basketball in the front yard and the boy is attempting to steal the ball from you and that means that his arm accidentally comes in contact with your front...don't let him have the ball and don't scream 'I've been molested' either." In our area, it's amazing what boys will be called perverts over.

 

Faith

That is just so wrong. These are probably the same girls that will be sexting sooner rather than later.

[simka2]

Simka, I understand what you are saying and it would be nice if mixed gender younglings could play a friendly game of a contact sport if the girls are willing and strong enough. That would be wonderful! Unfortunately, it has been my experience that this is an excellent way for boys to be accused of being perverts. One cannot play a rough and tumble contact sport and not wind up with some kind of contact. Many of parents of girls do not see things the way you do.

 

But, if girls were taught manners and how to think about a situation, then if their hineys were accidentally touched during a routine game of football such as when the ball is being hiked or there is a tackle, then they'd understand that this isn't a "sexual" attack. But, it seems that the good touch, bad touch conversation for most children does not include "if you're playing basketball in the front yard and the boy is attempting to steal the ball from you and that means that his arm accidentally comes in contact with your front...don't let him have the ball and don't scream 'I've been molested' either." In our area, it's amazing what boys will be called perverts over.

 

Faith

 

Maybe it's having 1 girl and 3 boys, she knows she would never get away with it. First off, I'm present (or at least watching.) Secondly, if it's rough play, it's rough play...my rule is "there has to be blood" to warrant tattleing.

 

Then again we do a lot of slapping hiney's here, so she really wouldn't think to call "Foul!" Yet.

 

We did have a girl at church who was constantly enticeing my twins to play chase, I just made sure the mom was aware, and I kept my kids in a public area. If something would have happened my response would have been, "It's rough play, if you don't like it...don't play."

[Greta]

As the mother of a girl, I say thank you for this.

 

As do I! My original post was too chatty. But that pretty much sums it up: I agree with you.

Edited January 29, 2011 by GretaLynne

[FaithManor]

Parrothead, you have NOOOOOOOOOO idea how close your last sentence comes to what my niece is likely to be doing!!! Seriously, though I really love her, I just can't have her around here. The last straw was the day she had a couple of the boys favorite stuffed animals out and wanted to demonstrate "TEA and tea positions" for her older cousins. That was it. I told my brother she couldn't come over to play anymore because I can't watch them every single cotton picking minute and still get anything done. (My sister in law believes in a blow by blow, full on, my child needs to know everything there is to know about the subject, s** education beginning at the age of FIVE! I think it is because she was molested at the age of 12 by her mother's boyfriend. But, what she has managed to do, with both of her girls, is OVER s**ualize them. They seem to have an unhealthy fixation on it because one can not even have a conversation about an animal that she doesn't turn into an instant treatise on breeding.)

 

Yeah, we've got WAY to many girls in our area that are a lot like my niece. So, unforunately, the boys just can't be allowed to play with girls except my dear homeschooling friend's...she has three young gals who have been taught well and since my boys have been taught well, they can play games, run like mad dogs around the yard, soccer, etc. and no problems of this sort. Incidently, ds's "pool" buddy in the youth rec room, is dear friend's eldest daughter.

 

Faith

[Ellie]

If I'd had a son, I would have taught him good table manners as well as things like opening doors and whatnot; to look people in the eye when he talks to them; to shake hands with a firm grip; to use the telephone properly (e.g., to announce himself when he calls, to ask properly for the person he's calling); to be a good guest (clean up after himself, thank the hostess, etc.); to write thank you notes...and probably more, lol. A "gentleman" does all these things; it isn't just being nice to women that makes him gentlemanly.

 

And no, I would not have taught him that women are weaker, but I would have taught him that some things are not appropriate (physical rough-housing, crude language) in mixed company.

[happypamama]

I have a bit of a less-than-typical situation in that my DD (older and bigger) is much, much more rough-and-tumble than her younger brother (the 5yo, not the 2yo -- the 2yo is pretty typically "all boy"). DS1 is much more likely to avoid rough play in general and is more likely to complain if he gets hurt. In general, he's naturally very protective and giving, like with his little brother. We've given him a few tips about treating ladies specially (and we talk about the things that I do to treat DH specially, and vice versa), and he is definitely a gentleman to me. He insists on holding the door for me if we go somewhere, comes up randomly to tell me he loves me, thanks me for random little stuff I do for him, etc. (He's seriously going to be a catch someday, truly; if nothing else, his dimples will have all the ladies falling for him. The first time he flashed them at me, I was completely gone.) What totally cracks me up is that his sister taught him that he should offer her his hand when they get in the car, and he just went along with it. (It probably helps that she is 95% of the time dressed in some outlandish fancy or historical costume and for all her tomboyish roughness LOVES to play the princess.)

 

But yes, I think it's very reasonable to teach boys to act like gentlemen to ladies. Not all women will appreciate having doors held for them (though I think that's just common courtesy, and I have done it myself when appropriate, male or female), but I think a fair number will like it.

[IsabelC]

We don't teach our son any differently from our daughters in that way. We try to teach them all to show respect, consideration and courtesy, to help others when they can, and to be extra gentle with those smaller or weaker than themselves. But no 'women as the weaker vessel' stuff, because they are all being raised as feminists. :)