Saxon 65 to Saxon 76 ?

[Murphy101]

Do you have to finish all of 65 first? I hear only the first 80 lessons are typicaly done before moving on?

 

How far should 65 be completed before starting 76?

 

Or would you suggest doing all of 65 then skipping ahead in 76?

 

Or should I stick with entirely completing both, which is my typical attitude?

[Gooblink]

When my son was about 1/2 through 6/5 I put him on 7/6 and told him to do the new concept and lesson practice in the old book and a full lesson in the new book. He's at lesson 95 or so on 6/5 and 35 in the new book and has not had any problems with the new material.

 

I'd not heard about the lesson 80 thing...maybe I'll remove that extra burden from his workload and let him move on. I'm interested to hear what others have to say.

[Chris in VA]

We just started 7/6 today after completing 6/5. I have NEVER heard that "80 lesson" idea.

Most of the new content comes in the latter part of the book, so why would you skip it?

 

The trick with Saxon, however, is that they often use simple content (addition and subtraction, for example) to teach complex ideas.

 

The people who get into trouble with Saxon in the upper grades, esp, are those that don't follow the program. There are some things that look easy, but are preparing the ground for harder stuff!

 

Don't skip. Take your time. Do all the problems.

The Saxon Mantra.

[Hoggirl]

It has been a few years since we used Saxon, but the only book we did in its entirety was Saxon 3. For 5/4 I let my ds test out of the first 8 tests (which covers the first 40 lessons - I think - it's been a long time). As long as he got 90% or better, we just started with lesson 41 after he tested out.

 

Now, my only caveat to this is that we were doing math year-round when we used Saxon. So, it seemed pointless to me to have him repeat material he had just had. My thoughts might have been different if we had taken twelve weeks off in the summer. YMMV.

 

FWIW, we moved to Chalkdust Pre-Algebra when my son was on about lesson 85 of Saxon 7/6. He had grown weary of the Saxon format and the constant review. We have been happy Chalkdust users ever since.

[Murphy101]

Hmm we tend to go year round as well ...

 

Does anyone know of a downloadable link for the tests in 76?

[Tammyla]

Hmm we tend to go year round as well ...

 

Does anyone know of a downloadable link for the tests in 76?

 

 

 

http://saxonhomeschool.hmhco.com/en/resources/result.htm?title=Placement

[LinRTX]

I agree. We are currently on lesson 115 in Saxon 65. The end of the book is all about fractions and decimals -- adding, subtracting, multiplying, dividing. It also includes equivalent fractions and reducing fractions. There is no way I would skip the last half of the book.

 

Linda

[Murphy101]

I agree. We are currently on lesson 115 in Saxon 65. The end of the book is all about fractions and decimals -- adding, subtracting, multiplying, dividing. It also includes equivalent fractions and reducing fractions. There is no way I would skip the last half of the book.

 

Linda

 

The point was that if the first say 30 lessons of Saxon 76 covers that same info, then I'm not skipping it. I'm just doing it in 76 instead of 65.

 

Not looking to skip anything.

 

Just not interested in repeating it. Again.:)

[EKS]

I hear only the first 80 lessons are typicaly done before moving on?

 

 

 

Really? I always found that the meat of the books was at the end. When it was reviewed in the next book, it was always with a twist, with it kicked up a notch, if that makes sense, so I thought that the initial exposure at the end of the previous book was important.

[EKS]

The point was that if the first say 30 lessons of Saxon 76 covers that same info, then I'm not skipping it. I'm just doing it in 76 instead of 65.

 

Not looking to skip anything.

 

Just not interested in repeating it. Again.:)

 

You could test through the review lessons of 7/6. Or if you've had it with repeating, you could move to a less repetitive program.

[Murphy101]

You could test through the review lessons of 7/6. Or if you've had it with repeating, you could move to a less repetitive program.

 

such as???

don't leave me hangin'!

:)

[galtgrl]

We moved on to 7/6 after the first half of 6/5 with my now 8th grader. She finished Algebra 1 this year with an A average and did well on the ACT, so I don't think we "missed" anything. Some kids just don't need all of the review,but like the Saxon explanations and approach.

We're currently doing the same thing this year with my 4th grader - we went up to about lesson 50 in 6/5, it was too easy and I knew the same things are repeated in 7/6, so we're now up to Lesson 90 in 7/6. No problems, but you just have to go by your child.

I really consider 6/5 to be a placeholder, but that's just me...

[M&M]

I had always heard about people skipping parts of SAXON, or only doing half of the problems. Then I read some of the replies below and I read Art Reed's Book, Using John Saxon's Books. They convinced me that I should not only do the whole book but also all the problems. Placement is key, if you think you should advance your child, I would take the placement test (these are not for current Saxon users). One of the things I learned from the book is that although problems seem to be the same or similar, they build skills and there is a method to the "madness".

 

This is Jann in TX's reply:

 

You will get many different answers to this question. There are many here on the boards who only give the odds or evens out...the PROBLEM with this is that Saxon DOES NOT design their program to be used in this manner (many other texts are designed this way). When you skip problems with Saxon you are setting yourself up for trouble later on...the problem sets do not have ‘evenly spaced’ concepts AND some “concepts†may ‘look’ the same to the untrained parent--BUT each problem is actually teaching/testing in a different area. By routinely skipping problems you are missing out on critical review. In most of the series--7/6 and above the practice problems often DIFFER from the original concept (the one noted by the little number). As the student’s knowledge and experience increases so does their ability to COMBINE concepts. The review problems are often more difficult/complex than the original practice problems.

 

I’m a certified Math teacher--turned homeschool Mother. I have taught/tutored Saxon for over 7 years (1st grade -Advanced Math). The vast majority of the students seeking tutoring in Pre-Algebra and above are those who routinely skipped problems--working only half of the problem set.

 

Skipping problems in the texts below 7/6 MAY work out well for some students as the concepts taught are very basic. From 7/6 on it is very important to work EVERY problem. If the problem set takes ‘too much time’ to do each day most likely the reason is that the student needs MORE practice!!!

 

I have a dd with some learning differences and she has had success working 15-20 problems a day--continuing on the next day without skipping any problems. She completes a little over 3 problem sets a week.

 

Some people are fine with their students making a “B†in math. It is sad that those students could be making “A’s†if only they had used the text the way it was designed!

 

It is probably obvious that I am passionate about this issue. When you choose to use a program such as Saxon that is designed with a complex spiral review it is important to use the program correctly--taking shortcuts will only shortchange your child. There may be other math programs where working only 10-15 problems a day is sufficient--but Saxon is definately NOT one of them.

 

This is another reply:

 

Like Jann, I am a teacher turned homeschooling mom. I have an education background in curriculum development, as well as testing and evaluation.

 

I, too have seen numerous students struggling, who had been using Saxon and skipping problems. I have not seen many struggling who were using the program as Saxon designed it.

 

As far as getting a “B†instead of getting an “A,†I agree with Jann. But along with this, I would say that the degree to which a student actually learns and the length which a student retains the material is greater when all problems in the problem set are completed.

 

Saxon interweaves so much into the problem set it is hard to demonstrate through words on a screen. Not only are the previous concepts reviewed, but they are expanded and combined with other aspects of math along the way. If you were to go through an entire level of Saxon Math and write down all the problems that related to a certain lesson, you would be amazed to see the progression and the development. Not only that, but Saxon often relates one lesson to another by having the students work problems which relate to each other across the lessons, as review is done. Glance through your answer key [especially easy where the problem set answers are in a chart form]. You will see that there are multiple answers that are the same value, but if you look at the problems you will see that the problems were reviewing or expanding different topics. [but the number answer is the same-- this skill of seeing this within the lesson is great for Algebraic thinking and more] These types of things also help the student see the relationships between percents/fractions/decimals and more.

 

It would be much more helpful to spread the lesson out over more than one day and cover the material a bit slower, than to rush through and skip part of the teaching and learning involved. You may find that your student improves his work time and can easily complete an entire lesson in an allotted time frame. [although I have come across some home schoolers who try to complete each subject in 30 minutes, which may be unrealistic for the Algebras or higher]

 

None of this is shared to imply anyone is doing their math lessons wrong, but only to share from experience and research what has shown to work or not to work in other situations, so you can make the choice for your student and your home school.

[AmeliaBinMO]

I'd have to agree with those who advise not to skip. With Saxon in the very early grades, I can understand skipping or lightly covering lessons in the first half of the book. I would not be skipping any lessons in 6/5 or above, and certainly not (as Chris in VA said) the new content in the latter half.

 

This opinion is based on using Saxon through 8/7 with two kids. Certainly you know your child best, but some kids can hit a bump in the road with Saxon by the time they get near the end of 7/6 or 8/7. I'd be cautious about skipping anything in these upper levels.

 

All the best to you as you make your decision!

AmeliaBinMO

[Murphy101]

okat.

we'll be finishing saxon 65 bc I already have it and need to wait to buy 76.

But I do think I'll test him past any part of the beginning of 76 that he can test through.

 

thank you ladies!

[EKS]

such as???

don't leave me hangin'!

:)

 

I prefer Singapore because it is much easier to control how much review to have.

[Teachin'Mine]

We used several different workbooks during the early elementary years, and when I needed to switch to a more formal approach, we started with Saxon 6/5. My dd took the placement test online, and actually tested into 7/6 or even 8/7, but because of her age and that I didn't want to skip anything, we started with 6/5. It was easy for her, but instead of skipping anything, I just let her do more. She was completing a lesson, including mental math and fact sheet, in half an hour. Instead of doing one lesson a day, she did two and completed 6/5 and most of 7/6 in a year. We began the next fall where we left off in 7/6, but it was harder than starting at the beginning of a book which is mostly review. Saxon packs a lot into the last 30 lessons or so. That year we made sure we completed 8/7 so we would begin at the beginning of a book the following year.

 

I agree wholeheartedly with what has been written about using the Saxon program as it is intended.

[EKS]

 

I agree wholeheartedly with what has been written about using the Saxon program as it is intended.

 

I agree as well. The review, both at the beginning of the books and the review in the review sets between lessons, isn't straight review. There is subtle (and sometimes not so subtle) teaching contained in it.

 

I firmly believe that if you're not wanting to use Saxon as intended that it's best to find a different program.