Can I get your help re: sugar

[Guest]

I'm trying to cut out all refined sugar. I was told to use honey or agave nectar instead. After searching today on the internet, it sounds like honey is no better than refined sugar. Can someone clarify? Why am I cutting out refined sugar? :glare:

[LauraGB]

As I understand it, the honey that is bad for you is the refined, runny, squeeze-it-from-the-bear kind. It has to do with the refining and heating process - it breaks down the molecular structure of the honey and it ends up in the same category as all the other refined stuff (like sugar, white flour, etc). I've also heard of manufacturers mixing it with other ingredients, like high fructose corn syrup, for a longer shelf life (because they've destroyed the honey itself, which has an indefinite shelf life in its pure form). Raw honey, on the other hand, is unprocessed and in its pure form has many benefits. Its usually soft, but kind of solid (you need a spoon or you can heat the jar in a pot of warm water to make it runny). Look for local honey if you can it before ordering it from other states.

 

I'm not positive, but I believe in your case maple syrup may be fair game. Again, though, you will want to look for pure maple syrup.

[DarlaS]

From Wikipedia (probably the first place you looked right? :tongue_smilie:):

 

Honey is a mixture of sugars and other compounds. With respect to carbohydrates, honey is mainly fructose (about 38.5%) and glucose (about 31.0%),[1] making it similar to the synthetically produced inverted sugar syrup which is approximately 48% fructose, 47% glucose, and 5% sucrose. Honey's remaining carbohydrates include maltose, sucrose, and other complex carbohydrates.[1] Honey contains trace amounts of several vitamins and minerals.[22] As with all nutritive sweeteners, honey is mostly sugars and is not a significant source of vitamins or minerals.[23] Honey also contains tiny amounts of several compounds thought to function as antioxidants, including chrysin, pinobanksin, vitamin C, catalase, and pinocembrin.[24][25][vague] The specific composition of any batch of honey depends on the flowers available to the bees that produced the honey.[23]

Typical honey analysis]].[26]

Fructose: 38.2%

Glucose: 31.3%

Sucrose: 1.3%

Maltose: 7.1%

Water: 17.2%

Higher sugars: 1.5%

Ash: 0.2%

Other/undetermined: 3.2%

 

Basically, it's not that different from sugar. Neither is agave nectar.

 

This video explains a lot more about various sugars (fructose etc) but is 90 minutes long:

 

 

[Guest]

Thanks, gals. I just found a blog that has helped me tremendously, too. I guess this will be a learning process. :)

[tex-mex]

I just met with my registered dietician today (appt for my endocrinologist for diabetes) and I asked about the agave nectar. She told me it is the same as sugar. Not a sugar substitute. Folks think because it is organic it is better than sugar... but unfortunately, both are the same thing. I was disappointed. HTH

Edited January 8, 2010 by tex-mex

[DarlaS]

When making changes like this, remember you need to give it time also. You will not believe how much your tastebuds will change.

 

I have quit refined sugars, and am even drinking smoothies now with 2-3 oz of greens, 2 servings of fruit (like an orange and some berries), water and NO added sweeteners. If I add anything, it's over the top sweet and I can't stand it. It didn't take long at all and I became much more sensitive to the natural sweetness almost all foods have.

[Aggie]

As I understand it, the honey that is bad for you is the refined, runny, squeeze-it-from-the-bear kind. It has to do with the refining and heating process - it breaks down the molecular structure of the honey and it ends up in the same category as all the other refined stuff (like sugar, white flour, etc). I've also heard of manufacturers mixing it with other ingredients, like high fructose corn syrup, for a longer shelf life (because they've destroyed the honey itself, which has an indefinite shelf life in its pure form). Raw honey, on the other hand, is unprocessed and in its pure form has many benefits. Its usually soft, but kind of solid (you need a spoon or you can heat the jar in a pot of warm water to make it runny). Look for local honey if you can it before ordering it from other states.

 

I'm not positive, but I believe in your case maple syrup may be fair game. Again, though, you will want to look for pure maple syrup.

 

The bears are sold to and used by local pure-honey producers, too. =)

 

By law, if HFCS is an ingredient in a honey-blend, it must be listed as an ingredient.

 

I haven't researched it at all, but if agave nectar changes the blood sugar/insulin levels, honey may also.

 

Darla is right about the taste buds! 3 days of no sugar and fruits taste like sugar-bombs!

[LauraGB]

The bears are sold to and used by local pure-honey producers, too. =)

 

:blush5:

 

But, doesn't it need to be heated to a really high temp to get it to maintain its liquid form?

 

By law, if HFCS is an ingredient in a honey-blend, it must be listed as an ingredient.

 

 

I would certainly think so, too. But I was talking to a local beekeeper a while ago and he told me that a leading commercial manufacturer (I don't want to mention the exact name) gets its honey from all different sources/countries and the "mixing" gets done in these other countries, then shipped to the US plant listed as just "honey", so the US company *really* wouldn't be at fault if an analysis was conducted and it was found the honey wasn't pure. Who knows? Maybe he just wanted me to keep buying his honey. :tongue_smilie:

[Aggie]

:blush5:

 

But, doesn't it need to be heated to a really high temp to get it to maintain its liquid form?

 

 

 

I would certainly think so, too. But I was talking to a local beekeeper a while ago and he told me that a leading commercial manufacturer (I don't want to mention the exact name) gets its honey from all different sources/countries and the "mixing" gets done in these other countries, then shipped to the US plant listed as just "honey", so the US company *really* wouldn't be at fault if an analysis was conducted and it was found the honey wasn't pure. Who knows? Maybe he just wanted me to keep buying his honey. :tongue_smilie:

 

No, it doesn't need to be heated unless it get very cold. During harvesting some is heated gently to get it off the frames.

 

I've not heard about the mixing in other countries. That's scary, really.

[Slartibartfast]

 

I would certainly think so, too. But I was talking to a local beekeeper a while ago and he told me that a leading commercial manufacturer (I don't want to mention the exact name) gets its honey from all different sources/countries and the "mixing" gets done in these other countries, then shipped to the US plant listed as just "honey", so the US company *really* wouldn't be at fault if an analysis was conducted and it was found the honey wasn't pure. Who knows? Maybe he just wanted me to keep buying his honey. :tongue_smilie:

 

I have heard similar things from local beekeepers. The honey brand they mentioned is carried in stores as "local" but they mix local honey with honey that is imported.

[mom2abcd]

It depends on your purpose. If you're diabetic, sugar and honey are no-nos. If you're watching blood sugar levels, honey is better than sugar. Turbinado sugar or sucanat are less processed sugars and are better for everyone than regular bleached sugar.

 

Stevia is a sweetener that hasn't been mentioned yet that doesn't mess with your blood sugar levels and is not so highly processed. It works best in liquids, but there are recipes out there for other things, too.

 

I went off sugar for a year to build up my adrenal system, etc., adding honey only the last few months. I felt better than I had in years and lost 30 pounds without trying. I should do it again, but as you can imagine, in this day and age it's not the easiest thing to do.

[tex-mex]

It depends on your purpose. If you're diabetic, sugar and honey are no-nos. If you're watching blood sugar levels, honey is better than sugar. Turbinado sugar or sucanat are less processed sugars and are better for everyone than regular bleached sugar.

 

Forgive me for jumping in here... but I am diabetic (I posted earlier about seeing my registered dietician). I am allowed to have sugar and honey. Diabetes is controlled via meds, exercise and diet. For myself, I limit my total carb count to 15-30 grams per meal. I eat 6 small meals a day. Obviously, it is prudent for me to conserve my numbers of carbs by switching to a sugar substitute to allow myself more variety to enjoy in the meal. But I do enjoy sugar and honey, trust me. LOL ;) Good news on today's A1C -- 5.9 level -- but I still have to take metformin 2x a day and monitor my blood glucose 3x's a day as family history of diabetes is strong on both mom/dad's side. (Years ago, I was diagnosed with Type II that had an A1C of 7.2)

 

BTW, the dietician says the raw sugar and sucanat is just the same as sugar. No difference.

 

Stevia is a sweetener that hasn't been mentioned yet that doesn't mess with your blood sugar levels and is not so highly processed. It works best in liquids, but there are recipes out there for other things, too.

 

 

We spoke about Stevia and other sweeteners. I find it gives me headaches. The dietician agreed with me and said it does happen to certain diabetics. Quite common. I also find I am very sensitive to Splenda (migraines), Equal, or any Aspartame product. I like Sweet n' Low as it gives me no side effects after 6 years of using it. Malitol works great too. Xylitol is also good -- but can give me the runs. Hehehe. ;)

Edited January 8, 2010 by tex-mex

[Peela]

Most sweeteners are concentrated forms of energy and should be limited. However, I have done a lot of study of this over the years, both reading and seeing what affects my body.

Table sugar- whether white or raw, is not so good. Just pure calories really.

Agave has been touted as a new kind of wonder sugar because it doesnt raise blood sugar the way sugar does...but thats only because it is almost 100% fructose. Fructose has to be converted by the liver first, which is why it doesn't immediately spike blood sugar- it's a slower process...but its not any better for your body- it's a strain on the liver....anything high in fructose has that affect and is not exactly good for you. Except fruit...because its not so concentrated and it is in its natural state.

I feel that honey isnt too bad in small quantities because it is also in a fairly natural state...if you have good quality honey. Here in Western Australia we have some of the best honey in the world because of our isolation. I visited an apiary yesterday and bought a kg of organic bee pollen and 6 kgs of organic honey from the man who collects it himself. He told me how he does it and I just love buying it from him. But its not something I will eat much of. I have been off sugar for 18 months and feel much better for it- I feel ready to add in a little honey. Never cook or heat honey though. It changes it into a different substance that isnt healthy.

Any of the more natural sugars like honey and maple syrup are a definite step up from sugar- they are real foods that our ancestors have eaten for thousands of years. The less processed something is, the more your body can deal with it, unless your body is already pretty unhealthy.

Agave is made with a chemical processing method- even organic, raw agave. Its not as "natural" as it is made out to be. But for all that, I have some in my cupboard because I dont mind cooking with it occasionally.

There is another product called xylitol which I have used at times. It is processed but comes from plants. It doesn't spike blood sugar and I dont think it has many calories either. It can be used just like sugar. I havent yet seen any information that points to any problems with it- in fact it seems to be quite healthy and is used a lot in some countries. I like to study these things so I have read quite a bit. The thing that turns me off it is actually the look- it looks like white sugar- probably fantastic for many people, but I dont like it and i dont want my family eating something that looks like white sugar. But perhaps I should get over that.

If you want to give up sugar...well, I did it 18 months ago and it was easist to do it cold turkey, otherwise just a bit would set me off to bingeing. But I did find that having some dates or other dried fruits around, or sweet fruits, helped me get past the worst of it. I didnt binge on them, or not often, but if I was really craving, they did the trick to get me past that.

[Peela]

 

BTW, the dietician says the raw sugar and sucanat is just the same as sugar. No difference.

 

 

 

 

I agree...no difference EXCEPT that it still has some of the minerals attached to it that help balance it, such as chormium, which helps balance blood sugar and stop cravings. But, generally speaking, no difference.

 

If you are on medication...you can eat sugar because you are balancing the effect with the medication. Not necessarily the ultimate best thing to do for your body though.

[SquirrellyMama]

Here is what I have found with honey. As far as calories go I think it is very similar to white sugar. When I eat white sugar I go on a sugar binge and I cannot get enough. I can feel the reaction to white sugar. Honey doesn't give me those same cravings. I cannot feel the reaction I get with white sugar. When I use honey I use much less than I would with white sugar.

[Guest]

So, Peela -

 

if a recipe (say muffins) called for honey, would you use agave nectar instead? Or is there something better (and equal in consistency?) that you would substitute?

[Peela]

So, Peela -

 

if a recipe (say muffins) called for honey, would you use agave nectar instead? Or is there something better (and equal in consistency?) that you would substitute?

 

Yes, I would use agave instead of honey in a cooked recipe because honey should not be cooked, in my understanding, but both a probably fairly equivalent in terms of sweetness and consistency. In a raw recipe, I would use either agave or honey...at the moment my preference is honey because I feel it is less processed and a more natural food. Sometimes honey crystallises...I would still prefer it.

[Denisemomof4]

I'm trying to cut out all refined sugar. I was told to use honey or agave nectar instead. After searching today on the internet, it sounds like honey is no better than refined sugar. Can someone clarify? Why am I cutting out refined sugar? :glare:

 

honey has HUGE health benefits if you buy the right kind. You need to get some unrefined (heated at lower temps as to not alter the natural state of it) raw honey. I buy mine from VT but you need to get yours from an area close to you. That way it's healthiest for you. Sometimes I have to pick out little parts (wings, legs) but I don't mind. They're usually at the top anyway.

 

I used to belong to a whole foods group. We'd share recipes and recipe flops, etc. I asked why I was using my expensive, low heat processed honey in baked goods? Didn't it ruin the health benefits of the honey? It was the only question never answered. Anyway, I used maple syrup regularly as a sugar substitute.

[HollyDay]

I'm researching this too. From what I understand, local grown raw honey has some benefit for allergies, immune system etc. Since it has some benefit, it is "better" than sugar which has no benefits.

 

Agave is supposed to have a lower GI. Which is supposed to help with sugar spikes which is supposed to be better for weight loss. Not at all sure of the science there..... My doc said it is processed and does not have the benefits that honey has, so he didn't recommend it.

 

Stevia is heavily processed. I was advised to cut it out completely since it was a processed "food". I noticed a significant reduction in headaches and fatigue when I cut it out. Not sure if that is from stopping the Stevia or not, but I'll take it :).

 

Blackstrap molasses has some great health benefits - iron and calcium for 2. I would prefer to use that for sweetener. It is very high calorie though and doesn't taste all that great. The midwife wants me to get 1-2T per day leading up to my cycle. I generally manage a T every other day or so. It is good in hot tea or mixed with hot almond milk.

 

Good for you making these changes!!! Keep it up!!!

[Dawn in OH]

Here is what I have found with honey. As far as calories go I think it is very similar to white sugar. When I eat white sugar I go on a sugar binge and I cannot get enough. I can feel the reaction to white sugar. Honey doesn't give me those same cravings. I cannot feel the reaction I get with white sugar. When I use honey I use much less than I would with white sugar.

 

I had this same experience.

[The Governess]

I use:

 

Honey in my tea, oatmeal, on biscuits

Maple syrup to sweeten breads and obviously on pancakes. :)

Agave if I don't want a honey or maple syrup flavor to come through

Sugar if I'm not sure how to substitute one of the above.

 

Are you just trying to reduce your sugar consumption? I think all of the above are classified as refined carbs and should only be consumed in small quantities. Agave doesn't give you the blood sugar spike but I have heard that it is a highly processed food, as processed as corn syrup. Honey and maple syrup are the least processed but they affect your blood sugar the same as white sugar would. So for me, the best choice is no sweetener at all, followed by honey or maple syrup, followed by agave, followed by basic everyday sugar.

 

I have also heard that concentrated fruit juice and even dried fruit is no better. :glare:

 

We are finishing up the last of our Christmas treats around here and then it is time to get back to low-sugar diets.

[Dawn in OH]

I'm trying to cut out all refined sugar. I was told to use honey or agave nectar instead. After searching today on the internet, it sounds like honey is no better than refined sugar. Can someone clarify? Why am I cutting out refined sugar? :glare:

 

Honey is just about the ONLY sweetener that isn't processed, providing that you are are buying raw honey. Raw honey is usually what you purchase from your local beekeeper/honey vendor. Honey purchased in grocery stores is usually processed honey.

 

All the other "liquid" sweeteners (maple syrup, agave nectar, yacon syrup, sucanat, evaporated cane juice) have all been heated (processed). The more processed an item it is, the more of it's natural nutrients it looses and the chemical changes caused by the heating process alters the affects of the food on the body.

 

For instance, Agave nectar, while it low glycemic, it is unusually high in fructose. Fructose is believed to interfere with copper metabolism, is processed strictly in the liver rather than all the cells and therefor contributing to liver damage, fructose may contribute to diabetic conditions, can cause an increase in uric acid, contribute to accelerated aging and make you fat.

 

The problem with the refined sugar is that it has been depleted of it's vitamins and minerals (during the refining process). What is left is pure, refined carbohydrates and the body cannot properly utilize this without the proper proteins, vitamins and minerals.

 

If I had to make a choice of sweeteners I would go with honey. It's the most natural and least harmful to the body. I however am not that disciplined and continue to consume some sugar. In small quantities, and generally only in homemade items. I probably do consume far less sugar than the average American, but I do still like a slice of cake or a cookie now and then.

[mcconnellboys]

As I understand it, honey is a more complex sugar and takes the body longer to break down, which requires more energy usage, so it's not as bad as refined sugar. Also, locally made, raw honey has properties that are very beneficial in other ways. We take it for seasonal allergies and have recommended it to friends who also have had good success with it. Honey also seems to facilitate absorption of nutrients from other things it's added to, such as tea. So honey is much more complex in terms of its benefits it might first appear to be.

[Guest]

This is all very informative and I thank you! I am currently searching for a local honey farm (?) or Farmer's Market so I can get some of this yummy stuff! Thank you all!

[EKS]

From a biochemistry standpoint, sucrose (table sugar) is simply a glucose and fructose stuck together. Free fructose has a lower glycemic index (22) than either sucrose (44) or glucose (100). The thing with honey is that it averages about half fructose and half glucose (by way of sugar content; there are other things in it as well) so you're getting the "zing" of that free glucose. But different honeys have different ratios and so the glycemic index can range from something like 30-70.

[JeneralMom]

DS5 and I are hypoglycemic and react really badly to processed sugars so I stay with raw honey (great for allergies if you can get it local), maple syrup and stevia. We just use it in very minimal amounts.

 

Here is an interesting blog post on agave nectar - I have never used it and will avoid it like I avoid HFCS (like the plague, that is).