OK then, maybe this could help me find out if there's been much of a content change. Here's part of a review from amazon on the old editions describing the assignments: In this series, each lesson is covered over a 5-day period. Day 1: Warm Up and Warm Up test which consists of a reading selection that uses the spelling words in context. The Warm Up test (called "On Your Mark") guides your student through the pretest and helps them self-assess their spelling Day 2 and 3 - Game Plan: consists of a written spelling rule, a presentation of the list words and a variety of activities that emphasize word meanings. During these days students will be given lots of practice with the List Words. Also included are dictionary skill activities and puzzles. Day 4: Flex Your Spelling Muscles: consists of a writing exercise and challenge words. Day 5: Spelling test is administered Other than the sports references, does that look pretty much the same? TIA!

Rainbow Resource sells both editions and notes a difference between them. Their notes are not specific enough for me to know if the format of the lessons has changed in the new editions or if it has simply eliminated sports references. I've never seen either in person. Which is better: the older editions (1994ish) or newer (2000-something), and why?

Peek, you picked up on exactly what I was trying to be vague about - illegal immigrants. As for other countries that have done well enforcing against this type of healthcare insurance fraud... I'd have to research that. Norway? Sweden? My dad was recently discussing one of those countries and how it is very socialist, but not communist. They've made their system one that works well precisely because they do not allow non-payers to particitpate in the system (i.e., illegal immigrants). This from a man who is usually staunchly opposed to any form of socialism; so they must have something figured out over there.

but I'd like to add this: To help the problem (obviously it will never be completely eliminated) of freeloader on any healthcare system, there should be heavy penalty for fraud, and the allowance for enforcement and penalty should be broadened to catch more of it. This would free up money to be used legally. The problem with some of the current healthcare proposals is that while they (one proposal inparticular) explicitly prohibit certain types of "freeloading", they don't have any verbage allowing for enforcement of those prohibitions. That is why some people think the notion that the proposed plan is protected from those certain freeloaders is a LIE.

They will have access to regular mail service, right? If so, publications like Which Way USA from Highlights magazine would be good for Geography. She'll need to get some basics before starting - a dictionary, a globe/atlas/good map, maybe some good "spines" for what she plans her children's content studies to be for the next couple years (ex. a Planet Earth encyclopedia if they'll be doing earth science, etc.). This would be a helpful supplement to any history, science, etc. since internet isn't an option. I honestly don't know how to suggest a 'classical' way to begin homeschooling, cheaply, in that situation. I'm sure others can lend some knowledge. AO comes to mind first, but that does rely on either having a library nearby or purchasing some books (they do have a minimized list for those on a budget). She'd have to print everything she can before moving out there. She could do straight Abeka with them for everything, maybe spicing up the history, science, and art with other books/projects. CLE is fairly cheap too. VP and SL come to mind if I had to order everything all at once for a 2 year period and be done ordering at once. They are most definately not cheap by my definition though. When she's at the library in the next town over, she could place online orders from Amazon as needed. Surely someone else has better suggestions?

Found it! To search the thread, it's titled "The Complete Writer: Writing With Ease (WWE)--All Separate Threads Merged Here". Here's the specific Q&A we were looking for, starting with my question and then SWB's answer: "Well that makes sense to me. So much so, that I've been tempted to just toss the idea of using a WWE workbook for level 3 when we get there, and just use passages from our content subjects. It's the WWE workbook that throws me into this confusion. It's convenient and all done for me, which I love, love, love. But, it does add an extra subject to our schoolday by having a separate subject for writing. I'm working with grammar stage kiddos, so there's not any outlining being done yet. WWE (the workbook) covers the copywork, narration, narration/dictation, and dictation in that order over 4 days - but on literature passages that we aren't using anywhere else in our studies. I just realized that I should restate my question: If one is using the WWE *workbooks*, then are they supposed to practice all those skills again in content subjects as well? That would double the amount of work required of the child. Or is the child supposed to be first doing those within a separate writing program and then also using them on content subjects? If I were just using the WWE textbook, it wouldn't be an issue for me. I would just use passages from the kids' sci., hist., and lit. It just looks like a ton of work trying to find specific literary and grammatical elements as WWE suggests, esp. when I limit the text options to the kids' content subjects. __________________ arcticmomView Public ProfileSend a private message to arcticmomFind all posts by arcticmomAdd arcticmom to Your Contacts # 410 05-24-2009, 03:06 AM Susan Wise Bauer The Overmind Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Virginia Posts: 436 If you're using the workbook, you would absolutely cut down on the number of narrations you're doing in history/science/lit. You wouldn't want to eliminate them, because they have value for those subjects, but you wouldn't want to double the child's workload. Not to work myself out of a sale but I think it's ideal to use the WWE textbook and do what it says WITH your history/lit/science. Writing should be something, in the best case scenario, that's taught along with the other subjects in the curriculum. But it does take both time and ease with the process, which is why we publish the workbooks. If it helps, I'm using the workbooks with DD8 and doing less in history/lit/science. Yes, it would be ideal to only use passages from history/lit/science. But I did all the research and prep already in the workkbook and don't really want to do it all again. Plus, this way my husband can help out with the writing instruction too. :001_smile:" ETA I'm printing this portion out so that when I forget what I'm supposed to be doing (how does that happen?), I can just look over at where I'm going to tack it to the wall and see the answer!

I don't have answers for all your questions, but I can point you to a thread here called "All WWE threades merged here" (or something like that). You can do a search for WWE and it should come up. As for your question on whether to do both WWE and the narrations/writing for history and literature - that used to confuse me as well. I asked Susan in the thread mentioned above and she answered it. I've already forgotten the answer as I am continually going in circles in my head about this. I will go look it up since I need the answer too. :)

Surely in such a large city there's a bookstore that sells/buys/trades used books, including partially used curriculum and hands-on stuff? I only ask because in my tiny town there is, so I figure there's got to be there in OC. At mine, when I bring things in, they give me credit for it towards the purchase of other used books/items. Even if I don't get much credit or any at all for mostly-used items, I know other families who like to pick things like that up to use the pages for review or supplement. It's worth googling or looking up otherwise. I agree that Goodwill would be better than trashing it.

I agree w/ all that's been said of both so far. I can't answer personally for SL as I haven't used it, but I have seriously researched it. I'm using WP AS 1 & 2 this year and next b/c my sons really wanted American History. I can't stress enough how true the comment about WP's shipping is. I plan to order WP AS 2 for next year (our new year starts late Aug/early Sept.) starting in MARCH, just to make sure we get everything in w/ time for me to look it over before we start. I really liked SOTW best, and we'll be going back to that after our 2-year rabbit trail. It felt far more open-and-go to me; there was no re-scheduling or having to decide what we have time for from a huge list, etc.; even though there is sometimes a long list to pick from. Somehow the format just made more sense and felt easier. I liked the projects in SOTW. My library never had *everything* from the additional reading lists in it, so we were never able to be overloaded. I did pick up everything available, but only scheduled ONE add'l readaloud per chapter plus I assigned a book to my then 2nd grader to read on his own. I let the boys peruse the other books at their leisure. It has questions in the Activity Guide that lead the child to a summary-style narration, building the ability to pick out important facts from among all the details. I really miss that; it's hard to replicate on my own w/ the WP books. SOTW includes maps, coloring pages, neat hands-on projects, etc. There's my 2 cents anyhow. :)

Just checked - CBD.com has CWP levels 2 & 6, Sonlight has levels 1 & 2 - for anyone looking for them.

I'd never heard of any of these tricks, so I just made up my own when my 13-yr. old was little: For b: "The bat hits the ball" (because we read from L to R, the stick hits the ball, and both start w/ "b") For d: "The dog chases the stick" (again, look at the parts of the letter from L to R, the little ball of the d is the "dog" and that starts w/ "d") Wish I had known about some of these others when I needed them!

I voted "other" and "I use multiple programs". I use Abeka penmanship books, and teach from those. I modify some of the manuscript letter formation to be a smoother, one-stroke movement for forming a letter (for ex. lowercase d) rather than teaching to make ball, pick up pencil, then make a stick - this would not transition well to cursive. So I guess I borrow a little from Zaner-Bloser's idea on that, but I don't own any of their materials. I do, however, go to the ZB site once in awhile for their free make-your-own printable worksheet feature. The ZB style & Abeka's are so very close (esp. since I teach to make a letter w/ as few strokes as possible) that this works for us. I can type in whatever I want my kids to trace/copy and print it out on K - 6th (I think?) lined paper in manuscript or cursive. I also sometimes just hand-copy a Bible verse or something else onto blank student-lined paper and have the kids copy it. My kids do best having a model of exactly how theirs is supposed to look as opposed to copying directly from the Bible or another book. As if that wasn't enough, I also just this year bought Presidential Penmanship in Abeka-style (Zeezok pub. sells it in many, many styles), but haven't so much as popped the CD into the computer yet. It was nice in theory; maybe we'll get to it one of these days, or years. The CD has k-8 on it. I would never do all of this at once. In fact, I sometimes allow copywork from another subject (usually WWE) to double as penmanship when it comes up. They only have 1 penmanship assignment per day, in which they are to concentrate on correct formation and neatness.

Something I plan to look into for logic stage grammar is MCT's grammar from Royal Fireworks Press. Since I don't own it, I can't comment on it all that much. I do know it's a workbook approach, but of a different approach. Not scripted like FLL, but also not simply a dry grammar textbook/workbook. There are different levels and all of Michael Clay Thompson's stuff (MCT) was written for gifted kids, though many use them at their own pace. The website to check it out and see samples is www . rfwp . com (spaces removed). You can also do a search here for "MCT" and a lot of threads should pop up. I hope you find the right fit for your dd!

It's threads like these that make me so glad that I found this forum. All these combined years of experience speak volumes to those of us w/ younger children or are otherwise "new to it". I am really grateful to you, OhElizabeth, Momof7, Moni, and others that I can't recall this early in the a.m. I glean so much from you all and just wanted to say thanks. By your combined input I am reassured in my gut instinct to play more math games, demonstrate math concretely, and focus on a good foundation in the basics. Who would have thought a science thread would have pushed me off the fence about whether to study Latin? We'll be doing it by 4th grade. PS: I'll "2nd" that book Sagira mentioned: "Homeschooling for Excellence" by Miki Colfax. It was the first "real" homeschool book I read that started me on this journey. Also, for anyone interested, R.E.A.L. science is neutral but has a list of resources in the front of the TM for teaching evolution. Ring of Fire Science is neutral/secular, as Myrna writes these for use in all schools, public schools included.

If I'm recalling correctly, TWTM recommends dropping additional writing exercises from FLL, since you're doing writing w/ WWE. Oral narration couldn't hurt, and that is not a regular thing in FLL; it is in WWE. For my kiddos I just do what they need. If ds needs extra reinforcement in a FLL concept then we're doing the additional 'optional' thing at the end of the lesson. If WWE & his other subjects have a lot of writing that day, I'll try to do the FLL writing orally with him, if at all possible. If it's a day when there isn't much WWE writing, then I go ahead and assign the FLL writing. If a FLL lesson is just narration, and you're doing WWE, you're right in your guess that you could drop it w/o missing anything. HTH!

Thanks! I just added it to my faves w/ this note: "Meaty Science Supplement". My husband will wonder if we're planning on learning about butchering meat or something when he sees that, lol.

Denise, there was a thread with a LOT of spelling info. about a week ago titled "Anyone NOT love AAS?". It was pretty long and would tell you the ins and outs of AAS, plus give info on other programs some people prefer & why. I am still using AAS for now, plus personal lists of misspelled words for ea. kid.

This has been an informative read; I've been taking notes for future years. Right now I'm using R.E.A.L. Science Odyssey Earth & Space and find it spot-on for my 1st grader, and easy for my 3rd grader. I have added all sorts of 'rabbit-trail' info as we go. I showed them pictures of water molecules, bonds between molecules, and surface tension after learning about water vapor/humidity. I want to expand on that since they were so interested. For my 1st grader, additional science books he reads are really more for practicing reading (easy beginning readers). My 3rd grader gets assigned science reading and is expected to retain and narrate back what he has read. I also read aloud to them together. At the beginning of the R.E.A.L. curriculum is a booklist & website list for each unit. I got all the books for unit 1 from the library - some I schedule in but most sit in book baskets for the boys to read/look at on their own. I plan to utilize the websites at the end of a lesson or the end of a unit. We only officially do science 2 days per week, but the science reading is all week long. It is a natural part of the rest of our lives, as well. Last night we stayed outside late star-gazing and talking about space, the moon, satellites, etc. This topic is largely why I am piecing together many curricula this year - I wouldn't have purchased so many to do it; I just had them from previous years and found some good deals on used ones. Ring of Fire earth science by Myrna Martin takes geology in-depth. I've got an older version of it on loan from a friend and it looks fun & challenging for my boys' ages. She offers higher levels but I don't think she's done high school yet. Myrna is a scientist who writes these for use in any school setting - public, private, or hs. The site is sciencekitsforkids.com. The only things I remember from my elementary science studies are the few hands-on projects we did. I learned more from growing up in the Alaskan forest living a subsistance lifestyle, which says alot for nature-based studies.

Actually it does. But these are made of solid real wood, not particle board. I think. I assume - because there are other pix on the site of the dovetail joints. I don't know what the finishes they use have in them though. Phooey. Yes, normally my PBT catalog goes straight to the recycle bin too, and I don't know why I had to open it up and see that they still sell those shelf units I wanted years ago. I'm in the middle of trying to organize things around here so these looked especially appealing. Oh well.

:lol::lol::lol:

Colleen, I agree that expository/persuasive writing takes priority over creative. I'm just second-guessing if I should have started off with WWE from the get-go. I guess my question is more about what WWE's intent is: was it meant for kids who are clearly writing-phobic? I never gave my kids a chance to show me whether they are or not before deciding on WWE. I like it, esp. since it's easy to do. But that's my preference for me, the teacher. Does it sound like I've misunderstood what SWB was getting at in the grammar stage writing section of WTM about this? I'm trying to understand how I should have gone about choosing a writing program in the first place. Thanks for the reassurance, Colleen!

While I'm at it, I saw that Nestof3 and Merry got to be greedy & list more than 1, so I get to also. :D I should send a copy to Santa, or walk across the main road & hand it to him. 1. Psychgal's Home/Life Organizer, once she's done - or a clone of the organizer would do - and maybe they should stick around to make sure the house doesn't get messy again. :) 2. jetted hot tub/sauna - an indoor set and an outdoor set 3. that massuesse (sp?) mentioned above 4. Those Pottery Barn shelves I posted on the curriculum board, all 3 sets 5. pottery barn stuff for the rest of the entire house 6. Granite - Emerald something or another, and one w/ blues. All throughout the house. Shoot, carve me some tubs and sinks out of the stuff. 7. Lipo, full body lift, and a safe way to be put under until recovery is complete (forget guts!) 8. for DH to not be on call all the time, or at least a predictable schedule 9. solar panels atop a large home on a mountaintop w/ a view of Mt. McKinley 10. willpower against the almighty chocolate Umm... what was the original question again? Wasn't it something about "little luxuries"? lol Ok, ok, how about just a haircut and a pair of jeans that fit decently.

^ I could have written that! Glad to know I'm not the only one that shudders at those things, in a happy-I'm-not-alone way, not a happy-you-have-it-too way. ;)

Well, this became a long thread; good discussion. It has me wondering now if I've picked the wrong spelling program for my sons. I picked AAS based on what matched what I was familiar with (which was Abeka). I didn't realize AAS is for remedial use (is this its' intent? or just a bonus that it works well for this?). If AAS was indeed written for more remedial use, then I have got the wrong program. Shouldn't I try SWO or SP 1st to see if those go well? I never even gave them, or anything like them, a chance. We're still going ahead w/ what we've got for now (AAS 1 & 2, fast-tracked) plus personal trouble-words lists. I'm just looking ahead here. This whole "remedial" aspect has thrown a new wrench in my thinking entirely. Thanks for putting up with my continual mental back-and-forth swings. ;P

I have a new question. Well, one I haven't asked yet; perhaps someone else already has. I'm using WWE 2 with my 8yo son who isn't completely writing-phobic. I just read over the grammar stage writing section of WTM 3rd rev. last night & saw that WWE is best for kids who get stuck or are "pencil phobic". While I don't think I could give him a minimal starter (ex. "Write a page about your best friend") without great frustration, he does write on his own as part of playing. Both he and my 6yo ds write pretend menus, ballots, campaign posters, etc. in playing with their stuffed animals. I chose WWE w/o connecting the dots between all of this info. - the target audience for WWE & my son's writing habits. Have I chosen the wrong program for this child? Am I at all holding him back by not putting him in Writing Strands, IEW, etc.? Or will the outcome be basically the same by logic stage if I continue w/ WWE all the way through?