WTM, and classical education in general WWE & FLL A Beka Lang. Arts & Math Horizons Math

If you are going to be looking at the books anyways, that would be great! Thanks!

Amy, :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:! I was an Army wife for 10 years (dh is out now). I didn't read all 4 pages but you've got some very good advice here. It's going to be a tough decision either way. In your situation, I'd be inclined to stay put until he gets back from deployment for the reasons you cited - that you know you don't make new connections quickly, family & friends are where you are now, your pet, and your dd's two-yr degree. Are you located near a military base where you could connect w/ other military wives? It's not easy, but it's a road many have walked - so you can do this too. It is possible. Just keep telling yourself that - that's what I had to do. PM me if you'd like another email address for another empathetic shoulder to cry on or just an ear to listen to you. :001_smile:

How many of you that have used or are using R.E.A.L. Science (Pandia Press) Earth & Space used the recommended spines and additional reading books (some are marked "highly recommended") that are listed at the beginning of the program? I'm just wondering how much I can get away with not buying. :D I have The Usborne Encyclopedia of Planet Earth (not internet-linked) and the Usborne First Encyc. of Space. There are alot of additional resource suggestions listed on pages 11-14 of this R.E.A.L. program. I'm thinking about getting 1 main general Science Encyc., 1 general illustrated dictionary of science, 1 main spine ea. for earth & space, and then just using whatever my library has of these titles plus whatever related books I already own (but not necessarily the exact titles) for the rest. Do you think we'll be missing out on alot by doing that? My library is very hit-and-miss about what they have. I don't mind buying a few things, but it would add up to hundreds of dollars if I bought the whole list! TIA!

I use Horizons math because of what I consider it's medium easy-going pace (JMO, keep in mind this is in comparison to ABeka). It's still rigorous and ahead of my ps district's math. K will cover addition and subtraction concepts with some other ideas such as indtroducing perimeter, etc. thrown. I use Horizons because it doesn't overwhelm my sons and they really love the colorful pages & illustrations. Knowing now what I do, I would have definately started the K math when they were 4 1/2. They were both hungry for math at that age though and loved it. The pages didn't take long at all at that age for my guys. IF it were taking a large chunk of time, I'd have put it aside. With my older son I used it more as a guide for what to teach w/ hands-on activities. We did the problems with marbles or base ten blocks/rods and played alot of math games. HTH!

Yes! I've wondered about this too - it seems to begin earlier and earlier every year, and now it runs into June in alot of places. It used to be Sept. - May. I have a theory about this, much along the lines of Gatto's. :)

We're finishing Atelier 1 and then moving onto 2, finishing it as well this year. The art assignements are not open-ended at all; in fact they have the child do as instructed. They use these lessons to teach art concepts - primary colors, secondary colors, color wheel, line thickness & the effects of thick or thin lines, etc. They incorporate study of great artists as well; get the art prints if you pick Atelier. I augment both aspects of it; the art instruction & the art history/artist study/picture study parts. We do the art lesson & read the artist bio from Atelier on 'day 1' of a lesson. I take an extra day to allow my kids to apply the concept they learned that week to anything their imaginations come up with (or if they want, by looking @ the pet fish, things outside, eachother, etc. as art subjects to draw/paint/etc.). Then I read them a book - I try to find well-illustrated children's books - about the artist we studied that week. This helps round it out, but art did spill over into the weekends this way. I can't comment on Artistic Pursuits b/c I've never seen it in person. I got to see artwork a friends' children did using Atelier and that sold me on it. She went on & on about how easy it is to do since it's on DVD. We pause the movie and go step-by-step too - only we set up a card table in the living room rather than run back & forth (but I plan to replace this carpet w/ hardwood in a few years - after that I might feel differently). HTH!

Curriculum alone: ~12 ft. Curriculum with all of the scheduled spines & additional resource books: ~34 ft., all of which is on the shelves right now. :D

I find laying it all out on the living room floor with ALL the books you plan to use or could possibly use for that subject spread out around you is what works for me. I take my spine(s) for that subject and divide by how many weeks/days that subject is to be done. Once you figure this out for each spine and each resource/project/additional reading book, jot it down on a post-it note and put it on the front of the book. That way you don't have to keep re-counting & dividing. Then I simply have a spiral paper notebook that starts with "Day 1". I write down the page #'s to do for the main textbook or spine(s), then add which labs, projects, additional reading, etc. underneath by writing the book title & which pages to find it on. If I have an idea for an activity or know a related website that isn't in a book, I jot that down too. If there are books that you know you want to use but are planning on getting them from the library (from a list in your main text or somewhere else), you'll need to gather all those titles & check your library's system to make sure they have them all. Ones they have you can put on hold a week or 2 in advance, but make note of it in your lesson plans. Ones they don't have, ask them to order. There's my "system", if you can call it that. I'm just a beginner at this though - I come from an open-and-go Abeka background, so I'm sure there's got to be a more tech-savvy & refined way of doing it. Check out acara's links in her siggy. They are helping me alot. HTH!

PBI w/ a hijack here, but Acara, I just looked at your REAL E&S Schedule. I've been working on a 2 day per week (with room for a book or project that spills over into the weekend) schedule for this. Thanks so much for sharing that! I just added it to my favorites. :)

We'll be starting most LA & math this week. Then I'll add a couple more subjects per week starting next week (week of the 10th) until we've got our full load going no later than 1st week of Sept. I thought it might be easier on the boys to ease into school, since we've been on break from everything but reading for a month. I'm still deciding what I go by. Part of me wants to stick to a traditional schoolyear w/ the summer off, but I'm toying w/ the idea of a 4-day week year round w/ breaks for holidays & maybe a 1 - 3 week break now and then. I've got this year planned for 36 - 38 wks w/ Fridays being a "light" day, and if we actually accomplish that, I'll still have my boys do something during the summertime so they don't forget everything. I'm not going to stress if we get a couple weeks behind during the year since I'm ok w/ summer schooling though. That's not much of a definite answer, is it? :D

The Burgess Seashore book by Thornton Burgess

I would have to clean for a cleaning lady/housekeeper! :D It's a super-small house w/ too much stuff, and we have boxes of things that we've been sorting to get rid in the middle of the living room. Nestof3, I noticed some good books on this topic up for swap on your paperbackswap bookshelf. I was tempted to ask about them but then I thought I'd better spend my time actually cleaning & not reading about cleaning if I'm ever going to get anywhere. ;)

My guys aren't ready to begin CW or IEW, but both are programs I have my eyes on for Logic stage. I ordered a used copy of CW Aesop A & the gal kindly threw in her dc's used student workbook for B. I flipped through it and loved what I saw; I knew CW was a top contender for logic-stage writing program. It did look like there would be a learning curve for me to get familiar w/ the program, but most programs that aren't scripted have that anyhow. I'm w/ dangermom on this - IEW is the one that interests yet scares me. I know it's a good program, but I really like a direct teacher's manual to go by. Just the idea that it's a workshop for me to learn to teach writing rather than a step-by-step open & go how-to manual makes my head spin, and I've never even seen it! :D I agree w/ the above poster about giving it a month. 2 weeks may be too short to really know. Best wishes!

I had this same problem with some OfficeMax brand pencils last year that were made in VietNam. No matter which way I sharpen them, they are junk. I just have a table-mounted hand crank sharpener for at home, and a little hand-held manual (looks like a cosmetic pencil sharpener) shaver/sharpener for on the go. Tigonderoga seems to be the sturdiest, though I got so many a couple years back that I haven't had to repurchase - so I haven't seen if the quality is different as of late as another poster said it might be. My kids loved it when we were out & about and broken pencils left us w/o a way to do schoolwork - hasn't happened since we switched brands. HTH!

I think I know what you mean about the final soft "g" - is it like beginning sound in the French word or phrase "j'emepelle"? (Sorry, my French is horrible, it's been since high school).

:grouphug: Thanks tink, Faith, & Pamela! Faith, I could just kiss you for scheduling my days out for me! Pam, I really like the idea of free reading right after the formal LA. I was trying to figure out a way to fit it into an afternoon rest time, but it just wasn't working w/ other things we've got going on. I just handed my boys a Highlights Puzzlemania book (this counts as semi-Logic or Pre-Logic, right?) in the car & they loved it. They assumed it was something fun to do while we were driving. I think I'll be able to slip in logic this way alot - keeping it fun. We have some thinking skills games on the way from RR, like Set, Duo, Rush Hour jr., etc. that will help. Yep - OPG/reader work and J's independent reading needs to just get moved on the official schedule to evening. That's when it usually happened anyhow. I don't think I can let go of math, though I can put a limit on it. I follow more of a WTM philosophy on that one. My boys really love having 'math lab' before they do their actual lesson. Thanks so much for the tips, ladies! What a nice suprise to come back here and find my problem solved. :)

While we're on the topic of the letter 'a' spoken by Canadians - I have a question for the Canadians here. My SIL (Ont.) says the word garage like this: GARE - uj (rhymes with carriage). I say it like this: gar (rhymes with car) - OJ. Is this a regional accent? There's been a few times she & I just couldn't figure out what the other was saying. :tongue_smilie:

I just put my kids' basic weekly schedules into an Excel doc. and can't believe that we'll really get all of it done. It looks like too much. Then on the accelerated learner board, people are talking about 2 hours being enough for 1st grade (and I believe that). So then, how did I end up with all this? Here's my schedules for C (1st) and J (3rd): C (1st) FLL 1: M - W WWE 1: M - Th AAS: M - Th Math: M - F Pre-Logic (games mostly): T OPG: M-F J (3rd) FLL: 5 lessons/week, M-Th to leave Fri. as "light day" WWE: 5 lessons/week, M-Th to leave Fri. as "light day" AAS: M-Th Math: M-F Logic: T Vocab/roots: M-TH or M, T, W Guitar: lesson 1x/wk, practice daily Both: Science: Th - F History: M - W Free Choice Reading: Sun - Sat. (daily) Assigned Reading: M-F (this would be reading practice w/ beginning readers for my 1st grader) Bible: daily w/ family in the evenings Character: M, W, F Penmanship: M - F Music appreciation/history: 1x/week plus review Art: 1-2x/week Spanish: M; review on T - F Nature Walks/Journaling: 1-2x/month PE: TKD 2x/wk I'll be combining subjects when and where possible - such as using WWE copywork for penmanship (on days that WWE schedules copywork). I'm thinking about just using the WWE guide so that most copywork/narrations/dictations will be from our history & science. That takes care of history and science questions & narrations. Assigned reading will frequently be tied in with other subjects. It just looks like so much. I totalled up how many subjects ea. boy will be doing per day and YIKES! Even last school year, it would take us about 6 hours to "do school". I'm bouncing back & forth between them for math & LA. It still just seems like alot. Any help? Encouragement? An "it just looks bigger on paper" would be great from someone who's BTDT. :D I'm just really nervous that this will feel like h#l1 to implement.

Well, I just asked my kids and I've got one vote for "Lego Academy" and one for "Alaska Bears Academy". Oh boy. Now ds8 says "How about the Lego Bears"? :D I think I'll pick the name myself.

I own both the guide and WWE1 & 2 workbooks, though you'd never know it my incessant WWE questions. :D The workbooks don't contain as much insight into the method or what grammar you're teaching w/ a certain piece of copywork. I bought the guide 1st, then for lack of confidence in finding appropriate passages and forming my own narration questions (I was new to the entire copywork/narration/dictation method) I bailed and got the workbooks. I like having the guide on the shelf too because it does lay out the long-term idea behind it all, and it lists exactly what to focus on for grammar (apparently that is just for the copywork, not for all passages for an entire week - Thank You Tara!). If I had to choose only one I'd choose the guide now that I realize the criteria for finding narration passages is looser than I thought. I could just hit myself with a 2-by-4 for that. :tongue_smilie: All this time I thought that the list of grammatical elements applied to the entire weeks' WWE work. I thought it all had to come from the same book. I'd choose the guide b/c I like to see the meaning behind the method. There are 36 pages before the beginning of Year 1 in the guide. Two of the sections that I know of are published online somewhere on the PHP site - Why Writing Programs Fail and The Three Stages. I like knowing what grammar from the sentence(s) to point out to my kiddos. I use the workbooks but refer to the guide to see what it is to point out to them that week. If it only takes one Saturday to plan the whole year (I've got a house brimming with books to choose from, too) I think I can do this. Thanks for all the help, Shelly, Tara, etc.!

Shelly, do you match up passages from your own books with the grammar suggestions in WWE? Isn't it hard to find the specific elements WWE is looking for sometimes? I really want to do this, but am afraid it would take FOR-EV-ER to find a passage with all the certain criteria listed in WWE from history or science books. How much time do you have to spend planning this out? (Thanks in advance!)

I know others have already commented on this, but I can't help but add my own personal experience here. My dh was military for over 10 years. When we got married, there was not base housing available (waitlist) so we had to get an apartment off-base. They did not increase his pay for having dependents or for BAH (to help pay for off-post housing, since base pay could not cover this plus basic necessities). He was getting $1,100/mo. and our rent was $600. That didn't leave much to live off of. That was just the first of many bad experiences we had with the Army. People are not lying when they say that the military healthcare is bad. Some military hospitals and/or Dr.'s are the exception to this, but as a rule, it is pretty bad. The sheer conditions in which I birthed my middle son were terrible, and my youngest was on the brink of death when they sent him home with me 4 days after birth. His only salvation was a breastfeeding consultant who talked me through procedures over the phone in the middle of the night. The military Dr.'s told me everything was fine, not to worry, etc. Then he peed orange dusty stuff. He was severely dehydrated. The story is long so I'll skip parts here. Turned out his tongue was tied and he couldn't suckle properly from anything - breast or bottle. They refused to cut it loose. I took him to every different Dr. in that place, incl. their oral surgeon. Same reply. My poor baby never got a full belly for his first 6 months. He could only drink what was manually injected or squirted into his mouth. I sat feeding him all. the. time. Since I wasn't going to let him become dehydrated and fed him in the only way he could eat, he was doing "OK" in their "expert" opinion. As soon as we moved to my Dh's next duty assignment the Dr.'s there were shocked and appalled that this had been allowed to go on for so long and said that they un-tie tongues right at birth. They scheduled a surgery immediately. I've delved into much more detail than I meant to, and I've rabbit-trailed. I want to add that we qualified for WIC the ENTIRE 10+ years dh was military, even after moving up the ranks. Veteran care is not what they promise soldiers, either. They send you off to war, ruin your mind and body, promise to be there to help cover any needed medical care or therapy and then try to find every single excuse not to cover it. My dh's claim was "being processed" for over 3 years while he was in pain daily. Of course he went to a civilian Dr. & paid out-of-pocket in the meantime b/c the condition couldn't be ignored. After many delays, they now say they have no record of him being in Somolia at all. :confused::001_huh: They say they need live witnesses to attest to the incident he wrote the claim for. Too bad those 2 guys committed suicide b/c they couldn't live with what they had seen. So no compensation for PTSD, busted knees and back. IMO our present-day army chews you up and spits you out. Just my 2 cents. ETA: Oh, and that GI Bill... it was far less back when my dh signed up than it is now. There were no 'sign-up bonuses' then either. The GI Bill has a use-it-or-lose-it date, an expiration date sort of. If they never allow you time away from work, training, the field, deployments, etc. because they own you, you don't get to use that GI Bill. Some higher-ups that are 'old-school' army can be ruthless about being at work 19 hours per day for weeks at a time. Time off, in my dh's case under that particular leader for 2 years, was spent in mandatory participation in unit fund-raising activities. We gave up alot, and the financial bit - big as it was - was only the beginning.

If all the politics were stripped away, I think most Americans agree on a basic level regarding how our country should be run, what life should be like for citizens, etc. It's these politicians who are so polarized against one another, and our choices are either here or there, no middle ground. I think politicians are in a fight for power against one another. Power that should be in OUR hands, not theirs. I DO believe that Americans, esp. young ones, should learn what their freedoms are and why their forefathers fought so hard for them before turning them over in the name of security, the greater good, or what have you.

Would CE I be too much for a 3rd grader who's never done a roots or vocab. program? I do plan to keep this program in mind for 4th/5th grade.