Wow, thanks for that- that's a lightbulb moment for me! And I was actually doing it anyway, through necessity. I am always amazed how Susan is so down to earth and can state the obvious and still surprise me with it! I actually feel relieved. I think my son will eventually do really well in the logic stage (he has developed a love of arguing!), and if he never gets to the rhetoric stage while at home with me...well, it's still a better education, and a better chance at a successful and rich life, than school would have given him.

It's interesting reading that other thread- what I realised is that the way we in Australia do highschool actually protects us from the build up that many people feel going from middle school to highschool. For us, there are two schools- primary school and highschool. Highschool starts in either year 7 or year 8, depending on the state you are in. There are some "senior highschools" nowadays which are just years 11 and 12. But overall, highschool is longer, and we don't have "middle school". So, each year is just a gradual jump from the previous ones, although perhaps some are bigger jumps than others. The big change is from primary to highschool, but the kids are 11 or 12 years old. The 3 WTM stages obviously correlate with the stages of school in the U.S. and we in Australia (and Britain I think) have always had to adapt it for us. But I can see that that concept of those big "jumps" may be intimidating. I kind of blend my stages into the next one...my kids are close in age, and we do some things together...I just keep moving my older onwards and try to keep challenging her as she matures....same with my son, who has matured more slowly. I must admit I dont worry too much about that big jump between Logic and Rhetoric stages and maybe it helps (someone out there) to remember that although you may have transcripts etc to worry about the change is arbritary in many ways, especially when you homeschool. The kids just keep going forward. I really like what JennW said about hormones at this time, and exploring interests. I find myself constantly trying to find that balance between academics and the rest of life, without sacrificing either. I like what Nan said about hands-on stuff too. My kids get a lot of that in Scouts, but I havent been good with it at home. That's partly why I still want to leave free time. I also subscribe to the mentality that says this is their life now, and I try not to sacrifice the present for the future too much (because adults tend to always live for the future and I don't think its healthy). However....I haven't had one go right through yet, and who knows what hindsight will show. I am not actually presuming either of mine will go to university, because I don't really see that as the be all and end all of their destiny, their direction, even their ability to earn money, even though I plan that they will be able to go if they choose. That changes how I do highschool because my focus isn't on getting them into the best university, getting scholarships etc. It feels freeing in terms of education, which ultimately isn't about getting into university, its about something more inner, about having a broad view of life, etc etc. All those things a classical education is supposed to be about. I will be interested what I think in a few years!

I am interested in what SWB has to say about children with learning issues- I seem to remember she was going to write some more about that in her new book.

We are on autumn break and dd14 just spent all of the first couple of days on her computer talking to friends. No self regulation at all (I was hoping!). When dh and I insisted she come for a walk with us in the evening, she sulked and pouted and spoiled the walk for us. So I have made a rule that she has a limit of 2 hours electronics, and she MUST spend at least a half hour getting some decent exercise outside before she starts her electronics. I have had to really talk to her about the importance of exercise. The electronics overstimulate her mind and everything else seems boring, especially walking, even though we live in a beautiful area. She chooses to ride her bike. I think I would do the same when she is 16. Perhaps you could leave when during the day up to her, but make other things dependent on her spending time outside first, to motivate her to get it done earlier in the day. Truly, you are still her parent and exercise and time outside are important habits to cultivate in our children. There is a whole generation of kids growing up with "nature deficit".

Its incredibly important to me. Central to my life, really. For my son....I think it is there, but it is not often expressed the way I might express it. He loves music. He loves me. He adores his snake. But he don't necessarily express his love as an appreciation of beauty- but I think it is there. But my daughter is like that too. Neither of my kids are nature lovers the way I was as a kid and still am. I have been thinking about that lately and realising it is really just a personality type. While I would walk for hours by myself in the bush as a child, my kids would think that was terribly boring- unless they were with friends! They love to go camping- to be with friends! I have tried to cultivate more love of nature and beauty in them but they have their own slant on it and find my perspective way too lonely and "out there" for them. Dd is a nature artist, so of course she appreciates beauty, but it doesnt mean she will go outside and watch the sunset or the stars.

I think of the term " PC " as one that describes an extreme form of manipulating an unpleasant truth into something palatable, the way politicians manipulate truth to get what they want. It is basically dishonest. Being kind doesn't mean you go around telling people about their faults unasked- being brutally honest all the time. Being kind is just being kind, and is different in every situation. I don't think it has anything to do with being PC. People are PC when they want something, when they want to be seen a certain way, usually as kind, loving, honest people when they are not- They say the PC thing to gain popularity. Being kind is far deeper than that- its the opposite of that, actually, and sometimes on the surface it doesn't look so good, but its coming from a deeper place thats far more selfless. I have never seen being PC as a good thing.

Nope, they dont work well for me. I am such a tweaker. I think the idea is that its less work for the mum to pull together. Thats ok if the mum is capable of just doing what she is told- X this day, Y the next- but I am not. Life gets in the way. We like parts of it, not others. Some feels like busywork. I feel like focusing on something and not what the program is focusing on. During every year, my program morphs a lot, no matter what I started out with. Last year I planned out our CM year this year, with HEOYear7. Well, altohugh we are using about half the books, it probably doesnt look much like CM or HEO to anyone because once we got started I dropped things and added others, found a good writing program and dropped CM style narrations, changed the order of the books, etc If my kids HAD to homeschool more independently than they do, it might be useful to have more integrated programs, but as long as I am around to perfect things :), they dont need it.

I always felt behind even though my kids were younger than yours when we started. Trying to live up to TWTM is very daunting when you didnt start from the beginning. I used to rush my kids to try and catch up, when I should instead have sloooooowed dooooown. I had this panicky feeling I was going to fail them and they needed to work really hard just to tread water! After a while, I started to relax. I think it takes a while of working with your children to really know where they are at, anyway. I wouldn't really have had a clue in the beginning- I knew my son couldnt read well so I began with that. Yes, definitely fill in the gaps, build a foundation, but dont forget the joy of learning, of homeschooling, of being together, as well. Have some fun, enjoy reading together, play some games now and then, have some field trips. Build on their strengths as well as their weaknesses. One of the advantages of homeschooling I have found is the amount of reading we all do- together and separately. It is a joy to us all (although it took a while to get my younger to enjoy it). As far as language arts go, I havent seen FLL /WWE- I felt my kids were to old for them. I just kept going with copywork, dictation and narrations. I would read what they are about and use them to see where your kids are at- they are a wonderful foundation and you will learn a lot by using them with your kids. For maths, one of the reasons I used Singapore was because we could move through the books quite quickly and catch the kids up to their grade level, even starting several years below. It worked well for that. There are lots of things you could start them where they are at. I would start the history cycle at the beginning and just move forward from there, and enjoy. We are going to get through the cycle twice. You may get through 1.5 times. It doesnt matter. Enjoy, its one of the best things about TWTM. And- I woudl use SOTW rather than Kingfisher. It can be for older kids too, and it is just fantastic. You can add more to it if you choose or just enjoy as is while you spend time on other areas.

My man is meatless, and a Microwave Man through and through. Hes not happy about the crock pot using so much power over so many hours. Hes not happy about the lamb I put in it. He feels the lamb should still be skipping around in the fields while he eats microwaved supermarket vegetarian lasagna. He does have other redeeming features and so far the crock pot is winning his battle against it.

Yeah, but the thing is, what I was trying to say is, the essence of any religion will take you to it, too...so I don't deny what he said, even though I actually doubt anyone knows what Jesus, if he existed, said. Its just that that's not the ONLY way to know the whole elephant. For him, in his time, he was trying to show people the way through himself, his teachings, and he did it by denouncing what was going on in the name of religion in his time, naturally. He was trying to wake people up. Other people over the ages have done the same, in the context of their times. They try to show people, hey, all this stuff you are doing, that's not it, THIS is it. But then, everyone does to THEM and THEIR teachings what they did to all the others. So, I dont have a problem with what Jesus apparently said, except that I think it has been twisted and taken out of context. His essential messages are beautiful, even the one you quoted, but I do think most people misunderstand it.

I figure when people write CC in the subject line, generally speaking they want advice or feedback from fellow Christians. Not that that always stops me saying something, but I am much less likely to be controversial or confrontative, especially where religion is involved. It just feels like the person has created a little safe space for themselves, and I respect it. Often though, I simply dont click on CC posts because even if I have an opinion, chances are it may not be in harmony with the OP's mindset, and they are not asking to be challenged in that way. I however feel that as a secular person, I am in a minority here and I wouldnt expect secular responses to all my questions unless I was specific about that. Yay for SWB for being so inclusive in her books and allowing these boards to feel comforable for a wide range of people.

I thought I was a pretty cool mum with my dd. Easy child. Sweet. Mothering was easy. Then along came my boy. Wow- if I hadnt had him, I would have far less compassion for mothers who have a hard time being mothers. But he made me grow in a way my dd never did, because he pushed me to my edge over and over. Still does.

There are things I would die for, but I cant think of any beliefs I would die for.

Sorry, but my brain just can't process your issue with what I said. Maybe you have to be in my head to understand it- I am sorry if it doesnt appear completely logical. I did say at the beginning of my post that I understand that people who have a fixed belief (as in, believe that Christianity is the only way to Truth) may take issue with my stance and also see it as a belief- fair enough, and it is. I just see Truth as beyond all religions, because it IS, it is self evident, not subject to belief or disbelief, religions or no religion. Either Truth is Truth or it isnt. Its not personal or subject to personal whims. I see all religions as people trying to access that ultimate, highest Truth through various means. And when someone finds it for themselves, others tend to follow. We are born into religious cultures so mostly we don't choose our religion..in other words, many Muslims may believe they choose their faith, but just like Christians, they are born into it and choose it less than they like to believe. It "feels" right because that is the culture. But "free will" is just another belief, another religion. That religion is a path rather than a prison? I see religion as a tool to find the truth, the highest truth beyond all beliefs and dogma, and that all religions at their deepest depths have that core essence (even Buddhism which I agree is a philosophy rather than a religion, but for this purpose I will bunch it in with other religions). All spiritual teachers have things in common, but we tend to emphasise the differences. I think most people imprison themselves inside their religion as a security instead of being willing to stand in the great Not Knowing of life. There is nothing wrong with following a particular path, 1000% totally committed to that- but when we become rigid, the path becomes a prison.

In Australia we have beautiful gold coloured $1 and $2 coins, which are both perfect for tooth fairies. They are also great for making donations when you go places. "Gold coin donation" is a common sign around the place.

I have a strong spiritual understanding that is so inclusive that the issue of teaching my kids that my ideas are the only true ones is barely relevant (although I can see how people who have more fixed ideas could see that I am still teaching them a belief). I don't believe any religion has any exclusive access to Truth that is not available without that particular religion. Religions are paths, not prisons. I love the earth/pagan religions from paganism to shamanism for their connection with Life and the spirit of Life, the trees, the earth, the sky and stars and animals and plants. It makes me feel deeply honouring of life, a small but worthy part of the whole. I love Buddhism and Hinduism for their concept of enlightenment and their beliefs that all people can be enlightened, all people can be like Buddha or the various Hindu saints. And that there are living saints and enlightened beings walking amongst us today- its not all in the past. I love Sufism for their absolute devotion to God. I love Christianity for Jesus's unconditional love and mercy for all beings. I absolutely love God, but my concept of God is not that there is a Christian God or a Muslim God, that God loves only certain people, or that I can ever be separate from God. God is the all loving conscious presence from which we ALL arise, are never separate from, and return to. So, my children are exposed to many different ideas and I don't try and convince them to believe me, I just encourage them to think for themselves. So far, they don't agree with my perspective :)

After a recent bout of terrible neck and shoulder pain that left me unable to sit for any length of time- and reading aloud is still an important part of our days- I decided to change things around. I found it was so easy to write off the whole day if I was in pain, and we are only in the beginning of our school year here. I have changed the kids' schedule from a daily one, to a weekly one. My feeling is that this will be hard for them at first, but my hope is that they will rise to the challenge. The idea is that just because they dont get something done on one day, doesn't mean they can drop it for the whole week. In other words, if on Monday to Wednesday I cant help my son with his Latin, it doesn't mean he just does Thursday's Latin when I am able to sit with him on Thursday. It means he is responsible for finishing it all by Friday, and if that means 3 days worth on Thursday, thats ok. My kids are older than yours, but I am just trying to change a mindset in them that only looks at the day's work, and instead sees a bigger picture. Also, because he has been dependent on me to do his Latin with him, I have been making up some drill worksheets I can hand him on days I can't work with him. Another thing I have implemented is that both have an "ongoing project" that will take several months. For my daughter, it is making a medieval style book with illustrations. For my son, it is building a town and castles etc to go with his Warhammer figures. What I found is that when I was simply unable to work with them and therefore they finished all their independent work and still had plenty of time left over, I just assigned them both to work on their projects. It has worked well and didn't feel so much like wasted time. I also swtiched some of our read alouds to independent reading, just to lessen the load on me. Another thing I have done is get Foxtel- cable TV I think you call it over there- in the schoolroom. My husband has always had it in his room but we never had much access to it. I decided it was time we got it, and when I was at my worst, we turned on Discovery Channel for them. They were only allowed to watch documentaries.

Yes, that would be good. Something that integrates spelling, grammar, writing, literature appreciation, over all 12 years....ha!

Where I am at right now, with older secular kids, is, I would love some ebook downloadable study guides for books we are reading, and maybe just for general literature appreciation on a deeper level. I'm not 100% sure what I am really looking for, but i feel the need to go into some of our literature more deeply, but I dont want to analyse it to death, either. I know Lightning Lit is popular, but we had already read most of the books so it didnt seem worth the exhorbitant price of getting them here to Australia to see if they were useable. Something along those lines (not that I have seen it) that is in separate parts, (I know they do have separate programs for some things) but downloadable, would be good. Clear as mud?

Ugh. I used to hitch hike, alone, in the country. I have gotten into men's cars...and amazingly, never been hurt or close to it. And I look back on those days (I was virtually a street kid for a short while) and roll my eyes at myself. However, I had an incredibly strong survival instinct, and very strong intuition. And my kids will, I hope, never need to be in the position I was in...but I hope to train them to have just as keen a sense of survival and intuition because the world seems to be getting more dangerous, not less.

I agree it's probably better for older kids. My kids were 12 and 13 when we read it. History IS brutal. So is the present- I guess it depends what you focus on, but then people will complain about the bias anyway. I think AIS a pretty good job of making it accessible to kids, myself, but my kids are not super sensitive to the horror. And we also loved the story of Boadicea. I find it an incredible story of self sacrifice for those times, it always touches my heart.

I must admit I have felt overwhelmed by the amount of marking I need to do, with only two children. Although, truly, it only takes a couple of minutes for most things and it does keep me in tune with where they are at. I think that is the key. You can leave the marking to them- IF they are responsible enough to redo their wrong answers, and IF they will let you know if they are struggling. My solution has been to find one child an online program where he puts the answers in and had to redo them and get 100% before he can move on. Its mathematics.com.au- an Australian program. It also teaches him with a voiceover like TT. It has been such a relief to have someone else teach him math- saved a lot of conflict between him and I! And for the other child, she often marks her own. However, I have found it is of greater benefit if I take the time to go over her work with her. It makes her feel connected and loved that I stick my head in her work, even though she is capable of doign it alone. At least, if I am having a bad day, she can do it herself, though.

It sounds like because your kids are older they need to understand the bigger picture of Latin. We all certainly did. I have tried LfC too and after a bit really detested it because we didn't understand WHY we had to memorise all this stuff. I truly think all that blind memorisation is only suitable for grammar stage kids, and even then many kids need to see the bigger picture to be motivated. The program I would highly recommend for your kids, especially perfect for their age, is Latin Prep. It is a fun program- with a sense of humour and some whacky sentences- it teaches the grammar right up front, but it also teaches the bigger picture. You are translating from both Latin to English AND English to Latin right from the beginning. It is satisfying to be doing translations and reading Latin, and understanding WHY its important to learn the grammar. Many people here use this program.

Yeah, absolutely. Why eat plastic when you can have the real thing for less calories? The thing about eating some good quality fat (and I consider cream good quality fat- it is REAL food) is that it feels good, it feels satisfying, abd feeling satisfied makes you less likely to binge eat. A low fat, low calories diet feels like starvation and deprivation. Fat makes you feel full. Also, if you use your frame of mind (wanting to diet and get healthy) to learn some stuff about nutrition, you may find that cutting all trans fats and fake foods out of your diet and replacing them with real foods, might just rebalance your body and help it lose weight with less effort. When your body eats real food, it feels good and is far less likely to overeat than if it eats highly processed and fake foods.

You are certainly not alone. Many people need the answer guide when they hit level 5, including me. We didn't finish 6 for the reasons you state. Just got stuck. However, this was a few years back now and I have heard people say that with the NEM series that it is normal for their kids to get stuck a LOT, but to barely scrape through NEM is still to be a top math student. So, in retrospect, I am wondering if it might have been worth finishing 6 , just skipping the problems we really couldnt do, for the way it makes you really think. Another possibility is to post the problem here and see if one of the math brainy people can help you. YOu couldnt be the first :)