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#1 mamamoose

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Posted 05 January 2017 - 08:39 AM

I have a son with dyslexia/dysgraphia/adhd. I don't post much here--honestly I am just really depressed about it. The school messed him up big time and we pulled him out of school last year and he's mid-way through level 4 of barton, but he hasn't taken off with reading like I had hoped. He is 9. And his younger sister now reads better than he does (she's 6). Last night she wanted to read to the family and he just deflated. I don't know what to do, how to handle this, where to go from here. He's depressed and angry most of the time. He excels in athletics and is very good at math, but its almost like he's given up caring. 

 

I am upset that Barton isn't helping more than it is: its an expensive program and he doesn't struggle with it, but he HATES it. Its boring, and the stories are dry and boring too. He loves audiobooks but I think he needs more practice with reading if he is ever going to get it. Am I totally off base? 



#2 mamamoose

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Posted 05 January 2017 - 08:53 AM

And i think this is on the wrong forum?? I wanted it in learning challenges...



#3 kbutton

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Posted 05 January 2017 - 01:17 PM

You are one level too far if you want this on the LC board. I would repost--many of us check here too, but it's much more noticeable on the LC board.

 

In the meantime,  :grouphug: . Mine are not dyslexic, but I do get therapy fatigue, frustration, etc. I am also going to note that 9 seems to be a stinky age. There is so much that seems to be nice about 9 year olds, and they are finally able to do some really cool stuff, but it's almost like a mini attitude/hormonal thing for a few months to a year, or at least it has been with my boys (again at 11). It's like a little biological bomb went off, and they get really irritable about everything in the world!

 

Hang in there!



#4 Lecka

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Posted 05 January 2017 - 02:17 PM

First of all, he does like reading. Liking audiobooks counts as reading.

If he hated or refused or didn't follow along with audiobooks -- well, then you would be more in full "hating to read" mode.

So liking audiobooks is a huge plus.

I am not a Barton user, first. I think you have an option of saying -- hey, he is doing good with Barton. And then if you want, you can teach some things (long vowels) if you want, earlier.

You will see if it is a bad idea and can stop.

But maybe it is fine.

Then, what are easy and high-interest books?

How might those be a good experience?

Now -- this is IF you want. I think waiting and doing high-interest read-aloud and saying how good he is doing in Barton is an option.

This is if you want to consider it, though.

Anyway -- if you look for easy books he would like, you can read them to him first. Maybe he would look through them. This can be GOOD. It has a good chance of going well and it is gentle.

You are not throwing him to the wolves with guessing and lack of support.

Are there little kids he could read to? From a selection of books you have looked through, and you know he knows most of the patterns?

Comic books? Garfield is one. Teen Titans Go is fairly easy and my older son liked it and would re-read after I read them... he could look at pictures too.

Any non-fiction where the captions wouldn't be too hard, or you could read them to him first? Animals? Star Wars? If he could also look at cool or intricate pictures and there is not much text, it can be good.

I think it is your call if you want to teach long vowels earlier than Barton, and introduce some outside reading. It is a choice you can make. You can pull back if it seems not so good, or go ahead if it seems good.

But books you read first, comic books, DK type of books from non-fiction that have a lot of pictures but are also interesting to older kids... these are some strategies for starting.

Another strategy is reading a series. They can be easy once proper nouns and specific vocabulary are known. You can flip through and look for easier books.

I think take the long view that reading is still hard, but it will get easier. In the meantime try to make reading (including audiobooks) as motivating and special as possible.

Can there be snacks involved?

Can there be some specialness in time you read to him?

Can there be an effort to find cool comic books or non-fiction books?

Another thing that might work is if you scan in books you read to him, and point out sentences he will be able to read. That can be gentle if you start small with sentences he will do well with it.

That is something that helped my son a lot and it was gentle, too.

Try not to do anything that lessens his interest in audiobooks. That is something that will help a lot.

I think overall if you think he has come a long way with Barton you can teach some things out of order (compared to Barton) to get to outside reading. It is an option.

If you think he is less steady I think stay with Barton.

But if things are going well and you think you are ready for outside reading now, with the foundation that has been laid, then you can do that.

If you feel like "he probably isn't ready" then don't do it. But maybe you feel like he is ready.

But you don't have a lifetime commitment to no outside reading until Barton Level whatever, if you are feeling like it is time for outside reading. Just teach long vowels.

I would never say this unasked, but since you are asking, I think it is fine to consider. It is a choice you have.

#5 OneStepAtATime

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Posted 05 January 2017 - 03:38 PM

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

It is really hard when a younger sibling picks up a skill that the older struggles with. BTDT.

 

FWIW, maybe your expectations for "loving" reading are too high right now?  I loved reading as a kid.  I loved it.  I read all the time.  DH?  Nope.  He never has liked reading.  I expected my kids to love reading.  It was so hard to accept that they didn't and that reading was a terrible struggle.  Now that they are doing Barton they do read but I wouldn't say either one loves it.  That isn't their personality.  They love being able to read for information when needed and DS likes to listen to audio books (DD never did) while he accomplishes other tasks and sometimes DD will read a book on her own for fun.  But I don't know that either of them will ever love reading 'just to read' the way I do.  They use reading as a tool to accomplish other goals.  I have had to accept that they are different from me and that's o.k.

 

What Barton did do was give them critical tools needed to function.  

 

Barton Level 4 is not an easy level, by the way.  It does unlock a lot of critical skills though.

 

Is there any chance he also has a developmental vision issue or slow processing speed?  DS has to read in very small bursts or his eyes fatigue.  DD reads in small bursts because it takes time for her to process what she is reading.  

 

I would encourage more audio books and help him to see that audio books are important and valued, too, not just print reading.  He may be picking up on the idea that print reading is more valuable.  Nip that in the bud.  DS was once asked if he had read the Lightning Thief series.  He had.  Several times.  But he did it through audio books.  When they asked him, he hung his head and shook it "no".  I was shocked.  The person asking knew that DS listened to audio books so they said "Well, audio books count, too." He looked up, startled, then grinned and said yes, he had "read" the whole series.  He seemed so relieved.  I realized after talking it over with him that, although I had never said this, somehow he had internalized that audio books are a last resort for defective people.   We had to work hard to help him see audio books are used by lots of people and is a perfectly normal way to "do books".

 

Maybe listen to some of the same audio books your son is listening to and discuss them casually with him, for fun.  Praise him for the audio books.  Listen to audio books of your own in front of him.  

 

As for getting more interest in print reading, I agree, the Barton stories are pretty boring for older kids.  See if there are any books of interest at his current reading level that are short.  Mine did better with a series so they weren't always have to start over with who the characters were and the setting.  Does he like fact based books?  Maybe he would be happier with those than with novels.  Have you looked at Hi-Lo books from High Noon?  They have fact based and story based books for kids that have decoding/fluency issues.

 

http://www.highnoonb...m/index-hnb.tpl


Edited by OneStepAtATime, 05 January 2017 - 03:40 PM.

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#6 Lecka

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Posted 05 January 2017 - 04:44 PM

https://www.amazon.c...Q5QHZGC76C17GY6

Tiny Titans

This was a good series for my son. It is not easy, but there are few words per page, and it can be fun to look at the pictures. It is not babyish. It is written in all capital letters which is easier to read than a lot of comic books.

Garfield is also all caps and fewer word per page.

https://www.amazon.c...ds=dust bunnies

This author has easy-to-read print, and few words per page, and it wouldn't work for a book "he" is supposed to like, but could be a fun book to read to a younger kid.

I started a lot of series that I had high hopes would be ones that transferred to my son reading them himself, that ended up being series I just read him, because he didn't end up able to read them at the right time.

It seemed wasteful at the time, and so frustrating, but we had a lot of good time together and it did help him to have books he enjoyed.

I have to go in with picking the right time, picking the right place, having a snack, etc., just for listening. This is much better now but I don't take it for granted. (I have a younger son now who is even more this way lol.)

All of that counts as having a love or enjoyment of reading, even if it isn't the child physically reading the book. It all counts.

In time more may come, or it may be that they don't read as much as we would want as parents, but it is a much better situation than if they really hated reading and didn't want anything to do with it on any terms.
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#7 Lecka

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Posted 05 January 2017 - 04:47 PM

We did also have a big DK Star Wars visual dictionary that I read my son a lot when it was too hard for him, and he spent a lot of time "reading" by looking at the pictures. Eventually he did start reading some headings himself, and then some of the captions or some blurbs. That was a big thing for him even though it took a long, long time for it to kick in to where he would even read a heading for himself. But it was something he did really like and kind-of a big thing for me to buy him an expensive book like that, and it seemed very grown-up to him also, and I think he was about 9.

But high-interest can pay off in the long-term even if it doesn't pay off in the short term (as far as physically reading).

#8 OneStepAtATime

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Posted 05 January 2017 - 06:16 PM

By the way, I did not mean to imply in my post above that your child will never like reading.  He may come to like it very much once it isn't so hard to do.  I'm just saying that maybe he will end up using reading for different things than for simple pleasure reading of fiction and such.  

 

FWIW, my dad read all the time but he read fact books, history books, management books, not novels.  My mom reads constantly but she reads biographies and information books and history books.  She rarely ever reads fiction novels.  Just not her thing.

 

DH reads a lot.  He reads information, he reads about areas of interest (he loves flying so he reads a lot about private pilot safety), he reads about whats happening in his career field.  He has never read a novel or story for pleasure, as far as I know.  Only what was assigned in school and only under extreme duress from teachers LOL.

 

DS has a lot of Star Wars novels and fact books.  He almost never reads the novels.  He will listen to audio books of star wars novels but he doesn't voluntarily read the print version.  However, he pulls out the fact books, and schematics and the books on the history of Star Wars and will read through those.  

 

Maybe your son 1. Still needs more time to smooth out the process of reading. and 2. has not yet found something worth using the skill set with.  Perhaps he has an area of interest that would get him reading for information?

 

 



#9 mamamoose

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Posted 05 January 2017 - 11:45 PM

We have had many evaluations for his eyes and nothing has been picked up but he does complain of eye issues--he wears reading glasses. He does have processing issues and we just finished neurofeedback...he has major attitude issues, and i struggle with whether they are learning disability related or heriditary (my brother had/has major issues). I would love links for Star Wars books that are age appropriate--he is way into Star Wars right now. We also just finished a wrinkle in time as a read aloud and are listening to wind in the door together--we listen to a lot of audiobooks while driving so it's a "normal" thing. I also listen to audiobooks while running--so I don't think he would disassociate that with reading at all, but maybe I'm missing Something. Sorry, typing on phone. :)
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#10 Storygirl

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 12:53 AM

We have anger and attitude problems here, too, and I attribute it to the ADHD. Is your son doing any treatment for the ADHD? Meds? Behavior therapy? Meditation? We notice that the attitude, anger, and verbal aggression is better when DS is on his meds. We've kind of slacked on practicing our calming techniques and need to start up with that again, but I also consider them beneficial.

 

Could you have a little talk with little sis about not reading aloud to the family from now on? She could read aloud to you privately instead.

 

Sometimes our family just gets in kind of a disgruntled rut, where we seem more annoyed with each other than usual. Like right now, for example! Things haven't been peachy around here over the past couple of weeks. Anyway, sometimes we play a game called Roses and Thorns, where each person gets to state the best (rose) and worst (thorn) part of their day. I like this game, because it builds empathy for each other, allows everyone to see that all people have ups and downs, and encourages people to express their feelings. We keep it light hearted. Playing a game like that is not going to solve anything for you, of course, but it can help the family bond a little when there seems to be a rift or disgruntled feelings.

 

I tend to get very discouraged when things aren't going well with my kids, and then I am right down in the dumps with them. Remembering to do some fun family bonding can make a small difference. (Note: the son I referenced previously really can sabotage our attempts at family fun sometimes, so it takes some thinking to pick what will work for *him* and not just what would be fun for me.)


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#11 OneStepAtATime

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 01:49 AM

We have had many evaluations for his eyes and nothing has been picked up but he does complain of eye issues--he wears reading glasses. He does have processing issues and we just finished neurofeedback...he has major attitude issues, and i struggle with whether they are learning disability related or heriditary (my brother had/has major issues). I would love links for Star Wars books that are age appropriate--he is way into Star Wars right now. We also just finished a wrinkle in time as a read aloud and are listening to wind in the door together--we listen to a lot of audiobooks while driving so it's a "normal" thing. I also listen to audiobooks while running--so I don't think he would disassociate that with reading at all, but maybe I'm missing Something. Sorry, typing on phone. :)

Were any evaluations done for developmental vision issues specifically?  And hopefully done through a Developmental Optometrist?  A regular optometrist or an ophthalmologist may not have the training or the equipment to asses developmental vision issues, which can exist even without visual acuity issues and are frequently not caught by a standard eye doctor.  I ask because we went many years with both my daughter and my son having normal eye exams and every eye doctor missed that they both have developmental vision issues.  DD has visual acuity issues, too, and wears glasses but DS does not.  He just has dv issues.  It took a Developmental Optometrist to finally find the underlying issues.


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#12 OhElizabeth

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 08:17 AM

I have a son with dyslexia/dysgraphia/adhd. I don't post much here--honestly I am just really depressed about it. The school messed him up big time and we pulled him out of school last year and he's mid-way through level 4 of barton, but he hasn't taken off with reading like I had hoped. He is 9. And his younger sister now reads better than he does (she's 6). Last night she wanted to read to the family and he just deflated. I don't know what to do, how to handle this, where to go from here. He's depressed and angry most of the time. He excels in athletics and is very good at math, but its almost like he's given up caring. 

 

I am upset that Barton isn't helping more than it is: its an expensive program and he doesn't struggle with it, but he HATES it. Its boring, and the stories are dry and boring too. He loves audiobooks but I think he needs more practice with reading if he is ever going to get it. Am I totally off base? 

 

My ds is 8, has never been in school, and is pretty similar. I think the others are correct that it's possible to have unrealistic expectations at this point. It's sort of like wow, I paid all this money, I brought in Barton, WHY ISN'T IT ALL BETTER!!

 

Since my ds has never been in school, and since he has had Barton, LIPS, etc. from the beginning, I don't have the school to blame it on. My ds is becoming self-cognizant, self-aware, and he's noticing his disability. THAT is what has disheartened him. Honestly, I would stop having a sibling read aloud in front of him. Like it would be nice if he was so mature, so strong, so self-confident that that wasn't going to hurt him, but personally I would just create a new way you roll together. Like everyone reads silently and then discusses or Dad reads aloud or everyone gets assigned the passage in the morning to read on their own time and discuss as a family in the evening. There would be lots of creative ways to work around that. I'm unrealistically protective, so I would. There are enough opportunities in life to hurt that I don't have to pile on more. Or have them read verses and take turns with verses, instead of it being like the whole chapter. He could probably get through one verse at a time.

 

I've been trying to read with my ds in the evening, and even though he *can* read the verses he shies away. At first he was game, but then he started pulling back. It's just HARD! I mean, think about it. We take something that is very important to us (learning about God) and we connect it to a disability! We wouldn't look at a person with no legs and say the only way to get to church was to walk; we'd give them a car! But we look at our kids with dyslexia and say the ONLY way to learn about God is to READ THIS PRINT AND READ IT NOW BECAUSE I SAID SO AND READ IT IN FRONT OF PEOPLE.

 

Kinda doesn't work, lol. If I were more organized, what I would do is use a Bible reading app, put the assigned text on a daily checklist, and just have him do that as independent work. There's no reason why it HAS to be done only one way. My problem is enforcement, facilitating. My ds, with the ADHD plus ASD, is a real pistol to organize. But my dd (only ADHD) at that age, sure, that's what I would have done. Once you stack the disabilities, you're like hmm, how do I make that happen? I have ABA workers who come in, and I can assign things. But if you can find a way to make it happen (like you use daily checklists, he works through his plan), then yes, that would be another really smart way to work around it.

 

I did have the learning disability talk with my ds. I had to, because he was just really getting discouraged at how hard things were. To him it was like well this is hard so let's just not do it! And with ASD, not do it literally means NOT AT ALL.  :svengo: So we talked about brilliant people with SLDs. Last night we watched a couple of these (really bizarre, not sure what I think of them) Percy and the Olympians movies, and Percy is open and out about his dyslexia and his FRUSTRATION over his dyslexia! There's this really cool scene where another character points out to him that his dyslexia was because he has a GIFT and that his ADHD was his SUPERPOWER! Do you realize how powerful this message is! We have to turn it like this!

 

So when I had the discussion with him, I used the Ben Foss thing that yes it's hard, but that he can ear read, he can eye read, that all reading is reading, and that even though it's hard and we have to work on it, he can use MORE tech even than we already do, that he can have MORE tech as he thinks of ideas and ways to use it. He has GOT to own the tech and use the tech and embrace the tech. That's my theory. Right now my ds has a kindle and access to my ipad. Now that his big sis is gone, he'll have access to an imac (for big things like Inspiration) and a pc laptop (for robotics). They need tech they can dictate into. They need tech that will do immersion reading. They need to learn to type. 

 

I agree with you on Barton. It's very efficient. Have you done RAN/RAS drills? And have you drilled the Barton words to fluency? Level 4 is rough. Also, when your ds was diagnosed, did they do any language testing? My ds had language quirks because of his ASD, but I've been told that dyslexics in general fall behind on language (subtly, sometimes not subtly) because their peers are reading more and getting more inputs. So that means he needs to be ear reading MORE than his peers are eye reading, because he may need to do language catch-up or work hard to stay even. If he doesn't know the language, it's really hard to read with comprehension, kwim? My ds, because of his extensive ear reading, has an outrageous vocabulary, like 99th percentile, and it boosts his humble decoding level (3rd) to a really ridiculous overall reading level (5th/6th last time we tested him). That score was while in Barton 4 at the end of 1st. 

 

So for my ds, refusing to read is not because he can't decode or not because he can't get there overall. He can in spurts. It's just it's VERY HARD. Wicked hard. So hard that he can't bring his little ASD soul to do it. Now comics go over huge! I got him 3 print books of Calvin and Hobbes, and those go over big! I've been paying him Mickey Bucks for books. I printed a file from Etsy ($5) and he earns $1 in money for disney (yeah, yeah!!!) with each book. You realize he could have earned HUNDREDS of dollars for Disney when we started this? But no, he has earned maybe, I don't know. It's low. It's just HARD. 

 

I think the more you can work in some consistency, routine, and expectation, the better it's going to be for tackling the "it's hard" part. I have ABA tutors, and they do some partner reading. We need to do more. They don't like to because they like to shake things up. But to partner read and get through an hour a day in chunks, that would not be too much. The tutor who did fresh testing for us this summer said it's hard because of the dyslexia and that we just have to DO it. There's not going to be a way around that. 

 

And I don't know. Like, to me, to my sensibilities, I wish it was just oh we got his reading so high that it was EASY and then he just DID it. Or we got him some highly engaging books and then he just DID it. Or we waited till his language or development kicked in and then he just DID it. And I *do* see where my ds spurts in his reading when we do language work, when we up the interest, etc. Language was DEFINITELY holding him back! And this is a kid with a 99th percentile vocabulary!

 

I have another ABA tutor joining, and yes I could assign more reading together. I probably will. It IS hard.  However I'm not sure that I want to wham to some really high number. I'm undecided or hesitant. I think you have to look at your child, at his mind, at his soul, and see how it's going. I don't think you torture into more reading. However my ds did have some behaviors and does have some issues where it's just like oh I have to decide to sit and do this. He's super, super, super ADHD. Like he was off gymnastics a month over the holidays, and he was blowing people's minds with his energy. It's NO WONDER he's not sitting there reading, kwim? So for us, when we create some structure and routine and a cozy spot and say no we're really going to do this, that helps him contain his body and get his mind ready. And what the workers usually do is set a required time (10 minutes) and then say he can read more if he wants. That really works! He often goes over! But then HE chose to go longer, kwim? And there was no physical reward/motivator there like candy or Mickey Bucks. At that point he's continuing to read because he's engaged and enjoys it. I think variety in motivators can be good, but he can read simply by having structure and the knowledge maybe of a pleasant follow-up activity when we're done.

 

Did Heathermomster reply here yet? She told me privately that when her ds was in these early years (4th?) things seemed DIRE. And at the time ds was in 1st or K5 and I was like DIRE, my kid will never be DIRE! My kid is getting early intervention from awesome me with the most awesome materials so things will never seem DIRE!! And now I'm like OH MY LANDS. There are SO many pieces that come together, and it feels like some tornado hit and blew them all over and you're like Dude I have to scavenge here for a piece and there for a piece and the pieces are SHATTERED. It doesn't FEEL like it will ever come together.

 

I take great solace in knowing that for many kids it comes together with enough time and continued piecing. I freak out knowing that time is actually very short to do this. I thought I had a long time, and I don't. That makes it feel dire all over again.

 

So I'm right there with you. We have to speak truth to ourselves. With the new semester and a new/additional worker coming, I'm going to be sitting down making lists. This is something you probably do too. Like I always did with dd, but with ds it's harder. Lists of what I need to get done (foundational skill goals) but always what HE needs to be doing to make his soul flourish. And ways we can amp that to fit him even BETTER and keep him more engaged. Like one of my workers is artistic! This is really fun, because we can tie making pictures and handwriting!! I get so bogged down and basic by myself, and these bright kids get BORED. That's why I got the K'nex robotics. I need to find more ways to make sure I'm really connecting at his MIND level, not just his disability level. It's SO hard sometimes. We want it all to be synchronized, almost to hold onto them and say slow down! We have to prepare for some HUGE spreads there. My ds functions multiple, multiple grades ahead in some areas and multiple, multiple grades behind in others. That's a really hard spread!

 

Are you using an ipad for your Barton 4? I love the app, love it. How is the handwriting going? We've concluded it is holding us back too much. We've tried for a semester, and it's just not a functional way for him to proceed. We've all agreed as a team we're going to focus on typing. I got pneumonia and then bronchitis back to back (I kid you not) and now have another cough. I wake up in the morning and go to bed and night thinking how can we do this, how can we nurture this spread and both the strengths and the weaknesses, how can we make this more uplifting and inspiring and engaging WITH A MOVING TARGET! It's not like the kids just stay put! They grow and change. You have a good balance, and then it shifts again. You constantly feel behind. And it's your first kid, so you're constantly learning just plain about development and what's coming too.

 

OneStep has talked about the severe balance shift her practitioners begged her to bring in. That's hard. To go ok I see weaknesses and want to work on them, but we're going to make sure some time each day is really at their level, at their gift level, at their mind level. That's hard! And what those things are shifts (at least I find they do) and needs to be adjusted at least every semester. At least. Or maybe others are better at this? I'm not.  

 

I agree with a developmental vision exam. If he needs reading glasses, he has convergence issues. Easy to fix in just a few months. Given the dysgraphia plus the vision, I would get an OT eval. If you can find someone who's killer with retained reflexes, that's what you're looking for. They can underly the convergence issues and make the dysgraphia worse. Sometimes it's hard, even when you know what you're looking for. I've taken my dd to at least 3 OTs, and now I've got a PT that is really stellar. You talk about cynical. At $100 an hour, you get cynical fast! But still if you find the right person there can be some improvement to be had. 

 

RAN/RAS is easy to work on yourself, and really it made my ds' reading more fluid, more comfortable. Now he has apraxia and attitude (haha), so it's not like easy peasy. But I'm just saying RAN/RAS you can improve. It's directly correlated to stronger readers, so it's worth working on. I've posted my file links in the past and am lazy. To google search, type your terms and site:welltrainedmind.com  Try searching "ohelizabeth ran/ras site:welltrainedmind.com" or "ohelizabeth dropbox site:welltrainedmind.com" and see what you find. I use google site searches all the time. Like you could read everything OneStep has to say about math, that kind of thing. :)


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#13 Heathermomster

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 08:39 AM

Idk...my son took 5 years of Wilson and his reading soared in 5th grade. As an 11th grader, he reads all the time using his kindle, audible books, and Immersion text with Bookshare. Last month, I sat through his Early American lit class which uses an Oxford anthology, and he understood the story and vocabulary better than his peers. Kids were answering questions incorrectly and he voiced corrections when asked.

My point is that you need to be patient and consistent. Do not express frustration about progress to your child. Hire an experienced O-G tutor and give yourself a break. Use audio books. Many students struggle to decode words but comprehend audio books years above their grade level. Allow your son to select books that he cares about so that he wants to listen to them. Join Bookshare and purchase the VoiceDream app for your IPad/iPod or Android. Give him every opportunity with tech to be successful.

As far as the attitude, I don't experience that and never have. I know my son's scores and know that these kids require patience and time. We are very active with our church, and he has spent many hours serving alongside his dad. We associate with very nice people that share their hobbies with my DS.

Ultimately, be brave. These kids can and do learn with explicit and multi-sensory instruction.


Edited by Heathermomster, 06 January 2017 - 10:51 AM.

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#14 Heathermomster

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 08:55 AM

OhE responded while I was typing...Rule out the vision with COVD and get the OT evals.  We used an OT first and a ped PT later to get that sorted.

 

Yes, the first three years of Wilson were dire.  We hunkered down during that period of our lives and pushed through.  DS worked with an excellent tutor, and I am forever grateful to that woman.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


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#15 OhElizabeth

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 09:17 AM

Heather, did your ds do *all* his reading with that tutor during that time? Was he also doing school reading or any forced/required reading? Like I'm being very literal here. I know that if I spent $80 an hour and took him to the swanky place in town, they would have him read 10 minutes per session as part of their normal flow. They put it on a chart and it's all there, all the things they do in an hour. So I know the tutor would have him read, but it would be SHORT. And I contrast that with what another person did here on the boards (an hour a day, broken into chunks, required), and I don't know. Perhaps the tutor is assuming the school is also compelling reading? The tutor seemed to communicate it was going to be necessary, that some compelling was necessary. But I don't know. And I think it's tricky because we want our kids to want to read, not to associate it with torture.

 

I've been trying to sort it out for myself. 


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#16 Heathermomster

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 10:33 AM

Heather, did your ds do *all* his reading with that tutor during that time? Was he also doing school reading or any forced/required reading? Like I'm being very literal here. I know that if I spent $80 an hour and took him to the swanky place in town, they would have him read 10 minutes per session as part of their normal flow. They put it on a chart and it's all there, all the things they do in an hour. So I know the tutor would have him read, but it would be SHORT. And I contrast that with what another person did here on the boards (an hour a day, broken into chunks, required), and I don't know. Perhaps the tutor is assuming the school is also compelling reading? The tutor seemed to communicate it was going to be necessary, that some compelling was necessary. But I don't know. And I think it's tricky because we want our kids to want to read, not to associate it with torture.

I've been trying to sort it out for myself.

As far as DS just sitting down with me and reading a book, I never forced. I selected coffee table type books that DS expressed a strong interest in. We own many DK publishing books, eye spies, and continue to watch documentaries for content. We also completed many hands-on type activities and museums. There is a lot of conversation, interaction, and vocabulary.

Most of son's eye reading was done with the tutor or consisted of school assignments. The school that he attended kept 3 Wilson tutors on staff plus we paid more tuition for the service. DS reading assignments in the classroom jumped in 4th grade and then we started using Learning Ally in earnest. When DS read aloud with me, it generally revolved around math, Bible, and history texts. DS read aloud to me homework assigned with Wilson that involved word lists, sentences, and paragraphs. Extra reading consisted of comprehension exercises with questions.

DS was attending school full time plus staying after for tutoring at least twice per week. Homework took forever once we got home. DS was fried by the time is was all over. I was in close contact with his language teachers. DS prelistened at night to every story that they happened to be covering in class at the time. He eventually started increasing the reading speed for that.

I am a strong supporter of Immersion tech. I realize that some people insist on their kids reading exclusively from text and that's great for them. My son uses audio and Immersion tech and has not been injured for it. He scored very well on the reading comp portion of the ACT last year without any test prep.

I'm not sure that I am the best guide for how to teach reading. With DD, she listens to her books and pleasure reads. For "school", we sit together and she reads aloud maybe 20 minutes daily.

ETA: DS read the entire Bible on-line by using audio and eye reading as a high schooler. I don't know how to express this. I don't want a weakness with decoding to interfere with learning. For topics that I consider really important, he listened or watched content until the decoding was sorted and he was able to read comfortably with zero mistakes. I did not want dyslexia to kill his joy of exploration. About 5th grade, son's SS teacher approached me to tell me that DS read from the Bible aloud beautifully. That was during year 4 of Wilson.

Edited by Heathermomster, 06 January 2017 - 12:09 PM.

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#17 Lecka

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 11:26 AM

https://www.amazon.c...sual dictionary

This is the book my son had (has). He loved this book and I read it to him, he would pick pages for me to read. He really liked this book for a long time.

If you go in a book store or the non-fiction section of the library, you can see what your child is drawn to.

There are books that have cross-sections of the spaceships with layovers -- not my son's thing.

There are books with scenes from the movies -- not my son's thing.

https://www.amazon.c...ader_1465435506

I am not sure if this is the exact one we have/had, but he also LOVES these Lego Star Wars ones. They are just character descriptions and they tell how the mini-figures changed between different sets. He really likes these.

Ninjago and Harry Potter are a little out-of-style now (compared to a couple of years ago) but my son had the Lego character books for both of them, they were very special to him at the time.

https://www.amazon.c...ds=lego ninjago

https://www.amazon.c...ader_0756692571
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#18 Lecka

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 11:39 AM

https://www.amazon.c...rds=darth revan

 

My son has read this book, now, but it is not something he would have read before. 

 

He hasn't really read many of the Star Wars novels, he just happens to really like Revan because of a video game that has Revan. 

 

That has been within the last year.

 

For a little younger -- he ADORED this book:  https://www.amazon.c...ds=jedi academy

 

I read it to him maybe twice, and then he read it for an entire summer.  He just loved this book.  It is good for fluency to read the same book, too. 

 

He has liked the sequels less and with book 4 there is a new author. 

 

But this book 1 was amazing for him. 

 

Then there is Origami Yoda.  https://www.amazon.c...ds=origami yoda  I have read about half of these out loud, they are also available on audiobook at our library.  These are books where my son would pick them as his prize for the library summer reading program, but I don't know if he has personally physically read more than one or two of them. 

 

This series is a little bit ---- I don't know, alternative?  It has things like bad teachers who make them watch poorly-made educational videos during class.  In a later book a boy's mom starts going to a church where the kids are afraid the boy won't be allowed to watch Star Wars anymore, but it ends up that the pastor (or youth leader, not sure) tells his mom it is okay.  So that worked out in a way I liked but I was a little worried I was not going to like how that went. (Edit -- these are really cool books, though, my son really liked them, they are very clever and they are edgy but edgy in a way that is okay for older kids in elementary school, I think.)

 

Then I think this is 3 books:  https://www.amazon.c...ader_B00WAUXVYK  They have these at the library now.  I haven't done more than glance at them, but my son has asked for them when we see them at Target, but they came out too late for when I would purchase them (as I am not trying so hard to find things for him now).  But if he were younger when they came out, they would be perfect for him to look through and re-read. 

 

Edit:  Some of these would be too hard now, but you can still get them and read them.  It is not that my son really sat down and read the visual dictionaries or the character encyclopedias, but they did contribute to him reading some here and there.  He was farther along when he read Jedi Academy and it was a book that was the right book at the right time for him, because it was hard, but it wasn't TOO hard (after I read it to him at least twice) and he could skip pages that had too much writing to look at the cartoons that were easier to read for him, and then he might ask me to read some pages to him.  But it was also a new book and so it was a book he would see older boys pick at the library for their reading prize, and that kind of thing was really important to him at the time.  He was very concerned he not be doing anything babyish.

 

He also drove me crazy by insisting he read Harry Potter when I thought it was way too soon, but I had read the books to him and he knew the plot from the movie, and it turned out that with so much support from having heard it before plus knowing the plot, it worked out.

 

Already knowing the plot made it a lot easier to follow along in books that were hard for him, it made a huge difference for him.

 

But a lot of that was wanting to be a cool big kid, it was not what "made sense" for him to try to read AT ALL.  But it worked out. 


Edited by Lecka, 06 January 2017 - 11:59 AM.

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#19 KathyBC

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 02:01 PM

I have a son with dyslexia/dysgraphia/adhd. I don't post much here--honestly I am just really depressed about it. The school messed him up big time and we pulled him out of school last year and he's mid-way through level 4 of barton, but he hasn't taken off with reading like I had hoped. He is 9. And his younger sister now reads better than he does (she's 6). Last night she wanted to read to the family and he just deflated. I don't know what to do, how to handle this, where to go from here. He's depressed and angry most of the time. He excels in athletics and is very good at math, but its almost like he's given up caring. 

 

I am upset that Barton isn't helping more than it is: its an expensive program and he doesn't struggle with it, but he HATES it. Its boring, and the stories are dry and boring too. He loves audiobooks but I think he needs more practice with reading if he is ever going to get it. Am I totally off base? 

My son finally started to make progress on reading, through intervention, at about age 9 too, but it took continued directed effort until he was about 11 to really take off. His younger sister passed him at both reading and spelling early on. We had family conversations as needed about his strengths and weaknesses and her strengths and weaknesses. We talked about how proud we were that he was working very hard to address something challenging. We explained how this would benefit him in later life as he already knew how to work hard to overcome hurdles. And we mentioned that there were areas in her life that she might need to address, too. We repeated these conversations as necessary.

 

It sounds like you and he are on track and need to keep on keeping on.


Edited by KathyBC, 06 January 2017 - 02:01 PM.

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#20 mamamoose

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 03:56 PM

My ds is 8, has never been in school, and is pretty similar. I think the others are correct that it's possible to have unrealistic expectations at this point. It's sort of like wow, I paid all this money, I brought in Barton, WHY ISN'T IT ALL BETTER!!

 

Since my ds has never been in school, and since he has had Barton, LIPS, etc. from the beginning, I don't have the school to blame it on. My ds is becoming self-cognizant, self-aware, and he's noticing his disability. THAT is what has disheartened him. Honestly, I would stop having a sibling read aloud in front of him. Like it would be nice if he was so mature, so strong, so self-confident that that wasn't going to hurt him, but personally I would just create a new way you roll together. Like everyone reads silently and then discusses or Dad reads aloud or everyone gets assigned the passage in the morning to read on their own time and discuss as a family in the evening. There would be lots of creative ways to work around that. I'm unrealistically protective, so I would. There are enough opportunities in life to hurt that I don't have to pile on more. Or have them read verses and take turns with verses, instead of it being like the whole chapter. He could probably get through one verse at a time.

 

I've been trying to read with my ds in the evening, and even though he *can* read the verses he shies away. At first he was game, but then he started pulling back. It's just HARD! I mean, think about it. We take something that is very important to us (learning about God) and we connect it to a disability! We wouldn't look at a person with no legs and say the only way to get to church was to walk; we'd give them a car! But we look at our kids with dyslexia and say the ONLY way to learn about God is to READ THIS PRINT AND READ IT NOW BECAUSE I SAID SO AND READ IT IN FRONT OF PEOPLE.

 

Kinda doesn't work, lol. If I were more organized, what I would do is use a Bible reading app, put the assigned text on a daily checklist, and just have him do that as independent work. There's no reason why it HAS to be done only one way. My problem is enforcement, facilitating. My ds, with the ADHD plus ASD, is a real pistol to organize. But my dd (only ADHD) at that age, sure, that's what I would have done. Once you stack the disabilities, you're like hmm, how do I make that happen? I have ABA workers who come in, and I can assign things. But if you can find a way to make it happen (like you use daily checklists, he works through his plan), then yes, that would be another really smart way to work around it.

 

I did have the learning disability talk with my ds. I had to, because he was just really getting discouraged at how hard things were. To him it was like well this is hard so let's just not do it! And with ASD, not do it literally means NOT AT ALL.  :svengo: So we talked about brilliant people with SLDs. Last night we watched a couple of these (really bizarre, not sure what I think of them) Percy and the Olympians movies, and Percy is open and out about his dyslexia and his FRUSTRATION over his dyslexia! There's this really cool scene where another character points out to him that his dyslexia was because he has a GIFT and that his ADHD was his SUPERPOWER! Do you realize how powerful this message is! We have to turn it like this!

 

So when I had the discussion with him, I used the Ben Foss thing that yes it's hard, but that he can ear read, he can eye read, that all reading is reading, and that even though it's hard and we have to work on it, he can use MORE tech even than we already do, that he can have MORE tech as he thinks of ideas and ways to use it. He has GOT to own the tech and use the tech and embrace the tech. That's my theory. Right now my ds has a kindle and access to my ipad. Now that his big sis is gone, he'll have access to an imac (for big things like Inspiration) and a pc laptop (for robotics). They need tech they can dictate into. They need tech that will do immersion reading. They need to learn to type. 

 

I agree with you on Barton. It's very efficient. Have you done RAN/RAS drills? And have you drilled the Barton words to fluency? Level 4 is rough. Also, when your ds was diagnosed, did they do any language testing? My ds had language quirks because of his ASD, but I've been told that dyslexics in general fall behind on language (subtly, sometimes not subtly) because their peers are reading more and getting more inputs. So that means he needs to be ear reading MORE than his peers are eye reading, because he may need to do language catch-up or work hard to stay even. If he doesn't know the language, it's really hard to read with comprehension, kwim? My ds, because of his extensive ear reading, has an outrageous vocabulary, like 99th percentile, and it boosts his humble decoding level (3rd) to a really ridiculous overall reading level (5th/6th last time we tested him). That score was while in Barton 4 at the end of 1st. 

 

So for my ds, refusing to read is not because he can't decode or not because he can't get there overall. He can in spurts. It's just it's VERY HARD. Wicked hard. So hard that he can't bring his little ASD soul to do it. Now comics go over huge! I got him 3 print books of Calvin and Hobbes, and those go over big! I've been paying him Mickey Bucks for books. I printed a file from Etsy ($5) and he earns $1 in money for disney (yeah, yeah!!!) with each book. You realize he could have earned HUNDREDS of dollars for Disney when we started this? But no, he has earned maybe, I don't know. It's low. It's just HARD. 

 

I think the more you can work in some consistency, routine, and expectation, the better it's going to be for tackling the "it's hard" part. I have ABA tutors, and they do some partner reading. We need to do more. They don't like to because they like to shake things up. But to partner read and get through an hour a day in chunks, that would not be too much. The tutor who did fresh testing for us this summer said it's hard because of the dyslexia and that we just have to DO it. There's not going to be a way around that. 

 

And I don't know. Like, to me, to my sensibilities, I wish it was just oh we got his reading so high that it was EASY and then he just DID it. Or we got him some highly engaging books and then he just DID it. Or we waited till his language or development kicked in and then he just DID it. And I *do* see where my ds spurts in his reading when we do language work, when we up the interest, etc. Language was DEFINITELY holding him back! And this is a kid with a 99th percentile vocabulary!

 

I have another ABA tutor joining, and yes I could assign more reading together. I probably will. It IS hard.  However I'm not sure that I want to wham to some really high number. I'm undecided or hesitant. I think you have to look at your child, at his mind, at his soul, and see how it's going. I don't think you torture into more reading. However my ds did have some behaviors and does have some issues where it's just like oh I have to decide to sit and do this. He's super, super, super ADHD. Like he was off gymnastics a month over the holidays, and he was blowing people's minds with his energy. It's NO WONDER he's not sitting there reading, kwim? So for us, when we create some structure and routine and a cozy spot and say no we're really going to do this, that helps him contain his body and get his mind ready. And what the workers usually do is set a required time (10 minutes) and then say he can read more if he wants. That really works! He often goes over! But then HE chose to go longer, kwim? And there was no physical reward/motivator there like candy or Mickey Bucks. At that point he's continuing to read because he's engaged and enjoys it. I think variety in motivators can be good, but he can read simply by having structure and the knowledge maybe of a pleasant follow-up activity when we're done.

 

Did Heathermomster reply here yet? She told me privately that when her ds was in these early years (4th?) things seemed DIRE. And at the time ds was in 1st or K5 and I was like DIRE, my kid will never be DIRE! My kid is getting early intervention from awesome me with the most awesome materials so things will never seem DIRE!! And now I'm like OH MY LANDS. There are SO many pieces that come together, and it feels like some tornado hit and blew them all over and you're like Dude I have to scavenge here for a piece and there for a piece and the pieces are SHATTERED. It doesn't FEEL like it will ever come together.

 

I take great solace in knowing that for many kids it comes together with enough time and continued piecing. I freak out knowing that time is actually very short to do this. I thought I had a long time, and I don't. That makes it feel dire all over again.

 

So I'm right there with you. We have to speak truth to ourselves. With the new semester and a new/additional worker coming, I'm going to be sitting down making lists. This is something you probably do too. Like I always did with dd, but with ds it's harder. Lists of what I need to get done (foundational skill goals) but always what HE needs to be doing to make his soul flourish. And ways we can amp that to fit him even BETTER and keep him more engaged. Like one of my workers is artistic! This is really fun, because we can tie making pictures and handwriting!! I get so bogged down and basic by myself, and these bright kids get BORED. That's why I got the K'nex robotics. I need to find more ways to make sure I'm really connecting at his MIND level, not just his disability level. It's SO hard sometimes. We want it all to be synchronized, almost to hold onto them and say slow down! We have to prepare for some HUGE spreads there. My ds functions multiple, multiple grades ahead in some areas and multiple, multiple grades behind in others. That's a really hard spread!

 

Are you using an ipad for your Barton 4? I love the app, love it. How is the handwriting going? We've concluded it is holding us back too much. We've tried for a semester, and it's just not a functional way for him to proceed. We've all agreed as a team we're going to focus on typing. I got pneumonia and then bronchitis back to back (I kid you not) and now have another cough. I wake up in the morning and go to bed and night thinking how can we do this, how can we nurture this spread and both the strengths and the weaknesses, how can we make this more uplifting and inspiring and engaging WITH A MOVING TARGET! It's not like the kids just stay put! They grow and change. You have a good balance, and then it shifts again. You constantly feel behind. And it's your first kid, so you're constantly learning just plain about development and what's coming too.

 

OneStep has talked about the severe balance shift her practitioners begged her to bring in. That's hard. To go ok I see weaknesses and want to work on them, but we're going to make sure some time each day is really at their level, at their gift level, at their mind level. That's hard! And what those things are shifts (at least I find they do) and needs to be adjusted at least every semester. At least. Or maybe others are better at this? I'm not.  

 

I agree with a developmental vision exam. If he needs reading glasses, he has convergence issues. Easy to fix in just a few months. Given the dysgraphia plus the vision, I would get an OT eval. If you can find someone who's killer with retained reflexes, that's what you're looking for. They can underly the convergence issues and make the dysgraphia worse. Sometimes it's hard, even when you know what you're looking for. I've taken my dd to at least 3 OTs, and now I've got a PT that is really stellar. You talk about cynical. At $100 an hour, you get cynical fast! But still if you find the right person there can be some improvement to be had. 

 

RAN/RAS is easy to work on yourself, and really it made my ds' reading more fluid, more comfortable. Now he has apraxia and attitude (haha), so it's not like easy peasy. But I'm just saying RAN/RAS you can improve. It's directly correlated to stronger readers, so it's worth working on. I've posted my file links in the past and am lazy. To google search, type your terms and site:welltrainedmind.com  Try searching "ohelizabeth ran/ras site:welltrainedmind.com" or "ohelizabeth dropbox site:welltrainedmind.com" and see what you find. I use google site searches all the time. Like you could read everything OneStep has to say about math, that kind of thing. :)

This is a lot to respond to! Thank you so much for your time and energy devoted to this post!  :grouphug:

 

My mom is tutoring him, not me. I don't have time and she's got plenty!  :lol:  She's doing an excellent job and I trust that she is taking it slow enough and he is reviewing and doing fluency, etc. 

 

My dh works long hours--like 12-14 hour days most days, including Saturdays. We take Sundays off. Bible reading time in the evening is as a family and that's his wish, and that's not going to change. I have mixed feelings on protecting him too much from knowing he's not reading adequately--I think he's smart enough (very high IQ) to know that anyway, even without little sister, and I feel like hiding it from him isn't doing him "justice" either. 

 

I don't know of a COVD optometrist within 200 miles of here--how would I find that out? Is it covered by insurance? And the nearest OT is 80 miles (walmart is too, as a point of reference). We drove 120 miles one way twice a week last summer for neurofeedback. I don't know what we can afford a whole lot more right now in the way of travel and doctor appointments. I had fully intended to get him into an OT but that is just not realistic in the middle of winter--we have not seen temps above 0 for two weeks!

 

He doesn't seem to have any speech issues--he's had several evaluations, including speech and nothing detected there. Some days I'm certain he has dysgraphia and some days I don't buy it--one day he's right on with handwriting and the next not so much. He definitely has some fine motor skill issues (piano is difficult, typing, handwriting, etc) but my good friend who is a schoolteacher and the mother to 3 boys just recently watched him writing and didn't think it was that out of line. 

 

Anyway, I have to run--hope to respond to all of these! I really appreciate the encouragement!



#21 mamamoose

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 04:00 PM

https://www.amazon.c...sual dictionary

This is the book my son had (has). He loved this book and I read it to him, he would pick pages for me to read. He really liked this book for a long time.

If you go in a book store or the non-fiction section of the library, you can see what your child is drawn to.

There are books that have cross-sections of the spaceships with layovers -- not my son's thing.

There are books with scenes from the movies -- not my son's thing.

https://www.amazon.c...ader_1465435506

I am not sure if this is the exact one we have/had, but he also LOVES these Lego Star Wars ones. They are just character descriptions and they tell how the mini-figures changed between different sets. He really likes these.

Ninjago and Harry Potter are a little out-of-style now (compared to a couple of years ago) but my son had the Lego character books for both of them, they were very special to him at the time.

https://www.amazon.c...ds=lego ninjago

https://www.amazon.c...ader_0756692571

Looks like my son would like the same books as your son. I am going to look into those. He was really into pokemon and devoured the character books on pokemon. He has set it aside but maybe star wars books would be a good thing. We are heading to see Rogue One tonight!



#22 mamamoose

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 04:05 PM

By the way he is EXTREMELY athletic and very very hyper--he is not attention deficit so much as hyperactive. He won state wrestling last year and took 4th the year before in a weight class higher than he actually he is. He is also a competitive downhill skier and excels on the swim team. He is really GOOD at a lot of things--he also remembers stories he has heard almost verbatim, Bible stories, especially. And he enjoys meaningful reading--loves reading the bible (probably the only thing he enjoys), and we never require him to read in front of anyone. Last night, gasp, so soon after posting this, he asked my dad to read aloud with him and they finished a short chapter book reading page for page and I felt encourage. This morning he refused to read at all, and I allowed him to skip his reading assignment. 

 

I go back and forth on whether or not he should be reading anything outside of barton or not. Its such a struggle and mostly I feel more self doubt about whether or not Im doing the right thing at all!


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#23 Lecka

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 04:16 PM

As far as enforcing reading.... what ended up working out was dividing things up.

Some reading program time. Doing as I wish. A limited time. If he has a good attitude and effort we end with a limited time. If not I will add time.

Some required book/quiet time. This is when he might choose to look at cool books. If he was really not in the mood he could play quietly with toys instead. But the cool books would win out a lot of the time.

Some special time for me to read to him. Zero times of me asking him to read a sentence or sound out a word. That would be during reading program time. We added this bc I snuck in too much and it really turned him off.

I also had a lot of incentives with reading program time, and kept it short and frequent. A lot of "do 2-5-10-15 minutes" depending on the situation, and then have a good snack.

I did "first reading program then swimming."

Mom reading time was his special time with me, I would tell the little kids to wait. I would do things like tell the little kids they were not mature enough to look at the nice books alone. Not really true but it made it more special for him. The little kids sounding sometimes look with him while he told them facts about the pictures.

That is where we settled. I was too pushy at first.

But building the times into the day helped a lot, and adding in the times when I wouldn't quiz him helped a lot.

I think I was really too pushy, though, and it was counter-productive, so I focus more on being gentle. I was too far on the other side and needed to add a lot of gentleness to get into the middle ground.

#24 Lecka

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 04:28 PM

Had cross-posted.... if he is doing Barton, I think anything above that should be added slowly and gently. But if you want to add you can. Has he covered the long vowel kinds of things?

Also it helped me to read about fluency. Bottom line is easier reading is good, repeated reading is good, lack of stress around reading is good, support (by hearing it first, knowing some plot points, knowing about characters and structure from other books in a series, reading just a paragraph while mom reads more, etc.) are all things that help with fluency.

It doesn't replace other things to work on reading, at all, but it can be something that is good to add at a certain point and with a balance.

There is a lot about fluency that I don't see as much with dyslexia stuff bc it is more common, and dyslexia stuff is more focused on stuff (phonemic awareness and decoding) that is more important with dyslexia. But fluency is also good and there is a lot out there.

The reading out loud is a great thing too.

If you wanted to be school-y you could read the night before a passage that would then be read in the morning. If you could add that in naturally it is something. Or have that passage again later in the day in some way. That would get either repeated reading or pre-viewing in.

If it doesn't seem necessary it isn't, but if it seems like it would help it can be a fluency kind of thing to do.

But don't be like me and add too much when something is working, you risk it becoming unpleasant.

But it sounds very nice!

I have let my son look at book previews on Amazon too, here and there. Sometimes it works out that it builds up his anticipation a little bit. He can be more interested when he picks sometimes. But it depends. Sometimes things bomb, too.

Edited by Lecka, 06 January 2017 - 04:29 PM.


#25 Lecka

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 04:38 PM

Also my son liked the Pokémon character books, too. There are a lot of books like this with stuff like Star Wars, Harry Potter, and Ninjago. I have seen it for Angry Birds I think. If you can find the movie-themed section in non-fiction you can see a lot of movie tie-in stuff.

Oh, my kids are aware of Skylander but we don't do it, and we have seen similar books about Skylander.

This is more recent too, but I get Game Informer through GameStop and the Lego Club magazine. Game Informer is now that he is older, for him it is what he went to after (and overlapping) Lego Club.

But there might be more magazines or sports biographies he might like, too. There is a lot available of stuff like that for more athletic kids. There are sports magazines that some kids like. Personally I would look for ones with a lot of nice pictures and not as much text, they may be a lot more appealing and seem less like he is being tricked into reading. This is where -- if he looks, fine, if you read to him, fine. Some time they are something he may read on his own. I do provide a space in the day it is likely to look at or read them, but he could play toys as an option if I knew he did look at them too in general. So it is less strict and bossy to him, since it is supposed to be enjoyable for him at that time in the day.

Edited by Lecka, 06 January 2017 - 04:42 PM.


#26 OhElizabeth

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 07:51 PM

They started off saying ADHD inattentive on my ds (which clearly was incorrect) and moved over to ADHD-combined type. My ds is like yours, doing tons of sports. He'll do 3 hours of soccer camp and then in the evening go do 3 hours of team gymnastics.  :D His energy without sports is off the charts, like drives him wild. 

 

I think I would view a good COVD eye exam more as a check it off your list type thing. Like maybe schedule just the basic exam, but do it with a COVD doc with a really good reputation, and ask them to *screen* him for the developmental stuff (convergence, etc.). I've driven 2 1/2 hours each way for therapy, so I get what you're saying. I would stack things. Like don't go out of your way just for that, but just arrange it and stack it with something else when you're already going. That way you could just check it off the list as not an issue.  And sometimes convergence issues are mild and just need a little.

 

Did the neurofeedback do any good? I'm sort of mixed in my mind about it. It seemed to slow my ds down, so that he didn't wake up so ON as he used to. Not really sure it did anything for him that was permanently good. And for dd it was WAY too much auditory input to process. Well, I take that back. When we started the neurofeedback, ds was EXTREMELY reactive to things. Like problems in bathrooms with hand dryers, etc. And that calmed down. We were doing a lot at once, so what was the neurofeedback, what was the listening therapy, etc., kwim? And we did *some* work on retained reflexes, which also helped things. I'm going to take him to the PT we found and have her check to see if there's more work to do on the reflexes or more she can do to get things to tone down. After that, honestly, he may need meds. I don't know, I hate that but I'm just saying that's what they're for and that's why they're there.


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#27 mamamoose

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 08:58 PM

They started off saying ADHD inattentive on my ds (which clearly was incorrect) and moved over to ADHD-combined type. My ds is like yours, doing tons of sports. He'll do 3 hours of soccer camp and then in the evening go do 3 hours of team gymnastics. :D His energy without sports is off the charts, like drives him wild.

I think I would view a good COVD eye exam more as a check it off your list type thing. Like maybe schedule just the basic exam, but do it with a COVD doc with a really good reputation, and ask them to *screen* him for the developmental stuff (convergence, etc.). I've driven 2 1/2 hours each way for therapy, so I get what you're saying. I would stack things. Like don't go out of your way just for that, but just arrange it and stack it with something else when you're already going. That way you could just check it off the list as not an issue. And sometimes convergence issues are mild and just need a little.

Did the neurofeedback do any good? I'm sort of mixed in my mind about it. It seemed to slow my ds down, so that he didn't wake up so ON as he used to. Not really sure it did anything for him that was permanently good. And for dd it was WAY too much auditory input to process. Well, I take that back. When we started the neurofeedback, ds was EXTREMELY reactive to things. Like problems in bathrooms with hand dryers, etc. And that calmed down. We were doing a lot at once, so what was the neurofeedback, what was the listening therapy, etc., kwim? And we did *some* work on retained reflexes, which also helped things. I'm going to take him to the PT we found and have her check to see if there's more work to do on the reflexes or more she can do to get things to tone down. After that, honestly, he may need meds. I don't know, I hate that but I'm just saying that's what they're for and that's why they're there.


I think the nearest COVD is 300 miles. 🙄 I'm not opposed to driving that but it seems like that's all we do and getting school in becomes a challenge.

Neurofeedback changed him dramatically but he seems to have fallen backwards now that I think of it. Maybe I need a follow up? He had night terrors and walked the house/halls all night, remembering none of it, he couldn't focus on anything for longer than 5 minutes, had literally no interest in anything like legos--he now completes HUGE legos sets without issue! His mood was improved too but that has slid backwards and his focus has too...I know we should get counseling too, he and I at the very least.

His energy is off the charts too. I wish I had a tiny bit of it for myself, because I sometimes feel I'm barely getting by!

#28 Storygirl

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 09:16 PM

Just wanted to respond to a couple of things in your longer post.

 

I don't think that not having him listen to his sister reading is shielding him from his reading difficulties. I'm sure he knows he has a hard time reading. It's protecting him from feeling humiliation, sadness, etc. Those are not helpful feelings. People with learning disabilities can really struggle with feelings of self worth, and it is worth avoiding triggers if at all possible.

 

Also, don't be too quick to dismiss the possibility of dysgraphia. Your friend, as wise as she may be, is not an expert in dysgraphia, and your description of his difficulties is pretty spot on regarding what dysgraphia can look like.

 

My son has dysgraphia and dyspraxia, diagnosed by a NP and an OT. And yet his handwriting is not bad enough for him to get help for handwriting in his IEP. And he is very athletic and was a competitive gymnast until recently. 

 

At almost 13 (sixth grade), his dysgraphia causes issues with copying material from the board or writing down what the teacher or other students say in class. He has trouble keeping his words on the lines and in the proper spaces when filling out workbook pages, but his handwriting is mostly legible. Typing is easier for him.  He has trouble getting his thoughts from his brain to the paper. This is a bigger issue than the handwriting, and he does get help for it in his IEP.

 

Just to give you a picture about what things could look like a couple of years down the line. DS does not have dyslexia, so that adds another layer of complexity in writing for your son.


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#29 maize

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 09:24 PM

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

I have a nine year old with all the same diagnoses as your son plus dyscalculia and anxiety. Success in academics is really hard for these kids!

 

For reading material, have you looked at High Noon Books? These phonics based easy chapters books are good for reading practice: http://www.highnoonb...ROUPdatarq=item

 

Other ideas to consider: 

 

Vision therapy (I haven't done this yet but know it does seem to help some)

Medication for ADHD if you have not tried this yet (being able to focus can help)

Reading glasses if he has even slight farsightedness or astigmatism.

 

I let my dd listen to all the audiobooks she wants, they are wonderful for building vocabulary and comprehension and general language skills.

 

 

 



#30 OhElizabeth

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 09:35 PM

I think the nearest COVD is 300 miles. 🙄 I'm not opposed to driving that but it seems like that's all we do and getting school in becomes a challenge.

Neurofeedback changed him dramatically but he seems to have fallen backwards now that I think of it. Maybe I need a follow up? He had night terrors and walked the house/halls all night, remembering none of it, he couldn't focus on anything for longer than 5 minutes, had literally no interest in anything like legos--he now completes HUGE legos sets without issue! His mood was improved too but that has slid backwards and his focus has too...I know we should get counseling too, he and I at the very least.

His energy is off the charts too. I wish I had a tiny bit of it for myself, because I sometimes feel I'm barely getting by!

 

This is fascinating. You hear these stories. We did 30+ sessions and didn't complete the suggested 40. Sigh. But I don't think that's the issue for my ds. I don't think it would have made that kind of difference. Does he do the huge lego sets completely by himself? Ds is asking for more sets. I used to do everything *with* him because his spatial was so bad. Like he'd assemble sections flipped, reversed, very frustrating for him when he realized they wouldn't go together. But you're right, it hadn't hit me that now he would probably do sets by himself if I got ones that intrigued him, hmm. He just makes things for himself now. Actually, he was asking for a warthog kit today, something they don't really make. (The custom sets are $$$.) So we'll see.

 

I agree, 300 miles is a long way! We don't get everything done. Life isn't perfect. A former head of COVD has a book. I got it, and some of the exercises are good. There's just a lot we don't get done. Kenneth Lane was the name.

 

What I don't know, in reality, is how much of the not reading would change instantly with meds. Can't know without trying them. Don't like regrets.

 

Agree with Story, btw, that your friend is not in a position to say yes/no on SLD writing. My ds is kind of funky with writing. He's basically non-functional for real life, every day, but he'll pull it out and look ok for a super short spurt for an OT. It's not the OT that gets to decide what is an SLD either. All these people have opinions and feel compelled to tell us their profound thoughts. Reality is the psych decides and they decide it based on discrepancy between what they should be getting out and what they can. Actually I have no clue how they do it. I just agree I would not listen to teachers, well-meaning therapists, well-meaning friends, etc. The psych eval decides that. I've had my kid through so many psychs and therapists, and I get SO TIRED of therapists, tutors, etc. who diagnose out of specialty and are wrong. It keeps us from getting needed evals and interventions. It undermines our own common sense and intuition about what is going on.

 

I can tell you that with my ds there's a profundity to his difficulty. My dd's motor planning for handwriting is a little crunchy, and getting out her thoughts, even onto screen, is fatiguing. But for my ds, it's this whole other level. And I had that gut level "my lands this is not right" well before I had validation. I think you have to listen to your gut. There are degrees, and sure some kids are crunchy who don't get the label. But listen to your gut and don't let unqualified people diagnose. 



#31 OhElizabeth

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 09:37 PM

I don't think that not having him listen to his sister reading is shielding him from his reading difficulties. I'm sure he knows he has a hard time reading. It's protecting him from feeling humiliation, sadness, etc. Those are not helpful feelings. People with learning disabilities can really struggle with feelings of self worth, and it is worth avoiding triggers if at all possible.

 

 

This.



#32 mamamoose

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 08:54 AM

I disagree to some extent that my friend isn't in a position to offer advice. She s a very close friend and mentor for me and has a ton of experience and is very caring and thoughtful. She didn't say it wasn't dysgraphia but she did say his writing was within the range of normal. I think the symptoms explained above very well fit him, though, and that's what keeps me hanging on to that diagnosis, although with work it copying has improved, spacing has improved, letter size has improved, etc. 

 

His psychologist does not think he's a great candidate for medication as his type of ADHD is treatable, yes, but because its more hyper than attention related, he is likely to suffer depression while on them, and he's already depressed to a degree. 

 

OHElizabeth: We noticed the biggest improvement in the last 10 sessions of neurofeedback. Before those, he got worse!!! It was awful, his mood swings and inability to stay on task, his anger and aggression. But the last 10 sessions he had frontal lobe and it assimilated all the previous work. He put legos together backwards all the time and couldn't even see what he had done incorrectly--he has put together sets for 12+ in the last 3 months in short time periods and his focus is excellent. He will still assemble things backwards but doesn't meltdown about having to take it apart, his ability to cope with change is better in general. 

 

I wish we had more options living here. We are 70 miles from a doctor, a grocery store, a gas station...



#33 mamamoose

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 09:20 AM

As for the COVD I will try to get an appointment this month. If it doesn't happen this month it can't happen until April or alter, because we have ski season and wrestling overlapped in February/March and we are on the road every day going the opposite direction. It doesn't seem like I should put that stuff ahead of his "health" but its the only thing he looks forward to and I feel like he feels "on the spot" already as we have been to 5 different eye doctors, 3 different counselors, and he had some other health issues last year where they thought he might have lymphoma and/or tonsil cancer, so we traveled for that a lot as well. He does NOT have it, Praise the Lord, but we saw 4 different docs last spring in the middle of it all.


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#34 Heathermomster

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 10:02 AM

If the NP diagnosed him with the SLD written expression, then he has it.  Accommodate him by scribing and possibly using speech to text with Siri or on an Android device.  My son's legibility, speed, and sequencing of thought are affected by dysgraphia.  Writing expectations increase substantially by about 5th grade.  If the diagnosis is correct, it will be affirmed IRL then.  

 

Reading instruction is boring and challenging on these kiddos' brains.  The multisensory instruction rewires the brain by creating new neural pathways.  Reading instruction hurts.  Why would a child undergoing these kind of therapies willingly pick up a book on their off time?  Reward your DS for his efforts.  Find his currency and use it to your mutual advantage.  Do not reward bad attitude.  This instruction is temporary and the payoff is huge.   Once he gets further down the line with Barton, things will improve.  


Edited by Heathermomster, 07 January 2017 - 10:29 AM.

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#35 Lecka

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 11:20 AM

I agree with that. I think that is where if there are some cool books to look at, it can be a gentle transition to start reading here and there as it gets easier. But there is at least that feeling that books are cool to look at bc they are Star Wars or Legos or something.

That was the first independent reading for him.

There is no way to tell a child "okay, now go read independently" (in the sense of not being told "read now, out loud, so I know you are doing it").

But this is what transitioned to a time when he would flip through and read a little, and then it transitioned to some more reading.

He doesn't just pick up a book now, unless the video game magazine comes. That is the only time. But he likes to read at bedtime, or if I ask him to read a while (as a routine when before bed it doesn't fit in).

But this is after years. Years. In the first year it is still very early.

#36 mamamoose

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 11:25 AM

The NP did not diagnose any of his SLD, afaik.

#37 kbutton

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 02:38 PM

Totally off topic, but OhE, this might not be a spatial problem. My older kiddo would recognize the same shape in letters (m, w, b, d, p, q), and he had to mentally assent to "allow' them to be "different" letters based on their orientation. To him, they were the same shape, and orientation didn't matter (there was an element of "this is ridiculous" about the idea to him. Your DS could be stuck on shape vs. orientation with the Legos. Or not. But I thought I'd mention that.

 

Does he do the huge lego sets completely by himself? Ds is asking for more sets. I used to do everything *with* him because his spatial was so bad. Like he'd assemble sections flipped, reversed, very frustrating for him when he realized they wouldn't go together. 

 


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#38 OhElizabeth

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 02:54 PM

Mamamoose, what was the system of neurofeedback you were doing?



#39 OhElizabeth

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 02:57 PM

Totally off topic, but OhE, this might not be a spatial problem. My older kiddo would recognize the same shape in letters (m, w, b, d, p, q), and he had to mentally assent to "allow' them to be "different" letters based on their orientation. To him, they were the same shape, and orientation didn't matter (there was an element of "this is ridiculous" about the idea to him. Your DS could be stuck on shape vs. orientation with the Legos. Or not. But I thought I'd mention that.

 

Hmm, so sort of a rigidity? Interesting. In his case, he was looking at the picture and building the mirror image. It was just a total flip. I had to watch him very carefully, because it would compound and leave him really frustrated and storming off. I always had to check each step. Now he builds his own things, so we haven't built from instructions in ages. 

 

Oh, total rabbit trail, but the new ABA worker might able to handle knex math stuff, hmm. And if I gave them a really big set to work on (a coaster or something), they could work on the behaviors he has with it...


Edited by OhElizabeth, 07 January 2017 - 02:57 PM.


#40 kbutton

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 03:03 PM

Hmm, so sort of a rigidity? Interesting. In his case, he was looking at the picture and building the mirror image. It was just a total flip. I had to watch him very carefully, because it would compound and leave him really frustrated and storming off. I always had to check each step. Now he builds his own things, so we haven't built from instructions in ages. 

 

Oh, total rabbit trail, but the new ABA worker might able to handle knex math stuff, hmm. And if I gave them a really big set to work on (a coaster or something), they could work on the behaviors he has with it...

 

I'll send a PM so as not to derail the thread too much.


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#41 Storygirl

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 03:20 PM

The NP did not diagnose any of his SLD, afaik.

 

That's weird. Where did you get the dyslexia/dysgraphia diagnosis then?

 

*The schools call dyslexia SLD (Specific Learning Disability) in Reading, though the NP might say "dyslexia."

* The NP may say "dysgraphia" but the schools will say SLD in Written Expression.

*And NP may say "dyscalculia" but the schools will say SLD in math.

 

Same meaning. Different terms.

 

And about the dysgraphia. We've found the diagnosis of this to be strange. DS12's NP diagnosed dysgraphia/written expression, due to fine motor problems and difficulty getting thoughts onto paper. The school did NOT give him a SLD written expression designation, because his handwriting was "good enough." He had so many other issues that we didn't push to have them add the written expression LD on due to his composition difficulties; he gets help for it in his IEP anyway.

 

On the other hand, DD11, who has dyslexia, was NOT given a dysgraphia diagnosis by the NP, though when I asked about it, he said she might meet the criteria (he did not included it as a diagnosis in the report, though). However, the school DID give her SLD written expression, due to her extreme trouble with spelling (her spelling is poor enough that it can make her sentences unintelligible if you don't already know what she means to be saying).

 

So the schools and the NPs made the opposite determinations for my two kids. Weird. But it doesn't matter practically, because they are both getting the help they need in their IEPs and the intervention services offered by their schools. (In case you are wondering, my two kids with LDs do NOT have the same learning issues, though they both have trouble with writing).

 

I think for a homeschooler, having a documented history of the trouble with writing is going to be important for test-taking accommodations in later years. For example, someone who has trouble filling in the bubbles on the scan sheet can have the accommodation of marking answers in the answer booklet instead. And may get extra time, due to being slower than peers. Plus, for college purposes (if they are homeschooled all the way through high school), they may get an accommodation for having someone else take notes for them in class, or copies of the teacher's lecture notes, or permission to record the lectures with a smart pen. But college disability services will want to see that the student has used these accommodations and has a history of needing them. And that an IEP or NP report indicates that they are needed.

 

Since your son is still young, you have time to work this out. But keep it in mind. There is another active thread on the LC board right now where a mom is miserable that she has no documentation of her son's learning disabilities, because it means he can't get accommodations on the ACT, which might affect his chance to attend the college he wants.

 

So the dysgraphia piece is important. You don't need a diagnosis for it right now, but keep records for the future and samples of his work at different ages. If he is still having difficulty in these areas in the middle school years, be sure to plan ahead for the documentation he may need in high school and college.

 

And you can keep working on fine motor skills. Do coloring, cutting, cooking, crafts, macrame, etc. DS12's fine motor allows for mostly legible handwriting, but it hinders him in some personal areas (cutting food, tying shoes, carrying things without dropping them) and will impact what kind of job he might have in the future. An OT could help with this if you could see one, but even with therapy, the fine motor problem may only improve but not be fixed.


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#42 Storygirl

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 03:28 PM

Oh, another accommodation can be for the student to give answers orally for test questions instead of having to write them.

 

Just saw this mentioned in the other thread. If you haven't peeked in on that thread, you might want to. It's the "Really Sad and Frustrated about our Situation" thread on the main LC board. Can't link right now, but I'm sure you can find it.

 


Edited by Storygirl, 07 January 2017 - 03:29 PM.

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#43 mamamoose

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Posted 08 January 2017 - 08:05 AM

Hmm, so sort of a rigidity? Interesting. In his case, he was looking at the picture and building the mirror image. It was just a total flip. I had to watch him very carefully, because it would compound and leave him really frustrated and storming off. I always had to check each step. Now he builds his own things, so we haven't built from instructions in ages. 

 

Oh, total rabbit trail, but the new ABA worker might able to handle knex math stuff, hmm. And if I gave them a really big set to work on (a coaster or something), they could work on the behaviors he has with it...

That's exactly how ds was assembling legos. And he still does if he's tired...but his frustration level with re-making things has decreased. And he is aware he sees mirror images so he can think through it. This is where neurofeedback really helped him--his patience and coping skills.


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#44 mamamoose

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Posted 08 January 2017 - 08:13 AM

That's weird. Where did you get the dyslexia/dysgraphia diagnosis then?

 

*The schools call dyslexia SLD (Specific Learning Disability) in Reading, though the NP might say "dyslexia."

* The NP may say "dysgraphia" but the schools will say SLD in Written Expression.

*And NP may say "dyscalculia" but the schools will say SLD in math.

 

Same meaning. Different terms.

 

And about the dysgraphia. We've found the diagnosis of this to be strange. DS12's NP diagnosed dysgraphia/written expression, due to fine motor problems and difficulty getting thoughts onto paper. The school did NOT give him a SLD written expression designation, because his handwriting was "good enough." He had so many other issues that we didn't push to have them add the written expression LD on due to his composition difficulties; he gets help for it in his IEP anyway.

 

On the other hand, DD11, who has dyslexia, was NOT given a dysgraphia diagnosis by the NP, though when I asked about it, he said she might meet the criteria (he did not included it as a diagnosis in the report, though). However, the school DID give her SLD written expression, due to her extreme trouble with spelling (her spelling is poor enough that it can make her sentences unintelligible if you don't already know what she means to be saying).

 

So the schools and the NPs made the opposite determinations for my two kids. Weird. But it doesn't matter practically, because they are both getting the help they need in their IEPs and the intervention services offered by their schools. (In case you are wondering, my two kids with LDs do NOT have the same learning issues, though they both have trouble with writing).

 

I think for a homeschooler, having a documented history of the trouble with writing is going to be important for test-taking accommodations in later years. For example, someone who has trouble filling in the bubbles on the scan sheet can have the accommodation of marking answers in the answer booklet instead. And may get extra time, due to being slower than peers. Plus, for college purposes (if they are homeschooled all the way through high school), they may get an accommodation for having someone else take notes for them in class, or copies of the teacher's lecture notes, or permission to record the lectures with a smart pen. But college disability services will want to see that the student has used these accommodations and has a history of needing them. And that an IEP or NP report indicates that they are needed.

 

Since your son is still young, you have time to work this out. But keep it in mind. There is another active thread on the LC board right now where a mom is miserable that she has no documentation of her son's learning disabilities, because it means he can't get accommodations on the ACT, which might affect his chance to attend the college he wants.

 

So the dysgraphia piece is important. You don't need a diagnosis for it right now, but keep records for the future and samples of his work at different ages. If he is still having difficulty in these areas in the middle school years, be sure to plan ahead for the documentation he may need in high school and college.

 

And you can keep working on fine motor skills. Do coloring, cutting, cooking, crafts, macrame, etc. DS12's fine motor allows for mostly legible handwriting, but it hinders him in some personal areas (cutting food, tying shoes, carrying things without dropping them) and will impact what kind of job he might have in the future. An OT could help with this if you could see one, but even with therapy, the fine motor problem may only improve but not be fixed.

We got diagnosis from a private tutor/specialist first. She has a doctorate in reading/writing disabilities. The school wouldn't test him because he was still passing all subjects, but it was evident to me he had dyslexia. After I had him tested, the school wouldn't accommodate and we pulled him out of school, later finding out they HAD to test him and had I been informed and/or more knowledgeable, I could have requested in writing that he be tested, and they would have been forced to test him. Its a very small school (K-8 with 11 kids including mine), two teachers and an aide. PLENTY of teachers for the number of students, and in my opinion, it was out of sheer laziness on their end. Anyway, its a long story, but all 3 of my kids because homeschoolers as a result...we decided to force them to test him so they could SEE they were wrong. The teacher kept telling me (and him) that some kids just weren't smart enough to learn to read easily. He was plenty smart and tested behind in both reading and writing, so he was diagnosed with SLD in both of those. He was ahead in math. His reading comprehension was the only thing that wasn't behind in either of those "subjects". I don't think the NP officially diagnosed him for either of those because we already had the diagnosis...but I'm not sure.



#45 Storygirl

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 01:48 PM

I'm sorry. That's a terrible story. I'm glad that he has a mom like you!



#46 mamamoose

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 10:56 PM

I made an appointment with the COVD doctor for the last week in January--I don't know what to hope for with that appointment. :/
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#47 OhElizabeth

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Posted 10 January 2017 - 08:25 AM

Well they should be able to explain for you what they do, how long the appt will be, whether they will have time to screen for developmental vision issues, etc. Some docs, and I'm not saying all but some, will actually do their entire developmental vision exam in an hour. Some take like 2-3 hours and do it separately from a regular vision exam. Some docs on that list rarely deal with developmental vision stuff and aren't very helpful when you go.

 

To avoid disappointment, I DEFINITELY recommend you TALK with the practice and ask lots of questions. You're going to huge effort, and it's TOTALLY REASONABLE to want info ahead. Don't walk in blind, not having gotten the details of how they roll, and then come back and say it was a waste. You have to ask. Places vary, practices vary. Ask, ask, ask. 

 

Your tip of the day. If the practice is listed on the COVD website, they may have links to email the eye doc or their therapists. If the place hires and lists therapists, that can be a sign that they do a lot of VT. Anyways, I would definitely, DEFINITELY avail yourself of that! Email them directly and ask these questions. That way you skip the middle person of the phone receptionist and move directly to someone who knows how things are done.


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#48 mamamoose

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Posted 10 January 2017 - 08:46 AM

Well I talked to the receptionist who asked the doctor while I was on the phone and since he's had a regular vision exam in the last 6 months, they won't even do that and will go directly to the vision development testing that day. I need to get those documents sent asap. And thankfully it's covered by our insurance.
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#49 mamamoose

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Posted 25 January 2017 - 11:29 PM

So he does have vision issues--just got back from the 320 mile round trip to the COVD doctor and she wants more testing (to tailor the therapy) and Therapy. To start with she prescribed new glasses and now we have to figure out how in the heck we can make this work. I was so hoping this wasn't the problem but I guess now we know and maybe it explains a lot??? Anyway, I will be posting on the correct board tomorrow when I'm on my computer.
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#50 Heathermomster

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Posted 29 January 2017 - 08:22 AM

We were told by VT that DS required prism glasses which cost $500 at her practice. I took the prescription to a Walmart Vision Center, and they filled it for considerably less.

Edited by Heathermomster, 29 January 2017 - 08:24 AM.

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