Is this 10th grade plan reasonable?

[pehp]

Without going into the specific details of what we're looking at for 10th grade, I'd love others' input on whether our plans are realistic. I am asking because my 14 year old is my oldest, and so of course I have no prior experience with homeschooling a high schooler!

We are looking at taking 2 classes/day (1.5 hours each, for a total of 3 hours/day on Mon, Tuesday, and Thursday).  On Wednesdays, he'd have 4.5 hours of classes (adding in Spanish 3, which I MIGHT convince him to audit).  Fridays are totally off.  It'll be 6 classes: math, literature, Spanish 3, French 3 (college credit), world geography, and science.  Plus piano--he's advanced intermediate, and needs to practice at least half an hour a day. 

I think it's pretty reasonable, but we've never done this many outsourced classes (they will all be outsourced, and the only "lite" one will be literature--House of Humane Letters).  Currently my son does Honors French 2 and Spanish 2 as outsourced, and we keep everything else in-house. He has a 100 average in both, so he does just fine!  However, they take a lot of time. 

He's a very intelligent person and a slow, deliberate worker.  Things take awhile!  I just don't want him to be completely overwhelmed, but he and I have both agreed that he needs more outsourced classes next year; he enjoys them, and I am helping to care for my father who has incurable cancer, so I need to be Less Necessary than I've been in the past. 🙂 And he just tends to be more motivated to do the work for a "class" than he is for just me--which I don't consider atypical for a 14 year old boy! I can appreciate that! 

For a student who works slowly, but steadily, is this an excessive schedule of outsourced classes? 

Thank you!

 

Monday	Tuesday	Wednesday	Thursday	Friday
Algebra 1.5	French 3 1.5	Algebra 1.5	French 1.5
Biology 1.5	Literature 1.5	Biology  1.5	World Geography 1.5
		Spanish 3 1.5

+ piano 1 hour lesson 1x/week plus daily practice sessions 

Edited March 24, 2022 by pehp

[Lori D.]

I see SIX outsourced courses, with 2 being 2 different languages -- plus Music (piano). That seems a lot to me, but if your student does well with online classes, and has already been doing 2-4 online classes in a semester previously, then this could work.

The main concern I would have is time for doing all of the homework and exercises that would have to be turned in, and time for READING all the material for every class AND the literature -- and being done by a "slow methodical worker".

What with also having piano daily, and possible outside-the-home activities, that could mean having to work through the weekends and/or evenings... which does not seem like a very balanced lifestyle and could lead to burn out before even graduating, if you keep up that same pace all through high school. BUT, you know your student BEST, and some students thrive on heavy academic loads.

Also, because of your time/emotional commitment to help your father (so sorry about the incurable cancer diagnosis!) I would be very concerned about your ability to help, or to notice if DS is starting to "go under". As your father declines, your ability for time and mental juggling of things other than being a caregiver will greatly decline, so that could impact your DS.

Because of that, I would either drop the Geography and do in informally at home through self-study so that it could be as lite or rigorous as fits in with everything else. OR, at least, discuss with DS and together decide mutually on one class that you would both be fine with dropping midway through the semester/year if it is getting to be too much for DS, and/or too much for you, if your father takes a turn for the worse.

BEST wishes, Lori D.

Edited March 24, 2022 by Lori D.

[MamaSprout]

It also depends on the provider and what level he is in the languages. If he's in the first or second year for both languages, I wouldn't advise it. It gets tricky with keeping vocabulary straight, etc, especially since they are both romance languages. 

[8filltheheart]

It doesn't look too bad to me.  I have had kids take multiple languages simultaneously, so that wouldn't concern me too much.  I do agree with Lori, though.  I'd look for a world geography course that he could do independently at home so that he can have one course that is more flexible in terms of due dates in case life goes haywire.  Oak Meadow has a fairly decent world geo class that might give you a place to start looking.

[madteaparty]

It seems fine though I will say we have not done more that two college classes at a time (I think we did three one semester and it felt like a lot). I’m not sure which ones are DE. My son has always taken two languages at a time, totally unrelated to each other, but again not both DE at the same time except once.

[JazzyMom]

My dd also did 2 languages at once, but only 1 was DE.  She is the type of kid who takes her time working and also needs time to do things that are non school related.

This looks like an intense schedule to me, especially since you say he is a slow, deliberate worker and also needs time for piano.  Also, since you will be helping your father, neither one of you needs the stress of an intense schedule that you have to help manage.

I would consider doing literature independently and saving geography for another year, so he has more time on Tuesdays and Thursdays to do independent work.  You could do one class (maybe geography) over the summer.

One of the benefits of homeschooling is that we don’t have to overload our kids, especially during times of great stress, so I would consider scaling back a bit.

Edited March 24, 2022 by JazzyMom

[8filltheheart]

34 minutes ago, madteaparty said:

It seems fine though I will say we have not done more that two college classes at a time (I think we did three one semester and it felt like a lot). I’m not sure which ones are DE. My son has always taken two languages at a time, totally unrelated to each other, but again not both DE at the same time except once.

@pehp Can you clarify?  My understanding was that only French 3 is DE and the rest are outsourced, but not college level, just high school outsourced classes.  I don't think 6 classes for a high school student is too many, especially if they really enjoy languages (which I am assuming is true since he has 2 scheduled.)

[pehp]

Thank you all! So much. This is helpful for me as I think through it all.

The languages are French 3 (online) and Spanish 3 (in person), but French 3 is the college credit course.  He's gifted at languages.  Right now he's doing ONE online course (Honors French 2) and one in-person course (Spanish). Everything else is at home.  I am very concerned about him getting burned out with too many online courses, and we have been in Heavy Negotiations over this for a few weeks!!

The World Geography class is a thorn in my side. He saw a sample class and jumped all over it with enthusiasm. He LOVES geography & cultures (that seems to tie into his interest in languages!).  He really, really wants to take that class; I'd be very content with him continuing readings in history and/or politics (he loves politics, especially international relations!) like we've done this year for that "social studies" credit.  Maybe we could negotiate a delay of a year for that class.  He might accept that, but it would put the class (which I consider more of a "fun" one, maybe? not super-rigorous, like AP History) to junior-ish year (not sure how to class his kid; I've written about this elsewhere).  But it might be a compromise, especially b/c he insists on taking both languages. 

I am casting about for the best way to meet needs for Algebra and Biology in particular. He's in Saxon now & we use an online teaching "lecture" that he watches daily plus the lessons. He really enjoys math most of the time and is pretty good at it, and I feel like having an outsourced class would be fun for him (if he likes it with the dry Saxon book, I feel like he might LOVE it with a decent teacher). We are going through the Miller Levine Biology book together, focusing on the chemistry and physics of biology as a foundational course, plus lots of supplemental readings. I'm calling it "Foundations of Biology" and it's SO interesting, but I'm not able to be super-consistent with it right now due to circumstances.  He's on his own a lot, which is okay, but maybe not ideal, especially for a kid who enjoys biology. My lab game is NOT STRONG.  I was loosely looking at Wilson Hill Academy for both.  

Literature would be the easiest--HHL courses seem to have a pretty light reading load.  But that's also the easiest class for us to keep in-house, because we enjoy reading books and discussing them.  

It's so tricky to cover the basics AND the other stuff he wants to do, without overloading, and while still honoring his need to have some freedom in his life.  

{Thanks for the kind words about my dad. I'm typing this from his living room right now (while my son does a virtual piano lesson, God bless his teacher!).  Dad is thriving & active, totally normal, with virtually no chemo symptoms.  Amazing!!!  If it weren't for the fact that he's got terminal cancer, he'd be in pretty good shape for 73 years old.  Whew.  But we are trying to carpe diem and live part-time with him in SC, especially while he's still in good shape.  Then things will shift eventually to more "caregiving." Hopefully not anytime soon, but this cancer is a wicked one.}

 

Edited March 24, 2022 by pehp

[pehp]

2 hours ago, 8filltheheart said:

@pehp Can you clarify?  My understanding was that only French 3 is DE and the rest are outsourced, but not college level, just high school outsourced classes.  I don't think 6 classes for a high school student is too many, especially if they really enjoy languages (which I am assuming is true since he has 2 scheduled.)

Yes--correct! Only the French 3 is a college credit.  The rest of the classes are high school level outsourced classes.  And yes: he loves languages with a passion unspeakable.  Currently also learning Thai and Mandarin in his spare time.  

[pehp]

9 hours ago, Lori D. said:

 

The main concern I would have is time for doing all of the homework and exercises that would have to be turned in -- and especially time for READING all the material for every class AND the literature. What with also having piano daily, and possible outside-the-home activities, that could mean having to work through the weekends and/or evenings... which does not seem like a very balanced lifestyle and could lead to burn out before even graduating, if you keep up that same pace all through high school. BUT, you know your student BEST, and some students thrive on heavy academic loads.

That's my concern, too.  The literature course is very light in terms of reading quantity, which helps.  I suspect the World G class will fascinate him and also involve some "busy work," which he would really enjoy but take forever to complete b/c he's a total perfectionist. 

We've always erred on the side of "less is more."  I worked really hard to not schedule overwhelming academics for my children in their younger years! I think this has really helped because he has an enthusiasm to learn everything, BUT burnout is a real risk!  He likes the drama and activity of having Lots to Do, but he also can get a bit overwhelmed from time to time. 

I had originally thought that we would add in one outsourced class per year so that eventually, senior year, he'd be at about 5-6 outsourced or DE classes. That seemed like a wise and sane plan! This year he's got 2 (both languages). But when my dad was diagnosed, 2 months ago, I began to have doubts about my own ability to "manage" and felt perhaps it would be better if we had more outsourced so that I could "facilitate/support." We are not in a race to the finish line, and I want him to have a balanced life with time to spend with family (especially my dad!), relax, explore interests, etc.  I really do value a happy and relaxed child. He's a very curious, academically-oriented person, so I don't want to sell him short and not provide sufficient educational opportunities, but I'm not sure a lot of heavy pressure is a healthy thing for him.  Sigh!!!!  Where's my parenting manual???!!!!

[JazzyMom]

Sounds like you are doing great in terms of how you are thinking things through.  Trust your instincts!

You said he’s doing well with math, so if he really wants to do the geography class, maybe math could continue to be done at home.  That would save him 3 hrs a week of class time, and if something came up and he needed to slow down, he could extend into the summer.

My dd didn’t take any outsourced math until she took DE precalculus the summer after junior year.  Up until then she worked through the math books on her own, grading her own work and tests.  It hasn’t seemed to hurt her any.  She got an A in DE precal and DE calc 1, and is currently in DE calc 2.

Also, if you enjoy doing lit together, that might help keep you feel connected to his homeschooling even with having so much outsourced and so much life stuff going on.  Not having an outsourced class for that would give him a few hours for the geography class.  You might even chose lit that goes with these different cultures he’s studying???

Anyway, just a few ideas.  I am also a big fan of balance, and I think you’re wise to be careful about burnout.  
 

I have one kid who never seems overloaded no matter how much work is assigned.  He works so quickly.  At times I am baffled to see him just sitting around, but his work is always done.  My dd is the opposite.  Strong student, but likes to really take her time and go deep and absorb things and go above and beyond on her output.  I have had to have some talks with her about knowing when and where to cut corners, lol!

 

Edited March 24, 2022 by JazzyMom

[8filltheheart]

1 hour ago, pehp said:

 

I am casting about for the best way to meet needs for Algebra and Biology in particular. He's in Saxon now & we use an online teaching "lecture" that he watches daily plus the lessons. He really enjoys math most of the time and is pretty good at it, and I feel like having an outsourced class would be fun for him (if he likes it with the dry Saxon book, I feel like he might LOVE it with a decent teacher). We are going through the Miller Levine Biology book together, focusing on the chemistry and physics of biology as a foundational course, plus lots of supplemental readings. I'm calling it "Foundations of Biology" and it's SO interesting, but I'm not able to be super-consistent with it right now due to circumstances.  He's on his own a lot, which is okay, but maybe not ideal, especially for a kid who enjoys biology. My lab game is NOT STRONG.  I was loosely looking at Wilson Hill Academy for both.  

 

 

Another option to consider for math might be Derek Owens.  It is asychronous, so if he needs extra time to due to life, he can have it.  I have never used his alg courses, but 2 of my kids have taken his precal and physics courses and like them.  One of my dd will be taking his precal course next yr.  

[lmrich]

I agree with 8filltheheart  - Derek Owens might be a great fit. You can even start it earlier so he can get a head start and get comfortable with the format. 

[pehp]

This has been an enormously helpful thread and has really helped me with establishing a more workable framework for next year. Thank you all SO much. 
 

The suggestion to align some literature with the geography class is brilliant—why didn’t I think of that? My son is so enthusiastic about the idea, as it will blend his love of cultures with the literature course. *I* am going to self-pace the HHL literature course *for myself!* ha! 

At this point we’re going to outsource French 3, Spanish 3, Biology, and World Geography with live courses. I think we’ll do some sort of self-paced Algebra. And then we’ll pace ourselves with the in-house literature. I still think this will be a lot for my son, but it’s doable but doesn’t rely too heavily on my participation and supervision. (Also Spanish is a cupcake class for him: quite easy, & he adores his two native-speaking teachers.) We considered keeping Biology “in house” but my son really feels he’ll get a better learning experience if he does a class. 
 

I'm going to try to incorporate some writing into our literature class as well. 
 

Y’all, this has been tremendously useful. Thank you! 

[Lori D.]

1 hour ago, pehp said:

... The suggestion to align some literature with the geography class is brilliant—why didn’t I think of that? My son is so enthusiastic about the idea, as it will blend his love of cultures with the literature course. *I* am going to self-pace the HHL literature course *for myself!* 

I'm going to try to incorporate some writing into our literature class as well.

Sounds like a great plan! 😄


In case you'll be compiling your own list of Literature to align some lit to go with Geography class, below are resources from which you might pull ideas. I just will note that nonfiction, missionary biographies, and autobiographies are super, but there is a tendency to go overboard on those works and then throw in a few fictional literature works written by Western authors -- when there is a lot of good, fiction literature, poetry, and short stories, written by actual inhabitants of many countries around the world (which allows for the opportunity to see the culture and issues through the actual eyes of those living there)... Just a thought for while you're putting together your lit. list. 😉  Have fun! 😄 

Literature program:
- Learning Language Arts Through Literature: Gold: World Literature -- literature from ancients to modern, and around the world

Both of these are heavily nonfiction and biography/autobiography, so they may not help so much with fiction literature:
- Guest Hollow High School Geography & Cultures Curriculum
- Heart of Dakota: High School World Geography

Past threads with a mix of literature, nonfiction / biographies, and movies from around the world:
- "World Literature Help"
- "Recommendations for World Literature novels/curriculum"
- "Living Book Geography Course"

[pehp]

1 hour ago, Lori D. said:

Sounds like a great plan! 😄


In case you'll be compiling your own list of Literature to align some lit to go with Geography class, below are resources from which you might pull ideas. I just will note that nonfiction, missionary biographies, and autobiographies are super, but there is a tendency to go overboard on those works and then throw in a few fictional literature works written by Western authors -- when there is a lot of good, fiction literature, poetry, and short stories, written by actual inhabitants of many countries around the world (which allows for the opportunity to see the culture and issues through the actual eyes of those living there)... Just a thought for while you're putting together your lit. list. 😉  Have fun! 😄 

Literature program:
- Learning Language Arts Through Literature: Gold: World Literature -- literature from ancients to modern, and around the world

Both of these are heavily nonfiction and biography/autobiography, so they may not help so much with fiction literature:
- Guest Hollow High School Geography & Cultures Curriculum
- Heart of Dakota: High School World Geography

Past threads with a mix of literature, nonfiction / biographies, and movies from around the world:
- "World Literature Help"
- "Recommendations for World Literature novels/curriculum"
- "Living Book Geography Course"

This is great! So helpful! 
 

Yes—we are big fans of reading native authors. I began a huge Chinua Achebe kick last year. He’s amazing. His prose floored me. And my son wants to read The Art of War! Also am looking at Gabriel Garcia-Marquez; it has been years since I read him so I’m going to preview. 
 

Also The Jade Mountain poetry collection, one of my old favorites….so many good things out there! 
 

For the US, we are going to read To Kill a Mockingbird. There’s so much there we can use for discussions on our country’s history. 
 

THANKS so much for these links! I can’t wait to sit down and compile our customized list. 

[Sebastian (a lady)]

It sounds like you have a workable plan. 

It might be worth a sitting down with ds and creating a plan for how he will keep you informed on what he's doing and what is upcoming. 

My suggestion would be to go through the syllabus for each online class together and also make sure you both know where assignments and grades are posted. 

Decide how often he will update you. I might suggest daily the first couple weeks, so you can help him get a good start. That might mean walking you through each course, what is upcoming, and what is graded. Then maybe weekly. 

Help him put deadlines and target dates on a calendar. Take note of when in the day assignments are due. 6pm? 11:59pm? Does timezone matter? It's easy to miss an assignment if one class is always due Monday at 6pm Eastern and another is due Friday before midnight Pacific. Try to determine exactly how assignments are turned in. Is there an online answer portal and also a place to upload handwritten student work?

The goal of this is to move back a little bit, but not leave him to just flounder. Setting expectations now make them feel less like punishment later. 

Also keep in mind that online classes typically have 1-2 hours of homework for each hour of class time.

 

[pehp]

1 hour ago, Sebastian (a lady) said:

It sounds like you have a workable plan. 

It might be worth a sitting down with ds and creating a plan for how he will keep you informed on what he's doing and what is upcoming. 

My suggestion would be to go through the syllabus for each online class together and also make sure you both know where assignments and grades are posted. 

Decide how often he will update you. I might suggest daily the first couple weeks, so you can help him get a good start. That might mean walking you through each course, what is upcoming, and what is graded. Then maybe weekly. 

Help him put deadlines and target dates on a calendar. Take note of when in the day assignments are due. 6pm? 11:59pm? Does timezone matter? It's easy to miss an assignment if one class is always due Monday at 6pm Eastern and another is due Friday before midnight Pacific. Try to determine exactly how assignments are turned in. Is there an online answer portal and also a place to upload handwritten student work?

The goal of this is to move back a little bit, but not leave him to just flounder. Setting expectations now make them feel less like punishment later. 

Also keep in mind that online classes typically have 1-2 hours of homework for each hour of class time.

 

Thank you! He excels at this already, fortunately! He has a planner that he fills out on his own every week for his classes, and I am 100% not involved in either Spanish or French (his two outsourced classes this year).  I helped him learn the ropes for about 3 weeks at the start of the year for French which is the online course, but he quickly got into the rhythm on his own and has had no issues at all-never a late or missed assignment, ever.  With a 100 average in each class!  He's super diligent, which I appreciate!!

[Sebastian (a lady)]

On 3/28/2022 at 9:52 AM, pehp said:

Thank you! He excels at this already, fortunately! He has a planner that he fills out on his own every week for his classes, and I am 100% not involved in either Spanish or French (his two outsourced classes this year).  I helped him learn the ropes for about 3 weeks at the start of the year for French which is the online course, but he quickly got into the rhythm on his own and has had no issues at all-never a late or missed assignment, ever.  With a 100 average in each class!  He's super diligent, which I appreciate!!

That's great. It sound like he is very diligent. 

My kids did find that as they added additional outside classes, it took a little more work to keep track of the different portals and schedules. 

[pehp]

2 hours ago, Sebastian (a lady) said:

That's great. It sound like he is very diligent. 

My kids did find that as they added additional outside classes, it took a little more work to keep track of the different portals and schedules. 

Yeah—I’m sure that will be true! We’ll have two online providers, so I think the paper planner will be essential so that everything is “all in one place.” I’d love to use only one provider, but that’s just not going to work for us!!