It was the new diet!

[BlsdMama]

Unbelievable. Absolutely unbelievable. 

I have been learning the Wahls Protocol for the past couple months and have been working really hard to fit in 7-9 cups of vegetables. 

My neuro is out for June so I went to my GP. 

I’ve lost 19 pounds. That’s a lot for me. I’m barely in normal ranges for iron, despite taking three different high quality supplements. My MCV level is above normal range - indicating very low B12. (It was normal last fall.) He didn’t test B12, but this is more telling anyway.

The labs were run on Friday. Friday AM, DH had to have an MRI, a steroid shot in his back, and DS went almost an hour away to bale hay and pick up rocks. We had a grad party in the evening, so when DH got done we were in a hurry to pick up DS so we ran through Taco Bell. Nothing was compliant and I gave in and ate an enormous thing full of protein - dairy, refined beans, black beans (all banned on Wahl Level 3) and steak. On Saturday I felt pretty decent for the first time in a few weeks. DH blamed the diet. Test results came back. He went and bought sardines, lol.  (Essentially, you can have iron available and low B12 can dampen your ability to utilize it.)

So - instead of just focusing on the veg., I’m tracking protein too and I’m fitting in at least one high B12 food each day. It’s only Tuesday. I feel shockingly better. I don’t know why my B12 is so readily depleted... Regardless, I thought I’d share. I really can’t believe the impact.

 

Thank you all for the prayers. This has been one amazing week for us.

 

[HomeAgain]

I'm glad you're feeling better!

I feel like all of my nutritional information has come to me in drips and drabs from doctors.  It took YEARS for one to connect my constant fatigue with anemia.  The rest brushed it off as just a side effect of my busy life.  Once I started increasing my iron I felt so much better, but not entirely normal.  This year I had a nurse do a blood test and comment on my very low blood pressure and then say "oh, well, it looks like that's normal for you so it's okay."  Nobody had told me before what my numbers mean. The new doc had me do a quick set of labs and posted them to my online file.  Low in B12, which contributes to low blood pressure.  Once I started tracking both my iron and B12 and adding a daily supplement I felt downright normal for the first time in forever.

[J-rap]

3 minutes ago, HomeAgain said:

I'm glad you're feeling better!

I feel like all of my nutritional information has come to me in drips and drabs from doctors.  It took YEARS for one to connect my constant fatigue with anemia.  The rest brushed it off as just a side effect of my busy life.  Once I started increasing my iron I felt so much better, but not entirely normal.  This year I had a nurse do a blood test and comment on my very low blood pressure and then say "oh, well, it looks like that's normal for you so it's okay."  Nobody had told me before what my numbers mean. The new doc had me do a quick set of labs and posted them to my online file.  Low in B12, which contributes to low blood pressure.  Once I started tracking both my iron and B12 and adding a daily supplement I felt downright normal for the first time in forever.

First, that's fantastic, BlsdMama!  

Then, HomeAgain--  had you been checked for low-iron during those years when no one could figure out your fatigue?   Your symptoms remind me of my dd (both the fatigue and the low blood pressure), but I know she's been checked for low iron and it was in the normal range.  I'm just wondering if it can show up as normal, even if it isn't.  (Do you take a certain kind of iron tablet and B12 tablet that metabolizes better?)

[Soror]

That sounds like a good plan, with so many veggies sometimes you can get full before getting the other nutrients that you need.

I take daily b12 supplements and iron cyclically, my b12 had gotten fairly low this winter, I thought it was thyroid driving my fatigue despite a steady dose but it was low b12 and I try to consume foods high in b12. It can make a huge difference in energy

@HomeAgain I tend toward lower bp too and have been so annoyed with dr's who just say oh that's great, the same with my very low cholesterol levels(120 total) at 38 but we've not figured that one out

@J-rap In my experience a dr. saying levels are normal means little, I'd check to make sure they do the full iron panel and look at the results yourself, in "normal" range isn't necessarily optimal. 

I take iron bygliscinate because it doesn't hurt my tummy and gets my levels up quickly 

[HomeAgain]

1 minute ago, J-rap said:

First, that's fantastic, BlsdMama!  

Then, HomeAgain--  had you been checked for low-iron during those years when no one could figure out your fatigue?   Your symptoms remind me of my dd (both the fatigue and the low blood pressure), but I know she's been checked for low iron and it was in the normal range.  I'm just wondering if it can show up as normal, even if it isn't.  (Do you take a certain kind of iron tablet and B12 tablet that metabolizes better?)

I had a doctor tell me my iron was normal, but it was definitely within the low range of normal and dipped further depending on the time of the month.  I honestly was a walking textbook case:
-bruise and bleed easily
-wonky periods
-insomnia
-overly tired
-muscle fatigue, which is not tired but feels like I just ran a marathon and my muscles are shredding.
-underweight
-constantly cold 

I think some medical professionals put too much stock in what a specific range is supposed to show and not enough into the symptoms.  I've gotten my diet to where I need an iron supplement about once a week, daily one week a month - once I upped the B12, things evened out more. I'm not picky about either.  I grabbed what our supermarket had to try out and am satisfied.  I am able to be more proactive now - I have enough energy to increase my exercise to build muscle which puts my weight in a more normal range which increases my circulation which... 😄 But I'm careful about what I eat.  I tried moving toward a vegetarian diet but that's a no-go.  So I eat a mostly plant diet with a proper daily serving of meat or protein.  I have to have enough healthy fat, too, or nothing is absorbed well. 
 

[Kanin]

My mom was feeling SO tired all the time, and then the doc gave her a B12 shot. She felt amazingly better, immediately, and then it wore off after a month or two. She's doing well on sublingual B12 supplements, but I think the shot would help a lot more.  THere's a test you can have done to see if your body produces the enzyme necessary to produce B12 (or to use it? something like that).

So glad you feel better!!

[mumto2]

Sending prayers your way!  So glad you are feeling better.

[Cecropia]

I mostly lurk and don't write much, but I want you to know that I think of you often, and you are in my prayers.  Reading your good news makes me happy!

Do you think you will stick with Wahls?  I've been trying it since the beginning of May, but loosely between levels 1 and 2.  Keto sticks show mild ketosis most days despite my propensity to consume fruit at dinner.  I sure feel like I'm eating a LOT of protein, though, floating in seas of vegetables!  If only it were more clear as to why some things are banned on one autoimmune diet but allowed on another (nuts, alcohol), or whether a ham containing less than 2% sugar is compliant enough, or why sodium nitrate is anathema when celery nitrate is perfectly fine.  Plus I'm not sure that coconut meat/milk agrees with me, and it really seems to be a lynchpin in the protocol.  Did the diet make you feel better before you started feeling worse?  I have more energy these days and some of my digestive issues have improved, but there doesn't seem to be much impact on whatever mystery condition I have.  The next step would be AIP, I guess, but I'm continuing Wahls at least until my appt. with a new dr. in July.

[JumpyTheFrog]

The version of the Wahls Protocol I am familiar with is about five years old, so she may have modified it since then. If you ever listen to any podcasts where she is a guest, she talks about how being a vegetarian made her so much worse. Adding meat back in helped Dr. Wahls a lot. When I read her book a few years ago I didn't get the impression all the veggies were supposed to push meat out of the diet (unless someone wants to be a vegetarian). I thought they were supposed to replace grains and legumes.

OP, I'm glad you figured something out.

[BooksandBoys]

Oh, this is an amazing discovery!! So glad you are feeling better. 

I have to eat plenty of protein each day or I start feeling awful, and even with that, I take an iron supplement daily (who knew that exhaustion the last two years was low iron? I didn’t.) and a methylated B complex every other day to keep my energy at reasonable levels (mind you, I’m not energetic, just not exhausted). 

[BlsdMama]

On 6/11/2019 at 6:46 AM, HomeAgain said:

I'm glad you're feeling better!

I feel like all of my nutritional information has come to me in drips and drabs from doctors.  It took YEARS for one to connect my constant fatigue with anemia.  The rest brushed it off as just a side effect of my busy life.  Once I started increasing my iron I felt so much better, but not entirely normal.  This year I had a nurse do a blood test and comment on my very low blood pressure and then say "oh, well, it looks like that's normal for you so it's okay."  Nobody had told me before what my numbers mean. The new doc had me do a quick set of labs and posted them to my online file.  Low in B12, which contributes to low blood pressure.  Once I started tracking both my iron and B12 and adding a daily supplement I felt downright normal for the first time in forever.

I've struggled with anemia a lot - to be expected, I suppose, being pregnant, well, always.  :P But, especially in the last 10 or so years, I've had very low blood pressure.  Once I had a nurse take it again to be sure it was right. They generally remark on it.  Interesting correlation.  I've taken B complex, but sporadically.  My B12 measured in the realm of "normal" last October (low 500) but ....  Hm.  I don't know.  The only reason I suspected maybe iron was because my arms felt heavy too - but breathlessness and fatigued arms make sense with PLS/ALS progression too.  It was crazy.  I've read where normal progression is very linear, but sometimes there can be "jumps" in progression and all I could think was, "Oh wow, we didn't think the respiratory would hit for years, if it did."  So grateful.


 

 

On 6/11/2019 at 7:12 AM, HomeAgain said:

I had a doctor tell me my iron was normal, but it was definitely within the low range of normal and dipped further depending on the time of the month.  I honestly was a walking textbook case:
-bruise and bleed easily
-wonky periods
-insomnia
-overly tired
-muscle fatigue, which is not tired but feels like I just ran a marathon and my muscles are shredding.
-underweight
-constantly cold 

I think some medical professionals put too much stock in what a specific range is supposed to show and not enough into the symptoms.  I've gotten my diet to where I need an iron supplement about once a week, daily one week a month - once I upped the B12, things evened out more. I'm not picky about either.  I grabbed what our supermarket had to try out and am satisfied.  I am able to be more proactive now - I have enough energy to increase my exercise to build muscle which puts my weight in a more normal range which increases my circulation which... 😄 But I'm careful about what I eat.  I tried moving toward a vegetarian diet but that's a no-go.  So I eat a mostly plant diet with a proper daily serving of meat or protein.  I have to have enough healthy fat, too, or nothing is absorbed well. 
 

 I ended up getting the Carb Manager app.  I'm supposed to stay in ketosis and this measures macro nutrients and micronutrients.  

On 6/11/2019 at 7:29 AM, Fifiruth said:

OP, you were eating a lot of vegetables! It sounds like your body is telling you what it needs. 

 

Nah, lol, just what the book was telling me. 😉  My body wants cake.  Chocolate cake, with maraschino cherries and fudge.  And ice cream.  

Today it got beets and rainbow chard with lamb.  It wanted to cry just a little.  But didn't! WIN!

On 6/11/2019 at 9:28 AM, Cecropia said:

I mostly lurk and don't write much, but I want you to know that I think of you often, and you are in my prayers.  Reading your good news makes me happy!

Do you think you will stick with Wahls?  I've been trying it since the beginning of May, but loosely between levels 1 and 2.  Keto sticks show mild ketosis most days despite my propensity to consume fruit at dinner.  I sure feel like I'm eating a LOT of protein, though, floating in seas of vegetables!  If only it were more clear as to why some things are banned on one autoimmune diet but allowed on another (nuts, alcohol), or whether a ham containing less than 2% sugar is compliant enough, or why sodium nitrate is anathema when celery nitrate is perfectly fine.  Plus I'm not sure that coconut meat/milk agrees with me, and it really seems to be a lynchpin in the protocol.  Did the diet make you feel better before you started feeling worse?  I have more energy these days and some of my digestive issues have improved, but there doesn't seem to be much impact on whatever mystery condition I have.  The next step would be AIP, I guess, but I'm continuing Wahls at least until my appt. with a new dr. in July.

Thank you!

Do I think I'll stick with it - um.  I am giving it 100% and intend to keep it up for at least a year.  ALS/PLS has one perk (in only this particular instance) - it's that it is a steady march forward.  Even if I saw NO regression, any lack of progression would be huge.  So, I"m being compliant and I'm committed to being compliant for at least one full ALS Clinic cycle.  I currently go every six months.  I've never not progressed, even though I'm the slowest progressor he's ever seen.  They saw my reflexes change in my arm before I could tell it was changing.  Now it's a challenge to turn my van key.  I mentally dealt with losing my ability to use my legs, I think, but the idea that the arms could follow quickly behind them means no self-care and I admit it bothers me.

Have you read the whole book?  I decided to just work in the 9 cups of vegetables and didn't read the rest of the book - with intentions of coming back to it.  Went GF, stopped dairy, stopped eggs, and I don't do soy anyway.  Then this happened.  I've worked through most of the book and it's fascinating, but if you go over on protein, you body, through glucogenesis, will actually turn the protein into sugar.  So, you have to minimize carbs, keep protein at a steady level, and maximize fat!  I'm finding it REALLY challenging and wondering if I'll ever get to eat chicken again because it's lean.  Today I hit 75% fat, carbs were 7%, and 18% protein.  

I didn't see any change from just adding in vegetables.  I didn't really ever lose energy pre-diet, not even with the disease.  That was the one oddity too when I was diagnosed with Lyme.  No lack of energy, no fatigue, etc.  Now my muscles fatigue.  I go out to the garden and by the time I get there, the right leg is announcing a strike. 

I found it odd that nightshades were allowed!   - Level 1 is vastly different than Protocol Paleo Plus (Level 3.)  She recommends soaked nuts and no alcohol on Level 3. 
The whole diet relies heavily on coconut... the irony of this is incredible.  Because the whole thing spins on an ancestral, primitive, ancient years premise....  but would we have had coconuts daily?  Or coconut cream?  Methinks not.  I kind of shrug my shoulders at some of this.  

I think the next logical step is to Level 3, not AIP.  You already know a good bit.  I have a friend who encouraged me - 100% for 100 days.  I think the hardest part was when I cut sugar.  I had to get past the hard cravings.  AND THE BIGGEST PERK?  You get to go DOWN to 4-6 cups of vegetables!!!  I can do 5 SO easily after working for 9 for a while!

I WANT sweets now because I know they taste so good, but it's different than craving them, kwim?  I did ban DD from bringing home Chick Fil A shakes from work - forever.

 

On 6/11/2019 at 9:51 AM, JumpyTheFrog said:

The version of the Wahls Protocol I am familiar with is about five years old, so she may have modified it since then. If you ever listen to any podcasts where she is a guest, she talks about how being a vegetarian made her so much worse. Adding meat back in helped Dr. Wahls a lot. When I read her book a few years ago I didn't get the impression all the veggies were supposed to push meat out of the diet (unless someone wants to be a vegetarian). I thought they were supposed to replace grains and legumes.

OP, I'm glad you figured something out.

No, she has the exact same belief - that vegetarian is really not healthy for us!  You are exactly right.  I decided to kind of "ease" into the diet - Just hit 9 cups of veggies (Level 1) consistently and keep out the banned foods.  The problem was, I wasn't paying attention to my protein or iron.  It was completely me not reading everything.  I'd drink 2-3 cup smoothie in the AM, skip my egg (advised against heavily) and any meats or dairy, eat lunch (2-3 c. mixed salad with a bit of tuna or nuts), then eat supper.  I was not adding in organs, spirulina, dulse, lamb, seafood... or at least not regularly and intentionally.  And I was definitely losing my appetite.  I still am.  They aren't kidding when they say fat is satiating.  I've lost another 1.5 this week - I'm at a weight I haven't seen in 10+ years right now, but at least my energy is back up and I'm not breathless!  Watching it closely!

[Cecropia]

10 hours ago, BlsdMama said:

My body wants cake.  Chocolate cake, with maraschino cherries and fudge.  And ice cream. 

Ha! The cravings are a real challenge, aren't they?  I'm better at avoiding sugar, because I know I have trouble with self-regulation (Who am I kidding? Addiction!) and it consistently makes my body feel "off" when I eat dessert.  Eggs, cheese, and heavy cream... avoiding these is killing me.  To eat eggs again with abandon would give me so. much. joy.  I'm taking it one day at a time and trying not to think about "maybe forever!"  The prospect of adding nuts and seeds to the no-list makes me want to go hide somewhere.  On the flip side, I've actually learned to enjoy mushrooms, avocados, and seaweed to a point, and liver is no longer disgusting when prepared in certain ways.  It's not all bad news.

10 hours ago, BlsdMama said:

Have you read the whole book?  I decided to just work in the 9 cups of vegetables and didn't read the rest of the book - with intentions of coming back to it.  Went GF, stopped dairy, stopped eggs, and I don't do soy anyway.  Then this happened.  I've worked through most of the book and it's fascinating, but if you go over on protein, you body, through glucogenesis, will actually turn the protein into sugar.  So, you have to minimize carbs, keep protein at a steady level, and maximize fat!  I'm finding it REALLY challenging and wondering if I'll ever get to eat chicken again because it's lean.  Today I hit 75% fat, carbs were 7%, and 18% protein.

I didn't see any change from just adding in vegetables.  

I read the whole book, but it was just on loan from the library.  I should probably buy myself a copy for daily reference.  I also read/listened to online interviews with Dr. Wahls, and some of them included a bit more useful rabbit-trail information than the book.  What you're talking about with the protein only applies to Paleo Plus, though, right?  You were adding in vegetables before you started the keto diet?

10 hours ago, BlsdMama said:

The whole diet relies heavily on coconut... the irony of this is incredible.  Because the whole thing spins on an ancestral, primitive, ancient years premise....  but would we have had coconuts daily?  Or coconut cream?  Methinks not.  I kind of shrug my shoulders at some of this.  

Often, I find myself wondering what people on this diet would do if the global food supply lines were interrupted.  Then I get the urge to start hoarding cases of coconut oil (this is the part where I say "How do I love thee, Aldi, let me count the ways... One, for carrying affordable organic coconut oil that tastes good...")

10 hours ago, BlsdMama said:

I think the next logical step is to Level 3, not AIP. 

I don't know.  Level 3 is the coconut 4-evah direction, and AIP is the clean slate direction.  If nuts, black pepper, and coffee are really inflammatory foods, maybe I should try 30+ days without them.  Maybe I should try 30 days without coconut meat/milk, since it kinda hurts my stomach! 

Dh suffers from food allergies which have only increased in number over the years, and watching his daily struggles doesn't help with these anxieties. Under the surface, I really fear cutting out a beloved food that seemed ok in my former life, and then reintroducing it only to discover that I'm intolerant.  It makes me think about how people with pet allergies can seem fine with their own family cat/dog so long as they have constant exposure, but after moving out for a while and then exposing themselves again, an allergic reaction presents itself (happened to dh!).  Likewise, can cutting out a food provoke an intolerance?