NY Times education article- teaching writing one sentence at a time

[MamaSprout]

I saw this today. It looks like a great approach to “writing across the curriculum”. You could do this with news, great books, fiction, biographies... anything really.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/06/learning/teaching-great-writing-one-sentence-at-a-time.html?em_pos=small&emc=edit_ln_20190307&nl=learning-network&nl_art=1&nlid=85426744emc%3Dedit_ln_20190307&ref=headline&te=1

[8filltheheart]

I agree with her approach. This quote

Quote

In my writing classes, I teach grammar principles over the course of a few weeks, which I teach through a PowerPoint presentation with examples of the principles in a few sentences. Then, I have my students use them immediately in a creative writing assignment. After a month or so of such lessons, I’ll focus on grammar in application by sending them to The New York Times website.

caught my attention bc it is exactly how I have naturally taught all of my kids. When they are little, we talk about grammar and how we can use precise wording to create strong images, etc.  Understanding the use of words and how they impact their writing provides them with the skills to control not only what but also how they write. (and it is how I approach teaching writing in TC.)

[MamaSprout]

38 minutes ago, Plum Crazy said:

I think they are talking about The Hochmann method. I just started The Writing Revolution that lays out the plan. I’ve been using Kilgallon and writing across curriculum, but this is an actual plan starting in elementary. 

I think it's just the way one teacher teaches her high school classes. It might be similar to the Writing Revolution. It's actually very similar to some of the earlier assignments in most classical writing programs, too, where they work with a fable and re-write with different focus (p.o.v., etc). 

I've done pieces and parts of this, but my dd "gets" it laid out in an article this way and is excited to jump in with a biography she just finished.

[daijobu]

I love this idea, and what a lovely article.  I wish someone had mentioned this to me years ago because I rarely notice good writing, although I immediately recognize bad writing.  Instead we are more inclined to read a NY Times article and pick out something that doesn't make sense or is not logical and complain about it.  

[katilac]

I like using the mentor sentence to write sample sentences. 

I don't like her 'extending with vocabulary' examples at all. They lose or twist the point of the sample story and don't even use many of the vocabulary words correctly. My exorbitant brother? 

[fourisenough]

1 minute ago, katilac said:

I like using the mentor sentence to write sample sentences. 

I don't like her 'extending with vocabulary' examples at all. They lose or twist the point of the sample story and don't even use many of the vocabulary words correctly. My exorbitant brother? 

I had the very same thought! I understand the idea behind it, but I think her examples proved that it isn’t really an effective way to learn vocabulary. 

[madteaparty]

1 hour ago, fourisenough said:

I had the very same thought! I understand the idea behind it, but I think her examples proved that it isn’t really an effective way to learn vocabulary. 

Not to mention they read awkward and wrong. I can’t believe they reprinted one of those examples particularly. Smh. 

[RootAnn]

I was left with an unfavorable opinion after reading the student examples. 

Not after long the football team continued to win, not through luck but through strength and togetherness shown by all the players on the team.

This one not only didn't match the example, it didn't make sense!

I wonder if the teacher included some not-perfect examples on purpose or if she really doesn't know better, either? 

[MamaSprout]

I didn’t look closely at the examples. Most student writing makes me cringe. That’s why I like the idea of it: students look at and work with good writing without adding another piece of curriculum to the line up. It doesn’t need to come from the NYT.

[wendyroo]

3 minutes ago, RootAnn said:

I was left with an unfavorable opinion after reading the student examples. 

 

This one not only didn't match the example, it didn't make sense!

I wonder if the teacher included some not-perfect examples on purpose or if she really doesn't know better, either? 

I agree.  I thought some of those examples sounded pretty dreadful.  And while I expect that writing some clunkers is an unavoidable part of learning to write well, these were by high schoolers who ideally should already be able to write simple coherent sentences.

In the example you listed, I'm just not sure that the method is helpful if it takes a kid who used to write:

The football team won not because of luck, but because of the strength and togetherness shown by all the players on the team.

and "helps" transform their writing into:

Not after long the football team continued to win, not through luck but through strength and togetherness shown by all the players on the team.

It seems like the focus is very much on form instead of function.  It doesn't matter if the vocabulary words don't convey their correct meaning or if the sentences don't effectively communicate information, as long as your writing looks and sounds fancy.

Wendy

[8filltheheart]

8 minutes ago, MamaSprout said:

I didn’t look closely at the examples. Most student writing makes me cringe. That’s why I like the idea of it: students look at and work with good writing without adding another piece of curriculum to the line up. It doesn’t need to come from the NYT.

I didn't, either.  

[SoCal_Bear]

Or basically what Kilgallon's Sentence Composing series does....

 

[MamaSprout]

12 minutes ago, calbear said:

Or basically what Kilgallon's Sentence Composing series does....

 

Correct- without buying another book. ETA- I’m glad we are discussing something that is not an outsourced class, which I think happens a lot this time of year. I hope there can be thoughts on how to use it rather than tearing down the specifics.

Edited March 9, 2019 by MamaSprout

[Lecka]

I think it’s okay to provide poor but realistic examples sometimes.... it can be depressing to look at what my child does if I am only seeing other examples that are exemplary.  

I think it’s okay to show a beginning point, and — it doesn’t show an end point, but depending on the level of trust for the source it can still be possible to get to a good end point.  

[SoCal_Bear]

I like the Kilgallon book though. I like that they have interesting sentences from books that students are interested in reading. NY Times isn't going to be high on my kid's interest list. 

Not going to break the bank at under $20 and saves me work on finding sentences. 

Edited March 9, 2019 by calbear

[8filltheheart]

Literature can be a great source of excellent sentences.  My girls (my boys never did) have kept/keep common place books where they write down sentences or thoughts they really like.  Our conversations often focus on beautifully or artfully worded phrases.  My current college jr really started blossoming in her appreciation of wording in 7th grade.  

I found one of the ones that inspired her that yr: I hied me away to the woods--away back into the sun-washed alleys carpeted with fallen gold and glades where the moss is green and vivid yet. The woods are getting ready to sleep--they are not yet asleep but they are disrobing and are having all sorts of little bed-time conferences and whisperings and good-nights. (LM Montgomery).

I think you can start off just having casual conversations about different things you read and the images invoked. For me, the initial goal is just to get them thinking about the fact that wording does impact how something is perceived by the reader.

ETA: Obviously that is not essay/academic style writing, but conscientious wording is a skill that we work on translating across curriculum (but we also start these conversations around 3rd grade.)

Edited March 9, 2019 by 8FillTheHeart

[RootAnn]

Oh, I'm a fan of using good examples of writing in teaching writing. I admit I don't do it like this, though. I prefer to look at a whole piece of writing (like a whole essay) and break down how the author put it together. We might discuss what parts are more effective and which are less effective. Or, we might talk about how an upcoming essay of theirs could be improved by incorporating a chunk of the same technique.

When looking sentence by sentence, I tend to use the student's own writing and talk about improvements - stronger verbs, looking for a synonym, combining two related short sentences, adding a transition word, incorporating a quote, changing the beginning so not all the sentences start subject-verb, etc. I like how my kid's eyes shine when they experience how their own sentences go from just ok to really having impact.

But, I admit to not being a great writing teacher, so YMMV.

[8filltheheart]

6 minutes ago, RootAnn said:

Oh, I'm a fan of using good examples of writing in teaching writing. I admit I don't do it like this, though. I prefer to look at a whole piece of writing (like a whole essay) and break down how the author put it together. We might discuss what parts are more effective and which are less effective. Or, we might talk about how an upcoming essay of theirs could be improved by incorporating a chunk of the same technique.

When looking sentence by sentence, I tend to use the student's own writing and talk about improvements - stronger verbs, looking for a synonym, combining two related short sentences, adding a transition word, incorporating a quote, changing the beginning so not all the sentences start subject-verb, etc. I like how my kid's eyes shine when they experience how their own sentences go from just ok to really having impact.

But, I admit to not being a great writing teacher, so YMMV.

I definitely agree, but I also think there is a place for both.  I think evaluating a piece as a whole is vital, especially in terms of essays.  But, equally, within a piece of writing there can be single sentences or single techniques which make a powerful impact on individual readers. Stylistic techniques beyond just effectiveness of overall  tone--the Gettysburg Address, for example--can be examined sentence by sentence in order to appreciate what makes it so powerful.

[daijobu]

23 hours ago, madteaparty said:

Not to mention they read awkward and wrong. I can’t believe they reprinted one of those examples particularly. Smh. 

 

I agree the sample sentences were cringey indeed.  At the time I had assumed they were a starting point for further editing, but now I'm wondering.  

[MamaSprout]

Seriously. Can we let it go? I won’t post anymore. Promise.