4th grader being dishonest about completing school work. WWYD?

[Guest]

I really appreciate you taking the time to reply.

 

I think what I hear you saying is that you personally wouldn't expect a 10-year-old to be able to brush their hair and teeth independently without being in the room. Or to log in to xtra math on an ipad for 10 minutes. You feel that kind of "alone time" is unrealistic to expect from a 10 year old.

 

Futhermore, if I do expect that type of "alone time", I should be able to "check" this somehow before I ever talk to him. For example, instead of asking him if he remembered to brush his teeth, perhaps I could start measuring the weight of the toothpaste tube, or checking to see if his toothbrush is wet, etc.

No, if a kid is supposed to brush their teeth and keep not doing that they are showing you that they can't just do it just because they're supposed to. There are lots of things you can attribute it to...But the issue IS that little dude isn't going to brush his teeth let to his own devices. So you can't leave him to his own devices IF you want his teeth to get brushed.

[Guest]

10 was a transition stage for my DS11. He wanted more independence at the same time as he seems to live in a preteen fog. So it is like he said he packed his backpack for his outside class but his textbook is still at his desk. My DS12 has always march to his own drum so I can't compare him to age norms.

There is lots of spurts and backslides throughout for my DS11 since he was a toddler. It wasn't a straight gradual path.

It's just a weird age. My nine year old seems like he can't sense the skull on top of his neck any more. He keeps running into stuff (walls, side mirrors on cars) head-first. I asked him what's going on and he's like THERE ARE TOO MANY WALLS, all super emotional about it haha <3

[SebastianCat]

I have been in the exact same situation, not realizing until I was knee-deep into a conversation that work/chores/etc. that should have been done independently weren't actually done, and my kids have lied in the process.   I have learned (and am still learning...) to change the way I ask from the beginning of the discussion.   Instead of "Did you do _____?" I try to say, "Show me your ______."   The conversation then proceeds in a much more pleasant manner, because the child can show the work completed, and I can let them know that they did a good job.   Of course, this does translate much easier to schoolwork where there's actual output that can be measured, and not so much to brushing teeth.   Even now with my 14-year-old, if I tell him, "Please take out the garbage," it leads to a much nicer interaction, because sometimes he can honestly reply, "I already did that, Mom" and I can thank him.  

 

As an immediate consequence for the lying, I would tell the child that because he has lied, he's lost your trust and now you must watch him do the tasks he was supposed to have done independently.   He cannot practice piano until you are nearby to be able to listen, and you will watch him brush his teeth and do his chores to make sure they are done well.    It doesn't need to be indefinite, but he needs to know that trust is important, and if you can't trust him to do these things independently, it will take time away from other fun things he'd like to do.   When you start giving him more independence again, be sure to check up on tasks completed, and let him know that you're still checking (in a positive way).

 

I agree with others about the brain fog starting around this age.   The worst was between 11-12 for both of my kids.   There were some times where they honestly could not remember what they were supposed to do - but it translated into all areas, not just chores or schoolwork.   They'd walk into their bedroom to get something, then look around and say, "I have no idea what I came in here to do," or be working on a math problem and not be able to focus.   More exercise, more food, and more sleep have helped.

 

 

[SeaConquest]

OP, it sounds like a rookie parenting mistake -- one that many of us have made (or are likely to make in the future!) with our oldest kid. I don't think you should beat yourself up about it, or feel misunderstood. What I hear is that the more experienced parents of older kids are saying to just slow up on the independence a bit and not to read too much into the lying. I hear them saying that this scenario is pretty common, and this is how you can avoid it in the future.

 

I have a pretty mature almost 8 year old, and it is very easy for me to give him more independence than he can handle. I do it on the regular, and I am sure that many of these more experienced parents are just sharing their BTDT wisdom. Please know that your thread has been helpful to me as a reminder that I still should hold fairly tight to the reins with my DS, even when it seems like he could handle me letting go a bit more.

 

I would just chalk it up as a first-born parenting lesson learned. Hugs to you. 

[RenaInTexas]

I have two sons: almost 8 and almost 10. They both have a list of independent chores and school work to get done every day. They both do it; 100% independently. We went through the growing pains that you are experiencing now. Basically, they tried to get away with the bare minimum / not doing something. However, we are passed that stage because they now know that they can't get away with not doing it. It is as simple as that. Now that he knows you can check XtraMath, he'll do it. So, I do things like random drawer checks, teeth checks, recite this poem for me now, log in and see what they have done, etc... If their completion rate or effort doesn't meet my standards they have to redo it --- it doesn't matter if they have 'already done it'. If they scored below X on Xtramath (for example), they do an extra assignment because they need more practice. If they don't have Poem X memorized by Friday, they get to spend part of their lunch break practicing Poem X for 10 minutes. If their teeth are fuzzy, they get to spend 2 minutes brushing them with me watching. So they have learned to 'Actually DO the task' and to 'Do it Right the First Time'. It took a few months of (consistently enforced) 'training' on my expectations, but they've gotten it. Anytime we add something new, I have to make sure that they know how I will 'check' that they did it so that they don't try to slack their way through it. 

 

So, basically, you don't have to ask if he has completed something. Figure out ways that you can check for completion and let him know that you will check and he is responsible for a certain standard. The problem here isn't a lack of ability to be independent...it's 'I'm Human and will try to do as little as I can get away with'.

 

As for the lying, I would not view what you did as giving him the opportunity to lie. You gave him the opportunity to be honest. He chose to lie. You can then turn his failure into a teaching moment about honesty. And give him more opportunities to be honest. You are preparing him for the real world and this world isn't going to avoid asking him questions so that he isn't in the position to lie. The biggest lesson -- for him -- will come at a time when he is telling you the truth, but you think he is lying (it may be something totally unrelated). At that point, he will then see the harm his lying does. Warn him that this is what will happen (The Boy Who Cried Wolf)...that this is what happens in life. This is my experience with my 7-year-old and I see him (now) thinking really hard and actually admitting that he is lying while he is talking. He's a good kid, but he seems to struggle with understanding what dishonesty looks like ... his oldest brother has always been extremely honest. Honesty doesn't come easy to everyone; some have to be taught what honesty (and dishonesty) looks like and avoiding those situations is not going to teach that to kids who need explicit instruction. Now may be a good time to incorporate some character building activities into his school day. 

 

You've gotten a lot of conflicting viewpoints. This is because there are millions of ways to raise a child into a solid adult. No one person's way is correct. You have to go through our comments and pick out things that may work for you and your family. 

The problem here isn't a lack of ability to be independent...it's 'I'm Human and will try to do as little as I can get away with'.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I don't know why I am having such a hard time communicating in this thread.   So I will try to explain again.

 

I asked for several reasons:  

Number 1, it was possible that he had innocently forgotten to do a few things on his list.  That could have explained how he was able to get everything done in such a short period of time.    And that is why I started rattling off the things on his list to make sure he remembered doing them all.  

Number 2, I asked because it was possible that he had done the things on the list, but he just rushed through them.   That was a very plausible explanation.    

Number 3, I asked, because many things on his list are things that I can't easily check.  (Example:  teeth brushing, practicing piano.)    Of course, in hindsight, AFTER I initially asked him, I remembered that I could go online and see if he had logged into xtra math, and that is how I ultimately caught him in a lie.   But in the moment, that "check" didn't occur to me until afterward, so that is why I asked him straight out.  

 

Now to your point about "too much independence".   I've answered that several times as well.  Perhaps I am still not being clear.  

So I will state again....He has VERY minimal independence.    I repeat....Minimal.     I am not expecting him to homeschool himself or be self-sufficient.    I teach him all of his subjects.   At 10 years of age, I ask him to do a FEW small things independently:  some basic self-care chores and a few small school things which I assign specifically to teach him to work independently.   I am not asking him to do anything new that he has not been able to do in the past.   

 

You said you give him a list.  Seriously, I don't think my kid would manage a list. 

 

But sure maybe he really just was having an off day and flat out didn't want to do the stuff and you should just punish him. 

 

I have been working for years to teach independence and I'm finally mostly seeing it with my almost 15 year old.  I can give him a list and he can manage that.  At 10?  Nope. 

 

[Tanikit]

My 9 year old can be super independent at times. She can do her homework alone and sometimes insists that she be left alone to do it - but I still check its done when she says she is finished. However if I ask her if she has finished some medication she will lie to me because she does not want to take it - she says it tastes nasty. I do ask like you asked your son - I think its natural to ask a child and want an honest answer. And then I do not trust her about that because I do go and check - so why did I ask? I guess to give her the chance to be honest - if I check and she has been honest then I can praise both that and having finished the medication. However if I ask her: have you brushed your teeth and she says yes, I either must trust her or go and check and even checking will not make it certain whether she has or not - then I must decide whether to just trust her that night (usually I do) and then check again the next night or show her I do not trust her and send her to brush them (either again or for a first time) - we are just parents, we do not know everything... and they are just children and I think if you had a totally honest 9 or 10 year old then they might seem a bit abnormal - that is not to say that lying is moral - it isn't. I think it is partly why the Bible says: "ALL have sinned." 

 

You seem to have two goals here:

 

1. You want your son to be honest - that will always be a work in progress. I think prayer here is required more than anything, good conversations about the negative effects of lying and perhaps asking him how he feels when his brother or someone else lies to him and what the negative consequences of lack of trust might have for him.

 

2. You would like your son to be more independent - this too will come with time and practice. And like any milestone expect it to change - there are so many other milestones when kids seem to have it and then seem to go right backwards before going forwards again.

 

Its interesting that there are so many replies to this topic - it clearly is an issue a lot of people wonder and think about - I do not think there are any specific things that will give you a 100% success rate or cause you to fail. Its just part of raising children - you are his mother, you know him best even when his behaviour confuses you. You've got him this far and done a good job - whatever you decide to do in this case will be just fine even if people do not necessarily agree with you. The fact that it bothers you and you are searching for what to do means you are thinking about it and care about it. He is lucky to have you as his mother. You'll figure it out and he will get there through the valleys and hills of life and eventually all his choices and the consequences of them will belong to him alone and he will be responsible to society and to God in the end. For now though you are leading him in the way he should go and you are doing just fine.

[Tanaqui]

I agree with others about the brain fog starting around this age. The worst was between 11-12 for both of my kids. There were some times where they honestly could not remember what they were supposed to do - but it translated into all areas, not just chores or schoolwork. They'd walk into their bedroom to get something, then look around and say, "I have no idea what I came in here to do," or be working on a math problem and not be able to focus. More exercise, more food, and more sleep have helped.

 

It's like pregnancy brain, but it lasts for ev er !

 

 

I think what I hear you saying is that you personally wouldn't expect a 10-year-old to be able to brush their hair and teeth independently without being in the room. Or to log in to xtra math on an ipad for 10 minutes. You feel that kind of "alone time" is unrealistic to expect from a 10 year old.

 

I was going to say you're misreading but then I realized - no, actually, my 11 and 13 year olds don't brush their teeth independently. I sit and listen and half the time I say "Okay, great, now go back and this time brush for the right amount of time and WATERPIK." "Oh, but I did waterpik! You don't need to sit on top of me!" Yeah, honey, if that were the case then the orthodontist wouldn't give me a lecture every month, so go back and do it right.

 

And the younger one doesn't brush her hair independently either. Every day I look at her and go "Egads! Your hair is a mess! Did you brush it yet?" and find out that, five hours after waking up, she has not brushed it. And if she starts combing it, odds are she'll get distracted halfway through and do something else. I have to sit there with her and say "Either you comb it or I do, but it needs to be done in five minutes" for it to get done in anything like a timely fashion. I have to actually hand her the coconut oil to ensure her hair gets oiled, and I have to repeat the "you or me" threat to get her hair braided for bed.

 

I always think I ought to be able to expect them to do these things, but they actually don't do them without me sitting on top of them and either supervising or checking as soon as they're done. And it's everything! "You took your inhaler? I didn't see you do it, let me see the numbers. Oh, wait, maybe you forgot? I'll wait! Do it in front of me so I can see." "You put lotion on? Well, it must not have been very much because your knees are mad ashy. Do it again, I don't need your grandmother calling me."

 

And these children routinely run all around NYC by themselves with no trouble. I don't understand it, but their ability to manage complex navigation and street smarts, not to mention algebra, somehow doesn't even a little bit translate to an ability to be responsible for their own responsibilities without somebody sitting on top of them every step of the way.

 

Maybe other children are different, but from what you posted, your son isn't one of those other children either. And it's not actually going to get better from here. Maturity isn't a linear progression, it's very two steps forward, one step back, except sometimes it's more like two steps forward, ten steps back! Especially as puberty approacheth. You have to be patient and responsible for him until he finally grows into it.

[CadenceSophia]

This is a weird thread to me... I can completely see how a child used to be able to complete some tasks independently, and yet suddenly they thought it would be more efficient only to complete what he thought could be checked.

 

My 6 year old brushed her teeth alone for about a year until her older brother suddenly informed me that at some point she had decided not to use toothpaste anymore. I did exactly what the op did and basically set her up for lying (which she did) because I was completely in shock. I mean.. She knew how to brush her teeth, she was guided until it looked like she could do it alone, and then checked until she seemed consistently successful. She just had a squirrelly kid moment and made a bad decision or decided to take up a bad habit. We started supervising again and will gradually cut back until we feel she can do it independently again. I kinda thought that was the whole parenting deal -- Teach and guide until they can do it alone. Adjust as necessary so you hopefully have a competent mature adult by the time they move out.

 

Maybe you don't start out giving independence in crossing the street, but xtra math and piano are pretty darn low risk areas to practice in.

[Laura Corin]

I think as home educators we tend to forget that there is positive peer pressure in school as well as negative.  When all the kids at school are doing their maths, then your child will probably do it too.  In that situation, other family things (brushing teeth) become minor matters that, yes, might need supervision.  No lists required.

 

When my boys were home educating at that age, I sat with them while they worked, because there weren't twenty other kids forming a consensus around them.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I think as home educators we tend to forget that there is positive peer pressure in school as well as negative.  When all the kids at school are doing their maths, then your child will probably do it too.  In that situation, other family things (brushing teeth) become minor matters that, yes, might need supervision.  No lists required.

 

When my boys were home educating at that age, I sat with them while they worked, because there weren't twenty other kids forming a consensus around them.

 

So true.

 

One day my 11 year old was moaning and complaining about school work.  He was giving me a hard time.  I asked him if he'd do that in a school.  He said no because the teacher would probably yell at him or other kids might make fun of him.  I said well when I yell that doesn't seem to matter!!  LOL

 

But he's right.  It's just a very different dynamic.  You sometimes have to get creative with how you handle it too.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I totally get the frustration.  If ONLY they'd do what we ask.  And what is it with the fact they seem to manage it, but then suddenly don't?  They do that...really...  It's not unusual.

 

 

[Guest]

Maybe you don't start out giving independence in crossing the street, but xtra math and piano are pretty darn low risk areas to practice in.

 

And these children routinely run all around NYC by themselves with no trouble. I don't understand it, but their ability to manage complex navigation and street smarts, not to mention algebra, somehow doesn't even a little bit translate to an ability to be responsible for their own responsibilities without somebody sitting on top of them every step of the way.

 

.

 

There is really something to this, though.

 

If the PERSON thinks it is a worthwhile endeavor, they are going to to do it, high risk or no.

 

A kid with healthy teeth doesn't have the long-view type thinking to grasp the importance of oral hygiene. A kid who doesn't feel like practicing piano/division/spelling/laundry folding isn't going to file it away under "super necessary" in their brains. That's OK, because they have us capable ape parents to guide them throughheir extended and often ridiculous adolescence until they are themselves mature apes and can brush their dang teeth, or not, who cares, it's their mushy bananas.

 

I think some ADD parents have a slight advantage in perspective here! Because once you get accustomed to kids that will hyper- focus on some stuff so super intensely it seems like their brains are going to explode...and literally (and sincerely) forget that some--important! basic! "common" sense! -other stuff are even concepts in the ether, much less things they actually need to DO...and you figure out how to be their executive-functioning coaches for the duration of the long flight to adulthood, then one or two (or 763)-off incidents like in the OP are an automatic "yep let's figure that out together" situation.

Edited December 20, 2016 by OKBud

[Guest]

For example, I have a kid who forgets to drink water. He honestly forget he is thirsty.

 

Do I feel like I SHOULD HAVE TO make him drink fluids? At his age?! Uh no. I think this is bean ballin bananas that I have to supervise him at this level.

 

And I used to ask, "Hey man have you had any water today?"  and he'd get all shifty eyed and say "uhm I think so..." and I'd be like REALLY cause ya pee is brown dude.

 

Now I just glance at the clock and tell him to go drink some water. Yes, you have to stop doing what you're doing. No, more than one swallow! The whole thing. There yago!

 

.....and an hour later. "hey, go to the bathroom."

 

"I don't need to and I am in the middle of this crazy thing I am doing even though I'm only XX years old and most 40 year olds couldn't even conceive of this activity..."

"I don't care if you're building a pod that will enable survival floating in Saturn's rings, go have a pee!"

"I don't have to!!!!"

"Go anyway, humor your poor beleaguered mother."

::pee sounds::

 

See

 

The thing people are trying to say is that it's not LYING! HE'S A LIAR! .....it's tat he's a kid who still needs to be parented in a way that his parent (rightfully, logically, lovingly) thinks he should be past by now.

 

But didn't you guys get your plaque when you have your kids, at the hospital? The one that says "Tough Nuts, Ma, Parent The Kid In Front of Your Face"?

[Tanaqui]

For example, I have a kid who forgets to drink water. He honestly forget he is thirsty.

 

One of my girls won't eat. First she forgets, and then once she's forgotten two meals she insists she isn't really hungry after all. Now, I feel her - if I go long enough without eating, I feel nauseated, and from what she's said that's what's going on here. But I'm an adult, and she's a teen, and even though she intellectually understands that eating will not make her vomit or that she wouldn't get so many headaches and scream at everybody if she'd just sit down for some eggs and oranges already it's hard for her common sense to override what her body insists must actually be the case, which is - omg, i'm so sick i'll vomit do not force me to eat!!!

 

So I have to sit there and tell her "Geez, sweetie, I'm not insisting you eat this entire burger, just take three bites" while she glares and grumbles, and then two burgers and a large fries later she's going "Didn't you get me a milkshake? Can I have one of those apple pies too? You don't mind if I cook all the blintzes in the house, do you?"

 

But didn't you guys get your plaque when you have your kids, at the hospital? The one that says "Tough Nuts, Ma, Parent The Kid In Front of Your Face"?

 

I didn't even get a manual. I was supposed to get a manual, right? "How to raise this kid from birth to college, without screwing up even a little", something like that? But they were on backorder or I don't know what, and so I didn't get one. I should write to the hospital and ask what the delay is! I NEED MY FAQ.

 

Edited December 20, 2016 by Tanaqui

[Guest]

You must have made the nurses mad, tanaqui. Everyone else got a manual and plaque.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Damn I didn't get my manual or plague either.

[Tanaqui]

I don't know, do plagues of children count!? Lately it seems that every time I turn around, there's another child in the house. I think one of them has moved in, and I still haven't met her actual parents.

Edited December 20, 2016 by Tanaqui

[SparklyUnicorn]

The weirdest thing to me is that I don't feel like an adult half the time.  Where's my mommy?!

 

:laugh:

[CadenceSophia]

The thing people are trying to say is that it's not LYING! HE'S A LIAR! .....it's tat he's a kid who still needs to be parented in a way that his parent (rightfully, logically, lovingly) thinks he should be past by now.

 

But didn't you guys get your plaque when you have your kids, at the hospital? The one that says "Tough Nuts, Ma, Parent The Kid In Front of Your Face"?

Well yeah obviously. I can't tell if you are agreeing with me or not. My view of parenting doesn't include never letting my kids mess up and needing to guide them all over again on any task.

 

The reason my 6 year old has been let to be independent with teeth bruising and with a million other little things is that she is the most highly capable little girl I could dream of. I don't know that ADD parenting gives an advantage or just an entirely different perspective. My younger 4 year old has been doing a morning and evening checklist independently for 18 months. We still double check him because he's 4, but by the time he is 10 I won't be expecting to supervise these things UNLESS he shows me he needs it.

[maize]

I think the advice "inspect what you expect" applies.

[Guest]

Well yeah obviously. I can't tell if you are agreeing with me or not. My view of parenting doesn't include never letting my kids mess up and needing to guide them all over again on any task.

 

The reason my 6 year old has been let to be independent with teeth bruising and with a million other little things is that she is the most highly capable little girl I could dream of. I don't know that ADD parenting gives an advantage or just an entirely different perspective. My younger 4 year old has been doing a morning and evening checklist independently for 18 months. We still double check him because he's 4, but by the time he is 10 I won't be expecting to supervise these things UNLESS he shows me he needs it.

Those two posts I quoted just prompted me think of the op and ensuing discussion from the angle of people only prioritizing what matters to them. Which, as I'm typing that, I'm realizing other ppl already said that. But in anY case it didn't strike me as an "obviously" kind of thing. I was just writing thoughts, not criticizing or agreeing with you. Edited December 20, 2016 by OKBud

[SeaConquest]

For example, I have a kid who forgets to drink water. He honestly forget he is thirsty.

 

I was a 30-something litigator at a multinational firm, and used to get UTIs because I was too busy to drink water and/or pee. I have ADD-Inattentive, and would get so hyper-focused on work that I would literally make myself sick. I still needed my mommy around. :)

 

Edited December 20, 2016 by SeaConquest

[maize]

This is a weird thread to me... I can completely see how a child used to be able to complete some tasks independently, and yet suddenly they thought it would be more efficient only to complete what he thought could be checked.

 

My 6 year old brushed her teeth alone for about a year until her older brother suddenly informed me that at some point she had decided not to use toothpaste anymore. I did exactly what the op did and basically set her up for lying (which she did) because I was completely in shock. I mean.. She knew how to brush her teeth, she was guided until it looked like she could do it alone, and then checked until she seemed consistently successful. She just had a squirrelly kid moment and made a bad decision or decided to take up a bad habit. We started supervising again and will gradually cut back until we feel she can do it independently again. I kinda thought that was the whole parenting deal -- Teach and guide until they can do it alone. Adjust as necessary so you hopefully have a competent mature adult by the time they move out.

 

Maybe you don't start out giving independence in crossing the street, but xtra math and piano are pretty darn low risk areas to practice in.

 

I didn't just stop putting tooth paste on the tooth brush at that age-- I developed a whole ritual of running the water, getting my toothbrush wet, and...not brushing my teeth.

 

I pretty much have no expectation that my kids will do something just because I tell them or teach them to do it. I wasn't that kind of kid.

[Smiles]

I do not think asking a 10 year old to brush his teeth and practice piano is too much! But I really do think it depends on the child, my 9 year old will brush his teeth, wash his face, comb his hair, get his clothes on, wash his breakfast plate and start on school work (work that he is able to do by himself) without me asking! But this is his personality type! He also will not lie, he is strange in that way, I admit. If he even thinks he did something wrong he will come to me! Things are very black and white to him! Now I have a 7 year old and I get the feeling he will not be this way! That's ok, we will just have to work on it, we have time! I have a 5 year old she will brush her teeth (she always asks me to watch her) she will wash her face, tries to comb her hair, and she will also wash her breakfast dishes! Again I think it depends on the child's personality! Some will struggle in certain areas. If you think about some of the things children have done in the past I think they are capable of more then what we give them credit for! Yes we do live in different times but I think we can spoon feed them a little too much! I really feel like this is a tricky area, some will be ready and some will not, so if it were me I would gradually work on it! I know a lot of kids in public school that have more expected of them than what mine do! Its good and bad all at the same time! The lying is expected from what I have read, but you need to set boundaries. I would make sure he realizes that he will get caught up in a lie and sometimes that lie can grow. I always explained it to my kids that its like the snowball effect, they do well with examples! I want to make it clear that I am not a parenting expert! Just giving my opinion! And I hope my 9 year doesn't start lying, since I have been bragging on him! Good luck, I hope you find a way to figure this out! We are all really in this together. I hope I don't sound snarky, that's not my intention. I think sometimes we are too harsh on others and things are hard to explain online.

[AdventuresinHomeschooling]

I could have written something similar about my fifth grader recently as I caught him saying he had finished his work when he only did a few problems or none at all. I have caught him bending the truth a few other times too. I have read this entire thread and benefitted from it, and I have been mulling it over all day.

 

The way I see it, there are two issues: not doing the work and lying about it. The debate over whether I am expecting too much from my child to do independently or not is one debate. I sometimes mistakingly think my son can handle more than I can, and through these trials and error, we learn. I learned that he cannot do certain math problems independently despite what the curriculum claims, and he needs more hand holding to gain more confidence. Maybe his work was too easy or hard. However, that issue is separate from the moral issue of lying. If he needs help, he should ask, not lie. And perhaps, he was truly scared at being caught and lied instead. These are all reasons the child lied, but it is not an EXCUSE. I feel some in this thread are blaming this mother for her child lying. Whether the work was able to be done or not is no excuse for lying. I hate lying, and I make it very clear to my children that lying makes it worse. Because in real life, lying makes it worse!

 

So I tell my kids that trust is fragile, and when it is broken, it has to be rebuilt slowly. This means I am going to be checking up on him more. It means that I cannot, sadly, take him at his word right away until I have more trust. There is likely to be some sort of punishment too. I don't want too create a pattern of lying. Nip it in the bud now.

 

Does this mean I do not recognize that he needs help with math? No. I am going to sit with him and help him with his math more. And I reiterate that he needed only ask and praise him when he does bring it to me without covering it up. I stress to him how much he needs to learn this for his benefit and that being hard on him is because I love him and want him to be successful in life, which requires math. But this does not excuse lying. Lying is unacceptable, and glossing over it only reinforces it.

 

I have taught at the college level, and if you think college kids don't lie to cover their tracks and make excuses or that it is something they outgrow. Character must be taught and reinforced.

 

As far as what is developmentally appropriate for independent work, I think every child is different. It is hard when you have littles and need your oldest to do more on his own. The goal is not for me to hover over my kids and make sure they do everything. I can be a softie about certain things too, but the ultimate goal is to teach them so they can do it on their own and build trust and confidence in their abilities. Maybe hover for a bit bc of lack of trust so they will want to prove themselves for the privilege of independence again. By the way, with privilege comes responsibility. A natural consequence for my kids is to link their responsibilities to their privileges that come with age.

 

Hang in there! Parenting isn't getting any easier. I feel the physical work of parenting the younger years makes way for the mental work of the upper years. I'm not an expert or anything, but I am right there in the trenches with you.