Dual Enrollment vs. College Enrollment During High School

[Woodhaven]

Can someone give me the pros and cons of each of these options?  I've been told by some that just enrolling my son in community college classes w/o dual enrollment was better and by others that dual enrollment is the best choice. 

 

I met various people who told me these things at co-op this past Spring, and don't have any way to contact them now to discuss this further this summer.  As my son wants to register for a higher level math class at the local CC this fall we are trying to sort this out.  One counselor at the college said he needed to get a minimum score of 22 on math on the ACT, which should be easy for him, so he is testing Saturday.  Another counselor at the same school said he would still need to take the school's math test to test into a higher level math, so taking the ACT is probably only useful for practice at this point if this is true. 

 

My son will be a Junior in the Fall and is 16 years old.

 

Thank you very much for your thoughts and information!!

[Arcadia]

One counselor at the college said he needed to get a minimum score of 22 on math on the ACT, which should be easy for him, so he is testing Saturday. Another counselor at the same school said he would still need to take the school's math test to test into a higher level math, so taking the ACT is probably only useful for practice at this point if this is true.

For my local community college, a ACT math score of 23 and above would prequalify a student to take certain math courses. For those outside of the prequalified courses, the student do need to sit for the math placement tests. So both counselors are correct.

 

E.g. copied from my local community college

"C. are eligible to enroll in an entry-level college-level mathematics course (Math 8, 10, 12, D, G, 1 or 2). "

 

For someone with AP Calc scores

"D. are eligible to enroll in advanced calculus courses. This eligibility is determined if you have scored appropriately on the tests below:

 

College Board Advanced Placement Calculus AB test: A score of 3 or above allows you to place out of Math 3A (Calculus I) and to be eligible for enrolling in Math 3B (Calculus II).

College Board Advanced Placement Calculus BC test: A score of 5 allows you to place out of Math 3B (Calculus II) and to be eligible for enrolling in Math 4A (Calculus III) or Math 4B (Differential Equations)."

 

ETA:

My kids are not in high school yet so no idea about DE or college enrolment. Most local parents I talk to opt for DE and decide later whether to graduate their kids early.

 

ETA:

There is also the Early College Program where students get an associate degree and a high school diploma. My car mechanic's daughter attends this one and likes it there. You can see if your district has something similar.

http://www.gavilan.edu/geca/about.html

Edited June 8, 2016 by Arcadia

[regentrude]

I am not sure what you are referring to: graduating your 16 y/o from high school and have him enroll in CC full time (i.e. going to college and no longer DE) vs taking CC classes while still a homeschooled high schooler (which is what DE is)?

I see no benefit in early graduation unless the student is seriously advanced and accelerated (in which case I would question why it would be in the student's best interest to attend community college instead of a four year university). I would also want to make sure the student has completed his high school education, satisfies my graduation requirements, and I can in good conscience award him a high school diploma. None of these would have to be an issue of the student did DE, i.e. took college classes while still enrolled in my homeschool.

 

Could you elaborate what exactly you mean by "just enrolling w/o DE"?

 

Edited June 8, 2016 by regentrude

[Woodhaven]

Well, I am kind of confused myself.  To clarify, a woman who works at a local private high school prepping teens for Harvard, taught an SAT/ACT prep class at our co-op this past spring.  She and I spoke and she suggested it was better not to officially sign my son up for dual enrollment.  She suggested he simply enroll in the CC while still in high school. I'm trying to contact her now to clarify what she meant.  Perhaps my memory is fuzzy.

 

Yes, I see what you mean about graduating him early, and I am not ready to do that. 

[regentrude]

.  She and I spoke and she suggested it was better not to officially sign my son up for dual enrollment.  She suggested he simply enroll in the CC while still in high school.

 

The bolded is dual enrollment.

 

ETA: if she is prepping teens for Harvard, she may have suggested that it is better NOT to graduate early and go to CC because then the student would be a transfer - and transferring into Harvard is even more difficult than being admitted as a regular freshman.

Edited June 8, 2016 by regentrude

[The Girls' Mom]

Also, as a DE student, it is easier to maintain freshman status should he decide to go to a university after high school.  DE at our CC is not any different than any other student attending.  In fact, only admissions really knows that you are DE, and you can take any class that you meet the pre-reqs for.  

[Woodhaven]

Ah, I wonder if she was referring to the high school transcript and how I listed his class credits there. 

 

Yes, I don't want to risk his status as a Freshman, nor do I want to risk possible scholarships.

 

Thanks!

[regentrude]

Ah, I wonder if she was referring to the high school transcript and how I listed his class credits there. 

 

It would not matter how you list them on the high school transcript, because he will have to submit an official transcript of any college he ever attended. So, you cannot hide the fact that a course has been taken at CC anyway. You mjght as well label it as such on the hs transcript and thus demonstrate strong academics.

Edited June 8, 2016 by regentrude

[Bootsie]

I think the terminology varies from school to school and perhaps from state to state.  DS has not graduated from HS yet but has been taking courses at a locall university.  The university does not offer "dual enrollment" courses but considers this "concurrent enrollment."  For dual enrollment, they would have to have some specific agreements with local high schools as to acceptance of students taking courses.  They do not have this, but allow students to take courses on a case-by-case basis.

 

DD took some "dual enrollment" while she was in high school.  (She went to a private high school that had a relationship with a local university that offered dual enrollment possibilities.)  She also took summer courses at another university that were not considered "dual enrollment"  These courses did not count toward her high schooll graduation requirmeents.  That university did not communicate with the high school regarding her grades, academic standing, etc. 

 

Dual enrollment can imply certain legal situations regarding reporting information between the college and the high school and who the college can speak to if there is any issue.

[Dmmetler]

What I found is that DE has rules and limits that registering as a non-degree student doesn't-but is also available for funding support. In DD's case, she's too young to register for DE, but could as non-degree based on her SAT score-we'd just have to pay for it ourselves. DE also has more limits as far as classes you can take.

[KarenNC]

So much varies by state. In our state, if the student is doing dual enrollment with the community college, there is a list of specific courses that are available in pre-arranged pathways (with some limited ability to choose between courses in the pathway). The student has to complete one of the pathways before having the option to enroll in other courses. High school students can't enroll unless part of this program, and it doesn't harm freshman status at any of the college we've researched. The tuition is free, but students pay fees and books and the program is only open to juniors and seniors. There are articulation agreements for these classes between the community college system and the state universities (as well as many private ones in the state), so that many of the courses are guaranteed to be accepted as fulfilling general ed requirements rather than transferring as electives.

 

Another option might be to enroll in courses with 4 year schools, but that isn't funded by the state and varies widely depending on the 4 year school.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

Well, I am kind of confused myself.  To clarify, a woman who works at a local private high school prepping teens for Harvard, taught an SAT/ACT prep class at our co-op this past spring.  She and I spoke and she suggested it was better not to officially sign my son up for dual enrollment.  She suggested he simply enroll in the CC while still in high school. I'm trying to contact her now to clarify what she meant.  Perhaps my memory is fuzzy.

 

Yes, I see what you mean about graduating him early, and I am not ready to do that. 

 

Dual Enrollment means different things in different places.

 

In some areas, Dual Enrollment is the specific name of the program through which high school students enroll in their local community college.  It might be on campus at the college in regular CC classes.  It might be taught at the high school by college instructors.  It might have a tuition discount or waiver.  It might be regular price.  It might be open to any high schooler or it might be restricted to juniors and seniors.  It might have a stipulated agreement with the high school that specifies how credit from the college will be applied to the high school record.  It might have restrictions on the number or type of courses a student may take.

 

At other schools a similar program might be called Early Admission, High School Special or Running Start.  

 

There isn't a standard nationally to what dual enrollment means.  In fact, I've seen different college systems in the same county and even different campuses in the same system have different requirements and restrictions.  

 

In our area, the phrase dual enrollment doesn't have any official meaning.  The local public high schoolers enroll in Running Start (which has an articulation agreement between the CC system and the school system).  Private school students and home schoolers access the same classes with the same requirements and restriction - except that there is not agreement as to how the high school will treat credit (it is up to each private school/home school and depends on the course and school policy).  Private schoolers and homeschoolers apply as Early Admission Students instead of under Running Start.

 

All of which is to say that there is a great deal of local variation.  You would need to see what dual enrollment means in your area and at the particular college and for homeschooled students in particular.  There might be no difference or there might be a great deal of difference.

[MarkT]

I think the terminology varies from school to school and perhaps from state to state.  DS has not graduated from HS yet but has been taking courses at a locall university.  The university does not offer "dual enrollment" courses but considers this "concurrent enrollment."  For dual enrollment, they would have to have some specific agreements with local high schools as to acceptance of students taking courses.  They do not have this, but allow students to take courses on a case-by-case basis.

 

Our local B&M high schools use this definition for concurrent enrollment:

 "college-credit bearing courses taught by college-approved high school teachers."

http://www.nacep.org/about-nacep/what-is-concurrent-enrollment/

 

It is just another form of "dual enrollment".

[MarkT]

Can someone give me the pros and cons of each of these options?  I've been told by some that just enrolling my son in community college classes w/o dual enrollment was better and by others that dual enrollment is the best choice. 

 

From a homeschooling perspective, a college course counting towards a "high school diploma" credit would be DE.

 

Does your community college have a specific recognized dual enrollment program for high school students?  If not then your son would just be another part-time enrolled student at the CC.

Edited June 9, 2016 by MarkT

[Melissa in NC]

For us, the county pays 50% tuition for DE so I choose DE.

[daijobu]

Being graduated from high school may give your student priority registration for classes which may be important if they are over subscribed.  Some cc's have automatic transfer agreements to 4 year universities, so in some cases it may be easier to be admitted as a transfer from cc than as a freshman.  (Harvard is not in this category, but your local state u may be.)  

 

Your question is best directed to other homeschoolers in your community as these rules vary from state to state and school to school.  

[lmrich]

Check with your state, some offer free Dual Enrollment to high school students so I see this as a huge pro for staying in high school.