Need advice assigning grade to dd's work....Oh Eliz, others...

[sheryl]

Background:

 

This time last year dd was a rising 9th grader.   Later in the fall and continuing to present we've been impacted by health crises in extended family:

 

1.  My uncle like a 2nd Dad passed away the week before Thanksgiving

2.  Just weeks later in January, my husband's Mother passed away

3.  Mil passed away in the morning on Jan. 8 and that evening bil was diagnosed with brain cancer

4.  My Dad was not doing well, in hospital, rehab and we didn't know of his future 

 

On top of all of that, dd was more socially active.  She compromised her studies b/c she has blossomed into more of a social butterfly.  She is involved in church youth group and volunteers.  She's part of a teen homeschool group and they offer socials, service projects, meetings and field trips - we do not participate in every event b/c it's too much.  We have Bible Study group every other week, horseback, etc. 

 

It might seem like I'm carving a good excuse for her.  I'm not.  I want to be fair.  All of the above contributed to her getting behind.

 

Today, August 28, she is finishing her 9th grade work!  Because of the above she had to "school" part-time during the summer to finish TODAY!   (She went through driver's ed class and behind wheel, took test and now has permit - this took 3 months turn around time from mid-May to mid-Aug.), 

 

She was waaaaaaaaay behind in math.  My friend's son who graduated homeschool and went off to college recently, spent several days reviewing math concepts with her to help her finish.

 

DD can not stand "format" of Apologia.   She likes the content (faith-based) but it's written in a very dry format.  So, to help her finish, I read the test questions to her.   I didn't bait her for an answer.  I asked her if that was the one she wanted only a few times in the 8 or so tests I helped her with.  I know she missed a few already and didn't say anything.   Basically, I had to read the question and help her where to find the answer in the book.  Oh yea, I gave her open book tests too.

 

Question:  How would I assign a grade to her math but more so her science?  Do I grade down b/c it took longer than usual, friend's son helped her review math but she did the tests, and I had to help her with Physical Science.

Any input would be appreciated.  I don't think I left anything out.  HELP! :)

 

 

[RootAnn]

Question:  How would I assign a grade to her math but more so her science?  Do I grade down b/c it took longer than usual, friend's son helped her review math but she did the tests, and I had to help her with Physical Science.

Any input would be appreciated.  I don't think I left anything out.  HELP! :)

 

I would NEVER grade her down because she took longer. The friend's son was acting in a tutor capacity. If your daughter took the tests, she gets the grade.

IMO, give her the grade she gets & move forward. Kudos to her for working through the summer so she can move on.

[AK_Mom4]

Give her the grade she earned on the tests and call it good.  No need to penalize for the school year taking longer - lots of kids go to "summer school" to finish up classes or recover credits and there is no penalty for that or for having a tutor.

 

And ditch Apologia for her.  There are other texts out there, including faith-based ones, that are better for kids who don't like the Apologia format.  The Abeka Biology book (God's Living Creation?) is very well written for one.

[Dina in Oklahoma]

Sheryl ~

 

Just wanted to offer a  :grouphug:  as this has been our reality for the past five years. Caregiving, death, health issues for DD and myself. I believe this year we will finally be on track! Please know all will fall into place. Best wishes on a great year! Dina

Background:

 

This time last year dd was a rising 9th grader.   Later in the fall and continuing to present we've been impacted by health crises in extended family:

 

1.  My uncle like a 2nd Dad passed away the week before Thanksgiving

2.  Just weeks later in January, my husband's Mother passed away

3.  Mil passed away in the morning on Jan. 8 and that evening bil was diagnosed with brain cancer

4.  My Dad was not doing well, in hospital, rehab and we didn't know of his future 

 

On top of all of that, dd was more socially active.  She compromised her studies b/c she has blossomed into more of a social butterfly.  She is involved in church youth group and volunteers.  She's part of a teen homeschool group and they offer socials, service projects, meetings and field trips - we do not participate in every event b/c it's too much.  We have Bible Study group every other week, horseback, etc. 

 

It might seem like I'm carving a good excuse for her.  I'm not.  I want to be fair.  All of the above contributed to her getting behind.

 

Today, August 28, she is finishing her 9th grade work!  Because of the above she had to "school" part-time during the summer to finish TODAY!   (She went through driver's ed class and behind wheel, took test and now has permit - this took 3 months turn around time from mid-May to mid-Aug.), 

 

She was waaaaaaaaay behind in math.  My friend's son who graduated homeschool and went off to college recently, spent several days reviewing math concepts with her to help her finish.

 

DD can not stand "format" of Apologia.   She likes the content (faith-based) but it's written in a very dry format.  So, to help her finish, I read the test questions to her.   I didn't bait her for an answer.  I asked her if that was the one she wanted only a few times in the 8 or so tests I helped her with.  I know she missed a few already and didn't say anything.   Basically, I had to read the question and help her where to find the answer in the book.  Oh yea, I gave her open book tests too.

 

Question:  How would I assign a grade to her math but more so her science?  Do I grade down b/c it took longer than usual, friend's son helped her review math but she did the tests, and I had to help her with Physical Science.

Any input would be appreciated.  I don't think I left anything out.  HELP! :)

 

[sheryl]

Thanks Root Ann!

 

AKMom4   Yes, I'm looking now to buy Abeka Biology.  I need it fast! LOL!   My question is really more about how to grade Science.  These 3 things:  1) I read the questions to her, 2) open book and 3) gave her an approximate starting point to start looking for her answer.   I'm worried I had to water it down.   What do you advise?

 

Dina in OK,  that is so sweet.  My irl friends know we've been through a lot but I don't know if they fully understand.   You seem to understand and I'm sorry to hear of medical issues b/t you and your dd.  :grouphug:  back to you and restore quickly!   Thanks for sharing/understanding!  

[Lori D.]

:grouphug:  Hugs and sympathy for you in juggling all of the extenuating life circumstances!

 

And just adding -- totally agree with RootAnn and AK_Mom4. Assign an honest grade (length of time does not matter, but actually knowing material does), move on -- and use something ELSE for science!

 

As for assigning the grade for science -- honestly, if it were me, what with everything your family was undergoing last year, as long as you read through the text and did a few labs, I would skip any tests or quizzes or lab reports, give a grade (I have been known to give lower grades for lack of effort, or not a firm grasp on the material) and start fresh this year with a new science and a new publisher. I'd also consider only awarding 0.5 credit, since not all work was completed.

 

Another option: Science Sheperd Biology. Christian perspective, includes DVD videos, written by a homeschooler FOR homeschoolers, with topic questions for each chapter as an aid to the parent to help the student hone in on the important concepts in the chapter. Here's the Cathy Duffy review. Other Christian options include the more rigorous Bob Jones Biology (option of DVD course); textbook-based Christian Liberty Press Biology; and the lighter Alpha-Omega Biology (either as a CD computer course of Switched on Schoolhouse, or workbook series of Life-Pac).

 

 

PS -- We had the same reaction to Apologia -- Christian perspective was nice, but we could NOT tolerate the overly-chatty writing style, the horrible layout/format of the textbook, and the formal DRY style of teaching, so we switched to something else that worked for us. It restored the enjoyment of science that Apologia had sucked away.

[Jann in TX]

((Hugs))-- sounds like an extra tough year.

 

Now being honest here...

 

If your dd took tests by herself (like in Math) and passed the class then I'd give her the grade she earned and move on-- as long as she is READY for the next level... in other words if 'she kinda-sorta worked Algebra 1 mostly by herself' she may not be ready to move on...as she would not be prepared for the next level-- high school maths really build on each other!

 

As far as science goes-- if you read the questions and she answered open book I would have trouble giving that a grade if that was all she did for the course (no other assigments, quizzes or tests) as she did nothing to prove that she learned or understood the material.

 

You are assigning high school credit-- something you will have to stand behind when she applies to colleges...

 

There is still time to get in 3 valid science classes using a different program (many colleges are fine with 3 solid science credits).

 

As you are the prinicpal of your homeschool you can assign any grade you want-- but if you just give her an A or B and she did not earn it (no grades to back it up) you might not be doing her any favors-- especially if she expects the same treatment this coming year.

[Lori D.]

As far as science goes-- if you read the questions and she answered open book I would have trouble giving that a grade if that was all she did for the course (no other assigments, quizzes or tests) as she did nothing to prove that she learned or understood the material.

 

You are assigning high school credit-- something you will have to stand behind when she applies to colleges...

 

There is still time to get in 3 valid science classes using a different program (many colleges are fine with 3 solid science credits).

 

I like this idea!

 

Just drop the credit (consider it an incomplete course), and you have 3 years to do 3 sciences now, which will easily match college admission requirements (most want 3 sciences, with labs). Just make sure they are solid sciences AND with labs, and consider last year's Physical Science a prep for the real deal now! :)

[RootAnn]

I think I'm the only one on the thread w/out high schoolers yet, so you can ignore my advice if you want.

 

Part of my answer relied on the fact that this was Apologia's Physical Science text. The one that is generally thought of as an introduction to high school sciences / taken in 8th grade. She'll see all of it again, theoretically, and at a higher level. No college is going to look at this one science grade, which I'm assuming isn't going to be an A+, and wonder why her ACT Science score isn't higher. There will be other science grades on her transcript.

 

Sheryl - Does she understand that the extra help you gave her to get done with Apologia isn't going to be the standard fare going forward? It sounds like you feel guilty for the help you gave her (reading questions / open book format). Drop the guilt. Move forward. Decide how you are going to do this year's stuff (open book or closed book? Are you going to provide a study guide before each test or just make her sink/swim with her current study skills?) Explain it to her. Stick to it. Grade by it.

 

See, going into this thread, I was thinking she was going to have to redo her whole Freshman year or something. (That's definitely happened to some WTM kids due to deaths in the family & health troubles.) This isn't something to dwell on.

[sheryl]

Lori,   Thanks - appreciate that!   Let me explain further:

 

Apologia Physical Science - 9th grade

- co-op for labs (taught by a homeschooling Dad who is heavily degreed in sciences - plural, I believe).  She had to read the entire text.  DD read each module, went to co-op class where they performed the lab/s, wrote the lab written for each module.  She earned all A's and B's on her lab reports. 

- in addition to reading text, lab reports for each module, she just finished (yesterday) with the tests that took her the summer b/c well, it's summer and there's other fun to do, right! :)   When she answered her questions on the tests, I could tell that, using open book method, she researched, found and reasoned her answers correctly more often than not.  I do recall her answering incorrectly, but I didn't tell her.  To be honest, she claims to not be science-minded.  (She's come a long way as she is s.n.  She has controlled epilepsy on meds and she just saw her neurol. yesterday.  We will be weaning her probably next year).  I don't want her s.n. to be an excuse b/c she has made great strides.  But, right after her grand mal in '07 it really did a number on her memory.  It's taken some time for her to improve in that area, but she has.   All  of that to say that she probably does not have a good handle on Physical Science.  It's not her thing.  So, she knew most of the answers doing a quick review (open book). 

 

I've heard different opinions about P.S. being used in 9th grade and 8th grade.  I thought the local p.s. system used Phy. S. in 9th, but maybe I'm wrong. 

 

Would it be fair to grade this way so as not to waste the time/effort for that year's grade:
-read text

-lab reports

-open book tests

 

Thanks for the link - Science Sheperd Biology.  Is it stand alone or supplemental?

 

Jann, read above.   There are 16 tests.  She did the first 8 or so by herself.  The last half or 2nd semester work (tests 9-16 approx.) is what I guided her on.  But, I did "not" give her the answers.   However, I guided to the section that contained the answer, sometimes.

 

RootAnn,   read above. Yes, she understands this is not the norm.  I've homeschooled her since K and just due to circumstances this past year this was about all we could do.  Study guide - unfortunately these were not used.  We should have though. 

 

I'm grateful to these responses!
 

[Mom22ns]

How you grade the science, from all you have said, I would use the grades she got on the tests (you said she missed some questions even doing them open book). What would her grade have been? I have no problem with reading the tests to her, however, if she is taking them open book, I no longer consider them tests and if you are directing her to the answers from there... obviously, she not only doesn't know the answers, she can't even find them in the text. You said she got a mixture of As and Bs on the labs and you can add that in if you'd like. It doesn't sound to me like she came away with an outstanding or excellent understanding of the subject (A). Come up with a formula that seems reasonable and assign a grade. None of us can see the grades or the quality of the work she did, so we can't tell you what grade to give her. 

 

Give her the grade she earned or if you don't think that grade is fair due to the circumstances, give her .5 credit and the grade she earned the first half of the year before you started helping. Or just don't count it at all and let it go. 

 

:grouphug:

[EndOfOrdinary]

Science Shepherd is stand alone.

[kiana]

How you grade the science, from all you have said, I would use the grades she got on the tests (you said she missed some questions even doing them open book). What would her grade have been? I have no problem with reading the tests to her, however, if she is taking them open book, I no longer consider them tests and if you are directing her to the answers from there... obviously, she not only doesn't know the answers, she can't even find them in the text. You said she got a mixture of As and Bs on the labs and you can add that in if you'd like. It doesn't sound to me like she came away with an outstanding or excellent understanding of the subject (A). Come up with a formula that seems reasonable and assign a grade. None of us can see the grades or the quality of the work she did, so we can't tell you what grade to give her.

 

+1.

 

Honestly, I'd be inclined to just count it as half a credit on the basis of the completed labs. I just don't think I could justifiably say someone learned physical science when they sometimes needed direction to look up the answers in the textbook. I'd be more inclined to call it something esoteric like "introduction to laboratory science" and just assign half-credit for that.

[regentrude]

Apologia Physical Science - 9th grade

- co-op for labs (taught by a homeschooling Dad who is heavily degreed in sciences - plural, I believe).  She had to read the entire text.  DD read each module, went to co-op class where they performed the lab/s, wrote the lab written for each module.  She earned all A's and B's on her lab reports. 

- in addition to reading text, lab reports for each module, she just finished (yesterday) with the tests that took her the summer b/c well, it's summer and there's other fun to do, right! :)   When she answered her questions on the tests, I could tell that, using open book method, she researched, found and reasoned her answers correctly more often than not.  I do recall her answering incorrectly, but I didn't tell her.  To be honest, she claims to not be science-minded.  ..

Would it be fair to grade this way so as not to waste the time/effort for that year's grade:

-read text

-lab reports

-open book tests

 There are 16 tests.  She did the first 8 or so by herself.  The last half or 2nd semester work (tests 9-16 approx.) is what I guided her on.  But, I did "not" give her the answers.   However, I guided to the section that contained the answer, sometimes.

 

I would not give a high school science credit for a student who answered tests based on being directed to the respective section in the book. That is a test in reading comprehension.

Yes, I know that there are open book tests even in college, but these would be designed specifically to be open book tests, so that the book is of limited help and the student needs to possess a higher level of understanding and problem solving. A test that is designed to test recall of facts that are in the book is not meant to be taken with access to the source. I do not feel this would be an honest evaluation of her science knowledge.

 

I think the suggestion of 0.5 credit for the lab is a good one. "Intro to physical science lab" or something like this. Anything else would be stretching it IMO.

 

ETA: A comment on the "not being science minded": you are already taking this into account by counting physical science as a high school course. That is for "non science minded" students, if such a thing exists (often it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy).

[at the beach]

It sounds like your daughter has special needs--the memory issues you describe. Whatever special needs she has should be taken into account. You can give her accommodations if she needs them and alternate assessments if those are necessary.

 

The following link is to a site that explains a little about alternate assessments. http://www.cehd.umn.edu/nceo/topicareas/alternateassessments/altAssessFAQ.htm. Apologia's tests may not be an appropriate assessment for your daughter.

 

I wouldn't scrap this year as she has done significant work, nor would I necessarily count on her getting three solid credits over the next three years. Things don't always go as planned. Maybe you can come up with some alternate assessments and give full credit for this year?

 

Our local high school offers physical science in 9th as the standard science course. Biology is honors-level. 

[Michelle_NC]

I agree with the others that if she had to be directed to the answers then that probably shouldn't count as a test.  Maybe more as a worksheet?  If it were me I would count it as .5 credit since she did put some effort into the first half and the labs. Or if she wants the full credit maybe you could assign a project or series of short research essays? I'm pretty sure that Physical Science can count towards college admissions (because it has  lab) so it would be a shame to waste the credit.

 

For the math I would give her the grade she earned even though it took longer.  My DD took  algebra in 8th grade and then took Algebra I in 9th grade because I thought she was a little shaky on some of the concepts toward the end. Mine definitely does not have a science or math career ahead of her, so i figured retaking Algebra 1 would help her get through the basic math classes when she gets to college.  If you don't think she's truly up to speed with math, you could do something like Saxon Algebra 1 and Algebra 2 (3rd editions) over the next 2 years.  When you get to the end of the 2nd book its the equivalent of taking Algebra 1, Geometry, and Algebra 2.  Just a thought.

[Farmgirl70]

I guess that considering that this is grade 9, and that she did consistent weekly work with a co-op and that she completed all tests, I would grade her work and give her the credit. When we were borderline between two grades, I would ask my kids what they thought they deserved and why. They often had interesting reasons and were surprisingly rigorous in their grading. I took their answers into account when I was determining their grade. For my kids, grade 9 was a real jump in content and discipline. It wound up gearing them up for the rest of high school. If a couple of classes were less than stellar, we just tried to improve upon that in our plans for the following year. I'd give her a credit and a grade and move ahead with plans for this year based on what you've observed. Good job having the fortitude to finish everything!