Need help, advice, group hug (or all of the above)

[nikkistone]

Hi y'all--

 

I may need y'all to talk me off of the proverbial ledge. 

 

I'm in my first year of homeschooling (DS10, DS8, and DD6 -- they were previously in public school).  My DH, who is very supportive, tells me to give myself grace; this is my first year -- it's going to be difficult.  While that's reassuring, it doesn't help solve some of the problems that we're facing on a daily basis.

 

My kids are good kids; they never had behavior problems in PS and they are generally well behaved, obedient kids (they have their moments of course).  I'll do my best to narrow down the problems.

 

Problem #1  DS10 is HIGHLY distractable (starts daydreaming, picking at his nails, looking out the window, etc).  It took him 3 HOURS to finish his Saxon 6/5 math yesterday.  NOT because it was too hard for him.  But because he didn't buckle down and just get it done.  Math tends to be where we see the most distractability.  But it can happen with spelling, or handwriting, or anything else DS doesn't seem to want to do.  His teachers, ever since kindergarten, have noticed this too and have commented on how long it takes him to do work.  He is an intelligent kid, but he "checks out" quite a bit during school.  But get him playing Minecraft and he can concentrate for HOURS.

 

Problem #2  my kids (specifically DS-8) are constantly making loud noises, talking out loud loudly, and generally being annoying and distracting to the rest of us.  I leave the room to go to the bathroom for 2 minutes, and it sounds like a menagerie broke out in the schoolroom.  Kids are laughing it up, making animal noises, etc.  Even when I'm in the room, there's constant noise.  It's annoying and distracting.  I'm constantly saying "Be quiet."  Or "You are not being respectful of the others by making those noises."  I had the pleasure of observing a friend's homeschool day before I started homeschooling, and when I think back to that day, I'm frustrated and disheartened by how boisterous my kids are.  In one way it's a blessing; they generally like each other and play well with each other.  But it's NOT acceptable when we're doing school.

 

Problem #3  my kids (specifically DS10) are not self-directed or self-motivated.  I have to hold their hands (especially with DS-10) and walk them through step by step on some things that seem very obvious to me.  For example, DS-10's writing.  We are in the Essentials program of Classical Conversations which uses the IEW program.  I have DS read the assignment which clearly states what to do.  Then DS looks at me with this blank look as if to say, "Now what?"  So I ask him what he needs to do next.  He may or may not answer correctly.  After that step, he'll then get "stuck" again and not know what to do next.  It's very obvious to me what the steps are.  And if he were paying attention in class (see problem #1), he would know what the steps are.  I realize that my 6 year old isn't ready to be self directed.  And I'm OK with that.  But it boggles my mind that my DS10 is so CLUELESS.  And he's a smart kid!  It's aggravating.  I was a very motivated student growing up, and I can't relate to this clueless kid who doesn't have a go-get-em bone in his body.  I find myself being descending towards him and talking to him like he's 2 years old when I'm explaining assignments or concepts that I think he should already know.  :sad:

 

Problem #4 DS8 frequently has a bad attitude toward school -- typically after he's become frustrated about something.  A typical scenario:  DS8 doesn't like the physical act of writing, so I've tried to limit what he has to write (for ex: we do Rod & Staff grammar orally).  But when I do occasionally ask him to write his grammar exercises down instead of doing them orally with me because I'm currently working with his sibling, he melts down (cries) and has a terrible attitude about things.  He also thinks it's GROSSLY unfair that DD6 has easy spelling words and not near as much of a work load as he does.  All that to say this: I feel like I battle with DS8 the most.  I've told him that it is unacceptable for him to talk to me the way he does and/or treat me the way he does when he's frustrated.  It's just unacceptable.  It wouldn't be okay at PS and it's not OK at home.  DH backs me up on this and has spoken with DS8 numerous times.

 

Thank you in advance for any comments, advice, group hugs, etc that are offered.  I'm trying not to freak out and dwell on the extreme thoughts of quitting.  But I'm frustrated, not enjoying this, and it feels like every day is a battle.

[Tmhearn]

My kids have only been homeschooled, and I have encountered every single one of those problems. Just to say, it all sounds totally familiar and normal. Obviously, that isn't to say that you can't or shouldn't attempt to make changes.

 

Problem 1: This sounds like my dd9. I find that I need to keep her near me and remind her to stay on task when she is seeming easily distracted. I also find that she might need an incentive to focus and work sometimes - for example, she can watch a movie in the afternoon if her work is done or she can use her iPad to play some games as soon as math is over.

 

Problem 2: Again, it's sometimes just a fact that my kids need constant reminding to be quiet, because they are distracting someone else in the room. If the person needing to concentrate can work alone, send them off. If the offender won't be quiet, send them out for a few minutes to calm down. Then they must come back and finish what they're doing, which prolongs their own work.

 

Problem 3: similar to number 1, some kids need more hand-holding. Sometimes we have to forget about the kid we expected to have and just deal with what we've got to work with. ;-) There seems to be a wide variation in the abilities of children to work independently. All you can do is take your kid where they're at and work on getting them to move further along. You know where your kid is. Can you maybe add one more subject that they do independently? Wait a few weeks or months and add something else...

 

Problem 4: My dd9 developed a much better attitude around 3rd grade. I'm hoping that is some magic number that will apply to future children as well. ;-)

[Jean in Newcastle]

A couple of comments.  

 

First -  :grouphug:

 

Your ds sounds like he might have some ADD issues esp. since this is a problem that has consistently been noted by teachers.  You can't expect him to have the same self control and focus as a child who might not have the same problem.  It's ok to acknowledge that he needs you right now to provide focus for him.  (I have a 16 year old who is much improved but still has trouble with focus.)  

 

Many kids, by the way, at 10 years old, are not ready to be independent in their studies.

 

The problem when you leave the room - believe me, that happens even in public school.  I've been a substitute teacher, I know how it can be with just a different teacher in the room!

 

You might consider having your kids do some exercise before school to blow off some of that extra steam.  Many boys, esp., need that.

 

 

[JustEm]

No real advice but  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

[Kevin'sMom]

My son is also 10 and easily distracted. I have banned Minecraft for a month, though, because he gets up in the middle of the night and plays it! I keep the teaching segments down to 20 minutes, and this seems to work very well. Curious what math your son is doing at the moment. I mix up the dry erase board, printouts, the K-12 site, a workbook, etc. to keep him interested.

[IsabelC]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

[My3girls]

We have all of that going on here, too. You're not alone.

 

Dd12 is a dawdler. I give her an allotted amount of time to do her work then we move on to the next task. What she doesn't get done becomes homework, and she has to do it on her time. I let her choose what subject we do next. We still do everything we were going to, but somehow choosing the order helps. She, also, is bright. She was in the gifted program in ps.

 

I have to separate the youngers regularly because one is always bothering the other. Somedays there is some strong discipline used to get them past it. Some days are smooth sailing, and I am so grateful. Again, I let them take turns choosing what's next since they are using the same curriculum. I try to incorporate some kind of hands on activity at least once a week, and we try to do something active outside the home once a week. There is a lot of outside run around time too to burn off some of that extra energy. We've really had a hard time with that the past few weeks because it has been so cold.

 

As for not knowing what to do and handholding, I make them read the directions out loud. This fixes it 8 times out of 10. The other 2 times I can tell they honestly do no get it. This has helped a lot because they have finally figured out that I am going to make them read, and they do not ask nearly as much. I do have a hard time with dd7 with Math, but I think this is more a confidence issue than not paying attention. I'm still working on that.

 

Keep up the good work. You're doing fine.

[Random]

:grouphug:

 

#1-Sorry, I don't have much constructive to add.  The only thing I find that helps (and it doesn't always help) is to have a reward for working diligently.  If my kids have an activity they want to get to, and they know they can't go unless schoolwork is done, they can somehow pull themselves together enough to do it.  But, this is an extremely slow process in our home.   I was the same way in school.  I stared out the window all day long.  All day.  My teachers didn't care, though.

 

#2-my 8 year-old is the EXACT same way.  It drives all of us absolutely nuts!  Just this week, I've started sending him to the front porch to sit for a while, and to give the rest of us a break.  He will sit alone until I have time to focus just on him.  I strongly suspect he acts the way he does for attention, and removing his 'audience' is having a mildly positive effect.  Chaos breaks out here whenever I leave the room, even for 5 minutes.  It's not pretty. 
 

#3-This year, my oldest is 12, and this is the first year he's been able to do 1/2 of his subjects on his own.  My day is very long, with 4 kids all needing to be taught different lessons.  And then checking over what they have been able to do independently. 

 

#4-my 8 yo sounds a lot like your 8yo!  We developed a system a while ago to motivate the kids to treat me better, or at least not constantly work against me.  Each morning, each child gets 3 (or 4) popsicle sticks.  Each child has his own color sticks.  Whenever I get the nasty attitude, I ask the offending child to bring me one of his sticks.  No discussion; no explanations; no drama. If I end up with all 3 (or 4), during the day, the child who lost all sticks goes to bed immediately after dinner and doesn't get any free time with Daddy that night.  This worked for us because my kids all adore their dad.  And time with him is precious.  This is something dh & I agreed on, because he really wanted to back me up and send a clear message that they cannot be obnoxious, rude, mean, disrespectful and generally out of control towards me and expect him to tolerate that.  Also, my sons responded much better to dad's authority than mine, even though I consider myself to be pretty tough and strong-willed.  And, our days were just plain awful and we needed drastic measures.

 

All that to say, you are not alone.   Hang in there!

 

[nikkistone]

THANK YOU, ladies.  It's comforting to know that we're not alone and that our issues aren't ours alone!  Thank you for reading all of my spewing above AND sticking around to comment.

[lots of little ducklings]

Ditto on all the great advice given by PPs. The only other thing I'd add (because I was guilty of this at first and thankfully learned quickly from others' wisdom) is this: don't try to recreate a brick and mortar school in your home. B&Ms have to do things a certain way--- their teachers have 20+ children to attend to and must follow certain procedures/schedules/systems that (often) are not the best climate for specific individual children. If your dc functions better in the afternoon, take advantage of that. If your dcs work poorly together, separate them and give them one-on-one time with you while their sibs are working independently, reading independently, or having free time. Reduce their subjects and workload so you can focus on the basics for now-- you are all adjusting and this can take pressure off of everyone while giving opportunities for true success. Then add to the workload gradually as things improve. Eliminate screen time during school days (my dcs' behavior is far better during the school weeks when the screen isn't used at all). And remember that they are learning to respect you as their teacher, not just their mom. This takes time and a lot of intentional training. It was my biggest hurdle starting out last year, and honestly, for a while last year (when my DS hated school, hated me, and I wanted to quit), I found that I had to change our primary focus from academics to behavior: respectful speech, respecting mom's authority, working hard at things we may not always enjoy, enjoying the rewards of finishing a task well... This took time but DH and I are finally enjoying the fruits of it this year. I can honestly say now that I love what I do even on the bad days (which are less frequent), and my DS (and DDs too) genuinely love school as well and even ask for it on breaks. Soooo.... Just remember your situation is entirely normal and it does improve with steady effort, consistency, and lots of grace for everyone including yourself. :-)

[Garga]

We use IEW, too. My ds10 also has trouble reading the instructions and following them. I don't know what it is about that program. It's a great program, but for some reason the instructions seem to throw the kids. Things that are glaringly obvious to me baffle my son.

 

I've found that I have to work much closer with him on that program than I thought I would. I don't always understand why (like you.) He gives me the same confused look I imagine your ds gives you. There have been a couple of times early on when we read the instructions, he did the work, but he did it completely wrong. I let my bafflement and confusion show and he ended up crying. He really didn't get it and I learned that I have to hold his hand a lot more on our IEW lessons than I'd hoped.

 

Everything else you described sounds pretty normal for homeschooling. You'll have to work hard on getting those things under control. I've also just recently added a walk up and down the street each day. We walk up the street and down (it's .6 miles, round trip) as fast as we can after breakfast and after lunch. This really helps my wiggly 8 year old.

 

I haven't solved the constant noise in our house yet. The humming or tapping or talking out of turn. It's starting to drive me a little crazy and I haven't taken the time to address it yet, but need to soon. I'm right there with you on that one.

[Vida Winter]

Your experience is not unusual at all. One thing that helped us a great deal during those years is to keep lessons very short (use a timer), even if you have to break up a math lesson into parts to finish it all in a day. Two pages of math may look unbearable but if taken in 15-minute concentrated chunks it suddenly becomes do-able. Another thing is that you probably need to sit right there with them, even though there are a thousand things you could be doing from a few feet away. :grouphug:

[mommymonster]

I have two boys, and they are younger. But, yes. There are a ton of similarities in our days (Problems 1, 2 and 4 are all things I discussed with my hubby earlier this year!). A few of the things we are doing: 

 

1. Before lessons, the boys have 30 minutes outside. No matter the weather. The oldest runs around the block three to four times. The youngest runs around the driveway. They need to be huffing and puffing to get the wiggles out. After "recess," they have a snack (muffins with soy milk, etc). They have a 10 minute break every hour to run around/read.

 

2. We use videos quite a bit for science and history. I teach one child while the other watches a video on my laptop with headphones on it. One-on-one seems to work better for both kids. It also cuts down the noise.

 

3. Get DS10 tested if you think he has special challenges. You might as well know what is going on. My DS8 was having issues with learning and was throwing fits every day when it came time to do school work, so we had him tested. We were surprised to find out he had a pretty severe vision processing disorder. I'm in the camp that it is better to know and deal with issues head-on, than to wait and hope things work out, but not everyone agrees. 

 

4. For general noise, I give both boys earplugs. It at least helps them to filter out the background noise of the dog, clocks, and each other's breathing... 

 

I have found that "classroom management" is more challenging for me than teaching subjects. I would second your DH's advice in giving yourself grace as you work out the classroom flow for your school...  :grouphug:

[Lori D.]

Having DS stand at the counter where he can move and jig about while doing his math can help him focus -- removes him from the distracting window, and from distracting sounds of others, and allows movement which a LOT of students NEED in order to focus, esp. on abstract topics.

 

 

General ideas to help:

 

- start the day with 20-30 minutes *rigorous* aerobic activity to burn off excess

- be sure to eat a breakfast with protein, and then a mid-morning protein snack, for brain food for focus

- esp. for the younger 2, break up writing and math into several shorter highly focused "bursts of learning" and intersperse with physical activity for 3-5 minutes

- try playing instrumental music for background sound, which may help fill the "sound need" the 8yo has (which all his talking and sound effects may be an effort to give him the noise background level HE needs to be able to think... Some children need auditory stimulation to help them focus...)

- have tactile "fidgets" and "chewy" fidgets available to keep hands busy so bodies and mouths don't have to be (... some children need tactile input to help them focus)

- try having DC sit each on their own big yoga ball while doing seat work, which allows movement to help with focus (with the warning that misuse means the yoga ball is taken away... ;) )

- you might try some nutritional supplements (fish oil, primrose, etc.) with DC you suspect may have ADD tendancies

- remove from the diet: food dyes, sugars/sodas, processed foods, plus anything you suspect may be a food allergen and triggering ADD-like symptoms (gluten, for example)

- reduce screen time to just an hour a day, AFTER school, to be finished at least 2 hours BEFORE bed (the rapid screen re-draws are seen subliminally and trigger our brain cells, which remain active and firing for up to 2 hours after last exposure) -- that will help their brains calm down to help for getting good sleep, but will also prevent brains in the morning from being fired and bouncing around and being distracted for school

 

 

Just to encourage you: 2 DSs close in age here to distract one another ;). Plus, DS#2 having mild LDs and very distracted, very chatty (his form of self-brain-stimulation) and very physical-all-over-the-place. It took the first 4 years of homeschooling to dial in what worked for him (grades 1-4), and then the next 4 years for maturity to finally start to kick in a little bit for him (finally, about grade 9). But thank heavens we homeschooled -- he would have completely fallen through the cracks in a regular school setting; as it is, he is now a wonderful 20yo young man in his 2nd year at the community college working on a 3-year Associate's degree in Interpretation for the Deaf, and continuing to do mature and do well!

 

Hang in there! BEST of luck as your family slowly finds your way to YOUR rhythm and what works for YOU all for homeschooling. :)

[KSinNS]

Hugs!

 

Our days are always like that too. 

 

 

[happypamama]

My distractible child sets up a tablet with her favorite youtube playlist, puts her headphones on, and plows through her work. As long as the tablet's case is closed, it doesn't seem to be a problem. I couldn't focus with music in the background, but it works for her, and she seems to be understanding what she's read. Also, for Saxon math, I have her do problems 1-20 one day, then 21-30 and 1-10 of the next lesson the next day, then 11-30 of the second lesson the third day -- spreading two lessons over three days. She gets 20 done quickly, but 30 takes forever. I think Saxon is often very tedious, although thorough, and I saw remarkable improvement in attitude and completion speed when I started having her do just 20.

 

Also, Minecraft is a powerful motivator. I had been doing no screen time during the week, except for what they need to complete schoolwork, but we recently started allowing some during the week if they get their schoolwork done by a particular time. This has helped a lot; DD is highly motivated by Minecraft.