I am not a home schooler but stumbled on these boards...

[Guest Dora the Explorer]

I think this board could be a huge help to me though. My children are four years old. They were micropreemies, born 14+ weeks early in mid July. By the grace of God, their intellect does not seem to have been at all impacted by their early arrivals though I do have some concerns with executive function especially with my son. He struggles in the areas of self-regulation, persistence, and especially impulse control. The school district does not provide support if this is your child's only diagnosed issue (though we have no official diagnosis at this point). I will not be starting them in kindergarten till 2015 since had they been anywhere near term, we would not be going till then, and I hope two years will be sufficient to help my son build more solid executive function skills.

 

I had been curious to get an idea if they would qualify for a nearby district's G&T schools, and had their IQs screened (Slosson test). My son received a 154 and daughter a 150. Daughter's score was no surprise but son's was a big revelation. I had her also calculate based on due date out of curiosity and both scored the highest score, 159.

 

Before they turned three, I avoided any literacy-based television shows, but did read to them a lot and had given them "leaptops" which taught them their ABCs and sounds they make before they were 3. No other electronic gadgets. Daughter began to read before she was 3 and is reading well now (I buy Rozanne Lanczak Williams books for her and she can read the 1st/2nd grade ones with no issue). I may spend 5 minutes a week actually teaching her - she just absorbs it. Son feels like he should be able to read to and is discouraged that he is so far behind her though I tell him over and over that kids learn to read when they are ready and most kids cannot read when they are 3/4. 

 

My questions are...

 

1) Do you think it's possible for them to be engaged and happy in a kindergarten class that does not challenge them? Can I provide enough supplemental opportunities? I still haven't decided where we will move for their schooling and am nervous making a bad choice if we do not pursue the district with the G&T schools (not lottery)?

 

2) How can I help my son with all his executive function issues (common in micropreemies)? People where I live would probably think Tools of the Mind is some satanic teaching method - I can't find a program anywhere and likely could not afford it even if there were one. Can you implement elements of it at home easily with twins? Any resources for TotM or other ideas? 

 

3) Since my daughter's desire to read has been pretty much 100% self-motivated - she even reads to her brother now (in some books I do realize there is a major memorization component but she can also pick up new books and read them), how likely is it that she will continue at this pace? I understand being brilliant is not necessarily the key to a happy future but I am just so proud of them and amazed by them, all things considered. i hope to see her continue to be a shining star and for my son to overcome his delays/deficits and do the same. 

 

If there is a better forum for me please let me know - as a single mom with a demanding job there is no way I can homeschool successfully but I thought this looked like a good place for answers, based on what I have read here so far. 

 

 

Thanks!

 

 

 

 

 

 

[La Texican]

I'm not at all trying to say you can't post here. I am relatively new to this forum. This forum also includes some regular posters who send their kids to school and suplement their learning at home. I am only recommending the Davidson Gifted forum http://giftedissues.davidsongifted.org/BB/ because they have a lot of posters there who send their kids to public school and have experience with 2e or asyncronous development executive function problems. That forum moves slower, so you'll get more answers here more quickly. This is a very active forum. But that forum is active it just moves slower. They would have more advice to give on issues related to gifted kids in public schools, more experience with how to work with the school system to meet your childs needs, and how to help your child adjust in the school setting. I learned this there: the national institute of mental health has done research using brain imaging devices that shows that the cortex in the brain thickens later in gifted children. That is the same development that causes executive function delays in ADHD kids. It thickens around age seven for normally developing kids, nine for ADD kids, and age eleven for highly gifted kids.

 

http://www.nimh.nih.gov/news/science-news/2006/cortex-matures-faster-in-youth-with-highest-iq.shtml

 

http://www.nimh.nih.gov/news/science-news/2007/brain-matures-a-few-years-late-in-adhd-but-follows-normal-pattern.shtml

[Guest Dora the Explorer]

Thanks - I will check the other board out. Sounds like it may be of great help. That is interesting re cortical thickness. My kids are already shortchanged there since micropreemie brains are structurally different from term babies even at age 8 (not sure abut beyond that but apparently there is hope for improvement). I don't specifically know my kids' measurements but the study I read was sobering. I thought we'd miraculously managed to escape any long term preemie-related issues but this one is just really starting to rear its ugly head as he gets older. It's frustrating that something as important as executive function is not in and of itself important enough to the school district to want to help address it now rather than wait till it causes my son to struggle in a formal classroom setting. :/ Thank you again for the other resource!

[Dmmetler]

I'd also suggest, in a couple of years, applying to Davidson for their young scholars program. Your kids won't be eligible until age 5, and you'll need different testing at that point, but it sounds like your kids would qualify, and the services may really help if you're having to work with a school system.

 

In my area, there's a window of opportunity before your child enters school that a parent can request testing and get a GT IEP set up. Otherwise, they won't test until 3rd grade or if there's problems at school-and usually that won't happen just for GT. Basically, you've got from age 4 to age 5-otherwise you've missed it. It doesn't mean they'll do much-but it's a place to at least start.

 

 

Good luck!

[Rachel]

I can't speak to all of your questions, but #3, as far as continuing at the same pace with reading, I think it really depends on the kid.  I only have one reader so far, but he learned with very little instruction at age 5 and quickly advanced to being able to read pretty much anything over the course of 6-8 months.  He loves to read and spends every moment he can reading.  Just this weekend he grabbed one of my books off the shelf because he was out of his own reading material.

 

I have watched many of my friend's kids who don't mind reading, but don't love it, progress at a much slower rate.  I'm not sure if that is common, but I do think my 3 year old will be that way.

[ThatHomeschoolDad]

I can only speak to #1. DD tested as MG and was bored silly in public school K. We pulled her after that year. That being said, we know PG parents who make school work with large doses of afterschooling, but they do seem to share common complaints about continually having to push districts hard to get what they need.

 

As for moving, I always meet new HSers who moved to our expensive part of NJ for the top rated schools and wound up pulling their kids out. I don't think there is a geographical panacea.

[bakpak]

#3   From what I've read on here, the reading frenzy that you're referring to will likely not slow down. I'd just keep putting fun books in front of them, at all different levels. Your son's interest in reading will likely be all that's needed to allow him to catch up soon enough (in the next few months or year or two, folks describe both). My DD4 is a reading fool right now, and she just keeps pushing ahead, I honestly can't imagine her slowing down due to her interest level and persistence. She's been interested in books from the get go and hasn't slowed down. That initial stage of learning to blend was the slowest time in my mind as it takes awhile to click and then read with speed. There's also the hump of larger amounts of text on a page that seems to be a developmental breakthrough. For example, my DD can read all the words of a Magic Tree House book and will read a passages to me, but isn't quite ready to commit to that level of effort quite yet that a full book requires.

 

One thing I did with my DD when she was slower at blending and when reading CVC words was doable but still hard work, was to go over some more advanced phonics rules (-ay, -ing, th-, ch-, silent e, etc) with her instead of continuing to practice blending just short vowel words. This was short and sweet and she absorbed the rules easily with little repetition. This meant that when she was developmentally ready to read (blending and stringing words together), she already knew what many of the common letter combos meant.  It might be a different track you could try with your son for awhile instead of practicing more reading. I found that taking a break from practicing reading with my daughter, then coming back to it 3-4 weeks later, was all that was needed for her to zoom ahead.  During that time I did LOTS of reading to her with my finger following the words. I think that period of quiet absorption really helped.

 

Sounds like you have fun kids!  I worry about putting my DD in public school too, even though I know they have decent G&T programs in this county. Fortunately we moved this year and there's a nice Montessori school here that goes to 6th grade that I can (barely) afford. I'm hoping this will stay a good fit for her. The math available for her K year will go up to 4th grade concepts, so that's reassuring at least! I can't imagine NOT supplementing at home no matter where she is.

 

Hope that helps!

[quark]

 

2) How can I help my son with all his executive function issues (common in micropreemies)? People where I live would probably think Tools of the Mind is some satanic teaching method - I can't find a program anywhere and likely could not afford it even if there were one. Can you implement elements of it at home easily with twins? Any resources for TotM or other ideas? 

 

3) Since my daughter's desire to read has been pretty much 100% self-motivated - she even reads to her brother now (in some books I do realize there is a major memorization component but she can also pick up new books and read them), how likely is it that she will continue at this pace? I understand being brilliant is not necessarily the key to a happy future but I am just so proud of them and amazed by them, all things considered. i hope to see her continue to be a shining star and for my son to overcome his delays/deficits and do the same. 

 

If there is a better forum for me please let me know - as a single mom with a demanding job there is no way I can homeschool successfully but I thought this looked like a good place for answers, based on what I have read here so far. 

 

Thanks!

 

#2: I wrote a little about our executive function challenges and solutions used here. Type in executive function in the forum search box and you'll get lots of results. You can specify the search to the accelerated board too. Son was actually overdue, not a preemie, but had significant EF issues as a youngster and is gradually overcoming them now at 11.

 

#3: I don't see any slowing down. I haven't seen any leveling off either (son's IQ is >99.9% on the WISC4). He keeps wanting more and more challenging stuff to read. It will at some point get difficult to balance reading appetite with age appropriate material but at 4yo, you're still some ways off from that.

 

And about #1, I agree with ThatHomeschoolDad. Families we know who moved specifically to better school districts for GT programs, and even the private/ alternative gifted schools eventually pulled their kids out to homeschool. There are others who make it work but supplement heavily or just address the day-to-day emotional stuff, hoping that this will help the kids handle the academic boredom a little better.

 

Welcome to the boards! Good luck!

 

[ThatHomeschoolDad]

#3 -- We do  tend to accumulate tote bags to use at the library.  The best part is when the staff there gets to know your kid by name.  That's nothing but a good thing.

[boscopup]

#1) There's certainly a chance of being happy in Kindergarten. My oldest enjoyed Kindergarten, even though the only thing he learned there was how to write. He was reading at a mid-2nd grade level at the start of K, so the teacher sent home 2nd grade reading textbooks instead of those little pamphlet readers with CVC words in them. He was also very comfortable with addition and subtraction and figured out multiplication, but the teacher didn't do anything there (they used Saxon K), and I didn't do anything at home that year, but we did continue with math discussions while driving in the van. He'd come up with something and we would talk about it. One day, such a discussion led to introducing negative numbers on a napkin (which has now become tradition in my household - when you turn 5, you learn negative numbers :D). Anyway, in school, Kindergarten was a party all the time. They did so much "fun stuff" that it didn't matter that my son knew the academic stuff. He did get in trouble a bit the first semester for talking (and this is not a child that talks much - he's fairly introverted). That was when the class was learning letter sounds, so he was pretty bored during that. Once most of the kids were reading CVC words (2nd semester), he enjoyed the class more. Boredom didn't really hit until 1st grade, when the atmosphere changed from party-all-the-time to school-work-all-the-time. He was still ahead (now reading at a 4th grade level and zooming ahead in math), though his writing was lagging behind. His "journal" for 1st grade contained a lot of copied prompts with no writing after the prompt. He couldn't just move up to 2nd grade, as the writing would have killed him and the reading/math still would have been too easy. Now this was a small private school, not a public school with access to gifted programs and such. You might actually have a better experience with a school that has more resources to deal with gifted children. Though around here, gifted programs don't start until 3rd grade and they will NOT test or do anything before that. That will obviously vary from state to state and district to district.

 

#2) I don't really understand executive function, so no help here. My oldest was a 29 weeker preemie, but not a micropreemie (he was the size of a 31 weeker). He has had zero academic issues from being a preemie. I do suspect some low tone, which affects writing. Of all my kids, he's had the hardest time with the physical act of writing. He's come a long way though. Playing hockey and being a goalie has helped with that issue, I think. He's building his core strength.

 

#3) Hit the library every 1-2 weeks. Bring bags. My oldest progressed very quickly in reading. He went from not able to blend a CVC word to reading at a mid-1st grade level in an instant. 6 months later, he was mid-2nd grade level. The next year, he was 4th grade level, and when I pulled him from school and taught him syllabication, his reading jumped up into middle school range. At this point, he can read anything, and he can read it faster than I can. He got a Kindle for his birthday this year, and I try to put books on there as often as I can, though I think we've run out of books on Overdrive. :tongue_smilie: He always has a pile of books in the van, and he can be entertained for hours with a stack of books. If he has to wait somewhere (like going to his dad's mini-corps rehearsal), he brings his Kindle or a good, long chapter book. He'll sit and read the whole time. It's quite helpful. Don't need electronic babysitters for this one! :D

[shawthorne44]

You can definitely do Tools of the Mind at home.  From what I have read, it is critical that the teacher be clued in to precisely where each student is in their development.  Which means an exceptional teacher or an average mother.  Amazon has some books on Tools of the Mind.  I like the one with a dark cover.  The basic idea with 3-year-olds is to work towards play for longer time periods at the same thing, for the play to more involved and for the play to be preplanned by the child. 

There is a pre-K section, and an afterschoolers section here. 

[Uff Da!]

nm

 

 

[SKL]

I'm also a single, working mom of two who are close in age.  (Mine were adopted and their birthdays are 3 months apart.)  Although my kids were not premies (as far as I know), they spent their first 9 mos / 12 mos in a non-English-speaking developing country, and at least one of them was likely malnourished in the womb.  So not exactly the same, but I can relate to your issues somewhat.

 

I should note that both of my kids tend to be calm, quiet, and rule-abiding.  Neither has had a problem with the physical behavior requirements of school - sitting quietly, taking turns, etc.  We've had temporary issues but nothing long-term.

 

Miss E was like your twins - she "absorbed" without formal teaching, and around her 4th birthday could read books she had never seen before.  Once she started being able to read whole books she really took off, and I started feeling that she needed to be accelerated, even though she has a January birthday.  I just couldn't see her waiting for years before reading became relevant in school.  We don't have gifted/talented schools around here, or that might have been an option.  She is now in 2nd grade (will be 7 in January) and she still loves books.  The other day my sister asked her what gives her joy, and her single response was "reading."  Her reading level (per tests) has not increased at the same rate over the years (likely because of age-related comprehension/experience limitations), but she's still about three years ahead of her age-mates per tests, and can read anything she wants to read.  For her, acceleration was 100% the right decision.  The only decision in my mind.

 

Miss A seems bright (to me) but has multiple learning issues.  Vision, auditory processing, retained reflexes, and sensory issues have come to light so far.  She is a capable learner but not a good listener.  She began reading slightly before her 5th birthday.  Her birthday was 10 days after the state cutoff and her school recommended that I accelerate her, so I did.  I didn't want her in a lower grade than her younger sister.  Because she has trouble processing information the way it's taught in school (primary grades at least), she has to spend significant time at home learning things her way - by reading, thinking, and using hands-on materials.  Although her learning is on a reasonable track, and her behavior (other than listening) is grade-appropriate, I still get grief for the fact that she is young for her grade.

 

If I were you and had two gifted kids and the availability of a gifted program, I would push to get them into the gifted KG in 2015.  But if they cannot get into the gifted KG in 2015, I'm not sure what I would do.  It is a hard decision when you have two kids, one of whom is more than ready, one of whom is iffy.  I don't regret my decision, but not everyone would have welcomed the amount of work we've had to do.  I could also say there has been a fair amount of stress over Miss A's challenges.  However, I believe that if I'd put my kids in KG a year later, I would have had just as much stress over Miss E being bored out of her skull.  I think that as the mom, only you can predict which situation will be most manageable for your family.

 

As for your son's learning/behavior concerns, I suggest that you have him evaluated for retained reflexes and vision problems, both of which might be more common in premies, and both of which can be addressed through therapy.

[EinsteinBlueprint]

"no way I can homeschool"???

 

How do you know?  Plenty of single parents do so.

 

Quite frankly the amount of hands-on teaching necessary is far, far less than most everyone thinks.

 

My kids have lists of assignments to do everyday.  They use websites and software.  They take classes with other homeschooled kids.  They have private instructors for piano, chess, origami, and spanish.  And they are only 7 and 8 years old.

Where there's a will...there's a way.

 

Henry Ford said, "Whether you think you can or think you can't....you're right."

 

When parents tell me, "Oh....I could NEVER do what you do.  I could NEVER homeschool."

 

I fire back, "Well, I could NEVER send my kids to school.  I could NEVER put up with all that nonsense...", etc.

[SKL]

"no way I can homeschool"???

 

How do you know?  Plenty of single parents do so.

 

I did when my kids were little - in the evenings.  But they were in daycare during the day.  There aren't daycares for neurotypical kids past KG age, and that's still young to be independent for long hours.  Depending on one's job one would likely have to hire someone to be with the kids for large chunks of time, in addition to finding opportunities for them to be with other kids.  Ultimately for most of us it makes more sense to send them to school, and do what we can with them outside of business hours.

 

Last year, substantively, I was homeschooling Miss A (in the evenings) because she wasn't really learning the 3Rs in school.  But she attended school, because I work long hours, and having her sit around at home wasn't the way to meet her needs.  One therapist did suggest that I hire someone to work with her during the day, but she was enjoying the social aspects of school, so I let it be.  I would also note that even our private school tuition is cheaper than a private tutor would be.

 

[swellmomma]

While 3 of my kids were preemies none were micro preemies BUT my 2 boys do have executive functioning issues that we are still struggling with.  My ds10 is coming along finally, but ds15 still lacks them and it is a struggle.  For him I am looking at a program from linguasystems to work through with him.  My kids are not G/T, but they are bright enough.  oldest if he had the attention span long than a gnat it would help, he is a smart boy but doesn't like anything that he perceives to be too hard and therefore sabotages his own ability.  ds10 has a long list of learning issues that hold him back in some areas but that kid has insight and forms connection between things quite well.  dd6 never feels she has been taught/learned enough and quite often is angry with me for not teaching her 24/7 the way she wants.

 

Now dd14 was my only non-preemie, when she was first hitting school age I put her and ds15 into public school (they are less than 11 months apart so very close in age).  She knew how to read before kindy, grasped math easily, could read and guage people quite well etc.  Kindergarten was so-so for her.  She was bored often with the seat work, she was expected to do the same work as teh other kids, learning the letter sounds, and writing them, then writing simple sight words etc.  Math focused for a long time on patterning, counting etc and she was beyond that.  She enjoyed music time, art, fieldtrips, drama etc.  But her boredom of the seat work got her into trouble often.  It got to the point were she started refusing to do what was being taught, they would be getting ready to do phonics and she would decline and announce she was going to go read a book instead etc and the teacher would haul her down to the office for disobedience.  First grade got worse.  By first grade she decided it was better to play dumb and mess with the teachers head.  She had her 1st grade teacher convinced that she could not read or write at all, that I would not do the home reading with her etc.  She would come home from school and pick up where she left off in little house on the prairie etc.  Teacher was phoning home and booking conferences to scold me all the time until I videotaped dd and showed her, that shut her up.  However that was not the end of it.  DD decided all school work was boring and started to refuse to do all of it, she would be sent home with all of her work from the day to do at home and she decided to expand her fun reading and manipulating people.  For example, at recess she convinced the little boys to carry her from place to place so she wouldn't get sand in her shoes, she played the helpless girl for a longtime and everyone bought it hook, line and sinker.  The teacher/principal were not too happy with her, they started punishing her insolence (aka silent protests) with daily detention, no recesses, no gym class, no fieldtrips, 1 suspension to no avail.  She would not do the work there, she was bored stiff.  Anyway at the end of grade 1 I brought her home to homeschool, by then her desire to just learn more and more was gone, she had learned to put forth the least output as possible and to not bother. I started homeschooling her for gr 2 just 1 month after her 7th birthday.  Skip forward 7 years to now at 14.  She spent several years getting rid of that whole helpless damsel stuff and is a headstrong, physically strong take no guff kind of girl (more tomboy than girlie).  For years she still allowed her potential to slide by attempting to do the least possible work.  Last year about 1/2 way through 7th grade (I had her do 5th grade twice to allow for some maturity/EF skills to develop) she suddenly had her light bulb moment of "I can do this work now, graduate early and get on with my life" and it changed everything.  Instead of continuing to allow herself to do the least possible work with the least possible energy used, she is surging ahead, quickly catching up and surpassing grade level.  This year I registered her in 9th grade getting her back on track to where she would be if I had not made her do 5th twice, but she is doing grade 10/11 work.  Based on her own goals she will graduate at 16.  Before her epiphany last year she was only working at a grade 4-6 level depending on the course because of the pace she set herself at, in the 6 months since that, she has jumped 4-6 grade levels in nearly everything (math is lagging, but she will be at grade level by the end of this year).  SHe was always very smart, but she had learned in her years at school to hide that away, it made her feel better in school.  Kids thought she was "cool" for doing her own thing, she didn't want to stand out just for smarts, now she is seeing the benefit in being smart. Had I known then what I know now I never would have put her in public school to begin with.  They don't have G/T programs here, starting in 4th grade the smartest kids get a once a week pull out of class enrichiment program, but that's it and nothing before hand.  I was spending so much time making sure she got her homework done each day there wasn't enough time left to challenge and accelerate her afterschool. She allowed herself to squander years worth of potential after only 2 year in school conditioning herself to fill a certain role.

Anyway I share her story because I don't think it is that rare of a tale for a bright student trying to fit in with the other kids in public school and find their own niche.  Back then I thought I had no option but to put my kids into public school, I have been a single mom for over 12 years now, I thought there was no way I could homeschool as a result.  It's funny how seeing 1 kid stop trying and the other plan his suicide at 7 yrs old because he felt too stupid for school suddenly changes what you think you can do.  I homeschool all 4 of my kids as a single mom.  My job may not be as demanding as yours, but my life in general is.  I work outside the home 3 days a week(2 of them weekends), I am the secretary of the board set to raise 100K to build a new water splash park(which means many meetings and other work to raise funds, apply for grants etc); I am vice chair of the cadet parent committee, I am a sparks leader, I attend bible study, I take my kids to all their things and stay at them to watch, I have a 2nd job writing study guides and a recurring gig writing articles for my homeschool board magazine.  So I certainly do not have a life of just being a SAHM with a husband out making the money and big spaces of free time.  with the oldest having such EF issues, plus learning issues and mood struggles, then dd now suddenly being eager to learn all, ds10 having a long list of learning issues, and dd6 being an insistant sponge it is not easy.  But then things worth doing right seldom are. 

Anyway all of that to say, you will do what works for your children/family, just don't assume you could never homeschool just because you are a working single mother.  Where there is a will there is a way, so if it is what you want to do, OR if you start in ps and see it is not a good fit for one or both kids don't think you don't have the option of teaching them at home, that option is always there.  It may not be a conventional schedule of 9-3 to fit it around your work schedule etc but it is still very doable with some resourcefulness, planning, and sheer will power.

[Kathy G]

I highly recommend you check out Davidson's also.  Once you are eligible and accepted you will get into the facebook private sites and the boards they have.  The facebook sites are sometimes what keeps me sane.  These will probably be of more help to you with profoundly gifted kiddos.  My older 2 did fine in kindergarten because they went half day and then came home and we went more in depth.  I work outside the home and didn't ever want to homeschool either.  I call myself the reluctant homeschool mom.  However 4 years into homeschooling it is a much better fit for us.  We would have had very depressed kids in the school system.  There is often no way to make the modifications they need unless you have a unique school. 

 

 

[jenbrdsly]

Personally, I had a horrible experience on the Davidson boards.  (Hopefully the moderation has improved since then.)

 

You don't need to be a homeschooler to add your two cents or ask questions here. Welcome to HIVE!