ok, I'm putting this out there, need help with 11 y/o struggling reader.

[nukeswife]

This morning we've started school again since takin off for the holidays. After about half way through our lessons I've realized that Annika is still very behind in her reading ability. She's made great strides from last year due to her vision therapy,(which she was in for 40 weeks and graduated back in July) but she's still very behind where peers her age are. She turned 11 in Nov and is probably at a low 3rd grade reading level. Her comprehension is through the roof, she just can't read the stuff herself. We started GWG 4 this morning and reading the directions and some of the sentences was pretty tough for her. So now I wonder do I bother with grammar for her or do I just make her read/read/read for LA class. The girl can write legibly so penmanship isn't needed, She also wants to start SWI-A which I let her but I know it will be a slow process, with me mostly reading the sources to her and helping her with a lot of spelling of words. She is doing AAS without much trouble (she's almost done with level 2. She knows most of her phonograms, but for some reason when reading, things just seem to clamp down and the phonogram knowledge just doesn't transfer through.

 

Any words of wisdom for a mama who feels she totally failed her daughter in this area because she kept thinking it was a matter of her being a late bloomer in reading. I know we have a lot of work to do, but please also keep in mind I have two others to educate here, one older that is going to be starting high school in the fall and a younger who is also learning to read (but he seems to not have any trouble in this area and is just chugging along in his program)

[mo2]

I have a 10yo struggling reader. She has made a lot of progress lately but still has a long way to go. I think she reads by whole word recognition and guesses by context clues if she doesn't know a word. I truly believe that AAS has helped her more than anything to this point, and we are only in level 2 of AAS, with a few steps remaining. One thing I have decided to do is add an old-fashioned reader, like the Harriette Taylor Treadwell readers, and have her read aloud to me daily. I'm going to purposely start with a level that is too easy, probably the primer, to work on fluency.

 

I don't have much advice for you regarding actual reading instruction. I've never been able to afford Barton or any of hte programs like that. I think we're just going to keep plugging away with AAS and practice, practice, practice. I'm interested to hear what suggestions others may have.

 

Best of luck to you.

[nukeswife]

MO2,

I remember you being in basically the same spot as me. I plan to keep going with AAS 2, and I will have her read to me daily. I let her pick books on her own and the current one she picked is "The Dragons of Wayward Crescent" book 1. I think I saw on the scholastic site that it's reading level 4.3 which made me really proud that she picked such a high level book for herself. It's been slow going, but she's doing it. I really just don't know if it's worth it to do grammar and writing now or if it would be better to do something else.

[Cynful]

Since you are already using it, I'd continue with AAS. I think you need another level or two to really see how it's working for her. I'd also suggest having her read as much as you can at her level or even easier than her level. The more automaticity she can have with what she knows, the better. She may need something else like Barton, but I'd give AAS some more time first. My oldest still struggles and we are using Barton, but quite honestly, I wish we had just stuck it out with AAS in the first place.

 

Good luck,

[Cynful]

Oh, I would forget the grammar and writing or just do it lightly for a while so you can concentrate on AAS - maybe work on AAS twice per day instead of once.

[mo2]

MO2,

I remember you being in basically the same spot as me. I plan to keep going with AAS 2, and I will have her read to me daily. I let her pick books on her own and the current one she picked is "The Dragons of Wayward Crescent" book 1. I think I saw on the scholastic site that it's reading level 4.3 which made me really proud that she picked such a high level book for herself. It's been slow going, but she's doing it. I really just don't know if it's worth it to do grammar and writing now or if it would be better to do something else.

 

I don't know what to do about grammar and writing, either. We started IEW SWI-A but it is very slow going, and she hates it. I'm thinking of backtracking to copywork and narration for awhile. We're not currently doing anything formal for grammar; I am just correcting her writing as we go.

[Cynful]

 

I don't know what to do about grammar and writing, either. We started IEW SWI-A but it is very slow going, and she hates it. I'm thinking of backtracking to copywork and narration for awhile. We're not currently doing anything formal for grammar; I am just correcting her writing as we go.

 

 

I think copywork and narration is perfect for struggling readers. I know it has really helped my son. I wish I could say more definitively which aspect is working the best, but since he's 15, I've pulled out all the stops and we're doing overkill right now (basically I'm over-teaching EVERYTHING).

[Silver_Kitten]

My daughter struggles with reading out loud, but personal reading she just started getting better at last year. I let her pick books she wanted, most were diary type books and manga, now she is reading whole chapter books for fun. This year she is doing more reading in history and science and her writing is starting to fall in to place as well. We are using Hake 6 for grammar and WWS for writing, which I've stopped at the moment to let her free write since she wants to. We are using AAS and are in Level 2 as well, it goes well, but slow. It's frustrating and a bit daunting to let go and let the child move at their own pace and see how far they come in a year, but that's what I did for reading and writing, and she is now wanting to work on it. If I could only get her to do that for handwriting.

[A home for their hearts]

Have you heard of QuickReads? I would try these with her to help build fluency. My ds12 is a struggling reader as well and I have these are our shelf to use with him. We are getting ready to leave so I'll post more later.

[Ellie]

Spalding. :-)

[nukeswife]

thanks all. I'm starting to wonder if what she really needs is practice. Like I said she knows the phonograms but the actual act of reading out loud is hard for her. She will read to herself as well, but I don't know if she's actually getting all the words right when she does read. We've only done one day of SWI-A so we'll try it for a couple weeks with lots of help from me with the reading and writing. I think I might shelve GWG for now. I have the PDF of FLL 2, I suppose I could do that for her grammar since it's mostly orally done anyway.

 

Oh and she loves AAS, so I wouldn't take that away. She hates the tiles, so we just do things that you'd use the tiles for other ways. Now if they would just put out that darn app they said they were working on we'd be all set there.

[farmgal]

I'm listening in on this one! I have a 9 yr. old in the same boat. We have used Spalding. I'm tired, he is tired. Yes, it is getting better. But, geez!!!

[momto2Cs]

Practice, practice, practice. That's what am doing with my dd9, and it seems to be helping. I only have her doing copywork and narrations for writing, plus we're working through The Sentence Family together for grammar, but no formal writing program until her reading improves.

 

We're using a combo of Explode the Code, Beyond the Code, Reading Pathways, and I just ordered a (used) copy of a Quickreads book (mentioned above), plus readers and I Can Read books. Just lots of daily practice. I do break it up into chunks... we'll do ETC and Beyond, then math or I read aloud, then she'll practice with one of the other options, and she'll usually do a eader at bedtime before I read to her.

[ChicoryChick]

My 9.5yo is a struggling reader and I am really proud of the progress he has made this past year. He has gone from a K level reader at the beginning of last year (barely doing CVC words) to a 3rd grade reading level. (He is now in 4th grade)

 

Grammar wise I have found FLL to be a good fit since I do a majority of the reading and he only has to read a few sentences. When a child is a struggling reader I believe that reading should be the main focus, I have found; however, that FLL and WWE have just the right amount of grammar and writing focus for his level without causing him to be further behind in those subjects. Each only taking about 10 -15 minutes each and you can alternate the days you do those subjects so as not to overwhelm the child with LA. I would still do AAs everyday as I do believe it helps with reading.

 

HTH

[La Texican]

Can she sit in your lap when she reads so you can hold the book and use your own finger to point to the words for her to help train her eyes. Sometimes correct her, sometimes don't. When she skips or misreads a word sometimes just give her a hint only, sometimes say "no, try again", sometimes just tell her the word. Sometimes when she's reading good and messes up a word, but is saying the content ignore the skipped word. Sometimes if she seems to have slipped into decoding rather than following what she just said you can bring her back up to speed quickly by saying the last sentence she read smoothly and the next word or two she needs to read and then pointing to the word after that, clearly expecting her to take over reading again.

This is what I remember from this summer when my son worked his way from reading to reading fluently. I think reading (whatever can be read comfortably in one sitting) three times a week is imo a good goal. I'm pasting a picture of a page from 101 Dalmations to suggest that Little Golden Books are great for practicing reading. The type is small and closely spaced so your eyes get used to it, but the pages are interesting, colorful, and easy on the eyes.

[La Texican]

http://image0-rubylane.s3.amazonaws.com/shops/kitschandcouture/KC-04406.6L.jpg

 

okay. My pictures don't paste here. Another tip is reading togeather outloud if you can get two copies of something. I have read with my son like that when I found out we had two copies of The Poky Little Puppie, also when they sent two copies of Science Spin. From what I remember kids at school do this at some point, read aloud a short story togeather, so it's a teaching tool.

[nukeswife]

We do read together, but she can't sit on my lap. I know she's only 11 but she's also as tall as me and almost 100lbs. She was doing lots of picture book reading, but wanted more chapter books/big kid books. Thanks for all your input. I will have to do a lot of thinking on it.

[MerryAtHope]

I was there (except I didn't start AAS until my son was 11, and didn't do vision therapy with him until he was nearly 13...so you've got a head start on us there). Personally I'd drop the grammar (but then, I don't do grammar and writing daily either--I either do units of one or the other, or switch off year by year.)

 

You are doing the right thing by making sure to have her continue practice reading with you in addition to her independent reading. Kids who have struggled with reading often learn to compensate by guessing from context--I found my son had amazing comprehension but couldn't read a list of unrelated words very well at all. So, it's important to keep working on reading strategies with her.

 

Can she read the AAS 2 words without having to sound them out? If not, use the word cards and the Word banks for fluency practice until she's really got those down.

 

She's got a long way to go with using a lot of the phonograms, even though you said she's learned them up front--AAS 3-5 will continue introducing them, and you may find those word cards and banks helpful in building up fluency. Instead of just having her read the banks when scheduled, have her read them daily until she can read them without sounding out.

 

AAS 3 and up also do a lot more work with syllables, which really helps with reading longer words. If you have any of the upper levels of AAS, you could consider going through some lessons just for reading practice, and then go back through later for spelling practice. For reading you would have her practice breaking the words into syllables and reading them, read the word cards and word banks, plus the dictations, but you wouldn't have her do all of the spelling and writing.

 

Have you ever looked at AAR 1? (No, I'm not saying she needs to do it :-) ). But the readers are set up in a unique way--instead of putting line breaks when there's no more room for text, the readers are phrased. This really helps with fluent reading, and if she's not familiar with the idea of breaking a sentence down into meaningful phrases, it might really help.

 

For some kids, reading aloud is more difficult than reading silently because of working memory issues. If that's the case for her, you might have her read a paragraph silently first, and then read it aloud to you so that she can hold several words or a phrase in her mind as she tries to say it. Kids who struggle with working memory may only be able to read one or two words at a time instead of reading ahead, holding a chunk in mind, and then saying it. This means that it's doubly hard for them to track with what they are reading aloud.

 

If you see that phrasing is difficult for her, spend some time working on that each day by breaking up some sentences and writing them on the white board, one phrase per line (or write on paper if she prefers that).

 

If chunking a word into syllables is difficult for her, work on that. I know she doesn't like the tiles, so you can write words for her to divide and then read. Do some directed activities for at least 5 minutes each day to help her work on these skills, and then have her read to you. During her reading time, focus on the things you practiced (whether reviewing a phonogram and words that use it, or syllabication etc...) If you know what she'll read ahead of time, pre-teach the passage by writing individual words or phrases, and talking through what strategies to use to read them. Then when she reads the passage, they'll be familiar.

 

If she doesn't yet read all of the AAS 2 words fluently, you might look at AAR 2.

 

HTH some! Merry :-)

[nukeswife]

Thanks Merry,

 

Yes she can read all the AAS2 words and word banks easily.

 

I'm now really confused with this child. She sat down to read with us from her book. This is what she was able to read to us, and her fluency was good with a few stumbles on the words I underlined.

 

In one or two places along the shelves, several dragons let out a hrr. With the tip of her little finger, Liz broke off a tiny piece of ice and brought it into the open air. It glinted in the light of her gooseneck lamp. She handed the box back to Lucy, who immediately closed the lid. Lucy gulped and held her breath as her mom put the ice on the end of the dragon's snout. Within seconds, it had melted and run inside his trumpet-shaped nostrils. Mrs. Pennykettle smiled and carefully twisted the turntable around until the new dragon was facing the dragon named Guinevere. "Time to go," Liz said in a quiet voice, and guided Lucy toward the door. From the doorway, Lucy took a quick glance back. Guinevere had opened her eyes. They were radiant and purple and shining with fire. Lucy clamped her hands to her chest and whispered, "Please make him the best guard dragon ever, Guinivere." "Go, " said Liz, softly but firmly. And Lucy dared not argue. She blew the new dragon a heartfelt kiss and closed the door of the Dragons' Den.

 

It took her about 12 minutes to read that passage. When I asked her why she had such a hard time reading her grammar instructions and page she said "Well it's not fun like reading a story" So I think we may not have the reading issues I thought. Obviously there is some work to do, but not nearly as much as I thought. I mean she was stumbling on things like "The big black bird flew to the nest" earlier today.

 

Thanks again for all your help. I guess maybe since it's not as bad as I thought and what we really need is just practice. I've thought of going through the AAS books in a fashion where we'd do the lesson for reading and just read the word cards and sentences and learn to break apart words into syllables for reading. I guess I'll have to think on that a little and see what I can come up with.

[Chloe]

My 10yo 4th grader is a struggling reader and speller. He had vision therapy for 20 weeks, which helped only slightly. The good thing is that he really loves to read and has good comprehension. I dropped the reading aloud over the past summer and just let him read lots of lower-level books (Magic Tree House, Encyclopedia Brown, Homer Price, etc.). He just took off. Now he's reading books at late fourth and fifth grade levels (currently on a Roald Dahl kick) and can tell me all about them in great detail. His reading aloud is still painfully slow and he still has trouble decoding some words. Also, his spelling is atrocious. I haven't started grammar with him at all because of his reading and spelling issues and don't plan to until next year, 5th grade. I just bought Apples and Pears to use for spelling and will have him read to me daily from a book at a lower reading level than what he reads to himself. I also plan to continue with cursive copywork for handwriting practice. My dilemma is whether or not to continue with WWE or to hold off on that until next year when, hopefully, his reading and spelling will be more on track. We just started it with book 2 a couple of months ago. The dictation is painful because of his spelling issues. Anyway, yes, I think it's a good idea to hold off on formal grammar in order to concentrate on the reading issues.

[Pen]

She is reading at about 15 words per minute, it looks like on the dragon passage, which is very slow (not "fluent"). That suggests that if the interest is high enough, she can make her way through something like the passage you gave, but cannot do so in a way that makes reading at her level easy yet. Also a story is not only more fun, but can be easier because the characters and all become familiar and it may be easier to use context to help with words. To me it does sound like a reading problem. I agree that practice is the main thing needed, but some practice is more helpful than others. Particularly I found practice that cements the basic CVC, CCVC etc. patterns, blends etc. so that at least those are not a problem to be extremely helpful.

 

Your dd may be beyond this stage, but my ds, who had similarly very high comprehension but decoding/fluency trouble, was most helped by High Noon Books Sound Out Chapter books and their reading intervention program. It was very stepwise going through the basic phonetic patterns with lots of practice (we did the books 3 times each, often aloud, and did passages in the intervention book timed till he got into target range for age/grade) till they became easy (fluent). The Chapter books have a big-kid feel and look (often with teen characters) that did not seem embarrassing to him even in a public waiting room--by age 11, that would probably be very important to your dd too. Their specialty is "high interest/low level" readers and have much material for children in your dd's age range still struggling with reading--mysteries and so on. And they are particularly strong on shoring up fluency in the basic areas. (I did not, however, so much like their simplified classics, which seemed too simplified--and decided to wait on such books till originals could be read, although I have seen HN listed in some of the dyslexia books for having easier to read versions of classics. While for my ds that was not so helpful, it could be that for your dd, it would be. By "classics" I mean more things like, say, Shakespeare simplified or Treasure Island--not the Iliad.)

 

He also got to hear audio books with professional readers so he had a good sense of what excellent fluent oral reading would sound like.

 

At the same time, we also did practice by letting him read whatever interested him (as you are doing). And much practice did all come together bit by bit into becoming a good reader. Sometimes he read on the phone to older relatives (something that might help you when you are working with the other 2).

 

 

At some point in all this, he just took off rapidly, and, after a bunch of Percy Jackson, Harry Potter etc., is now taking science fiction / Star Wars books out from the young adult section at the library. I offer this to you to say there is light at end of tunnel, and it is usually easier (reading specialists tell me) to deal with decoding/fluency issues than limited comprehension. I also had let things be delayed (we were in Waldorf which delays reading), and then regretted it when he turned out to have trouble, and there was a huge gap between interest and abilities which made remediation more difficult. But it did resolve last year in one year of intense reading work, and he went from way way behind to getting the second top reading score for his grade in the place he did his standardized testing last year.

 

If she likes the IEW, I'd definitely let her do it. Is there any way that the 13 year old could help with the reading in it to lessen your load? I tried to get my ds to work on writing, grammar etc. before reading was solid and think it was a waste of time--but if initiated by the child, I think it would be a reason to do it.

[MerryAtHope]

It took her about 12 minutes to read that passage. When I asked her why she had such a hard time reading her grammar instructions and page she said "Well it's not fun like reading a story" So I think we may not have the reading issues I thought. Obviously there is some work to do, but not nearly as much as I thought. I mean she was stumbling on things like "The big black bird flew to the nest" earlier today.

 

 

The variability in ability (easy one time, hard another) like you saw today was common here too. Plus, it IS easier to focus and concentrate on things we are interested in--and much harder to slog through content that we really don't care about.

 

Another thing to keep in mind is that fiction offers a lot of context clues that non-fiction and short passages (such as grammar instructions) do not offer. Have her read her instructions and test questions out loud to you, and help her with any parts she struggles with to round out the picture of her reading struggles. That's another reason to have her read things like the AAS word banks or other lists you might have, especially lists of unrelated words. Then you can really see how strong her decoding skills are, and how much she's relying on the context of a story for comprehension.

[Rod Everson]

My first suggestion is to make sure you're doing the vision exercises that you should have been assigned to do at the end of vision therapy. These are essentially maintenance exercises, so that the gains during vision therapy are retained. I say that because the struggling one part of the day and not the other are more indicative of the vision issues still cropping up, perhaps when she's tired, or has been doing close work for a while, etc. It's surprising how many people don't follow through with them, especially after spending a lot of money on the therapy to get vision skills in place. I've always told parents that eventually just doing a lot of reading will maintain the skills, but for a time the exercises are very important for maintaining the gains from vision therapy.

 

My second suggestion is to take a look at the Multisyllable Decoding Method on my website. I taught struggling readers for over a decade, up until recently, and during the last half of that decade I usually worked with kids after vision therapy. The multisyllable method is one of my own design, but you won't believe how effective it is if you follow it closely. Virtually all of the materials are free on the website. Just read through it all and see what you think.

 

I will warn you that if you're in love with syllables, and with a multisyllable decoding method based on syllables, you won't like my method, which is all about chunking words after the vowel sound and then applying three very-easy-to-understand exceptions. Thus, "habit" is chunked "ha--bit" by rule (stop the chunk after the vowel sound, and "rabbit" is chunked "rabb--it" because the first exception (add doubled consonants) is applied. The method dictates using the First Vowel Sound (or short vowel sound) on the first attempt through a word, so both "habit" and "rabbit" are decoded easily on the first pass if your daughter knows the code, which you imply that she does. I will absolutely guarantee you that the method is easier to explain, and for a child to understand, than is a methodology that uses syllables.

 

When I used this method, kids would rapidly move from two-syllable to three- and then four-syllable words and the gain in their confidence was dramatic. In fact, they would grow confident enough of their ability to get the correct result most of the time that they would give up the one thing virtually every struggling reader grows fond of, their guessing habit.

 

Furthermore, because the method doesn't dictate a vowel sound by rule, but just has them trying the First Vowel Sound on each chunk on the first pass, then trying the Second Vowel Sound, etc., until they recognize a word that fits the context, it builds code knowledge very quickly. For example, they quickly learn that the three sounds of the letter "a" are /a/, /ae/, and /o/, because their approach to a word like "father" is to try f/a/ther (rhymes with "gather" and not a word, then f/ae/ther (still not a word), and finally "f/o/ther" and getting the word. After a few encounters, they are expected to start to recognize the word on sight, having successfully decoded it a few times already. That can be another issue, of course.

 

The one hitch is whether or not the child has a sufficient grasp of code knowledge to be able to test the options efficiently. For some, the advanced code phonics workbook that's available on my site might be necessary, but for older kids, especially those who've been exposed to the phonograms, the free multisyllable method is often sufficient.

 

Incidentally, I've started a new blog, Perspectives, on my website at OnTrack Reading. I'd be happy to carry on discussions about the multisyllable method either here or there, although I've yet to write a blog post on the multisyllable method. But I don't want to hijack this thread with an extended discussion about it either.

 

Rod Everson

OnTrack Reading

[nukeswife]

Thank you Pen and Merry for your input. I'll look at those High Noon books.

 

Rod, we did do the maintenance exercises but she's been out of therapy for quite a while now and at her last check up there were no exercises that we were specifically given. We will go in for a follow up eval later this month and and see what they say.

 

The part with her being good one time and not another seems to not be related to being tired, as she did better reading before bed than in the morning when she was fresh. I really am starting to think it has a lot to do with her interest in what she's supposed to be reading. I've gotten a lot of suggestions, so now I have a lot to think about.

[Pen]

...

The multisyllable method

...

 

 

This looks very interesting.

 

I am wondering how it would work with a word that the child had trouble with--for example, "immediately" -- could you explain? ih-mehd-ih-at-eh-ly, eye-mehd-ih-at-eh-ly.... It seems like if one did it with all short vowel sounds first, it might take a while before getting to which should be long sounds or schwas. And it seems like it would be harder if it were a word that were not yet known. Some of the other words, like "argue" seem like they would be easy with this system though. But then I think, what if one goes from that to "plague"--that it would be tried as plageh, playgeh, plagyoo, playgyoo, etc. and might be a long while before one got the the playg sound. Not that I know another way that would be likely any better, though.

 

Here are a couple of others I noticed problems with in my ds recently: "seismic" and "deified" --similar looking, but different pronunciation patterns, and complicated by deified not being a word he had heard before. How would your system deal with such?

 

I can kind of see how it would help young readers moving to easy multi-syllable words, but does it usually still help at age 11 level, or leave the process tediously slow?

 

One of the things that I think was accomplished via the Chapter Books I mentioned in my other thread was that my ds learned to do essentially exactly what you are suggesting--to try the most common sound for a vowel first, because that was what got drilled first over and over, followed by the second vowel sound over and over, and only later on to the less common sounds--but it became a habit to do that rather than requiring conscious thought.

[thundersweet]

Have you looked at Reading Assistant? I purchased the monthly subscription from Homeschool Buyers Coop for my struggling 8yo. Every day he gets on there with his headphones and reads for 20 minutes. The program is set for 20 minutes I believe. It tells him when his time is up. He can first listen to the book read to him. Then he records himself reading. The software detects when he struggles with a word and reads it for him. After he as read it and recorded himself, he gets to listen to his recording if he wants to. I think he reads it again and has to press lightbulbs along the way which are comprehension questions. Then he takes a quiz! Now, all of this is broken up into timed sessions. If he has trouble with the book, it takes him longer. The software has him repeat until he reaches a fluency goal, I believe. The program shows him his fluency report when he is done reading. Actually, after every read it shows him how many words per minute he read. He could care less but I like to see it! I'm sure I am forgetting some of what it does but you get the idea.

 

ETA....we also use Logic of English.

Sandy

[CatholicMom]

I didn't read this whole thread but just wanted to pop in and say make sure you rule out any possible learning disabilities like dyslexia, if you've never considered it. I'm getting my son tested soon, so it's on my mind. A big red flag is that there is a large discrepancy between the child's obvious intelligence and their ability to read. Sometimes writing is also a problem, and spelling is almost always a struggle as well, but sometimes one of these areas is the "big one" for that particular child. My son struggled with reading for a while and now is doing better. I think he's reading on or close to grade level. His comprehension is fine. But, for him, writing and spelling is pure torture.

 

To see some red flags for dyslexia, take a look at susanbarton.com

[Rod Everson]

 

 

This looks very interesting.

 

I am wondering how it would work with a word that the child had trouble with--for example, "immediately" -- could you explain? ih-mehd-ih-at-eh-ly, eye-mehd-ih-at-eh-ly.... It seems like if one did it with all short vowel sounds first, it might take a while before getting to which should be long sounds or schwas. And it seems like it would be harder if it were a word that were not yet known. Some of the other words, like "argue" seem like they would be easy with this system though. But then I think, what if one goes from that to "plague"--that it would be tried as plageh, playgeh, plagyoo, playgyoo, etc. and might be a long while before one got the the playg sound. Not that I know another way that would be likely any better, though.

 

Here are a couple of others I noticed problems with in my ds recently: "seismic" and "deified" --similar looking, but different pronunciation patterns, and complicated by deified not being a word he had heard before. How would your system deal with such?

 

I can kind of see how it would help young readers moving to easy multi-syllable words, but does it usually still help at age 11 level, or leave the process tediously slow?

 

One of the things that I think was accomplished via the Chapter Books I mentioned in my other thread was that my ds learned to do essentially exactly what you are suggesting--to try the most common sound for a vowel first, because that was what got drilled first over and over, followed by the second vowel sound over and over, and only later on to the less common sounds--but it became a habit to do that rather than requiring conscious thought.

 

 

Your last comment is on target. The point is to set up a system that works most of the time and to get the child to systematically apply it, so that it becomes second nature to test the various vowel sounds.

 

Your other point that "it would help young readers moving to easy multi-syllable words" is also on target. That is the exact point of any multi-syllable decoding method that a child should be taught. It should give him a reasonably reliable means to attack unfamiliar words he's encountering at his grade level.

 

As for your examples, yes, other than "immediately", they are tough words to decode regardless of the approach used. That's why we have dictionaries, or now the web, and others around us to ask questions of. The key then is whether or not the word being questioned can be coded (not decoded, but coded) in a sensible manner given the coding system being used. "Seismic" cannot because the "ei" is such a rare spelling of the long-i sound that it should be considered an exception, rather than being taught as a viable option to test, much like the "eo" in "people." They just don't occur enough to warrant being considered viable spellings of a sound.

 

By the way, here are the three Exceptions to the Main Rule:

 

1. Add any doubled consonant to the preceding chunk, thus ha--bit, but rabb--it

 

2. Add any marker to the preceding chunk. The markers are ck, tch, dg, and x, so ro--cket becomes rock--et.

 

3. Add a consonant if the next chunk is "hard to say." (That's the kid language...in adult language it's if the next chunk starts with an illegal blend.) Thus, mo--nster becomes mon--ster, because nster is "hard to say", i.e., ns is not one of the possible (legal) beginning consonant blends in English words.

 

Now, one of the neat things about every single one of the exceptions is that each of them tends to "lock in" the First Vowel Sound (the short sound). The doubled consonant usually marks a short vowel; the markers all usually "mark" short vowels (ack, ick, adg, edg, itch, etch, ax, ox, etc.), and the third exception usually creates the fabled "closed syllable" of Orton Gillingham fame.

 

Note that I said "usually" in all three cases; this is English after all.

 

The free Multisyllable Decoding Method on my website has word lists at the 2-, 3-, and 4-syllable level that gradually introduce the Main Rule and then each of the Three Exceptions in an organized manner.

[nukeswife]

Sandy, we did try reading assistant but she didn't enjoy it, she didn't like being on the computer for reading. I think part of it is because ours didn't cut her off after 20 minutes (even though it was supposed to it never did) and part because reading out loud is part of her one on one time with me or dh and she looks forward to that.

 

I believe I've come up with a plan we can work with and if we see no improvement or what looks to be forward progress in another month we'll have her tested for LDs/dyslexia.

 

I plan to use the list from WRTR but not as a spelling program, we're just going to go through it at about 10 words a day breaking them down for reading and putting them on flashcards using the tools we've learned from AAS and someone tipped me off to DIBELS fluency sheets, so we'll do those a few times a day. I'll keep going with AAS because we both enjoy that.

[Black-eyed Suzan]

I went to a convention last year where the woman who created the Struggling Reader program spoke. I don't know if it is within your price range, but I thought I would share:

 

http://www.thestrugglingreader.net/

[nukeswife]

I went to a convention last year where the woman who created the Struggling Reader program spoke. I don't know if it is within your price range, but I thought I would share:

 

http://www.thestrugglingreader.net/

 

 

Interesting, but I'm not even sure which one we'd need. I also see there is one whole book on sight words. I'm ok with using a few, but 300 sounds like a lot of them.

[ElizabethB]

:hugs:

 

I would work on syllable division, work through my syllable division exercises, links number 6 and 7 at the end of my how to tutor page.

 

Also, I would try some nonsense words and see how those go, here is a good nonsense word test to see, she should be able to read them almost as quickly as a normal word. If she has trouble with them, my phonics lessons and the book We All Can Read both use nonsense words. My daughter can actually read the nonsense word sentences faster than me, and I wrote the sentences! (I got a bit of sight word teaching in 1st grade, she has had just phonics from the beginning.)

 

I also like the 1879 McGuffey readers for building up reading fluency and vocabulary. The difficult words are defined and diacritically marked, and the series builds in difficulty incrementally. Start slightly below challenging level, but not crazy easy.