TheAutumnOak Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I am going to apologize beforehand for the post that is coming...It will be filled with me rambling and being indecisive... Before I go on and on, the short of it is that I want too much...I went to the CT conference and had the chance to meet and listen to SWB (again :)), Andrew Kern, Christopher Perrin and Martin Cothran...I loved hearing them speak and the conference was well worth it to me... Now here is the problem...I want to use Memoria Press because it is so well laid out and I like a lot of their materials...It gives me a sense of security knowing it was planned out by people I consider to be smart individuals, and it has a classical focus...The open and go aspect is very appealing to me right now...On the other hand, I really identify with SWB...I have read WTM, heard her speak on three different occasions, and have listened to many of her audios...Her approach is different than that of LCC and Memoria Press...Her approach to history and literary analysis is different than Martin's (Cothran), and it is difficult for me to let go of Susan's approach...I am not a hundred percent sure why... For the past year and a half I have been loving Susan's approach, but not really doing a good job of bringing it home...It makes sense to me until I am in the thick of it, then I wish I had something planned out to guide me...Memoria Press is that plan for me, but it is hard for me to let go... I don't expect anyone to solve my problem for me, I know I have to decide what to do for myself...I just needed to articulate what I am feeling (though I don't think I did a great job of it), and listen to the advice of anyone who wants to respond... And as a side note, Andrew Kern and Christopher Perrin are awesome :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 It gives me a sense of security knowing it was planned out by people I consider to be smart individuals, YOU are one of the smartest people I know. Not one of the most confident, and not one of the best educated, but one of the smartest and wisest and most resilient and loving...and I could go on and on. No matter what you choose, you can change your mind, if you don't like the results. Hopping around has it's drawbacks for certain, BUT it also has it's benefits. It's going to be okay. It really is. YOUR homeschool doesn't look like some of the other ladies' here, but it isn't worse, it's just different. And I believe it's all YOUR boys need to get where THEY are going. BREATHE :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIS0320 Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 (edited) I also chose Memoria Press for next year. (I think you saw my hybrid classical/waldorf post from earlier this week?). I did a lot of planning on my own last year and even though it was "only" first grade it was a lot of work. Memoria Press isn't my absolute perfect curriculum but I know it will get done and I know it is a good, solid educational path. I am in awe of the moms who are able to school multiple children of multiple ages and tailor each child's education to the nth degree and pull it off beautifully. At this time in my life I need some help with planning and MP looks solid and reassuring and it looks like it will get done. I spotted Hunter's siggy a few months ago about the best curriculum is one that gets used and I think that is probably the most valuable piece of homeschooling advice I've gotten on this board - and there is a lot of good advice on this board so that is saying something! Anyway, I am a new homeschooler but I thought I'd reply because I feel like we have some things in common, mainly a very Waldorf influenced background trying to make classical work for our families. Edited June 20, 2012 by drexel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justamouse Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I'm so jealous you got to see them all! It wil be fine! I agree with Hunter-if it fails, you can change! I do things my own way, but I'm always checking myself against MP. I so love them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kristinannie Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 (edited) This is something that I have been struggling with as late as well. They are too very different ways of looking at education, especially literature. SWB uses history as the Core of her curriculum, while LCC and Circe focus more on literature and classics as the Core. I tend to learn more towards LCC and Circe (and MP) because I love reading excellent literature and not reading books just to fit them into a historical time period. Plus, LCC and MP focus on fewer books with a greater depth of study while with SWB you would read more books. Although LCC does say to have your children read other books as well (just not for major discussion). It is a really hard decision to make. If you are feeling led toward MP, I would just go for it and see how it works out for you!!! It isn't like you can't resell most of it on here later... :lol: Edited June 20, 2012 by kristinannie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warneral Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 Didn't you use TOG this past year? Why didn't it work? I have 1 quarter here and am starting to doubt that it will work for us Best wishes!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen in NS Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 Now here is the problem...I want to use Memoria Press because it is so well laid out and I like a lot of their materials...It gives me a sense of security knowing it was planned out by people I consider to be smart individuals...On the other hand, I really identify with SWB......it is difficult for me to let go of Susan's approach...I am not a hundred percent sure why... For the past year and a half I have been loving Susan's approach, but not really doing a good job of bringing it home...It makes sense to me until I am in the thick of it, then I wish I had something planned out to guide me...Memoria Press is that plan for me, but it is hard for me to let go... (I took out some of your text above and put ellipses points in its place, but since you use ellipses points so much, I don't know if you can tell where I took text out - but anyway, I'm responding to the text I left in - telling you just so you don't get confused about my reply) I can identify with what I think you are saying. I've been so helped by the methods/resources in WTM, and all of Susan's audio lectures, and the WTMers on these forums over the years who've tested out WTM methods with success. So every year, I bumblingly go into the next year with gusto (not having studied this way myself in the past). I do end up tweaking things along the way. And there are many times when I wish someone would just come and *do this* for me, because I get into the thick of it and realize I really don't know what I'm doing or how to do it "right." I think, "gee, I wish Janice in NJ would come teach writing/literature/history and making connections to my kids. And I wish Jane in NC could come tutor math - she'd make it far more fun while making it understandable. And I wish FaithManor would come do science experiments with my kids - she LOVES science and would know how to lead them!" And then I step back and focus on the overall picture, and try again, because the reality is, I can't have those people. I also can't afford "programs." Here, it's all up to ME to make it work. And in my OK moments, I realize, "I like the challenge. I *like* putting this together for my kids." I also know now that if I were to use an all-in-one program, I would quickly get frustrated and bored with using it. This is why I like assembling my own program, using WTM/etc. as a guide. I can't teach math and grammar and Latin on my own, so I use teaching programs specifically for those. I feel a little more confident teaching writing skills on my own, with a lot of guidance, but not daily lessons laid out, so I do that. I know zero logic, so I depend on a program for that. But I love being able to assemble a general study plan for content areas. I would go nuts using a planned out content program. I love the freedom of picking our own books and deciding on writing assignments (with the help of all my notes in WTM and notes from the WTM anniv. conf. I attended - lots and lots of notes!!!! lol). I also once bought MP's guides to Henle Latin. Henle is pretty straightforward, but the guides broke it down into daily lessons, weekly plans, for a couple of years. But even with that, and even with my little knowledge of Latin, I quickly got tired of using the guides. I figured out the general study pattern, and came up with a pattern of my own that allowed us to progress a little more quickly, wasn't all about laying out each particular day, but was still thorough. It also gave us more flexibility. I don't know - I am rambling here. And of course you are going to make your own decision about what to do, and no one will fault you for it because you have to be comfortable with what you do. But, maybe try figuring out *why* it is difficult for you to let go of a WTMish way of doing things. Can you break that down into subject areas, too? Maybe thinking that through will help you to decide. For me, the years of being so constricted by finances, lack of transportation, my lack of good education, and lack of other WTMish people in my real life have forced me to become a DIY person with regards to educating my kids. And I've come to enjoy the challenge. I used to feel so "deprived", but I don't think I am now. I'm a little freaked out right now about planning for rhetoric stage studies (today I combed through WTM to figure out how to conduct teaching in some areas), but I remembered I went through that when beginning logic stage, and when beginning grammar stage when I had NO IDEA how to teach my kids or what to teach them after I'd taught them how to read. I went to a small homeschool conference a few weeks ago, and talked with one university representative. Talking with him really calmed some of my fears down. It gave me a better idea of what to make sure to do in high school, and it made me think, "Hmm....I think I *can* be a pretty good guidance counselor to my kids!" I also got to talk with some other Moms who'd already graduated some of their kids from homeschool, and heard stories of how these kids got into university AND got scholarship money (including one whopper of a scholarship for one girl this year!). Anyway, I don't know if anything here is helping. Just wanted you to know that I *think* I understand how you feel, and what I do about my feelings. YOU are one of the smartest people I know. :iagree: This is *exactly* what popped into my mind about her comment about "smart individuals", even before I read your response to her. Tahara, I'm so glad you went to and enjoyed the conference. I so wish I could have gone and met you, too. A friend of mine, whom I haven't seen in about 19 years, went. Did you happen to notice a 4' 10" redhead walking around with her family? She's my friend. :D But anyway, yes, you ARE smart. I'm sure you are doing a better job with your kids than you think you are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Another Lynn Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 ...It makes sense to me until I am in the thick of it, then I wish I had something planned out to guide me... :iagree: This exactly. In the thick of it, I feel like I barely know my name. And no matter what my original plan was, I end up finding a history spine, reading it aloud, assignming literature books, (happy if I get a bit of mumbling out of them after they read it), and whine about how am I going to teach them writing this year? Thank you.... this is the clearest thinking I've had since I started planning months ago, LOL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boscopup Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I too have strayed from some WTM methods this year from the last year and a half, and it is a bit scary! I finally decided that we needed something slightly different. I am still keeping some WTM ideas in my homeschool, but we have strayed away from the 4-year history cycle (DS1 is re-reading all 4 SOTW volumes this summer anyway, just to boost his summer reading program page numbers :lol:), and I have even strayed from the WWE method of writing when I realized that my son needed something slightly different there. It's OK! I may change back to pure WTM at some point, or I may go a completely different direction. The thing is... there are many ways to successfully homeschool a child, and we need to pick what WE can get done. So far, having started some non-WTM style curricula for this year, I have been VERY happy with my choices. WTM was great for getting me started with homeschooling, and I'm forever thankful for SWB and JW. They are an inspiration, and I loved seeing SWB in person last year at a conference (sadly, she wasn't at this year's conference). I will probably use WWE again with my younger kids (though I may need to use something different for DS2 because of language issues). I love SOTW and need to replace them all with hardbacks probably. They're getting a workout around here! I will probably use FLL1/2 with DS2 at the very least (probably skip it with DS3). I will also continue to re-read WTM periodically to gleam some ideas. But in practice? I'm ok with going the Sonlight, IEW, KISS Grammar, etc. route. :D If it's working for us, why worry about it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 For the past year and a half I have been loving Susan's approach, but not really doing a good job of bringing it home...It makes sense to me until I am in the thick of it, then I wish I had something planned out to guide me... Have you tried writing your own plans ahead of time so that when you are "in the thick of it" you have an objective/assignments/routine scheduled? If you have and weren't satisfied w/it, then there is nothing wrong w/going w/pre-fab plans if that is what makes you a more successful teacher. (remember, that is the goal! ;)) But if your approach has been to simply generate objectives/assignments "in the thick of it," taking time now to develop detailed outlines of books/topics/assignments/areas of possible research/etc might make it actually easier to teach and not cause the sense of "in the thick of it" b/c you see the whole path in front of you and not just the path ending at your feet. Ultimately, you need to give yourself permission to do whatever it takes to make you feel that you are achieving the specific goals you have for your children. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Critterfixer Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I always feel that way after going to see a beautifully maintained garden. The grass is so perfect, the beds are full of perfectly picked colors and plants, there are no bugs, except the pretty ones. The paths are well laid out, and there's not a weed to be found. Everything in it's place. Then I get home. And I feel bad that my garden looks so rough, that I don't have that kind of color, that my paths aren't straight and neat, that I can't grow that kind of beauty at home. It's rough. I've got weeds. Paths mean nothing at all. To anyone. And boy do I have bugs. And they are not the pretty ones. Things have a habit of up and seeding to someplace they were not supposed to be. But I've learned a few things about those beautifully maintained gardens. They had trained designers. They typically are planted in places where the climate and soil are really good for gardens. Most of all, there is a veritable army in place to maintain them. I could take home a detailed plan, invest a fortune to recreate it, and it wouldn't be there in six months, because I don't have that army to take care of it. I feel the same way about educational philosophies to some extent. Just because I can appreciate, admire and love a certain style (CM for example) does not mean that I can duplicate the approach or the results here where I am. That doesn't mean I can't grow a decent educational garden, or even a remarkable one. But I have to consider the climate, the place and time and I also have to appreciate the beauty of what will grow, and not be fixated on something that simply will not survive. Learn from them. Pick out things you love about the approaches and then think about whether you can "grow" it at home. Sometimes you can. Sometimes it's worth the effort, even if it does die out in a year. Other times it's not, and you should either let the idea go, or pick something with a similar color or look that will grow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MerryAtHope Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 A few things to keep in mind: A choice to use Memoria Press this year is not a choice to never follow a classical model. It's just a choice for this year. Maybe it will show you how to plan and you'll follow a classical model next year and come up with your own plan. Maybe it will show you just how much you like having that planning done for you--and you'll either want to stick with MP or go with another planned curriculum. Sometimes I really admire a speaker--that doesn't mean that the speaker's methods work for me. A gentleman from a highly ranked children's museum came to speak to our homeschool group about science--and he was so inspiring and I totally, 100% agree that his way of teaching science is wonderful, perhaps even the best approach to teaching science. But I'm not him. I can't teach science the way he does. My choices at that point are to see if I can adapt anything he says to how I CAN teach it, or look at other various options. That's ok! I think, at the heart of teaching, is the imparting of yourself more than the imparting of knowledge (although we certainly do impart knowledge, skills, and so on). Look for the tools that free you to do that, rather than the ones that stress you out and make you feel you need to be something you're not. And those tools may change over time as you grow and as your kids grow--all of that is perfectly natural. Finally...give yourself the freedom to fail. The freedom to fall flat on your face and have to say, "this isn't working!" Don't let fear hold you back from doing something you really want to do. When we take a risk, sometimes we will fail--but sometimes we'll succeed too. And our children learn a lot from how we handle failure, so even that is not lost. And we learn--but we need the freedom to fail in order to have the freedom to succeed. Merry :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PRTGSw2K Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Have you tried writing your own plans ahead of time so that when you are "in the thick of it" you have an objective/assignments/routine scheduled? If you have and weren't satisfied w/it, then there is nothing wrong w/going w/pre-fab plans if that is what makes you a more successful teacher. (remember, that is the goal! ;)) But if your approach has been to simply generate objectives/assignments "in the thick of it," taking time now to develop detailed outlines of books/topics/assignments/areas of possible research/etc might make it actually easier to teach and not cause the sense of "in the thick of it" b/c you see the whole path in front of you and not just the path ending at your feet. Ultimately, you need to give yourself permission to do whatever it takes to make you feel that you are achieving the specific goals you have for your children. I hope to one day reach a place where I can comfortably plan out lessons in exactly this way. It just seems like the best way to teach something is to know it yourself, and in order to plan lessons, you have to know the material. I always feel that way after going to see a beautifully maintained garden. The grass is so perfect, the beds are full of perfectly picked colors and plants, there are no bugs, except the pretty ones. The paths are well laid out, and there's not a weed to be found. Everything in it's place.Then I get home. And I feel bad that my garden looks so rough, that I don't have that kind of color, that my paths aren't straight and neat, that I can't grow that kind of beauty at home. It's rough. I've got weeds. Paths mean nothing at all. To anyone. And boy do I have bugs. And they are not the pretty ones. Things have a habit of up and seeding to someplace they were not supposed to be. But I've learned a few things about those beautifully maintained gardens. They had trained designers. They typically are planted in places where the climate and soil are really good for gardens. Most of all, there is a veritable army in place to maintain them. I could take home a detailed plan, invest a fortune to recreate it, and it wouldn't be there in six months, because I don't have that army to take care of it. I feel the same way about educational philosophies to some extent. Just because I can appreciate, admire and love a certain style (CM for example) does not mean that I can duplicate the approach or the results here where I am. That doesn't mean I can't grow a decent educational garden, or even a remarkable one. But I have to consider the climate, the place and time and I also have to appreciate the beauty of what will grow, and not be fixated on something that simply will not survive. Learn from them. Pick out things you love about the approaches and then think about whether you can "grow" it at home. Sometimes you can. Sometimes it's worth the effort, even if it does die out in a year. Other times it's not, and you should either let the idea go, or pick something with a similar color or look that will grow. :iagree: Beautifully explained. A few things to keep in mind: A choice to use Memoria Press this year is not a choice to never follow a classical model. It's just a choice for this year. Maybe it will show you how to plan and you'll follow a classical model next year and come up with your own plan. Maybe it will show you just how much you like having that planning done for you--and you'll either want to stick with MP or go with another planned curriculum. Sometimes I really admire a speaker--that doesn't mean that the speaker's methods work for me. A gentleman from a highly ranked children's museum came to speak to our homeschool group about science--and he was so inspiring and I totally, 100% agree that his way of teaching science is wonderful, perhaps even the best approach to teaching science. But I'm not him. I can't teach science the way he does. My choices at that point are to see if I can adapt anything he says to how I CAN teach it, or look at other various options. That's ok! I think, at the heart of teaching, is the imparting of yourself more than the imparting of knowledge (although we certainly do impart knowledge, skills, and so on). Look for the tools that free you to do that, rather than the ones that stress you out and make you feel you need to be something you're not. And those tools may change over time as you grow and as your kids grow--all of that is perfectly natural. Finally...give yourself the freedom to fail. The freedom to fall flat on your face and have to say, "this isn't working!" Don't let fear hold you back from doing something you really want to do. When we take a risk, sometimes we will fail--but sometimes we'll succeed too. And our children learn a lot from how we handle failure, so even that is not lost. And we learn--but we need the freedom to fail in order to have the freedom to succeed. Merry :-) :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FO4UR Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 I looked very closely into MP for the coming year. They actually used SWB's writing recommendations as they write their elementary level plans.;) So...it's comparing apples to apples...the same underlying philosphy, if I understand correctly. I think you cannot go wrong either way. What will make it easier for you? What can you afford? What will delight your dc? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawn E Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 (edited) I am using MP K with my ds this year and I love it. Most of all, or at least way up there, I love that it is getting done...in total. I love having it all planned out there for me so all I have to do is check a box. I love the very logical, well-planned foundation it is laying in the basics. However, I am with you in regards to my dd. I am very impressed with MP's sets and do not doubt that they were put together very thoughtfully...by very intelligent individuals. They have also been through the trial run at Highlands Latin School. Yet, I am unable to commit to the upper levels wholly at this stage since I have so many other materials (some SWB, some others) that I trust and want to include. I have duplicated the MP teacher guide for the 5th grade level in Word. I am using English, Science, Classical Studies and some of the literature as they are already laid out (though I am putting the English in the order it is written, not the guide order). I'm using Christian Studies 1 instead of 3, so I'm changing that around. For the subjects I am using different materials in, I have gone through and typed in a daily plan in the subject areas. I did add a "History" section in addition to the "Classical Studies" one since we do more history than MP plans out. I am well aware that the best of plans rarely work out perfectly, so I am prepared to have to shuffle some things around. I feel really good about it, though, and it really has not taken as much time to pull it together as I anticipated. Regarding LCC and SWB's history, you really have to decide which one resonates the most with you. If you can't let go of the SWB way, then there is likely a good reason for that. Possibly there is a way to do it while keeping some of the spirit of LCC in. It just won't look like the MP way, and that is totally okay. Edited June 30, 2012 by Dawn E Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLittleBears Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Have you shared your concerns with your dh? I think out of all my homeschool friends, I have gotten the best advice from my dh. He knows you, your dc, and your situation best and sometimes they can be so accurate with their advice, it downright scary. At the very least, it may help you think out your thoughts. I am with you, WTM is wonderful, and makes so much sense, it's hard not to feel as if you should be doing it. But in the end, it should not bog us down, and we should allow ourselves some freedom of movement. Preplanned curricula is usually planned by highly experience people who devoted their wisdom, time and energy into the planning so that you don't have too. If you trust the sorce, I say go for it. The longer I homeschool the more I realize how much I *need* it planned just for my own sanity. I have 3 boys too! :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.