The Governess Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 Dd 7 has always been an intense child. She hasn't been tested but I'm assuming that she somewhere on the gifted scale - she was reading at a third grade level before she turned four, and has continued to work ahead in language arts. In general, schoolwork is very easy for her and she picks things up quickly. Anyway, about her intensity. Maybe I can list some of the things she does and you can tell me what you think. 1. She is very physically intense: gives very hard hugs, loves to snuggle, tickle, is always pulling on me or trying to hang on me, has no concept of personal space (it doesn't help that I am an introvert who likes a lot of personal space!). She does this to others too - the closer you are to her, the more she interacts this way. It's very hard for her to remember that not everyone likes this. 2. She is very controlling of her little sister. If they are in the same room together she trying to police her every move. I work every single day with her on this. 3. She is very persistent/argumentative. She has to ask "why?" or respond with a "but......." to every request. Nothing I ask is ever responded to with quiet compliance. :tongue_smilie: I am constantly saying things like "we aren't talking about this anymore" or "I am not going to debate this with you," etc. I never change my mind after saying no, but she still tries hard to wear me down - every single time. 4. She has a hard time at bedtime going to bed and staying in bed. She *always* gets up. She doesn't like being alone. It can take her a while to fall asleep. Add all these behaviors up, and I can feel exhausted after interacting with her all day. Dh and I joke some nights that it feels like someone came and vacuumed the life out of us - we are just so emotionally drained at the end of the day after dealing with both the girls - but I would say 85% of the time it is dd7's behavior. I've been reading a bit on overexcitabilities (?) and wondering if that's what this is, or if this is just a personality issue (she has outgrown other behaviors, like fear of loud noises and wind). If you have a child like this, how do you parent them? How do you maintain a peaceful environment in your home? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenbrdsly Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 If you have a child like this, how do you parent them? How do you maintain a peaceful environment in your home? Ummm... I blog about it. :tongue_smilie: Seriously though, this is what helps us with dealing with intensity on the weekends. :bigear: I can't wait to hear some more ideas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KirstenH Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 My gifted 7yo is JUST like this, and yes, it's exhausting. I have no answers for you. Maybe I will have some after we see the psychologist on Friday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Governess Posted May 22, 2012 Author Share Posted May 22, 2012 Well, at least I know I'm not alone. :D I've been considering taking her in for testing/evaluation. I keep thinking that she will eventually outgrow some of this intensity, but it hasn't happened yet. My main fear is that she will have a hard time developing and maintaining strong friend/family relationships because of some of her behaviors. And I'd like to try to figure out a way to help her use her intensity in ways that don't wear on the people in her life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathy G Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 You are definitely not alone. My DD- almost 7 is that intense too. It is almost to the point of embarrassment when she gets all huggy. Some days it is a struggle. Homeschool has been great to help her with it. We have read Living with Intensity, Raising you Spirited Child...all the books and it is still a struggle. It has gotten slightly better after many talks about appropriate hugging etc. My worst worry is that she will be overly affectionate with boys in the future and be viewed as leading them on or worse. We are starting to work on boy-girl interactions now. (hopefully we have plenty of time- because she thinks boys are aliens now!) There are nights of total exhaustion when I tell my hubby I don't have one more ounce of parenting left in me for the day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nellecv Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 She sounds just like my daughter. We haven't found a "solution", but this helps: Exercise - if she doesn't get exercise every single day, she goes a little nuts. In the summer she swims for 3-4 hours a day. On winter weekends we often use the playspace at the mall or do a LOT of walking at a museum. She also plays soccer and basketball, hikes, and rides her bike. Mental stimulation - if she's not learning and thinking, the arguing and fussing gets worse. That's one reason we afterschool! Art projects - we do a TON of art in my house. I'll get her started and work with her for a few minutes than quietly stand up and start doing dishes, folding laundry, or checking my e-mail right nearby. Rest time - this is not optional in my house. For one hour every afternoon she can do whatever she wants in her room as long as she's quiet and doesn't come out. Consequences are always given if she harasses me during rest time. Over time, this has helped her learn to play independently for short periods of time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissKNG Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 Oh yes...I have two of "those"! Lots of mental stimulation, outdoor play, etc. helps here but they are still bouncing off the walls at night! I do have their 8 year old cousin down often and she spends the night. It gives me a break because they all play together. I agree with the art project accessibility. I keep all sorts of paper, scissors, glue, markers/crayons/colored pencils, etc out for them. It's exhausting, I'm always tired but I wouldn't trade my kiddos' quirks for anything because that's what makes them my girls! :D But I will popcorn this for more ideas! :lurk5: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKL Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 I agree with the mental stimulation. Easier said than done sometimes, though. In the past week I took my 5yo daughters to a Yanni concert and a dance variety show. Two times we had to sit and watch a near-wordless production. Although she loves music, my youngest quickly had enough of Yanni, and then she had a really rough time tolerating the "sit still and watch" requirement. I finally ended up holding her in my lap for most of the show (to her sister's jealous dismay). The dance show was similar - you could sense this intense need to "do something" other than just watch people do their thing. When she wasn't fidgeting, she was trying to bug her sister (who was enjoying the show). At that point I realized we need to work on some techniques to get through times like that. She also interacts inappropriately at times, fueled by nervous energy. She wiggles her legs a lot, like she's impatient. She gets too hands-on with her food to the point that she's gross (and she knows better). Sometimes she'll pull my finger back until it hurts, not maliciously, just for something to do. Other times she'll repeat a nonsense phrase over and over, knowing it irritates me. It's weird. At home, she has a castle full of prince/princess dolls and this is a great outlet for her. She can get very intense and controlling and nobody tells her what to do. (Just don't move things around while she's in school, like the maids did yesterday.:tongue_smilie:) I don't really have a lot of ideas. My dd does not like exercise much, so that's out. One thing that helps (if I think of it) is getting her to put words to her feelings. I'd rather have her tell me about her excitement than hang on me. Though the jealousy dynamic between the sisters (competing for my ear) makes this interesting. I'm hoping that when she gets a little older, I can send her off to write a story or something. You're right, it makes a mom tired. I can't tell you how many times I've said the same thing. Then again, I'm an introvert like you. Maybe there's a pattern there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Embassy Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 Dd 7 has always been an intense child. She hasn't been tested but I'm assuming that she somewhere on the gifted scale - she was reading at a third grade level before she turned four, and has continued to work ahead in language arts. In general, schoolwork is very easy for her and she picks things up quickly. Anyway, about her intensity. Maybe I can list some of the things she does and you can tell me what you think. 1. She is very physically intense: gives very hard hugs, loves to snuggle, tickle, is always pulling on me or trying to hang on me, has no concept of personal space (it doesn't help that I am an introvert who likes a lot of personal space!). She does this to others too - the closer you are to her, the more she interacts this way. It's very hard for her to remember that not everyone likes this. 2. She is very controlling of her little sister. If they are in the same room together she trying to police her every move. I work every single day with her on this. 3. She is very persistent/argumentative. She has to ask "why?" or respond with a "but......." to every request. Nothing I ask is ever responded to with quiet compliance. :tongue_smilie: I am constantly saying things like "we aren't talking about this anymore" or "I am not going to debate this with you," etc. I never change my mind after saying no, but she still tries hard to wear me down - every single time. 4. She has a hard time at bedtime going to bed and staying in bed. She *always* gets up. She doesn't like being alone. It can take her a while to fall asleep. Add all these behaviors up, and I can feel exhausted after interacting with her all day. Dh and I joke some nights that it feels like someone came and vacuumed the life out of us - we are just so emotionally drained at the end of the day after dealing with both the girls - but I would say 85% of the time it is dd7's behavior. I've been reading a bit on overexcitabilities (?) and wondering if that's what this is, or if this is just a personality issue (she has outgrown other behaviors, like fear of loud noises and wind). If you have a child like this, how do you parent them? How do you maintain a peaceful environment in your home? :grouphug::grouphug: I've been there. It does get a little better. An OT might help with the sensory issues (needing hard hugs). We dealt with unwelcome hugs to a sibling. We ended up giving a large consequence for that behavior. It stopped. The controlling issue has been difficult. It helps that the younger has stood up to the controller. I won't continue to discuss things after I said no. Being consistent has helped, but as they grow I also let them come and try to convince me. I try to listen and be reasonable. I let my child know when he is disrespectful (dh does as well) and he immediately apologizes. For bedtimes, can she share a room? My boys have always shared a room. If not, can you lay down with her while she goes to sleep and then gradually wean her off of that? I am laying down with my 4 year old and I expect to for at least another year yet - and she is my best sleeper. Mental stimulation is a necessity too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DandelionMom Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 (((HUGS))) :grouphug: You are not alone...Hang in there!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Governess Posted May 22, 2012 Author Share Posted May 22, 2012 It is almost to the point of embarrassment when she gets all huggy. My worst worry is that she will be overly affectionate with boys in the future and be viewed as leading them on or worse. We are starting to work on boy-girl interactions now. (hopefully we have plenty of time- because she thinks boys are aliens now!) There are nights of total exhaustion when I tell my hubby I don't have one more ounce of parenting left in me for the day! . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Governess Posted May 22, 2012 Author Share Posted May 22, 2012 Thanks again for the help and commiseration.... It's nice to hear from others who are dealing with similar issues. When the parenting gets hard, I try to envision all of the amazing things she will accomplish as an adult when she can put her persistence, exuberance, etc. to great use - it helps me be more patient with her. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgan Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 My dd 5 was evaluated and sent to OT for mild sensory issues. Personally, we didn't feel OT helped much, but one thing we did take away from it was knowledge about therapy swings.They are quite expensive so I just picked up a swing from IKEA for under $40 (not quite the same thing, but close enough for me). They offer a cozy, quiet place to relax and seem to offer some deep pressure (similar to hugs). If you have a space to hang one, it might be an idea. If you have a good library system you might want to check out some books on sensory integration. I found a few had suggestions for calming kids down to sleep (and realized I was getting my daughter more worked up by giving her a bath before bedtime, who knew?). I really had to skim them for the chapters that pertained to my personal concerns, but I found Sensational Kids by Lucy Miller particularly helpful. I wish I had more answers, but know many of us are having similar issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenbrdsly Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 Thanks for all of the suggestions! She really is a lovely kid, but when she is one of her "demanding" moods it makes the whole house miserable. I'll try giving her more exercise and other stimulation. This summer I want to spend a couple hours a day on foreign language and math and hopefully make things more challenging for her. Now that dd5 is deep into reading instruction, I tend to spend more one-on-one time schooling her and dd7 does a lot of her work independently (when she is cooperating anyway). Maybe this is compounding the problem. Once dd5 is reading well I'm hoping that things will even out a bit more regarding the time I spend with both of them. She's not really an artsy kid, but she does like those step-by-step drawing books a lot....maybe that would be a good outlet for her as well. Thanks again for the help and commiseration.... It's nice to hear from others who are dealing with similar issues. When the parenting gets hard, I try to envision all of the amazing things she will accomplish as an adult when she can put her persistence, exuberance, etc. to great use - it helps me be more patient with her. :D I was also thinking... you are lucky you are dealing with hugging and not physical aggression. My DS7 hasn't had a hitting problem since he was 2 or3, but you can still watch him clench his fists and struggle to hold everything in now at 7. He always manages to exert self-control, but it is hard to watch. :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poetic license Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 1. She is very physically intense: gives very hard hugs, loves to snuggle, tickle, is always pulling on me or trying to hang on me, has no concept of personal space (it doesn't help that I am an introvert who likes a lot of personal space!). She does this to others too - the closer you are to her, the more she interacts this way. It's very hard for her to remember that not everyone likes this. Touchy child and not touchy mom--That's a catastrophic combination as I experience every day! :lol: DS 5 can be very needy for sensory stimulation--to the point that I have to go change out of a short sleeved shirt because he'll start rubbing his face against my arm. I know its innocent but it honestly gets to the point of seeming positively creepy. I don't have much help with this one except that sometimes I have to lay down the law pretty firmly and explain that I can only handle a certain amount of touching. We've had to do the same thing with bedtimes--just make it a non negotiable that he has to stay in his bed once its bedtime. He talks about how his mind is too active or his stuffy nose, or whatever, but he has to stay put. My husband does like to once in a while cuddle him to sleep, so that helps to fulfill some of his cravings I guess. :D Our next project is establishing a mandatory quiet time in the afternoon, so we'll see how that goes. I'm hoping that it will help me recharge and get a break, especially once we start full time homeschooling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathy G Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 My dd 5 was evaluated and sent to OT for mild sensory issues. Personally, we didn't feel OT helped much, but one thing we did take away from it was knowledge about therapy swings.They are quite expensive so I just picked up a swing from IKEA for under $40 (not quite the same thing, but close enough for me). They offer a cozy, quiet place to relax and seem to offer some deep pressure (similar to hugs). If you have a space to hang one, it might be an idea. May I ask which swing you purchased? I looked at the Ikea site and didn't find anything Kathy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
songsparrow Posted May 28, 2012 Share Posted May 28, 2012 (edited) Your post could be describing my dd8! I understand what you are saying. My parenting improved dramatically when I learned that these behaviors are quite typical for gifted children. This allowed me to shift my expectations to be more realistic, and it also gave me relief from feeling that it was my fault because I wasn't parenting well. I participated in a small group discussion of the book A Parent's Guide to Gifted Children by James Webb, and I recommend it highly - it provides lots of strategies, some short-term and some long-term. It was amazing how some of the strategies worked almost instantly! (The interesting thing in the group was that different strategies worked for different kids, so I recommend trying out a bunch of them to see what works for your daughter.) I also read here on the board about sensory-seeking children and their needs, which gave me some ideas and tips. I came to understand that my daughter needs the physical contact, and so I do my best to meet those needs. I let her snuggle and sit close to me; I've gotten quite used to it now. For bedtime after reading, if she wants us to, either my husband or I stay with her until she falls asleep. If she's really having a hard time settling and falling asleep (or at other times if she is showing signs of anxiety or being unable to relax), I find that massage works wonders - I'll rub her head, back or feet. The part that I struggle with most is the constant debating and resistance to my requests. Most of the time it's manageable. I find that patience helps immensely here, as well as tempering my expectations - e.g., does she really need to respond instantly, or can I give her a minute or two space? At its worst she'll respond to any and every request with resistance and delaying tactics. That is a huge challenge for me. At that point, usually a stern talking to, letting her know she's pushed me past the limits of my patience, coupled with a consequence will indicate to her that she needs to change her behavior. The most effective consequences have been small but immediate, such as a time out to give her a chance to stop and regain control, or telling her she must stay with me wherever I go. And some of it is simply repeating expectations over and over while patiently giving them time to grow and mature enough to be able to meet those expectations. My older daughter had many similar tendencies, and she has outgrown many of them or she has learned how to control them. I hope that helps! Edited May 28, 2012 by songsparrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celticmom Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 I don't really have any new suggestions but :lurk5:because that sounds exactly like my dd7. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minuway Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 (edited) Sounds like my dd 7 too! Lots of great suggestions here - I'll add a couple of links and books that have been helpful to us. SENG's Overexcitabilities and the Gifted Overexcitability basics Raising Your Spirited Child - best practical advice with helpful strategies Some of My Best Friends Are Books Great intro into some emotional issues with gifted kids, enormous wonderful reading list resources specifically for relating to gifted kids' Living with Intensity This one is a lot more academic, with fewer practical strategies, but I appreciated reading it especially because my husband is quite gifted and still has a lot of the issues gifted children face (he just has more emotional tools to deal with them now). Its not the first one I would buy, but definitely worth reading at some point. Edited May 31, 2012 by minuway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wheres Toto Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 :grouphug::grouphug: I actually came to this board today because I was feeling so discouraged about my son's behavior at our 4-H meeting. I knew I could find posts here with others dealing with the same thing. Your description of your daughter is exactly my son. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathwonk Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 I am a grandparent who was not particularly good at any of this as a parent, I'm still not that capable. But as an old man, when I watch some well meaning parents of bright intense young kids, I feel as if the parents respond verbally too much too everything the kid says. Sometimes it is not necessary to argue with the child, you just do something and that's it. You do need to keep calm, but you don't need to defend every decision. Sometimes its just your decision, and all further questions can be met with silence. It may help sometimes to observe an experienced KG teacher who is used to managing kids without fussing. I'm not saying I'm good at it myself, but I can still see what is going wrong when I observe it. Does that make sense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazyforlatin Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 She's not really an artsy kid, but she does like those step-by-step drawing books a lot....maybe that would be a good outlet for her as well. First, :grouphug: Second, DD loves Ralph Masiello's step-by-step drawing books. There's something soothing about his books. Or maybe I think they are because I can't draw and find it amazing that I can draw beautiful drawings by following his steps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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