Writing...do I have to ?

[Alison in KY]

The one thing that stresses me out about homeschooling is writing. I do not like writing, and I do not like teaching it. I encourage my kids, but so far, they don't like it either. I see writing programs and they just look like so much hard, hair pulling work. I keep thinking that I tolerated public school writing classes, and was able to successfully graduate with a bachelor's degree, even though I'd never consider myself a good writer.

 

This year is going so well because I have simplified things in our school...and we are not doing writing. What I am doing is going over spelling, and grammar and punctuation with my oldest (6th grade)...and just trying to get those basics down. I keep thinking if I can get him to successfully write a single sentence, or be able to edit a sentence with mistakes, then that will be great. That is my goal for this year. Beyond that, I really don't know where to go with writing.

 

So, have any of you ever had high schooler's graduate, move onto college, and be successful at their English courses with a minimum of writing experience? Have you ever just kept things really simple for writing and had it work out in a positive way? Or am I just kidding myself here?

 

If I stick with my simple plan for this year (which I really want and need to do) then what about 7th and 8th grades? And then high school? I do not want to fail my kids, and I want to prepare them for a higher education...but I really need simple in my life...and writing programs just do not look simple to me. I know I could pay for online courses, but we just never seem to have enough money for extras like this.

 

Any suggestions or encouragement would be greatfully appreciated. I know I'm a few years away from high school, but I feel like I need to have some tentative plans.

 

Alison

[Pam L in Mid Tenn]

You could give short writing assignments (less than 1 typed page ) in different subjects and then correct grammar, spelling, punctuation. You could pull two or three sentences from the paper and talk about improving sentence structure.

 

If you use textbooks, most will have short inserts of extra information in the chapter. A geography text might have a picture and some information about a people group within a country. The assignment might be to Google and read about that group and then to summarize a few facts about them in several paragraphs. Think "short report".

 

Then correct mistakes, find 2 or 3 sentences that need improving, re-write them together, and have him make changes for the final paper.

 

It is an easy way to improve writing skills without a "curriculum".

[Ellie]

My dds learned to write in college--more specifically, at community college, which they did instead of high school.

[chepyl]

Writing skills are SO important! Not just grammar and punctuation, but structure and format. We just finished interviewing for a position that requires someone to respond to emails. We dropped several people immediately because their cover letter (if theu even had one!) And resume were such a mess!!

 

Freshmen comp classes are really designed to remidiate writing skills. I took comp 2 and was the only one in my class who knew how to do proper citation! Those classes are not enough to make up for a lack of writing in high-school. If you take a year off, you need to work your way back in to it by high school.

 

Have them write a brief summary, just a few lines, of everything they read for school. Then have them pick one topic a month to study and write a short 2 page paper about. Once a semester, have them do a 4-5 page paper on a topic. In high school they need to write at least two 10+ page papers. My husband was homeschooled without any writing, his firat semester he had to write a 10 page research paper. He did not know how to start the process. I helped him do the whole thing. I got a 100%;) he wrote the second paper line and did okay. He corrects my writing (grammar and punctuation) because he is very strong in that area, but he never had to actually write, so he struggles with writing letters and papers. We do make a good team.

 

Don't short change your kids. Have them write something at least once a week. Even if you skip the curriculum, have them write essays and summaries.

[Guest annieJ]

I have to agree with the last post! I used to work in a university's writing center and cannot tell you how many freshman came in and were greatly struggling to pass basic writing. Writing is the basis of SO much of our life. Communication these days is becoming more and more written. Resumes, cover letters, etc. I can't stress enough the importance of being able to write. Have them read a newspaper article a couple times a week and write a summary. They don't have to write 10 page papers, but they're going to have to write in life, so I say help them with that foundation now! :)

[chepyl]

I have to agree with the last post! I used to work in a university's writing center and cannot tell you how many freshman came in and were greatly struggling to pass basic writing. Writing is the basis of SO much of our life. Communication these days is becoming more and more written. Resumes, cover letters, etc. I can't stress enough the importance of being able to write. Have them read a newspaper article a couple times a week and write a summary. They don't have to write 10 page papers, but they're going to have to write in life, so I say help them with that foundation now! :)

 

She mentioned preparing them for higher education, that is why I mentioned the 10 page papers. As a freshman in a state school, I had to write 5 page papers weekly for my honors classes and my history classes. As a freshman in a smaller school, my husband had to write 4 10 page papers in his freshman year. When I worked on my masters, I had to write 5-10 page papers weekly. Writing a research paper is a learned skill that is much better started early. I had to teach my fellow master's students how to research and cite in a paper....and they were all teachers in the public schools! (Theatre teachers, not English...and they were 10-15 years out of college and had forgotten a lot of research writing skills because they were out of practice.) I was not saying that a 6ht or 7th grader should write a 10 page paper, but high schoolers should at least do one their Jr year, and one their Sr year.

[Kendall]

A few brief thoughts that are worth about what you are paying for them:)

 

Writing is thinking. You can be sloppier in your thinking when you are only thinking it or saying it. Writing can make you think harder and more clearly.

 

There are good online classes that can do it for you. The Potters School starts in junior high (or younger?) I'm sure others do as well.

 

I also wrote well enough to do well in college, but I didn't like writing and wasn't taught how to write. Teaching writing has been stressful because I never feel like I’m doing a good job. One thing that has helped motivate me to teach writing is reading books about it-books on teaching writing and books written to help people learn to write. Some of them are quite engaging even for this non writer. If you are interested I’ll give you some titles.

 

My senior is taking an online writing class this year and my graduated son also took an online class. With my younger ones I have so many more ideas about teaching writing that I’m doing a better job with them.

 

You could add a few simple things for your 6th grader. Have him spend 10 minutes writing a summary of something he has read or heard (narration). Start observing good writing with him. Have him imitate sentences. You can use that to talk about the grammar. I don’t have much time now, but these are the simple things that I did with my 5th grader last year so that we were at least doing something. If you are interested in more specifics you can send me a private message. I’m not claiming that these were the most rigorous things to do, but I think they were valuable and we can build on them.

[Kendall]

Sorry, I didn't reread you post. You could save money for an online class in high school and you could learn from it yourself so that you might not need it for the next child.

[sharon family school]

Personally, I see writing instruction being the biggest area most HS moms struggle with (including myself), so you are not alone!!

Can't really give this a thumbs up or down yet, but we are going to use

www.essentialsinwriting.com this year. It is like Math-U-See only for writing...so the main instruction is dvd based. I personally spoke with the author at a homeschool conference and was very impressed. It is $40 per grade level.

I spoke with a homeschool mom recently who sent her first child off to college last year and looking back she said the most important things to teach our kids before they go off to college are: reading, writing, math and character...she said if they are strong in these areas, all of the other subjects can be handled just fine. Her daughter did extrememly well her first year! I think that information is like gold and it really showed me what I need to focus on.

[Alison in KY]

Thanks so much everyone, hopefully I'll see even more responses.

 

Ellie, I like your writing plan, and I also seem to recall that you stuck with the writing in Rod and Staff English...I think that is what I'll do for 7th grade.

 

I will definitely check out the Essentials in Writing. I really need a writing program that teaches to my kids (DVD program), but then I'm stuck grading it and I do not feel very qualified to grade papers.

 

To the poster who did so much writing in college, WOW. I know it's been a few years since I've been there, but I do not remember college English being that difficult. Maybe things have gotten tougher since I've been out.

 

 

This is the beginning of our 8th year and while things have never went better school wise, my excitement for homeschooling this year has significantly diminished. That is why I am really appreciating the steps I've made to simplify our homeschool. I really just need that happy blend of teaching some writing, but not having all of us so miserable doing it that homeschooling becomes a poor choice. I know it sounds a bit weird to suggest that the one subject could make or break us, but this year that's what it feels like.

 

:tongue_smilie:

[Hunter]

Of course one subject can make or break you!

 

With any skill, when we struggle and hate it, it is because we don't know HOW to do it. Often we are not encouraged to go ALL the way back to where the problem is.

 

I had to go back to k-3 phonics/spelling and writing to get to the START of my problems.

 

I quickly reviewed the Amish Climbing to Good English 2 and am now doing every lesson in 3. I also like Understanding Writing that is often available used at Exodus Books for $25.00. It focuses on using the friendly letter to teach as much of general writing as possible.

 

I too am focusing mostly on sentences right now.

Edited August 26, 2011 by Hunter

[homeschoolmom97]

I'll second the rest of you - while technically college MAY do some writing remediation, it's MUCH better if you could help your dc's get a handle on writing. I was a lit major in college, and I LOVE the written word. My ds, (who went to Christian school all the way through), credits me nonetheless with teaching him his basic writing skills. My dd, a homeschooled junior this year, struggles. I'm scratching my head...but I'm going to take another stab at it with SWB's Writing with Skill materials. She also has a program for younger kids, Writing with Ease, that I haven't looked at yet, but if it's anything like her hs program, you might want to look it over. One nice thing - there's an instructor's manual that seems to have a lot of good stuff in it, including samples and examples, and hints for how to help your struggling writer. And, of course, don't forget that this forum has a spot where you can submit your child's work, and get feedback!

[Halftime Hope]

Wanted to second that rcmd for SWB's books. I looked at the online sample, and if I had a junior high or early high school student, that's what I'd do in a heartbeat! : )

[Trilliums]

I can relate to your concerns. I felt the same way when my oldest child was around 6th grade and I held off on much writing because it created a lot of stress. I do think kids can develop decent writing skills by the time they are high school age without a lot of overkill in the early years.

 

In 8th grade my son used IEW SWI B. This helped him loosen up a lot about writing. He began to see it as less onerous although we never completed the program (planning to do the rest of it this year!). Grammar for Middle School by Don and Jenny Killgallon helped with his sentence variety. He developed an ability to write more complex and interesting senteces using their mimicking technique.

Figuratively Speaking from The Learning Works. My kids learned soo much from this book and ended up writing very nice quality responses to the questions.

 

I'd recommend you check out magazines from the library (if possible) with short essays in them. Discover Kids, Muse, Cricket, etc. were all good choices for my kids. Read some together, or just discuss the different techniques used to introduce the topic, develop the ideas and then wrap it all up. Reading these kinds of short essays helped my kids get a feel for the kind of writing expected of them.

Good luck!

[Food4Thought]

You have gotten some excellent advice (which I am saving up for later!). I just wanted to alert you to one *free* resource that can be a lot of fun.

 

Every November is National Novel Writing Month, and NaNoWriMo also puts on the Young Writer's Program. They have a TON of great resources on their website that help with crafting creative fiction. It might be a fun way to get started in one kind of writing, at least. FWIW, I've done it the last two years with my son, and he's already planning a character for this year's story. If you choose to participate during November, you can set your own goals for kids (the goal is 50,000 words for the regular contest).

[TeaCookiesBears]

Of course one subject can make or break you!

 

With any skill, when we struggle and hate it, it is because we don't know HOW to do it. Often we are not encouraged to go ALL the way back to where the problem is.

 

I had to go back to k-3 phonics/spelling and writing to get to the START of my problems.

 

I quickly reviewed the Amish Climbing to Good English 2 and am now doing every lesson in 3. I also like Understanding Writing that is often available used at Exodus Books for $25.00. It focuses on using the friendly letter to teach as much of general writing as possible.

 

I too am focusing mostly on sentences right now.

 

I think am going to have to look at those book myself as I realized a few years ago that I needed to go back that far myself. It's nice to know that I am not the only one having to do this. :001_smile:

[Teachin'Mine]

A couple of writing programs I've looked at exhibit poor writing IMO. From what I've seen of SWB's latest writing program, I would use that without hesitation.

 

I'd also recommend having your children write more - not less. It doesn't have to be formal papers - especially in the younger years. Just let them get in the habit of writing often. They can write stories, keep a journal, write about places they've been, etc.. I don't think it's even necessarily important to correct or grade this writing, it's more for them to get used to writing and even learn to enjoy writing.

[Hunter]

I like the Amish materials for extensive remediation, because they are designed to prepare a student for LIFE rather than high school. They are packing some weighty topics into early grades, but making it as easy as possible and starting from ground zero.

 

Amish children speak English as their secondary language and are taught by teachers with only an 8th grade education in a large, mixed age classroom. It is truly amazing what they accomplish by grade 8.

 

Climbing to Good English spends a lot of time starting in grade 2, teaching the phonetic pronunciation system of dictionaries. They call it respelling. I cannot imagine using book 2 to teach ELS 7 year olds :-0 The handwritten friendly letter is introduced.

 

Grade 3 extensively reviews the respelling exercises and then really gets into handwritten letters and composition. The friendly letter instructions help support Understanding Writing.

 

Some of grade 3 is babyish, but I've been amusing myself by keeping a mystery theme going through the babyish writing assignments, that won't be revealed for many lessons yet.

 

And I have been doing the handwriting lessons in Writing Road to Reading, so when a lesson is super easy, I use it as handwriting practice. I'm not skipping anything anymore, because I almost skipped a few things, and after starting them, I realized that they included far more than I first thought they did.

 

I just think one of the most important ideas that is NOT being talked about on homeschool forums is the need to go WAY back when remediating. And sometimes when going way back, moving through the materials at regular pace--not quickly--is what will be required. Sometimes we waste incredible amounts of time trying to find shortcuts.

[MyThreeSons]

The one thing that stresses me out about homeschooling is writing.

.....snip .....

 

So, have any of you ever had high schooler's graduate, move onto college, and be successful at their English courses with a minimum of writing experience? Have you ever just kept things really simple for writing and had it work out in a positive way? Or am I just kidding myself here?

 

 

We have done lots of reading, and lots of discussion about what we've read, but I haven't made my guys write nearly as much as I ought to have, I'm afraid. Our co-op does IEW starting in the elementary years, but we didn't join until my guys were in middle school, and I didn't want them to do the class with much younger kids, so we haven't ever done it. (Yes, I know we could have done it on our own at home, but I really wasn't impressed with the formulaic method I saw.)

 

I just sent an email to the teacher of youngest ds's Essay Writing class at our co-op. I thought the class was going to be more remedial than it has been this first week. I don't think we're going to be able to meet his expectations. Of particular concern to me is that he specifies that the student is to receive NO help from the parent at any point in the writing process. My son simply isn't at the point where I can tell him "this is your topic" and have him come up with a 500 word essay without some guidance.

 

Middle ds didn't get much formal writing instruction, either. He placed out of Freshman Composition at college, though. He also did very well on the grammar quiz he took the first week of class. He may not be able to identify all of the parts of speech and such, but he can identify proper and improper usage when he sees it.

 

I do wish that I had done more formal writing with both of them, though.

[Janice in NJ]

I would like to second (third) the rec for Susan's new book.

 

You don't have to have a complete understanding of the process. You just have to do each lesson as listed. Four times a week. Faithfully. (I know this is hard. I know. But I would really like to encourage you to do this now. Even though it's hard. :grouphug:) Susan's student edition is written to the student, but she offers plenty of additional guidance for the parent in the instructor's guide.

 

I would heartily recommend that you face this issue head-on this year. It doesn't get better over time. This time next year, you'll be glad to be headed in a good direction. :001_smile:

 

First few weeks of the program are available for download. Print the pdfs and get started this week. Really. Just do it! You'll be glad you did. :001_smile:

 

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=303489

 

 

Peace,

Janice

 

Enjoy your little people

Enjoy your journey

[Candid]

I hope you've been convinced writing is important. I have been using SWB's Plan for Teaching Writing talks as my guide. It is easy to set this up and do it. I can't think of a better spent $8.

 

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/store/middle-grades-mp3.html

 

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/store/high-school-years-mp3.html

[Pamela in VA]

I have not read every other reply in depth, but thought I'd tell you writing was my biggest apprehension also. I'm a math and science person, so I'm comfortable writing in that manner, but literature type papers are another animal altogether.

 

I will say that the one comment I hear/read over and over from colleges about many homeschool students is that their biggest area of weakness is writing. So, I would second all those who have encouraged you to deal with it now. Just eat the elephant one bite at a time.

 

I don't remember the ages of your children, but I think the value of copywork and dictation are so important that it is never too late to start if you haven't done this before. This is the ONLY kind of writing my dc did until late grammar stage. We also did lots of narration ala WTM/CM methods.

 

Dc are now 8th and 9th grades and have finished 3 years of IEW. For me, it provides step-by-step instruction in a gradual manner that I can learn to evaluate objectively. We will be continuing with IEW courses throughout HS.

 

However, we have also used parts of SWB's WWE and I think we will try some of the new WWS materials that are online for free. SWB says they can be used starting 5th grade all the way through HS if writers are inexperienced. It is gentle but thorough.

 

Good Luck. We'll look forward to hearing what you decide to do.

 

Blessings,

Pamela

[SailorMom]

I love to write, but my sons hate it. They are their father's children :)

Anyway - when they were younger we did a lot more creative type writing. I was hoping they'd get into it. They never did.

Now - with my 8th grade ds - I am focusing on skills that I know he will need for college. He will be some kind of science major- so I doubt creative writing will be all that necesarry to him.

Last year he wrote multiple 5 page papers - research papers, not stories. They had to be well thought out, have a thesis statement, correct grammar and spelling, interesting sentence structure, a good conclusion, and adequate supporting facts. I didn't ding him for not being a natural, creative writer, or for not having 'pulled me in' with interest :)

He is doing Write-Shop, which I consider more creative. I like that the curriculum picks apart every single sentence, and he focuses on the one paragraph for days! He, however, hates it :) I am hoping it will give him tools he'll need.

I do think it is vitally important that dc are able to write well - at least in a technical manner if not in a 'sweep you away' ficton manner :)