creekmom Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 A friend of a friend uses this with her ds, and he absolutely loves history now. I've never heard of it before - do any of you use it? Opinions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiobrain Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 I do. We love it. Plan on using it as long as I can. I don't have any time to go into it now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oakblossoms Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 I am curious, too. Would it work alongside HOAW? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiobrain Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 I have a few more minutes. I am not sure how many people use it on this list, but in my real life I know 6 people who do. We all love it. If your kid is not at all auditory, it probably won't fly. I have only done the upper elementary levels, European & U.S., recordings only. You wouldn't think it would be interesting, listening to a class full of kids on a phone-in class...but it is. Mr. Powell is very good. His content is good, his visuals.. maps, timelines, art etc. are very excellent. There are extensive class notes, and tests. He is moving out of the country this year, so next year will be wonky. I think he is also starting a Science at our House, and this year he had a Music at our House. He only teaches the history, other people will teach other subjects. He does have sample lectures, some you tube videos and other sample stuff at his site. Some people here will point out that he is an Objectivist (Ayn Rand fan) but I have done 2 full years of his program and have found nothing that I disagreed with. I have gone more in-depth with some parts, but in general... it is totally solid. I don't know if that means that I am a closet Objectivist (I have never read an Ayn Rand book, and don't really care to) or if his approach is just very straightforward and sensible. Of my 6 friends who use it IRL, I have 2 very liberal friends, 2 more conservative and 2 middle of the road, non-religious independents. None have had any issues on content or slant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creekmom Posted June 30, 2011 Author Share Posted June 30, 2011 I have a few more minutes. I am not sure how many people use it on this list, but in my real life I know 6 people who do. We all love it. If your kid is not at all auditory, it probably won't fly. I have only done the upper elementary levels, European & U.S., recordings only. You wouldn't think it would be interesting, listening to a class full of kids on a phone-in class...but it is. Mr. Powell is very good. His content is good, his visuals.. maps, timelines, art etc. are very excellent. There are extensive class notes, and tests. He is moving out of the country this year, so next year will be wonky. I think he is also starting a Science at our House, and this year he had a Music at our House. He only teaches the history, other people will teach other subjects. He does have sample lectures, some you tube videos and other sample stuff at his site. Some people here will point out that he is an Objectivist (Ayn Rand fan) but I have done 2 full years of his program and have found nothing that I disagreed with. I have gone more in-depth with some parts, but in general... it is totally solid. I don't know if that means that I am a closet Objectivist (I have never read an Ayn Rand book, and don't really care to) or if his approach is just very straightforward and sensible. Of my 6 friends who use it IRL, I have 2 very liberal friends, 2 more conservative and 2 middle of the road, non-religious independents. None have had any issues on content or slant. Thank you for this information. So, by "wonky" do you mean he will only have sporadic lessons? Does he give you a link to print out maps/notes/etc.? Do you feel that your kids retained the information? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 (edited) He does have sample lectures, some you tube videos and other sample stuff at his site. Some people here will point out that he is an Objectivist (Ayn Rand fan) but I have done 2 full years of his program and have found nothing that I disagreed with. I have gone more in-depth with some parts, but in general... it is totally solid. I don't know if that means that I am a closet Objectivist (I have never read an Ayn Rand book, and don't really care to) or if his approach is just very straightforward and sensible. Of my 6 friends who use it IRL, I have 2 very liberal friends, 2 more conservative and 2 middle of the road, non-religious independents. None have had any issues on content or slant. Some people would be me. I have listened to Mr Powel's sample lectures and it is absolutely clear that his Objectivist worldview permeates the lectures. To his credit Mr Powell does not deny that Objectivism informs the philosphical lens through which he perceives the world and that it does influence the way he teaches. If one does not understand what Objectivism involves and thinks it is just being a fan of "Ayn Rand" I would strongly advise one dig a little deeper before persuing this option. Read Ayn Rand's compilation of essasys called The Virtue of Selfishness if you want to read about her egoist philosophy in a nut-shell. Beyond the issue of Objectivism in the lectures, I was very unimpressed with Mr Powell's lectures on history and politics. I though they were misinformed and laughably bad at times. In addition they do have a clear objective (no pun intended) to get young children to develop Objectivist world-views. I would not touch this with a ten-foot pole. Bill Edited July 1, 2011 by Spy Car Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 We've used HaoH for 2 years now. Here's my review. I'll post more information separately. A little background on our history studies thus far: We used SOTW in 2nd-5th grades and loved it. We used History Odyssey in 6th-7th grade and tolerated it. In my search for a secular history program that that would not bore ds to death (as I had been bored to death by history all my school years), I found History at our House. History at our House website is http://www.historyatourhouse.com. The website is difficult to navigate. Scott Powell teaches history via conference call 4 days/wk, with 1 day devoted to history through art, to students from 2nd grade through high school. He teaches in a 3 year rotation: Ancient History, European History, and American History. We participated in European History in the 2009-2010 school year and American History in the 2010-2011 school year. 4x per week live participation is available for $75/mo. 1x per week live participation is available for $35/mo. No live participation (all recordings) is available for $20/mo. My son is in the junior high class. He participates live 1x per week. Pros: • Passionate, knowledgeable (actually brilliant) teacher • Teacher answers all questions easily • History through art is outstanding • Ancillary items (maps, family trees, timelines, pictures) • History is being logically presented • Thorough tests (administered and graded by parent with provided grading key) • Occasional homework assignments (knowledge web, historical dates, written narrations, facts practice, timeline) • Class notes are nice summary, but arrive late in the week • Lots of review (due to drawbacks of audio only and no text), but this also insures that students retain more of the information presented • Respectful of different faiths • Monthly payments (as opposed to payment in full in spring for fall start) Cons: • Audio only. Students don’t know how to spell unfamiliar names/places (ex. Godfrey de Bouillon). IMO, this makes it difficult to retain information because it’s difficult to remember material that has been presented. • No text or reference material with a table of contents or index. IMO, this makes it difficult to retain information because it is difficult to reference material that has been presented. • Class relies heavily on memorization due to no reference materials. • Little assistance with supplemental literature • Regular parent and/or student maintenance needed since many ancillary maps, pictures, timelines, etc. are not available until shortly before class time. Even class syllabus is not available until first day of class. • Mapwork seems totally unrelated to lectures • Home printer gets a workout • Free technology challenges (speed dialing in the midst of a call, static on the line, noisy surroundings) Both Pro and Con: • Because there is no text and there is a lot of review, the pace of the class is slow. The scope and sequence is a fraction of what a typical history class would cover, imo. OTOH, what the students learn, they retain well because they have repeated it so many times. Having completed Story of the World, I am saddened to realize that my son will not be exposed again to the Crystal Palace, the Opium Wars, samurais, and more. Overall, I appreciate Scott Powell’s engaging presentation of history. If I could change one thing about the class, I would use WebEx technology in order to have a whiteboard and in order to have the teacher and all the students able to look at a piece of art, a map, a hierarchy, a timeline, or another image all at the same time. It would be more professional, would engage my student better, and would help my student to retain more quickly the information that is being presented. At the same time, I asked my son to rank all his curriculum on a scale of 1-10 at the end of the year. HaoH received a 10. High praise, indeed, from a sullen teen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiobrain Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 (edited) Some people would be me. I have listened to Mr Powel's sample lectures and it is absolutely clear that his Objectivist worldview permiates the lectures. To his credit Mr Powell does not deny that Objectivism informs the philosphical lens through which he perceives the world and that it does influence the way he teaches. If one does not understand what Objectivism involves and thinks it is just being a fan of "Ayn Rand" I would strongly advise one dig a little deeper before persuing this option. Read Ayn Rand's compilation of essasys called The Virtue of Selfishness if you want to read about her egoist philosophy in a nut-shell. Beyond the issue of Objectivism in the lectures, I was very unimpressed with Mr Powell's lectures on history and politics. I though they were misinformed and laughably bad at times. In addition they do have a clear objective (no pun intended) to get young children to develop Objectivist world-views. I would not touch this with a ten-foot pole. Bill Yes, Bill... that would be you. :D I understand your problem with Objectivism, and it just doesn't phase me, effect me, sway me. I have used his program for 2 years, and I find nothing in it objectionable. Now, I do not know what lectures are samples, and when they were recorded. I only use the Upper elementary so far, I have not listened to any others. I also don't see the world exactly through your lens, and that's totally cool. ;) However, because of your previous posts... I thought I should put that there out front, in the middle of my review. The end. Anyway, there is no need to get our panties in a bunch. I have had a horrible day. :tongue_smilie: As far as the wonkiness, I think he is only doing 2 classes live next year (I think High school & Upper Elem.), instead of 4. So, that is sort of what I mean. Unless your kid is in one of his new classes it will be only old recordings available. He is also toying with some web-ex technology (my computer doesn't like it) and digital whiteboard stuff. You know it can't be all that bad if I like it. Come on Bill, I'm awesome. :D Edited July 1, 2011 by radiobrain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trish Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 Sounds like it might make a nice supplement to the other stuff I have planned. I will at least check out the samples. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 Yes, Bill... that would be you. :D I understand your problem with Objectivism, and it just doesn't phase me, effect me, sway me. I have used his program for 2 years, and I find nothing in it objectionable. Now, I do not know what lectures are samples, and when they were recorded. I only use the Upper elementary so far, I have not listened to any others. I also don't see the world exactly through your lens, and that's totally cool. ;) However, because of your previous posts... I thought I should put that there out front, in the middle of my review. The end. Anyway, there is no need to get our panties in a bunch. I have had a horrible day. :tongue_smilie: As far as the wonkiness, I think he is only doing 2 classes live next year (I think High school & Upper Elem.), instead of 4. So, that is sort of what I mean. Unless your kid is in one of his new classes it will be only old recordings available. He is also toying with some web-ex technology (my computer doesn't like it) and digital whiteboard stuff. You know it can't be all that bad if I like it. Come on Bill, I'm awesome. :D I'm sorry you've had a horrible day :001_smile: Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiobrain Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 I'm sorry you've had a horrible day :001_smile: Bill You have no idea. I am about ready to ship my 12 year old to a boot camp or to have a lobotomy. I haven't decided which. :D I spilled gasoline all over my favorite pants. We are out of wine, and there is not anything to mix my vodka with but milk. You get the idea.... :glare: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creekmom Posted July 1, 2011 Author Share Posted July 1, 2011 Thanks everyone!- Sue, I was hoping you would respond bc I read in one of your posts that you were going to try it this year. I really appreciate your thorough reviews! I love SOTW also and wish she had a logic stage history curriculum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 (edited) Okay. Let me write down some random thoughts. I have a degree in math. I'm fairly weak in every other subject. The way history was taught to me in school had me bored out of my gourd. I seriously learned very little history in my school education. I loved SOTW. I love HaoH. History is fascinating! My son enjoys history 1000x more than I ever did. I have listened to every lecture over the last 2 years. That's 200+ lectures (not counting the art lectures). Maybe 2x a year I hear something objectivist-ish that I need to discuss with my son because I don't quite agree. Sometimes, Scott Powell will go on a rant generally about the sad state of history education in the US or how people don't understand that this country was established as a republic meant to protect individual rights not a democracy. We especially discuss his rants. Sometimes, I agree with him. Sometimes, I don't. Bill could probably find lots of examples of evil in his lectures. I don't claim to be the brightest crayon in the box. Bill has me terrified of Objectivism. I've tried to read some of the Ayn Rand books, but I don't get far. I did watch Fountainhead on DVD, borrowed from the library. I was not really impressed. The best description I've seen of it came from a newspaper story: Individualism untempered by common decency. From what I can gather of it, that seems about right to me. Not my cup of tea. Where I see Scott's objectivist nature come out is in his single-minded focus on doing only what he wants to do. Here is an example. We have used the call in 1x a week option ($35/mo) for the last 2 years. Next year, ds will be high school. That option is no longer available. High school prices double (recordings $20->$40/mo or live $75->$150/mo). If we continue with HaoH, we will move to recordings mainly because we cannot be tied to a certain time of day, but also $150/mo is a lot of money!). At the junior high level, Scott provides a grading key for the 6 tests. At the high school level, he says he must grade the tests himself for his live clients because he couldn't possibly provide a grading key because the nature of the questions is too open-ended. That leaves anyone who uses the recordings at the high school level to find their own way to evaluate their student's work. I asked if I could pay for that additional service, but he was very reluctant and would not commit to it. I not only consider this unprofessional, but short sighted. But, he will provide only what he wants to provide. I've had my panties in a twist a few times over the last 2 years due to issues like this. My husband can attest to it. ;) As to next year, my understanding is that he will only have live classes for upper elementary and high school. Lower elementary and junior high will be recordings only from 3 years ago. If your student really wants the live interaction and they are lower elementary or junior high age, you are out of luck. As you can see from my review, I don't whole-heartedly recommend HaoH. However, if there is a better secular history program post-SOTW, I haven't found it. Had I discovered K12's Human Odyssey, I would have tried that before HaoH. Since it's only a year long middle school program (I think), I'd still be in the same quandry. I've checked out SWB's HoAW twice from the library. IMO, it's meaty enough for adults. My high schooler would find it way over his head. HTH! Edited July 1, 2011 by Sue in St Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 I am about ready to ship my 12 year old to a boot camp or to have a lobotomy. I haven't decided which. :D One day, someone came knocking on my door wanting to sell me something. I told them the only thing I was buying that day was military boarding school... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 I have listened to Mr Powel's sample lectures and it is absolutely clear that his Objectivist worldview permeates the lectures. For the heck of it, could you cite specific examples? :bigear: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 Can 2 children in the home participate in the live class for one level price or does each child pay? I looked all over and it didn't seem to be addressed on the site. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 Can 2 children in the home participate in the live class for one level price or does each child pay? I looked all over and it didn't seem to be addressed on the site. :) It is my understanding that you pay by level, not by student. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 Thanks Sue! That is good news! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt_Uhura Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 As you can see from my review, I don't whole-heartedly recommend HaoH. However, if there is a better secular history program post-SOTW, I haven't found it. Had I discovered K12's Human Odyssey, I would have tried that before HaoH. Since it's only a year long middle school program (I think), I'd still be in the same quandry. HTH! I'm unclear what you mean by the above statement. There are three K12 Human Odyssey books. I don't even think the K12 course covers all of the first book the first year. There are teacher/student guides for the first 2 books but not for the third. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 (edited) I'm unclear what you mean by the above statement. There are three K12 Human Odyssey books. I don't even think the K12 course covers all of the first book the first year. There are teacher/student guides for the first 2 books but not for the third. I don't really know anything about Human Odyssey. I heard about them after we had started down the HaoH path. Are they intended for 6th-7th-8th then? If I had to do it all over again, I would investigate them before deciding upon HoaH. Hope that is clearer. Edited July 1, 2011 by Sue in St Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiobrain Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 (edited) Sue~ I appreciate you re-posting your in depth review and your follow-up. I think you and I are the only people who use it on the forums (or at least who will bother to reply about it). I, too, have listened to every single lecture, and just haven't had as many things pop out at me as you have. Maybe it is the level, maybe it is that I don't get my feathers ruffled easily. I naturally discuss things with my kids whenever I find it necessary, about anything, so I just don't think I notice it as much. I also haven't ever done anything other than the recorded lectures, and they don't have the high-school issue you are encountering... so it doesn't matter. I hope by the time that we get that far (if I continue using it), he will have figured something out. :) So, again, I have had a different experience than you, as I always will. I have not experienced the Mr.Powell ego, that you are describing, but I would say that you could chock that up to his being an Objectivist, or that he is just inflexible about certain things. I know tons of people like that IRL who are just jerks about certain things, that have nothing to do with their worldview. My kids actually are at the perfect age for the K12 Human Odyssey, but my kids do not need another book. They enjoy listening to the cds in the car, answering the questions, having discussions, playing legos while learning about Napoleon or the Industrial Revolution... it is a nice change in format from everything else we do. I have never found a curriculum (even MCT) that is absolutely perfect. As far as secular history goes, this is top notch, IMHO. The geography component is excellent. I love the art portion, even though I usually don't get around to it. However, whichever posted said something like... "this looks like it will be a good supplement", um, I would disagree. It is too involved and expensive to be a supplement. It is a full program, that you can supplement. :D Hopefully, today will be better than yesterday. My fingers are crossed. Edited July 1, 2011 by radiobrain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripe Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 I have seen Ray post about it, but he doesn't post too often. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt_Uhura Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 I don't really know anything about Human Odyssey. I heard about them after we had started down the HaoH path. Are they intended for 6th-7th-8th then? If I had to do it all over again, I would investigate them before deciding upon HoaH. Hope that is clearer. Yes, it's clearer, thanks! Just wanted to make sure I wasn't mis-reading you. I think the first K12 Human Odyssey book is 7th grade. Looks like there are two courses. Intermediate WOrld History A which covers Prehistory through MIddle AGes vol1 and Intermediate World History B which covers 1400-1917. They are listed as 7th and 8th grades. I don't see where the K12 HUman Odyssey Vol3 is used but presumably it would be after 8th grade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 I have not experienced the Mr.Powell ego, that you are describing, but I would say that you could chock that up to his being an Objectivist, or that he is just inflexible about certain things. The times I've had my panties in a twist were due to ego issues (perhaps his vs. mine). I have no problem with the content of the class. However, whichever posted said something like... "this looks like it will be a good supplement", um, I would disagree. It is too involved and expensive to be a supplement. It is a full program, that you can supplement. :D :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 Okay. Let me write down some random thoughts. I have a degree in math. I'm fairly weak in every other subject. The way history was taught to me in school had me bored out of my gourd. I seriously learned very little history in my school education. I loved SOTW. I love HaoH. History is fascinating! My son enjoys history 1000x more than I ever did. I have listened to every lecture over the last 2 years. That's 200+ lectures (not counting the art lectures). Maybe 2x a year I hear something objectivist-ish that I need to discuss with my son because I don't quite agree. Sometimes, Scott Powell will go on a rant generally about the sad state of history education in the US or how people don't understand that this country was established as a republic meant to protect individual rights not a democracy. We especially discuss his rants. Sometimes, I agree with him. Sometimes, I don't. Bill could probably find lots of examples of evil in his lectures. I don't claim to be the brightest crayon in the box. Bill has me terrified of Objectivism. I've tried to read some of the Ayn Rand books, but I don't get far. I did watch Fountainhead on DVD, borrowed from the library. I was not really impressed. The best description I've seen of it came from a newspaper story: Individualism untempered by common decency. From what I can gather of it, that seems about right to me. Not my cup of tea. Where I see Scott's objectivist nature come out is in his single-minded focus on doing only what he wants to do. Here is an example. We have used the call in 1x a week option ($35/mo) for the last 2 years. Next year, ds will be high school. That option is no longer available. High school prices double (recordings $20->$40/mo or live $75->$150/mo). If we continue with HaoH, we will move to recordings mainly because we cannot be tied to a certain time of day, but also $150/mo is a lot of money!). At the junior high level, Scott provides a grading key for the 6 tests. At the high school level, he says he must grade the tests himself for his live clients because he couldn't possibly provide a grading key because the nature of the questions is too open-ended. That leaves anyone who uses the recordings at the high school level to find their own way to evaluate their student's work. I asked if I could pay for that additional service, but he was very reluctant and would not commit to it. I not only consider this unprofessional, but short sighted. But, he will provide only what he wants to provide. I've had my panties in a twist a few times over the last 2 years due to issues like this. My husband can attest to it. ;) As to next year, my understanding is that he will only have live classes for upper elementary and high school. Lower elementary and junior high will be recordings only from 3 years ago. If your student really wants the live interaction and they are lower elementary or junior high age, you are out of luck. As you can see from my review, I don't whole-heartedly recommend HaoH. However, if there is a better secular history program post-SOTW, I haven't found it. Had I discovered K12's Human Odyssey, I would have tried that before HaoH. Since it's only a year long middle school program (I think), I'd still be in the same quandry. I've checked out SWB's HoAW twice from the library. IMO, it's meaty enough for adults. My high schooler would find it way over his head. HTH! Hey Sue, You know I'm a fan of your (and of Radiohead) so I don't want to cause you any upset. You really deserve to have a better understanding of Objectivism and Objectivist premises so you can understand the means by which this cult (and yes it is a cult) operates. The newspaper description of Objectivism as "individualism untempered by common decency" only gets one a small part of the way there. It gets worse. Objectivists believe there are 3 classes of people. At bottom (where almost all people dwell) are the "Moral Parasites" who suck of the talents, hard-work, and creative efforts of the "Creatives." Without their parasitic leeching off the talents of others Objectivists believe these masses would--if cut off from from the fruits of the Creatives labors--wither and die. This is exactly what Ayn Rand thinks ought to happen; it is the theme of her novels that the Creatives withdraw and the Moral Parasites get their due. The Third Class of persons is limited to one person: Ayn Rand herself. She is "The Objectivist." The modern-day philosopher law-giver who reigns above all. She is (or was, because she is long gone) akin to Nietzsche's Übermensch. A creature who is under no compulsion to follow the laws of the Moral Parasites, not follow the laws of the Creatives, but is the shining individual who makes her own law. What is good for her (the individual) is GOOD. Altruism (anything that would aid the Mental Parasites) is evil. The whole Western Tradition of morality is out the window. Rand was rabidly-atheistic (which I mention as a person who is not religious himself) and beyond a "lack of belief in a deity" believed Christianity and Christian notions of charity, loving ones neighbor, etc. were gravely evil. Christianity, in her view, was a system designed to help the Moral Parasites exploit the Creatives. Nothing more, nothing less. The things most of us might (and here I refer to the religious and non-religious alike) consider "good" are the very thinks Rand considers "evil." ANYTHING that in any way detracts from personal self-interest is "evil." Selfishness is the ultimate virtue. Of course an Objectivist would teach against Democracy. Democracy is a means for the Moral Parasites (being in the extreme majority) to suppress the Creatives and steal their efforts. If an Objectivist decides it is not in his or her interest to conduct a business relationship with someone who is leeching off his or her creative brain-power it would be evil to give onto what Moral Parasites might call "human decency" (feelings like loyalty, obligation or other such sentimentalities) if it went against what was best for oneself. I hope you understand this. Here is a small excerpt for Rand herself, it is on a scratch on the surface of her ideology, but it is a start: The standard of value of the Objectivist ethics—the standard by which one judges what is good or evil—is man’s life, or: that which is required for man’s survival qua man. Since reason is man’s basic means of survival, that which is proper to the life of a rational being is the good; that which negates, opposes or destroys it is the evil. Since everything man needs has to be discovered by his own mind and produced by his own effort, the two essentials of the method of survival proper to a rational being are: thinking and productive work. If some men do not choose to think, but survive by imitating and repeating, like trained animals, the routine of sounds and motions they learned from others, never making an effort to understand their own work, it still remains true that their survival is made possible only by those who did choose to think and to discover the motions they are repeating. The survival of such mental parasites depends on blind chance; their unfocused minds are unable to know whom to imitate, whose motions it is safe to follow. They are the men who march into the abyss, trailing after any destroyer who promises them to assume the responsibility they evade: the responsibility of being conscious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 Bill, you are obviously well versed about Ayn Rand and her philosophy. It certainly doesn't sound appealing to me. But, I still don't understand exactly what you heard in Scott Powell's sample lectures that made it absolutely clear that his Objectivist worldview permeates the lectures. Can you elaborate on what you heard? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiobrain Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 (edited) It's RADIOBRAIN not radiohead, Bill. ;) It is a long, sordid and ultimately boring story. Inside baseball. If you knew me in real life you would find it amusing. As a person who always has every name (whether it be my first, middle, maiden, married, band name or homeschool name) mispronounced, misspelled or otherwise mangled... you would find it ironic, and funny. Maybe you knew that though, somehow. :D Edited July 1, 2011 by radiobrain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riverland Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 This the first I have heard of HAOH, and it has my interest. I just visited his website, but still haven't figured out the logistics of this program. What exactly do you get for written / printed materials... Tests? Lesson Summaries? Map Work? Worksheets? etc. Is the printed work daily? weekly? Do you get a link that has all of this, or regular emails containing the printed material? How often do you get it....If I do the $20/month option of a prior year's live session, then can I print stuff ahead of time, or is it only available on a day by day basis? I hope those questions make sense.:tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 It's RADIOBRAIN not radiohead, Bill. ;) It is a long, sordid and ultimately boring story. Inside baseball. Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear. Please forgive an old man his senior-moment :D Bill (Dunderhead :tongue_smilie:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 What exactly do you get for written / printed materials... Tests? Lesson Summaries? Map Work? Worksheets? etc. Is the printed work daily? weekly? Do you get a link that has all of this, or regular emails containing the printed material? How often do you get it....If I do the $20/month option of a prior year's live session, then can I print stuff ahead of time, or is it only available on a day by day basis? I hope those questions make sense.:tongue_smilie: You get: - weekly class notes - weekly geography worksheets - occasional maps to go along with the lecture - weekly art - occasional ancillary items (timeline, family tree, etc.) - approx 6 tests (junior high level and up) Everything is at the HaoH website. Once you pay, you get a userid/password. The client area has separate webpages for each month. I haven't done the recordings, but I imagine that the first of each month you would be given access to the next month's webpage. HTH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riverland Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 You get:- weekly class notes HTH! Yes, thank you! That helps a lot. Are the weekly class notes thorough? My DD12 has fine motor skill delays and it would be very hard for her to take complete notes during the lessons. Although, I guess she could listen to the recording multiple times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 Are the weekly class notes thorough? My DD12 has fine motor skill delays and it would be very hard for her to take complete notes during the lessons. Although, I guess she could listen to the recording multiple times. The weekly class notes are succinct. Yes, she could listen to the recording as many times as she likes. Does your dd type? (sorry if that is a very ignorant question) Scott actually suggests that the students do not take notes during the lessons, but retype his class notes. I have ds take notes during the recorded lectures. I don't know of anyone who actually types up the class notes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trish Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 Sue~ However, whichever posted said something like... "this looks like it will be a good supplement", um, I would disagree. It is too involved and expensive to be a supplement. It is a full program, that you can supplement. :D Actually we're planning K-12's the Human Odyssey (Ancients). I was thinking we could listen to this program's lectures alongside that, especially if they are interesting. Six tests doesn't sound like a lot -- plus, I'd have the option on whether to use his, or create my own. What part of this program makes it involved? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiobrain Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 Actually we're planning K-12's the Human Odyssey (Ancients). I was thinking we could listen to this program's lectures alongside that, especially if they are interesting. Six tests doesn't sound like a lot -- plus, I'd have the option on whether to use his, or create my own. What part of this program makes it involved? Well, you would have 4, 30 min. lectures a week. There is a geography portion and whatever other stuff gets thrown in there too. He has a test prep and the test. You have the notes and timelines or whatever (as it varies a bit). It is $20 a month, so around $200 for the year. That much $$ and involvement doesn't shout supplement to me. Now, it might seem like "Hey, that's not a lot... just a little extra History"but it is designed to be a whole and complete history program. Maybe your homeschool is less chaotic and difficult than mine. So, really it is your own choice, but it is a full program and is paced that way. Once again, I really like the format and content of the program, and it works well with my family. I think it is worthwhile persuing, but everyone is different. The tests are quite thorough. 6 is plenty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matryoshka Posted July 3, 2011 Share Posted July 3, 2011 I don't really know anything about Human Odyssey. I heard about them after we had started down the HaoH path. Are they intended for 6th-7th-8th then? If I had to do it all over again, I would investigate them before deciding upon HoaH. K12's Human Odyssey series has three volumes - K12 uses them in 7th, 8th and 9th with their online courses, although if you're using them yourself I think they can easily be used with a wider range of ages. There's apparently also an American Odyssey text they use in high school, but I'm not sure what year. I hear rumors it's also very good. As to HaOH, my friend who uses it with her dd just loves it, but then she's also a die-hard objectivist, so I'm not sure if that clears things up any... :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwg Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Bill, you are obviously well versed about Ayn Rand and her philosophy. It certainly doesn't sound appealing to me. But, I still don't understand exactly what you heard in Scott Powell's sample lectures that made it absolutely clear that his Objectivist worldview permeates the lectures. Can you elaborate on what you heard? :iagree: I too am waiting anxiously to hear. I am not planning on using it soon year but thought I might when ds is older. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trish Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 On the HAOH website they are still talking about the 2010-2011 academic year. When do they normally get ready for the upcoming year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 On the HAOH website they are still talking about the 2010-2011 academic year. When do they normally get ready for the upcoming year? Good question that I cannot answer. It's another thing that irritates this well-planned mom. The best way to find out is to join the yahoo group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mom-ninja. Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 I'm reading Fountainhead right now. I'm finding it fascinating and disturbing. Ok, back to history.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 I'm reading Fountainhead right now. I'm finding it fascinating and disturbing. Maybe you could start a new thread for a discussion of it...I'd be curious to hear opinions! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trish Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 Good question that I cannot answer. It's another thing that irritates this well-planned mom. The best way to find out is to join the yahoo group. Sue, can you tell me what the Yahoo Group is called? I tried History at our house, and HAOH, and didn't come up with anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 (edited) Sue, can you tell me what the Yahoo Group is called? I tried History at our house, and HAOH, and didn't come up with anything. HaoH yahoo group Edited July 15, 2011 by Sue in St Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 I'm unclear what you mean by the above statement. There are three K12 Human Odyssey books. I don't even think the K12 course covers all of the first book the first year. There are teacher/student guides for the first 2 books but not for the third. Ah, I found the K12 information. 7th - The Human Odyssey Volume 1: Prehistory Through the Middle Ages 8th - The Human Odyssey Volume 2: Our Modern World, 1400 to 1914 HS - The Human Odyssey Volume 3: From Modern Times to Our Contemporary Era I wish our library had them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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