clingy older child...question

[ProudGrandma]

first my question...then some background information....

 

How do you handle an almost 11 year old who gets physically upset about being away from you even if she is going into an environment that she is familiar with (people and location)?

 

From the minute my daughter was born, she has preferred being with me over anybody else. In the hospital after she was born she would scream and cry if anybody else tried to hold her or even looked at her (this included her dad...much of the time). I am talking hours old here. And that has not changed. Before we started homeschooling, she would leave here every morning with an upset tummy and crying. I would often get a phone call from school wondering if she was sick. We started homeschooling when she was half way through 2nd grade. I thought after we spent some quality time together she might become more confident and would feel good about branching out and doing more things on her own...but that was 2 1/2 years ago. It's not everytime...but especially if she has to do something completely by herself (without her younger brothers) she is especially bad. She won't spend the night with anybody with out us (which is fine with us...I just find it odd that she doesn't WANT to), she just went to story hour at our library and she was all excited to go...but minutes later I get a phone call from our librarian and she is complaining of a tummy ache and is all nervous about being there...(this is not a new place or with new people)...I made her stay...but I just wonder what I can do to help her...she can't do this forever. I also then get people judging our choice of homeschooling becasue we are "isolating" her and not allowing her to make friends (which is not true)...she should be socializing more...etc. UGH...please help!!!!!

[ProudGrandma]

anybody??

[twoforjoy]

I would consider the possibility of an anxiety disorder, possibly panic disorder or social phobia. I have panic disorder, and I used to have similar reactions when going places at times. It might be less that she's clingy, and more that you are a "safe person" to her, so that when she's in a situation with you, her anxiety is greatly reduced.

[ProudGrandma]

so if this is the case, what can I do to help her...I can't spend the rest of my life by her side...I want her to feel comfortable doing things with friends, without me. We have some really close friends who have a daughter and we do many things together. A while back she invited Hannah to go see a movie at the library with her (familiar place, familiar people) and she was so excited to go...until she found out that I wasn't also going....so then she came up with 25 excuses why she shouldn't/couldn't go. Do I allow her to not go to these types of things...or do I somehow gently push her to do that. Is it a case where the more she does it the better it will get for her...or not so much. I just dont' know what to do.

[heartosunshine]

Poor girl! It sounds like she wants to go have fun with her friends but she feels like she "can't" because of her anxiety. If she is suffering from an anxiety disorder, then she'll need professional help through therapy and/or medication. A good place to start might be her pediatrician.

 

BTW, what a wonderful mom you are for providing her with a place where she can feel safe! :grouphug:

[ProudGrandma]

if she is, I would think it is a mild case...I was wondering if there was something we could do at home to ease her anxiety?

[Joanne]

if she is, I would think it is a mild case...I was wondering if there was something we could do at home to ease her anxiety?

 

Honestly, for her age, the behavior is not developmentally expected or appropriate. I wouldn't call it "mild". Anxiety responds well to meds (if needed) and therapy.

[In The Great White North]

Honestly, for her age, the behavior is not developmentally expected or appropriate.

 

I don't think it's that unusual and I wouldn't rush off to the doctor with her.

 

I have one that was very reluctant to go out on her own. It took not only a place she was familiar with, but a situation/activity she felt competent at. She is becoming more confident as she gets older, but at 11 she still wanted me around.

 

What I did was go with her. She happily went to activites (Scouts, swimming. libraries, etc) when I was in the building. It doesn't last forever. She's 14 now and doesn't really want me around much anymore. :(

 

Some dc just need more time.

 

PS. Pushing her to go when she isn't comfortable just reinforces the feeling of not being comfortable with it and doing it anyway. Not really something I want dds to think they should be doing right before I send them off to college, where lots of people will try to get them to do things they aren't comfortable with.

[july19]

:grouphug:

 

I agree that she shouldn't rush to see a doctor tomorrow, but I feel the need to share my husband's experience. Similar to the OP's, but also different.

 

As a child, he was the exact same way. Hours old, he wanted mommy and only mommy. He only would sleep if she was with him until past 12 months. He was reluctant to do things without his mom and if his two younger brothers weren't doing said activity either, he would come up with 30 excuses why he couldn't. He had stomach pain and panic attacks as a teen. His parents don't believe in psychotherapy or medicine, though and they figured he'd "outgrow" it in time.

 

Please flash forward to college. (He did go to college away from home, but it was to escape his overbearing and verbally abusive father.) His freshman year, Nick became a very sad, scared shell of a human. He became more withdrawn than ever. He managed to complete through his Junior year, believe it or not. But no one paid attention that his anxiety was through the roof even though he kept saying he didn't want to go back to college and that he wasn't okay. His parents kept saying that he was fine, his anxiety was a mild case and that he needed to "buck up" :glare:

 

When he returned home for the summer after Junior year, he reached his worst level: he became a full fledged agoraphobic who would go to the front door, stare out it for a while, cry, and then go back to his room. Finally, his mom noticed what was going on after a few months (Nick isn't exactly the favorite of the boys and tends to get looked past a lot because he isn't a macho sports star like his brothers, he's an intellectual who is sensitive - something that the father considers un-manly and the mom goes along with because he's the man of the family.....ugh). Secretly, behind the dads back, she decides to finally listen to Nick and got him some help - both therapy wise and medicinally.

 

Almost immediately, he was changing for the better. It took a few months to get the right medicine for him, but the therapy sessions were what really made the difference. Just being able to get out the emotions helped him greatly. Being able to express his issues with his parents made him understand himself better. He still isn't healed, though. The therapist lamented when we had a group session one time that if he had been able to have help when he was younger, he could have learned different (and more effective) coping skills. Because every once in a while, he will go through rough patches with his anxiety, stress, trust, etc issues. It'll never go away completely. But I wish his parents had cared about it enough when he was younger. Because now, he will probably never not be on some sort of medication. :crying:

 

I guess my overall point is (took a while, I apologize...I tend to be long-winded...pretty much all the time) if she isn't showing improvement soon, don't wait until she's REALLY bad, you know? At least your home environment is happy and healthy, unlike my husband's. And the fact that you are seeking out ideas to help her shows how much you love and care. Oh how I wish more parents were like you and your husband!

 

Best of luck to you and your family. Oh, and lots more :grouphug:

[TravelingChris]

I agree with Joanne and with July19. I also can relate my experiences with an anxious child. Please get her help. It really isn't just a phase and it will be such a relief for her to get over her anxiety.

[speedmom4]

I have a child who is very similar. He was petrified to do anything without me or my husband. I decided a long time ago that I would let him lead in that area of his life. I would always encourage and support him when he did make an effort to do something without us but even when he wasn't able to do it I never made him feel bad about it. In the past 6 months I have seen a change in him. He is feeling more confidant. He still will not go camping with Boy Scouts without my husband but he did spend a whole day (without sleeping over) with his troop without his dad being there. I just told him how proud I was of him instead of telling him that all the other boys were staying the night.

 

Many people will disagree that I am letting him run the show. But it is only in that situation. I am still the mother. I make decisions for him. But I always felt that if I just let him go as he felt comfortable, eventually he would begin to do things on his own. I have no doubt that in another year or two he will make tremendous progress.

 

I will agree with other posters that it is an anxiety issue. This particular child has always had anxiety. He has some OCD issues, but not horrible. I have tried to be very calm and understanding about his issues but also firm when he has to do something. I try to really encourage him when he does do something that is outside of his comfort zone even if I had to make him do it.

 

I really hope this makes sense and offers some hope.

 

God Bless,

Elise in NC

[Peela]

I am really anti-meds but it does sound like strong anxiety- beyond the normal- and life debilitating. I would go and talk to someone professional.

[twoforjoy]

so if this is the case, what can I do to help her...I can't spend the rest of my life by her side...I want her to feel comfortable doing things with friends, without me. We have some really close friends who have a daughter and we do many things together. A while back she invited Hannah to go see a movie at the library with her (familiar place, familiar people) and she was so excited to go...until she found out that I wasn't also going....so then she came up with 25 excuses why she shouldn't/couldn't go. Do I allow her to not go to these types of things...or do I somehow gently push her to do that. Is it a case where the more she does it the better it will get for her...or not so much. I just dont' know what to do.

 

A lot of it really depends on her, I think, and figuring out what works. It could be something that reading up a bit on anxiety disorders and doing some work at home could help. It could be something that requires the assistance of a therapist trained in cognitive-behavioral therapy. It could be an issue that is greatly helped by medication. There is extremely effective drug treatment for anxiety disorders, and I know that in my case taking an SSRI reduced my symptoms, almost immediately, in a way that years of attempting cognitive and behavioral changes didn't even come close to.

 

There are a lot of books out there on dealing with anxiety disorders. One thing that many people find helpful is leaving their "comfort zone" in controlled steps. It's really, really unhelpful to push a person with anxiety issues into a situation they are anxious about with no skills, and just expect them to get over their fear. That does not work. Once you have a good base of skills for managing anxiety, and practice using them, then, yes, entering really scary situations can be a good thing, but until those skills are there and well-practiced, all you are doing is increasing somebody's anxiety if you force them into a situation they are really anxious in. I know that my parents thought that was the best way to handle my panic disorder (we didn't know what it was at the time): no matter how anxious I was, I had no choice but to do the thing I was supposed to do. It did not help. All it did was make me fear and try to avoid those situations more and more.

 

But, at the same time, allowing somebody to always avoid situations that they find anxiety-producing isn't helpful, either, because that also increases the fear. Every time you are supposed to do something and then don't because you are anxious, you are training yourself to fear and avoid that situation.

 

So it's really a very fine line. I think ideally you'd figure out ways to get her to enter into situations that make her anxious, and to push her a bit out of her comfort zone, but in a way that lets her know that she is in control and that allows her to gradually become more comfortable. Like, if she wants to go to story hour, the first time, maybe you go with her. Then, go to the library, but stay outside of the area where story hour is. Then, maybe go with her, but stay in the car. Let her know that you are there and that if she wants to leave, she can, but encourage her to sit through uncomfortable feelings as long as possible, because they do pass.

 

That is just an example, not some sort of process you'd need to follow. But the basic idea is that you help somebody to enter situations that make them anxious in controlled ways, and then, in baby steps, help them to move further and further out of their comfort zone.

[texasmama]

My general rule is that if anxiety is severely interfering with one's life, it is time to seek out professional help. I would put your dd in this category. I would start with a good therapist who is experienced with kids. Social anxiety (and anxiety in general) is fairly common. Anxiety does not tend to just "go away". Anxious kids tend to become anxious adults. Everyone knows someone who "grew out of it", but it is more common for kids to continue to suffer from anxiety. I favor early intervention and help. There are specific techniques to address anxiety which can be taught by a good therapist. If these are not successful, then sometimes medications are used. The medications used wth kids tend not to be addictive benzodiapines sometimes used for adults but the SSRI antidepressants, lest anyone fear that their child might be "drugged up".

 

This is said from the perspective of a professional, as well as from the perspective of a mom with an anxious child. My child's anxiety is not evidenced socially, but I have taken him to therapy in the past to address his anxiety.

[Joanne]

I don't think it's that unusual and I wouldn't rush off to the doctor with her.

 

I have one that was very reluctant to go out on her own. It took not only a place she was familiar with, but a situation/activity she felt competent at. She is becoming more confident as she gets older, but at 11 she still wanted me around.

 

What I did was go with her. She happily went to activites (Scouts, swimming. libraries, etc) when I was in the building. It doesn't last forever. She's 14 now and doesn't really want me around much anymore. :(

 

Some dc just need more time.

 

PS. Pushing her to go when she isn't comfortable just reinforces the feeling of not being comfortable with it and doing it anyway. Not really something I want dds to think they should be doing right before I send them off to college, where lots of people will try to get them to do things they aren't comfortable with.

 

You've made a lot of assumptions in response to my post.

 

I attach no stigma to seeking medical/professional help for mental illness. I attach no stigma to *having* a mental illness. Going to a Dr. for anxiety is no different for me than going to a Dr. for an ear infection.

 

And, since mental illness involves the body and thinking, seeking professional support in the form of counseling is also not a stigma to me. The level of anxiety shown by the OP is pathologic - meaning it is more than expected and normal for the situation and age.

 

Don't assume the answer I suggest is "pushing them into it". I never stated such a thing. Pushing an anxious person into something, sans professional guidance will only exacerbate the anxiety and would be counter-therapeutic.

 

I think that allowing/fostering/not assisting with moving a child to a developmentally appropriate level of supervision and attachment is a form of neglect. It's not an improvement or "good" parenting. It's bad parenting of a specific kind.

[Starr]

I have a friend that would sit in the room at an activity and then the next week move outside of the room and always wait. Slowly over the years it has gotten better but the anxiety continues.

[sbgrace]

Poor sweet thing. It does sound like anxiety to me.

 

I had anxiety as a child. My parents didn't seek professional help until I graduated from high school and fell apart going to college. I so wish I had professional help early in life.

 

Because of my experience I would address an issue like this in my child as young as I possibly could. There are many effective therapy techniques for anxiety.

 

I think it's great that you're seeking help by posting this. I wish my parents had thought to get opinions and ideas like you are doing for your daughter. Knowing what I know I believe your daughter would benefit a lot from professional help.

[Terabith]

My daughter has always been very similar, even though she is much younger. (She just turned six.) Even at that age, it was seriously impacting her ability to socialize with friends, even if I was in the room. It was getting worse and preventing her from doing things she wanted to do. She was getting anxious when she was left alone in a room, while I went to the kitchen, for example. She would want to watch tv in the living room, but if I wasn't there, she just couldn't.

 

For other reasons, we took her to a developmental pediatrician. They thought she had Aspergers, but I did not believe that diagnosis, although she DID look very Aspergers-y. Further testing ruled it out, and the doctor strongly recommended a low dose of celexa. I was incredibly reluctant to do that, since I am bipolar, and I was worried an SSRI would trigger mania. We did some therapy, but she wasn't really responding. We finally started the celexa, and the difference has been incredible. It's not like she is a different kid, but she is so much more self-confident. Her personality was able to be seen by others. Her ability to learn academic skills has improved, because she is not constantly battling with anxiety. Her preschool teacher said she did seem like a different kid, because she was interacting and playing with the other kids. She actually got in trouble for talking a few times! She can go into other rooms in the house, and she is much more confident trying new things and playing with other kids. She is still on the cautious, anxious side, but she is able to cope. The panic attacks have pretty much stopped, and she can play and learn. I never thought I would put a five year old on medication, but it has made a tremendous difference in her life and the life of our family.

 

At eleven, I do think this is a big problem. I would definitely consider therapy and medication.

[twoforjoy]

My daughter has always been very similar, even though she is much younger. (She just turned six.) Even at that age, it was seriously impacting her ability to socialize with friends, even if I was in the room. It was getting worse and preventing her from doing things she wanted to do. She was getting anxious when she was left alone in a room, while I went to the kitchen, for example. She would want to watch tv in the living room, but if I wasn't there, she just couldn't.

 

For other reasons, we took her to a developmental pediatrician. They thought she had Aspergers, but I did not believe that diagnosis, although she DID look very Aspergers-y. Further testing ruled it out, and the doctor strongly recommended a low dose of celexa. I was incredibly reluctant to do that, since I am bipolar, and I was worried an SSRI would trigger mania. We did some therapy, but she wasn't really responding. We finally started the celexa, and the difference has been incredible. It's not like she is a different kid, but she is so much more self-confident. Her personality was able to be seen by others. Her ability to learn academic skills has improved, because she is not constantly battling with anxiety. Her preschool teacher said she did seem like a different kid, because she was interacting and playing with the other kids. She actually got in trouble for talking a few times! She can go into other rooms in the house, and she is much more confident trying new things and playing with other kids. She is still on the cautious, anxious side, but she is able to cope. The panic attacks have pretty much stopped, and she can play and learn. I never thought I would put a five year old on medication, but it has made a tremendous difference in her life and the life of our family.

 

At eleven, I do think this is a big problem. I would definitely consider therapy and medication.

 

I'm really glad things worked out so well for your daughter.

 

SSRIs can work incredibly well for anxiety disorders. In fact, it's my understanding that, even though SSRIs were originally developed as anti-depressants, they actually have a significantly higher success rate in the treatment of anxiety disorders. Panic disorder in particular seems to respond extremely well to medication therapy.

 

I resisted taking medication for years, and I so wish I hadn't. After maybe a week or two on an SSRI, the anxiety that I had been struggling with on a near-constant basis was reduced so dramatically that I felt like a different person. It went from being something that I had to be constantly vigilant about and constantly using coping skills to handle just to get through the day (and sometimes even that didn't work), to something that was very manageable.

[In The Great White North]

Don't assume the answer I suggest is "pushing them into it". I never stated such a thing. Pushing an anxious person into something, sans professional guidance will only exacerbate the anxiety and would be counter-therapeutic.

 

It had nothing to do with you. I was answering the OP's question:

 

.or do I somehow gently push her to do that.

[sbgrace]

I thought of something. We have this book. What to Do When you Worry Too Much: A Kid's Guide to Overcoming Anxiety (I'll copy and paste the link below too in case this link doesn't work) and I think it's absolutely terrific.

 

I looked it over again today and I think it might be really helpful to you/your daughter in dealing with her anxiety. It even talks about her particular stuff--needing to be around parents, feeling too anxious to do even fun stuff like a sleep over, tummy aches--etc. and it gives kids tools to manage the anxiety.

 

http://www.amazon.com/What-When-You-Worry-Much/dp/1591473144